The Perfect Vagina Channel 4 Sunday 17th August

doctor evil

Did anyone catch this documentary?

I really loved it! it made me feel much more normal. I wish I had seen it in my teens. They made a very good distinction between sex education and body awareness, both of which is lacking in our schools.

Fortunately they used technical terms and not those stupid immature names, foofoo and what not.

I felt so sorry for the girl Rosie who felt she had to have Labiaplasty just to be happy. Her sisters a bitch. It looked so painful and she was crying out when they were injecting the local anesthesia into her inner labia. Took a good month to heal properly.

The two male painters were unbelievable, it sounded liked the only exposure they had to lady bits were porn!

Jamie McCartney is a star! I would have loved to have had my vagina cast as a mould for the wall. No idea if I would have had the balls to go through with it!

The segment with the eccentric counselor was strange at first but I can see how it can be a very good therapy. Not too sure if vagina's themselves hold memories but could be very for a general release of anxiety, cathartic as you are facing things in a 'safe' environment. Thought the presenter let herself down by being a bit callous about the practitioner.

http://www.channel4.com/health/microsites/G/g-spot/perfect-vagina/index.html

Gauge

It was an eye opener, some parts were very depressing, particularly when they focused on the popularity of hymen reconstructions in cultures/religion where 'physical' virginity is extremely important.

I enjoyed it, but one thing bothered me- couldn't figure out why the presenter kept saying vagina when she was referring to other parts like the labia, or the vulva as a whole- in fact, despite the show's name, very little of it focused on the vagina. Not a big deal, but given the show's theme, would have been nice if she'd used the correct names for things

Ginny

I watched a bit earlier, The scences with Rosie were awful, the poor girl it looked so painful.
None of her family were there to support her either, very strange.

I just can't get my head around why anyone would think they need to put themselves through that.

And were they actually that ugly like?

Drift

No Rosie's wasn't at all. To me it looked perfectly normal although I can't claim to be an expert in the area ..... unfortunately

I think it's a bit like every other area of the body. People want to look like the airbrushed unrealistic images they see in porn/telly/newspaper. As a guy I was amazed though at how much women would think about things like that. Among my group of male friends who range in age from early 20s to mid 30s I have never heard a single one of them comment on the downstairs appearance of a girl he'd been with.

Is it the same here as the situation in the UK, are there that many girls here in Ireland worrying about the appearance of their vagina? Any guy who would make a girl that uncomfortable isn't worth being with, he should be ecstatic that he's getting to see it in the first place. As for the girls who make fun of other girls - the mind just boggles - it doesn't happen with lads. No-one says "You've got such a small cock" or "You knob hangs to the left all the time" or "That guy has a funny looking scrotum."*



* Ok yes i know, ALL scrota are funny looking.

Phototoxin

The two male painters were unbelievable, it sounded liked the only exposure they had to lady bits were porn!

it probably was, sex ed doenst usually show an ACTUAL female genital area but rather a scientific diagram AND IF ITS NOT *EXACTLY* THE SAME THEN YOU ARE A FREAK!

like in blokes it not uncommon that one testicle is larger than the other. However the program shows how women are more comfortable discussing their bodies than men despite the culture of 'cover wimmenz up'

Phlann

Drift wrote: »

Among my group of male friends who range in age from early 20s to mid 30s I have never heard a single one of them comment on the downstairs appearance of a girl he'd been with.

It happens.

Reku

Drift wrote: »

As a guy I was amazed though at how much women would think about things like that. Among my group of male friends who range in age from early 20s to mid 30s I have never heard a single one of them comment on the downstairs appearance of a girl he'd been with.

Well lets face it, if you were to go down there with a miners cap and the torch turned on to get a proper look I somehow doubt the lady would hold still long enough for you to get said proper look. Besides considering the general unattractiveness of genitalia both genders probably try imagine something else when down there.

Drift wrote: »

No-one says "You've got such a small cock" or "You knob hangs to the left all the time" or "That guy has a funny looking scrotum."*

Probably more due to the obvious retort of "why were you looking at my cock, see something you like?". I suspect homophobia may be more the deterent than actual morals and empathy among lads.

Phototoxin wrote: »

it probably was, sex ed doenst usually show an ACTUAL female genital area but rather a scientific diagram AND IF ITS NOT *EXACTLY* THE SAME THEN YOU ARE A FREAK!

like in blokes it not uncommon that one testicle is larger than the other. However the program shows how women are more comfortable discussing their bodies than men despite the culture of 'cover wimmenz up'

I'm sure dildos also give women realistic expectations too.:rolleyes:
A slight bend is supposed to be rather common in penises yet you still get the odd agony aunt message where the guy is convinced he needs surgery as something must be wrong with it. Then you have guys going for circumcisions solely for aesthetic reasons too, while from the descriptions in this thread I suspect it's far more minor surgery than this Labiaplasty, in effect it's similar enough.
For a part of the body we hardly ever see people do seem to spend far too much time dwelling on their genitals appearance.

SarahJ

I am raging I missed this. I wonder will they show it again?

Reku

SarahJ wrote: »

I am raging I missed this. I wonder will they show it again?

http://www.channel4.com/video/brandless-catchup.jsp?vodBrand=the-perfect-vagina&brand=The%20Perfect%20Vagina

You can watch it online anytime over the next 6 days.

Wibbs

Drift wrote: »

Among my group of male friends who range in age from early 20s to mid 30s I have never heard a single one of them comment on the downstairs appearance of a girl he'd been with.

I have heard it, but it's rare enough for guys to say it. TBH the only general comment that might be made would be about it's feel(tightness) not how it looked, though as I say I have heard guys comment that they didn't like the look of that part of a woman. It was in general terms though. They didn't like the vulva full stop. No matter what it looked like.

Personally while they do vary quite a bit I've never met one I didn't like the look of.

Cathmandooo

It certainly was an eye opener.

doctor evil wrote: »

I felt so sorry for the girl Rosie who felt she had to have Labiaplasty just to be happy. Her sisters a bitch. It looked so painful and she was crying out when they were injecting the local anesthesia into her inner labia. Took a good month to heal properly.

It looked like a horrific thing to get done. God love her, I just hope it has given her the happiness and confidence she thought she'd get from it.

The two male painters were unbelievable, it sounded liked the only exposure they had to lady bits were porn!

I had to laugh at them, i loved the presenters comments afterwards saying she wishes she asked them to get their manhoods out so she could say ew at them but true they were only in to paint her house

Jamie McCartney is a star! I would have loved to have had my vagina cast as a mould for the wall. No idea if I would have had the balls to go through with it!

Agreed, fair play to her. I really don't think she knew what she was getting herself into with the documentary but she went along with it. Took guts!

adelcrowsmel

Its was really interesting to watch and might inform girls that we all don't fit into the 'normal vagina model'!! Although in saying that the plastic surgeon that she visited that performed surgery on the 16 year old girl and showed the photo of her - I think in certain extreme circumstances maybe surgery is required/needed for the individuals own self confidence etc...but 16 is abit young to be making these decisions!

Reku

I'm afraid I think if the appearance of your genitals is affecting your self confidence enough that you're willing to pay the crazy amounts that a plastic surgeon will ask for to make them more aesthetically pleasing then you need to start wearing underwear.
Someone who lived in a naturalist community would have a fair complaint (since wearing anything to hide it would make them stand out), but otherwise, unless there's a tumor down there that is impossible to hide under normal clothing, if the appearance of your genitals is affecting your confidence that much the problem's not your genitals, it's your head. Genitals are not a part of you anyone expects, or in most instances even wants, to see other than for intimate encounters (where either the person should care anout you enough not to make a deal of it or is someone you'll probably never see again anyway so who cares).

Wibbs

I caught a fair bit of the programme and tbh they all pretty much looked standard to me, within the usual variation. The only exception was the picture of the 16 yr olds in the doctors surgery. That looked like a lot of extra tissue goin on. Then again if I was into someone I honestly don't think that would put me off at all.

Also I have the strong suspicion the doctor rolled out the most extreme example to justify his fanny face lift practice. That's common enough with your elective plastic surgery types. If it was affecting her functionally fine, but unrealistic expectations about ones looks are the issue. Of course many quacks will say they're only fulfilling a need, as these women are affected functionally in an emotional way, but I would say that's largely an excuse. They're actually adding to the pereception by siggesting they can "fix" them and making money on the back of that. Hey whatever gets them through the night.

Nevyn

"fanny face lift"
lollers.

Drift

Wibbs wrote: »

I caught a fair bit of the programme and tbh they all pretty much looked standard to me, within the usual variation. The only exception was the picture of the 16 yr olds in the doctors surgery. That looked like a lot of extra tissue goin on. Then again if I was into someone I honestly don't think that would put me off at all.

Yeah Wibbs I agree that there did seem to be a lot extra going on with that pic the doctor had but like you I doubt it would be something I'd notice beyond the first couple of minutes if I was interested enough in the girl to be getting down to business. Obviously I suppose it may have caused some raised eyebrows in one night stand scenarios.

Anti

Im guessing Rosie's Vagina was hung like sleeve of wizard ? Poor girl. I've never seen this program, although i did catch "designer vagina" a few years ago, think that was also a chan 4 production. I didnt think women had the female version of "penis envy" that some blokes get.

Still, i could never be with a woman if her vagina was not appealing to look at. I dont like my partner to have a inside out baseball mit for a cooch !

John Mason

personally, i dont see the difference being a fanny job and a boob job or a tummy tuck or any other form of plastic surgery.

if the person wants it done, then just let them get on with it.

we ahve no right to judge anyone

Reku

But at least the boobjob or tummy tuck affects a part of you others will see day to day, or at least they'll see the shape of, a fanny face lift doesn't so how can it produce a significant improvement to one's confidence? We're not so much judging the people as the reasons they are doing it.

Drift

Manties wrote: »

Im guessing Rosie's Vagina was hung like sleeve of wizard ? Poor girl.

Actually no, her pre-op vagina was pretty nice. Or at least I thought so. I have no idea where she got the idea that her labia was too "long".

irishbird wrote: »

personally, i dont see the difference being a fanny job and a boob job or a tummy tuck or any other form of plastic surgery.

if the person wants it done, then just let them get on with it.

we ahve no right to judge anyone

You're spot on Irishbird; thats one of the points that was getting to the woman who presented the show. She saw how happy some of the girls were after getting it done and made that point that if something like this makes someone that much happier then it can it really be that bad? The real problem as I see it though is what sort of a society do we live in that women have to chop off bits of their labia just to make them feel comfortable in their own body?

Kur4mA

Whatever keeps her a woman happy with herself I suppose. I do think surgery is a bit much but I can see where she'd be coming from if she was having to tuck them into her socks or whatever.

Nevyn

Drift wrote: »

Actually no, her pre-op vagina was pretty nice. Or at least I thought so. I have no idea where she got the idea that her labia was too "long".

That is the bit I find worrying.

Drift

She said her sister teased her about it in front of her male friends who continued on with the teasing.

Her sister clearly hasn't a clue! She obviously didn't do much internetting to compare hers to other girls though because that would have proved her sister totally wrong - provided of course she steered clear of the touched up porn sites.

Clare Bear

Drift wrote: »

You're spot on Irishbird; thats one of the points that was getting to the woman who presented the show. She saw how happy some of the girls were after getting it done and made that point that if something like this makes someone that much happier then it can it really be that bad? The real problem as I see it though is what sort of a society do we live in that women have to chop off bits of their labia just to make them feel comfortable in their own body?

That's often the case with cosmetic surgery though....it's only the person themselves that notices it.

That operation was hard to watch. Poor girl. Her sister needs a thump.

Reku

I do remember a rather disturbing video of a girl getting liposuction before, it was on a documentary, can't remember if it was about liposuction, fat people or something else, but the part that stuck in my mind was that even though the girl had been put under general anaesthetic she was still moaning as the tool was pushed into her skin or moved around.:eek:

Nevyn

It makes me worry that children including my own will think there is something wrong with them as they are not photoshopped, airbrushed and body sculpted.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvSaA-QIqvk

Wibbs

It does get to ridiculous proportions in some quarters, especially in the US. I watched a programme a while back about cosmetic surgery and there was this woman who was in for a breast "augmentation" consult. Her mate was there for moral support. Now this woman's breasts were verrrry nice as they were. About a B cup, pert and very shapely. Anyhoo she wanted to look like a dead heat in a zeppelin race and the quack(for that is what he was) was all up for it at about 4 grand per boob.

Her mate who was there for moral support then had the pleasure of the quacks "opinion". Now let me set the scene. This woman's body was in the top x% of women's bodies as far as what is considered universally desirable in the west. She was tall, small framed and very toned. We're talking volleyball player with just the right amount of hips and boobs thrown in. If there was a build your own woman kit for saddos, they would use her figure as the template. The technical term I believe is phowaaaar.

OK, the quack looked at her in her underwear(this part I could well understand) and proceeded to tell her she had saddle bags that he could "fix". Now the only way one would accuse this woman of having saddle bags, is if the pony express had pygmy hamsters in their stable. This muppet was trying to pinch less than an inch of skin. A very attractive inch too. Guess what though, she believed him and made an appointment. Madness.

Reku

Indeed, people seem to place far too much weight regarding their happiness in how others view their appearance and completely forget that "you can please all of the people some of the time & you can please some of the people all of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time". Why worry so much about those who you can't please all of the time, or even at any time outside their being completely legless drunk, when there will be those who will adore you for you.

The irony of this is that what is attractive suffers from fashion trends, for a while there we were being told that size 0 was supposedly attractive, then for a bit it was larger women, in the middle ages really large (no parasites and well nurished so more likely to be healthy, also skinny was the mark of the poor and malnurished => not rich, not cool.:rolleyes:) were the in thing. Mutilating your body to fit in with a trend, just because of how you think others will perceive you is just foolishness IMO. There will ALWAYS be someone there who'll say you're ugly and that x is too big or y too small, c is too round, b is too straight, etc..., etc....

Either way in time your body and all those expensive operations will fall apart on you and you'll be left with only those who don't define you by your body.

Anti

okay i watched the show last night. Quite disturbing infact.

The girl who had the "fanny face lift" was not in real need for it, granted she did have a failry nasty looking vagina, i dont think there was a need for the op personally. But i can understand why she did it. Being teased by your sister and friends has taken its toll.

I never realised women were that worried about the appereance of their bits to be honest(especially as their not publically on show). It just shows how the media etc etc has had such a huge negative effect on how you view yoursefls.

Drift

Manties wrote: »

granted she did have a failry nasty looking vagina

You think? I can't claim to be any sort of an expert but it looked fine to me. Although I didn't pause for a long examination or anything - but then I wouldn't in real life either. No point looking at, might aswell get to work!

Anti

Yeah it was a bit to un-neat for my liking. Call me fussy or shallow, but if your going to be with someone you will most likely spend alot of time down there, and it mayaswell be plesant looking.

Nead21

I only caught the end of this programme but i found it to be a real eye opener, quite disturbing tbh.

Is this something else that women really have to be worried about? Is it not bad enough that we have enough pressure on us to be thin, cellulite free, air brushed forms of ourselves that we now worry about how our vagina's look...something that we really have no control over?

I have never know a man to turned off a women by how her vagina/labia looks!

LolaLuv

Nead21 wrote: »

I only caught the end of this programme but i found it to be a real eye opener, quite disturbing tbh.

Is this something else that women really have to be worried about? Is it not bad enough that we have enough pressure on us to be thin, cellulite free, air brushed forms of ourselves that we now worry about how our vagina's look...something that we really have no control over?

I have never know a man to turned off a women by how her vagina/labia looks!

Preach it! I couldn't possibly agree with you more.

Phlann

Nead21 wrote: »

I have never know a man to turned off a women by how her vagina/labia looks!

I've never really given it much thought. It'd have to be pretty manky though. Like, teeth growing out of it kinda manky!

Check out the link I posted earlier in the thread for proof that at least one man has been put off by an odd vagina.

doctor evil

Manties wrote: »

Yeah it was a bit to un-neat for my liking. Call me fussy or shallow, but if your going to be with someone you will most likely spend alot of time down there, and it mayaswell be plesant looking.

Looked fine to me, could it have been the setting that put you off? aka sterile surgical enviroment, just the inner labia showing with the rest covered by the green cloth and a man about to cut it off. I think because there is no hair it in a way makes it look bigger. All it is, is two flaps of skin with a blood supply to it. I wonder if they blood supply to it increases during foreplay.

*adele*

When the presenter was looking at the porn magazines,it bothered me that she was saying that nobody has that. And saying that girls have unrealistic views due to porn. The girls in the magazines didnt look too abnormal to me. Does that mean that in you look like them your fake and unrealistic?

Wibbs

*adele* wrote: »

The girls in the magazines didnt look too abnormal to me. Does that mean that in you look like them your fake and unrealistic?

I have to agree. There's a range out there alright, but it's pretty narrow and "extremes" are pretty rare. Most women look like kinda the same. I suppose it was the usual over compensation to reassure people.

Anti

doctor evil wrote: »

Looked fine to me, could it have been the setting that put you off? aka sterile surgical enviroment, just the inner labia showing with the rest covered by the green cloth and a man about to cut it off. I think because there is no hair it in a way makes it look bigger. All it is, is two flaps of skin with a blood supply to it. I wonder if they blood supply to it increases during foreplay.

Maybe, but i dont think so.

All the women i have been with have always have attractive looking vaginas, neat and tucked in. I think if i met a girl and she had a vagina like the girl who had the op, I'd run a mile !

Ginny

*adele* wrote: »

When the presenter was looking at the porn magazines,it bothered me that she was saying that nobody has that. And saying that girls have unrealistic views due to porn. The girls in the magazines didnt look too abnormal to me. Does that mean that in you look like them your fake and unrealistic?

But was it not also suggested that maybe some of those girls were airbrushed to look the same, so the mags have a uniform representation rather then the range of different appearances?

Reku

Manties wrote: »

Maybe, but i dont think so.

All the women i have been with have always have attractive looking vaginas, neat and tucked in. I think if i met a girl and she had a vagina like the girl who had the op, I'd run a mile !

It's not like you're going to be gazing lovingly into her fanny most of the time is it? At least I hope you'll say the meaningful things to her face and not her crotch?:P
Besides, is it not possible that they had "attractive looking vaginas" because you found the women themselves attractive, both physically and mentally?

Wibbs

doctor evil wrote:

I wonder if they blood supply to it increases during foreplay.

It does, but it may not be that obvious in most cases as you may only get to see the change after it happens. Some women do grow a little from un aroused to aroused.

IMHO, like everything some are better looking than others. I can think of some who were nicer than others. This of course would be down to personal preference too and the difference between the nicest one and the not as nice one would not be large. If I saw one that was like the photo the quack showed, if I'm honest I would be initially thrown. But it could also be a case of more to play with too.

TBH the feel of that area would be far more important to me. Add in the biggest part of it all, how I felt about her as a woman and the appearance of her vulva would be way down the list.

john_aero

Wibbs wrote: »

TBH the feel of that area would be far more important to me. Add in the biggest part of it all, how I felt about her as a woman and the appearance of her vulva would be way down the list.

too true and best answer so far, why such big deal over it, its the person and not what they have got