T-rex 600 electric

workaccount

Hi,
Would this chopper be abit too much for a beginner.

I could swap it for something I have so am considering... otherwise would have gone for something smaller like a logo 10.

Am I right in thinking these machines are worth about 500 euro? This one is carbon fiber.

syl77

Hi, have you got the 600E yet, if you have then there is nothing wrong with starting out with it, just that the batteries might be a bit expensive.
If you haven’t got it, you may consider a 500 size like the Mikado 500 or t-rex 500. The Mikado 500 uses a longer main blade than the Trex 500, but does not come with a speed controller or motor where the Trex 500 does.
You could also consider getting the new rave 450 heli (by CYE), I’m just back from IRCHA where they were first released to the public, helped build one and they fly a lot better than any other 450 on the market, they look bigger also and can be pumped up to a 350 blade size. The kit will include 325 radix (and tail blades) and a scorpion 6 motor. Plenty of bling included...

workaccount

syl77 wrote: »

Hi, have you got the 600E yet, if you have then there is nothing wrong with starting out with it, just that the batteries might be a bit expensive.
If you haven’t got it, you may consider a 500 size like the Mikado 500 or t-rex 500. The Mikado 500 uses a longer main blade than the Trex 500, but does not come with a speed controller or motor where the Trex 500 does.
You could also consider getting the new rave 450 heli (by CYE), I’m just back from IRCHA where they were first released to the public, helped build one and they fly a lot better than any other 450 on the market, they look bigger also and can be pumped up to a 350 blade size. The kit will include 325 radix (and tail blades) and a scorpion 6 motor. Plenty of bling included...

Got it now actually - the 600. Took it out once or twice and it was very stable. It was windy today but it didn't really push the chopper around at all. The anti torque motor (is that the right name) seems very insensitive though - this was the part I found most difficult. Maybe it's just a matter of getting used to it as the simulator i'm using is sensitive. I like a sharp response though.

I was using training gear and one of the end points fell off in flight! Lost my concentration for a second and the blades took a branch off a tree. New blades required Damn. Gonna get budget ones in case something like this happens again - at least until I learn the ropes.

lotus791

had one ,crahed it ,kicked it a bit ,sold it not for me ...a lot of respect for flying peeps

workaccount

lotus791 wrote: »

had one ,crahed it ,kicked it a bit ,sold it not for me ...a lot of respect for flying peeps

Did you practice on a simulator?

syl77

The anti torque motor (is that the right name) seems very insensitive though - this was the part I found most difficult. Maybe it's just a matter of getting used to it as the simulator i'm using is sensitive. I like a sharp response though.

Not sure if it is called the anti torque motor, remember there was first the 600L motor and then the 600XL which was more powerful. it should feel plenty sensitive but still feel less zippy than the simulator, remember your flying the sim with a direct cable to it, no delay like in the real thing (although 2.4ghz speeds things up quite abit). Also things like, blades, head speed, idle up curves will have a factor on how it performs, plus training wheels had more weight. I recommend flying for a while before you start to look for extra power.
If you want, slow down your sim a bit by bringing down the head speed. The sim is supposed to mimic the real thing, not the other way around...
The second round of the heli challenge trophy is on this weekend at the midlands flying club if you want to come along and fly...this years heli challenge is geared more so to having a fun fly after.

lotus791

workaccount wrote: »

Did you practice on a simulator?

yes i spent most of the winter stuck to the puter , im just not a stick person lol

workaccount

Hello,
I'm considering whether it's worthwhile changing the connectors on my lipo to bullet or not. The chopper came with deans.

EDITED: Would it be a worthwhile difference changing my 22.2v 5000mah lithium batteries to bullet connectors?

coolwings

Deans (T plugs) usually turn up on US models, but don't sell so well in Europe where electric models are better understood by the modellers.

The deans (< 0.3mOhm) have much higher resistance than 4mm bananas (< 0.2 mOhm). I'm referring to the top quality connectors of both types. Some copies have base metal underneath the gold plating!


I suggest you put the more costly cells in it after you go through the bashing it stage.

workaccount

coolwings wrote: »

I suggest you put the more costly cells in it after you go through the bashing it stage.

How do you mean?

syl77

Would it be a worthwhile difference changing over with a big powerful 22.2v 5000mah lithium?

What are you currently running in it and at what headspeed?
Are you at the stage where you need more power or just longer flight times from the upgrade?

workaccount

syl77 wrote: »

What are you currently running in it and at what headspeed?
Are you at the stage where you need more power or just longer flight times from the upgrade?

Just don't want to be wasting power I suppose. Extending time would be the best thing for now.

Not sure what the head speed is at now. I've left it on the same setting as when I got it.

syl77

Would it be a worthwhile difference changing over with a big powerful 22.2v 5000mah lithium?

Sorry, I read this line wrong, thought you had also asked about upgrading lipo.
As for deans Vs bullet connectors, Id go with a good set of bullets...

EDIT: lipos should only be drained to about 80% of capcity during a flight, i.e. for a 5000mah, you should only be putting back anything up to 4000mah, anything more than 4000 and your draining the battery to much. You may know this so just making sure.

coolwings

coolwings wrote: »

... I suggest you put the more costly cells in it after you go through the bashing it stage.

workaccount wrote: »

How do you mean?

I assume you are flying it on 3000s at the moment? If that is so then 5000s represent an added cost, so as to get more duration per flight. But the model is heavier also.
My point is, the lighter configuration is more favourable while learning.
After you can fly sufficiently well that you begin working on flights over 8 minutes, then 5000s become interesting, providing 12-14 minute flights. Until that point is reached, it is simpler to fly a cheaper, and lighter heli that costs less when it has accidents. It is cheaper and lighter with the 3000s size cells in it.

workaccount

coolwings wrote: »

I assume you are flying it on 3000s at the moment? If that is so then 5000s represent an added cost, so as to get more duration per flight. But the model is heavier also.
My point is, the lighter configuration is more favourable while learning.
After you can fly sufficiently well that you begin working on flights over 8 minutes, then 5000s become interesting, providing 12-14 minute flights. Until that point is reached, it is simpler to fly a cheaper, ilighter heli that costs less when it has accidents. It is cheaper and lighter with the 3000s size cells in it.

Oh no sorry. I don't think I've made myself clear.

I don't have any 3000mah batteries. I only have 3 5000mah batteries. All these came with deans connectors but I am wondering is it worthwhile changing these batteries to bullet.

syl77

then 5000s become interesting, providing 12-14 minute flights

Sounds a bit high, but maybe not if headspeed is low and pilot isnt flying to hard.
What kinda of flight times are you getting with you 5000 battery and what make are the batteries.

workaccount

syl77 wrote: »

Sounds a bit high, but maybe not if headspeed is low and pilot isnt flying to hard.
What kinda of flight times are you getting with you 5000 battery and what make are the batteries.

Thunder power extreme version 1. Haven't has them out properly yet but I reckon maybe 7 mins at idle 1 setting - moderate flying. No aerobatics. Not sure about idle 2.

It's very low really. Wonder if the mah of lipos will keep climbing?

syl77

Thunder power extreme version 1. Haven't has them out properly yet but I reckon maybe 7 mins at idle 1 setting - moderate flying. No aerobatics. Not sure about idle 2.

This seems about right. It all depends on your headspeed and then on how you fly the heli, the more aggressive you fly it the quicker you use up power.
I would say your idle up 2 setting has a higher headspeed, with this you will probably get less flight time, but not much less.

After a 7 minute flight, are you putting the full 4000 (80%) back in to the battery, if you are not, then you can increase you flight time till you do.

Wonder if the mah of lipos will keep climbing?

If you mean will battery companies keep bringing out new batteries with higher capacity, then yes and no, MAH will continue to rise but newer lipo technology will appear. Flightpower have released there new pack and thunderpower are set to release there new packs (meant to be better than flightpower packs) in the coming month or so. Each new release gives better continuous and burst power than before. Having said that motor and ESC makers like Scorpion are also improving and demanding more from the battery...

coolwings

True, capacity is improving.

However don't forget the power waste of a budget motor of, say 75% efficiency, when compared with a premium motor of 90% efficiency has on flights.

A 75% efficient motor makes 25% heat, and a 90% makes 10% heat. The heat is lost power.
So cheap motors waste 2 1/2 times more power than the best.
Then there are the speed controllers .... forget the amps printed on the label for a moment ..... the mosfet quality inside ESCs have a huge bearing on speed controller efficiency.
There are good reasons why some people use certain makes only.

workaccount

syl77 wrote: »

This seems about right. It all depends on your headspeed and then on how you fly the heli, the more aggressive you fly it the quicker you use up power.
I would say your idle up 2 setting has a higher headspeed, with this you will probably get less flight time, but not much less.

After a 7 minute flight, are you putting the full 4000 (80%) back in to the battery, if you are not, then you can increase you flight time till you do.

tbh I've only got the heli recently and haven't flown it properly yet but I am aware you can't use all the capacity and should only let it go down to 3.2v. So if it is discharged down to 3.2v does that mean that there's only 1000mah left in the battery. ie. Does mah left and battery voltage work parallel with each other?

coolwings wrote: »

True, capacity is improving.

However don't forget the power waste of a budget motor of, say 75% efficiency, when compared with a premium motor of 90% efficiency has on flights.

A 75% efficient motor makes 25% heat, and a 90% makes 10% heat. The heat is lost power.
So cheap motors waste 2 1/2 times more power than the best.
Then there are the speed controllers .... forget the amps printed on the label for a moment ..... the mosfet quality inside ESCs have a huge bearing on speed controller efficiency.
There are good reasons why some people use certain makes only.

How much power are you talking about losing though? My chopper has the align xl600 which I know is not a premium motor - how can I find out it it's worthwhile upgrading or not. ie. Can you post figures or anything?

Thanks.

syl77

tbh I've only got the heli recently and haven't flown it properly yet but I am aware you can't use all the capacity and should only let it go down to 3.2v. So if it is discharged down to 3.2v does that mean that there's only 1000mah left in the battery. ie. Does mah left and battery voltage work parallel with each other?

When it comes to electric helis, I would not go by what voltage is left in the battery. Does your charger tell you how much MAH is put back into the pack when it charges. If it does, then this is the amount of mah you used in your last flight, so anything below 80%(4000 for a 5000mah battery) is good.

How much power are you talking about losing though? My chopper has the align xl600 which I know is not a premium motor - how can I find out it it's worthwhile upgrading or not. ie. Can you post figures or anything?

I wouldn’t worry about losing power through the motor right now. Money spent on parts due to crashes is more important at the beginning stages.
Fly it and get comfortable with it.

coolwings

syl77 wrote: »

.... I wouldn’t worry about...the motor right now. Money spent on parts due to crashes is more important at the beginning stages....

Good advice. Practise, and the ability to get practising again quickly after a bang, are your priority.

workaccount

syl77 wrote: »

When it comes to electric helis, I would not go by what voltage is left in the battery. Does your charger tell you how much MAH is put back into the pack when it charges. If it does, then this is the amount of mah you used in your last flight, so anything below 80%(4000 for a 5000mah battery) is good.


I wouldn’t worry about losing power through the motor right now. Money spent on parts due to crashes is more important at the beginning stages.
Fly it and get comfortable with it.

coolwings wrote: »

Good advice. Practise, and the ability to get practising again quickly after a bang, are your priority.

Yeah and I think I'll take it. Thanks.