Top 10 Countries that spend the most on ....

IvaBigWun

Healthcare

Look who's number one! :eek:

So Michael Moore was full of sh*t again when he made this?

I doubt Ireland would make the top 30.

Cookie_Monster

would cosmetic surgery etc fall under healthcare though?

Turd Ferguson

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Heathcare

Heathcare....lulz

Tigger

thats not gvt spending tho thats outright spend

us healthcare is dearer

IvaBigWun

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

Heathcare....lulz

Eh?

KerranJast

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Heathcare

Look who's number one! :eek:

So Michael Moore was full of sh*t again when he made this?

I doubt Ireland would make the top 30.

The US spends a lot of money on healthcare for the poor and higher paid workers and rich can afford the price of insurance there. There's a huge chunk in the middle though that can't afford insurance but aren't poor enough to qualify for aid so go without. That was the gist of the film. US Health care = best in the world (if you're lucky enough to get access to it).

Cant access this in work. Just make sure u should look at relativity as in per capita, not just the actual amount.

Also the US may have a high per capita but that doesnt always tell the whole story.

Doc

Dose this refer to government spending on healthcare or what?

Because if not then how is Michael Moore full of sh*t?

If insurance makes up this high level of spending then the poor still suffer don’t they?

IvaBigWun

KerranJast wrote: »

That was the gist of the film. US Health care = best in the world (if you're lucky enough to get access to it).

If I remember right the film made a mockery of the US heath system and Moore went around Europe looking at better systems in different countries.

rowlandbrowner

http://content.healthaffairs.org/cgi/content/abstract/20/2/9

"5 percent of the population accounts for the majority of health expenditures."

on this occasion mr. moore was not full of sh*t.

IvaBigWun

Doc wrote: »

Because if not then how is Michael Moore was full of sh*t?

Wasnt the point of "Sicko" to make the US health system look a disgrace compared to the rest of the world? That chart (at first glance) would counter that.

Now imagine if Michael made a film about Ireland's system :pac:

Tom65

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Wasnt the point of "Sicko" to make the US health system look a disgrace compared to the rest of the world? That chart (at first glance) would counter that.

Now imagine if Michael made a film about Ireland's system :pac:

Spending money doesn't equal a good health care system.

KerranJast

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Wasnt the point of "Sicko" to make the US health system look a disgrace compared to the rest of the world? That chart (at first glance) would counter that.

Now imagine if Michael made a film about Ireland's system :pac:

The point was the working class in the USA are unlikely to have health insurance and so suffer when they need to access healthcare. The rest of US society (the very poor, those with high paid jobs that include employer paid insurance and the rich) have access to the best health care system in the World.

Peyton Manning

Turd Ferguson wrote: »

Heathcare....lulz

A few months too late for that unfortunately.

The_Minister

rowlandbrowner wrote: »

http://content.healthaffairs.org/cgi/content/abstract/20/2/9

"5 percent of the population accounts for the majority of health expenditures."

on this occasion mr. moore was not full of sh*t.

That 5% is people with chronic illnesses/the very old.

brianthebard

IvaBigWun wrote: »

Wasnt the point of "Sicko" to make the US health system look a disgrace compared to the rest of the world? That chart (at first glance) would counter that.

Now imagine if Michael made a film about Ireland's system :pac:

so you looked at this for a few seconds and then decided mm was completely wrong?Well done on your in depth research.

Kavinsky

Michael Moore in biased film shocker :eek:

IvaBigWun

brianthebard wrote: »

so you looked at this for a few seconds and then decided mm was completely wrong?

That page lists the "World Map showing top 10 Countries That spend Most on Healthcare"

Moore's film investigates the American health care system.

So yes.

Winters

Just because you put in a lot of money doesnt necesarily mean you will get the best return. There are many factors which can lead to bad and mismanagement of funding and the like.

Michael Moore's film is also about as good as watching a dog taking a poop on the ground. It is in no way a documentary but a one sided biased opinon of a fat guy with some money and a camera.

Also, pointless thread.

Tigger

why on earth did youu start anotherone?

Victor

The_Minister wrote: »

That 5% is people with chronic illnesses/the very old.

More telling is that 50% of healcare goes on people in the last year of life. Primary health care has suffered because of this.

IvaBigWun

Tigger wrote: »

why on earth did youu start anotherone?

Too many tabs open. It was meant to be in here.

Earthhorse

Victor wrote: »

Moore telling is that 50% of healcare goes on people in the last year of life. Primary health care has suffered because of this.

I wouldn't believe anything he tells you to be honest.

Neamhshuntasach

Did the original poster ever see Sicko? It doesn't make a mockery of the standard of their healthcare. It makes a mockery of how it is run and how the insurance companies basically determine who and who isn't going to be covered for the treatment they need.

When the US healthcare system is compared with ones in Europe the main reason is highlight the difference in price. not how much better it is in Europe.

brianthebard

IvaBigWun wrote: »

That page lists the "World Map showing top 10 Countries That spend Most on Healthcare"

Moore's film investigates the American health care system.

So yes.

fail,massive fail.

The_Minister

Earthhorse wrote: »

I wouldn't believe anything he tells you to be honest.

I forget the actual figure, but I think thats 50% is actually very close to the truth.

Flamed Diving

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_spe_per_per-health-spending-per-person

http://ucatlas.ucsc.edu/spend.php

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_in_the_United_States

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2006_June_21/ai_n26902657

IvaBigWun = pwned

The guy

IvaBigWun wrote: »

So Michael Moore was full of sh*t again when he made this?

When was Michael Moore ever right?

Macha

For anyone interested in drawing a conclusion from a set (gasp!) of figures. Not just one.

http://www.authorstream.com/Presentation/liamgr-58658-Health-Care-Ireland-Status-indicators-Outcomes-Primary-strategy-in-Education-ppt-powerpoint/

hunnybunny

I doubt Ireland would make the top 30.

Well we have the best paid nurses in Europe. Nurses in no other European country I know of make such a high salary starting off.

IvaBigWun

IvaBigWun wrote: »

That page lists the "World Map showing top 10 Countries That spend Most on Healthcare"

Moore's film investigates the American health care system.

So yes.

:facepalm:

Moore was on about government spending and how the health service is too privitised.I was over there last summer and my friend(an illegal irish) got bitten by a snake.He spent two weeks in hospital and ended up owing 33000 dollars.
Obviously at these prices the americans would spend more.This means that the health care over there favours the better off.

The point you are trying to make is totally wrong.

Flamed Diving

Deleted User wrote: »

:facepalm:

Moore was on about government spending and how the health service is too privitised.I was over there last summer and my friend(an illegal irish) got bitten by a snake.He spent two weeks in hospital and ended up owing 33000 dollars.
Obviously at these prices the americans would spend more.This means that the health care over there favours the better off.

The point you are trying to make is totally wrong.

I hope your friend pulled a legger!

Earthhorse

The_Minister wrote: »

I forget the actual figure, but I think thats 50% is actually very close to the truth.

Hmmm, I think you missed the joke.

Look carefully at what Victor wrote and what I quoted.

The_Minister

Doh!

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

came in here purely to see the "fails" directed at ivabigun.

in other news, USA safest country in the world based on spending the highest amount on defence spending

Overheal

IvaBigWun wrote: »

If I remember right the film made a mockery of the US heath system and Moore went around Europe looking at better systems in different countries.

I stopped paying attention in that movie when he got to france and forced amazement at their healthcare system. He makes some arguments but they aren't points, so to speak. Universal healthcare would be great except you're getting taxed to help stabilize a heroine addict in ohio that Overdosed. I'd love it if my tax dollar went to Alzheimers Research or helped mend a litttle boys broken arm but this is not always the case.

However I still have big beefs with Big Pharma, they do charge insane amounts for prescription medicine.

Earthhorse

Overheal wrote: »

Universal healthcare would be great except you're getting taxed to help stabilize a heroine addict in ohio that Overdosed. I'd love it if my tax dollar went to Alzheimers Research or helped mend a litttle boys broken arm but this is not always the case.

Sometimes if you want to do those last two things you have to do that first thing as well.

Black Swan

More money may be spent on health care in the US, but by whom in the US (those that can afford private sector comprehensive health coverage as opposed to those that are poor and have no medical insurance)? Well, more may be spent in the US, but one of the results of the US health care system is not so impressive, namely *infant mortality rankings and rates. For example:

#1 Singapore 2.30 deaths per 1000 live births
#2 Sweden 2.76/1000
.
.
.
#27 Ireland 5.22/1000
.
.
.
#37 USA 6.37/1000

So kids, in general, it's safer to be born in Ireland than the good ole USA (unless your family is wealthy or has grand private sector insurance coverage).

And if you want to get into a great argument, suggest socialized medicine to a medical doctor in the US that's a member of AMA (American Medical Association).

*IMR reference: Geography IQ

tallaght01

Moore is totally full of crap. But, spending on healthcare isn't really a great indicator of how healthy you're gonna be in any given country. You look at spending per capita and in particular access to healthcare, and indices such as life life expectancy, and infant mortality, and quality life years etc.

But, in fairness, when he started holding up the NHS as an example of a quality healthcare system, thousands of docs who were working there at the time collectively laughed our arses off. The way he paints the NHS, in his pathetic attempts to belittle anything American was completely at odds with the reality.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

tallaght01 wrote: »

But, in fairness, when he started holding up the NHS as an example of a quality healthcare system, thousands of docs who were working there at the time collectively laughed our arses off. The way he paints the NHS, in his pathetic attempts to belittle anything American was completely at odds with the reality.

I think that you used to work in the NHS, so you probably know more than me. But, any experience i've had with them has been extremely pleasant and efficient (including taking care of my currently broken leg).

Flamed Diving

tallaght01 wrote: »

Moore is totally full of crap. But, spending on healthcare isn't really a great indicator of how healthy you're gonna be in any given country. You look at spending per capita and in particular access to healthcare, and indices such as life life expectancy, and infant mortality, and quality life years etc.

But, in fairness, when he started holding up the NHS as an example of a quality healthcare system, thousands of docs who were working there at the time collectively laughed our arses off. The way he paints the NHS, in his pathetic attempts to belittle anything American was completely at odds with the reality.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7511426.stm

tallaght01 = pwned

Earthhorse

tallaght01 wrote: »

life life expectancy

Life life expectancy? Is that how long they expect the life expectancy figure to be accurate?

Whoa, the government just cut health spending so it's down to 72 but there's been a medical breakthrough so your back to 75 but your wife just left you so it plummeted to 60.

All in the span of an afternoon.

tallaght01

Flamed Diving wrote: »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7511426.stm

tallaght01 = pwned

Eh, the article you linked backed up what I said

ie that you can't look at any one indicator in isolation. There's lots of things you need to look at. America's problem has always been their inequity in terms of access to healthcare. Their life expectancy is crap, considering how rich they are. Same with, say, their HIV levels. But when you look at it, it's not their really well off people who are dragging the average down. It's the people who have poor access to healthcare.

there's also a shocking amount of poverty in the states, which in itself adversely affects your health outcomes.

tallaght01

Earthhorse wrote: »

Life life expectancy? Is that how long they expect the life expectancy figure to be accurate?

Whoa, the government just cut health spending so it's down to 72 but there's been a medical breakthrough so your back to 75 but your wife just left you so it plummeted to 60.

All in the span of an afternoon.

Man, the wife leaving you has gotta extend your life expectancy to beyond a hundred

Overheal

Flamed Diving wrote: »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7511426.stm

tallaght01 = pwned

Hello and welcome to Boards.ie

Theres no glory in pasting a link about life expectancy and screaming "pwned". It makes you look like an idiot and 15 years of age. Instead may I recommend you make an intelligible argument? For instance,

"It's true that America spends the most on Healthcare but it has one of the lowest Life Expectancy's in a First world Country. According to this article (link) its down to obesity, and a lack of adequate health insurance coverage. So Moore might not be entirely wrong after all"

But you didn't. You had to scream Pwned in Red text because otherwise everyone would have just ignored such a retarded post.

I'm sorry sir but thank you for playing.

rossie1977

the big debate in america at the moment is whether to stay private or go the socialized route. those against the socialized route (and there are lots of americans in that boat) say it would destroy the economy yet the american government spend far more per capita on their health system than the british government do on theirs and something like 30 times more per person than cuba does (both socialized)

50 million americans have no health insurance (and no way of getting it because of the red tape), thats what the sicko movie focused on mainly; those uninsured cannot afford the health care even if it is the best in the world, people in the states have lost everything and declared bankruptcy all because of medical bills