Waterford vs Tipperary

Daysha

Lots of talk down in Waterford that Ken WONT be starting at full back for the big match, and that the place may very well go to James Murray, who apparently played at FB during a challenge game against Galway U21s recently. Personally, I'd prefer things to stay as they are. On the face of it it does seem crazy to play the best centre back in the country out of position but he's still probably our best choice for the role.

Murray's a good player no doubt, and he'd be a better option than say someone like Declan Prendergast but Ken's already proven he's more than competent in front of the posts. I'd start Ken at FB and if it turns out his services are badly needed further up the field then I'd throw Murray into the mix, or even slot Tony Browne in there.

So, predictions anyone? It's understandable why Tipp are favourites and rightly so. They haven't lost a match this year and their consistency has been amazing. They almost have an aura of invincibility about them. But the same had been said about us last year. We had beaten the big 3 on the way to winning the NHL and managed to sneak out results when we would've capitulated other years. But in the end of the day we were beaten by the fresher underdog who were slowly but surely working their way through the Championship. Could history repeat itself?

Speaking of history repeating itself, take a look at this:

In 1998, when Waterford hadn't won a first round match of significance in years, they made the breakthrough by beating Tipp.

In 2002, when they hadn't won a Munster Final in 39 years, they made the breakthrough by beating Tipp.

In 2006, they had a (well-publicised at the time) Croke Park hoodoo, which they broke by beating Tipp.

Now in 2008, the talk is about a semi-final hoodoo, and low & behold, who do they have in front of them only Tipp.

Everyone will talk about whether this will be 6th time lucky at this stage for us, but what makes this semi completely different to the previous ones is that the expectation level is no where near that of other years. To most of the country's eyes, we've already over-achieved this year. This time its the form of the opposition that has got everyone talking.

There's no doubt there's a huge weight of expectation on Tipps shoulders coming into the match, and considering each countys contrasting year so far, all the pressure is on Tipp, and Waterford will be more than happy with that.

That's why I'm going with Waterford to sneak it. We're not as good as last year, we're playing a better team than last year, we have vital players like Dan off-form and we've had a near cataclysmic start to the summer. What better way to break the hoodoo?

blue-army

Is it this sunday or next sunday?

Mossy Monk

Sunday August 17th

Daysha

Yeah, it's Cork/KK this Sunday.

Now that I think of it, who will the Tipp or Deise fans out there be supporting in the semi? I'll be going for Cork myself, simply because I'd fancy our chances more against them, and after the Munster semi final I'd say a lot of Tipp would feel the same way too. Not to mention the fact that the very thought of a Waterford vs Cork All Ireland final after all the recent history would just be epic. That said though, considering the long term rivalry between Tipp and Cork, it would be great to see those two face each other in an All Ireland final for the first time ever.

run_Forrest_run

would you not like to see a Waterford/Kilkenny final deise59? Think of the intensity around the South East for weeks/months? phew!
Really there is rivalry between all the teams in the semis, sure we all live in each others pockets...here's to good matches...up the Cats.

Limestone1

If Waterford made it through there would be huge hype in the south east no matter who they play. However Cork beating KK would be a massive boost for Waterford going into the game v Tipp - they have no fear of playing Cork after all the tight games between the two over the last few years as opposed to having a seemingly invincible KK waiting for them.
I think if Waterford saw a Tipp/Cork route to AI glory opening up in front of them, they would really start to believe it is possible ...

Damo.Smith

how about playing mcgrath at centre forward??

CyberDave

Damo.Smith wrote: »

how about playing mcgrath at centre forward??

Then you leave two holes in the Waterford defence. There is no doubt that McGrath is vital to this Waterford defence. Not sure about full-back though. He seems to be restricted in there. Waterford are not the same team without McGrath playing in a more central role. He can drive them on from centre-back unlike full-back.

premierstone

Damo.Smith wrote: »

how about playing mcgrath at centre forward??

While this would be akin to hurling suicide i would love to see McGrath against O'Mahoney, cos even though O'Mahoney has really grown into the centre back position and become a real pivotal figure on the tipp team there are still a few doubters out there who reckon he hasnt really been tested and a high class centre forward could expose him

CyberDave

premierstone wrote: »

While this would be akin to hurling suicide i would love to see McGrath against O'Mahoney, cos even though O'Mahoney has really grown into the centre back position and become a real pivotal figure on the tipp team there are still a few doubters out there who reckon he hasnt really been tested and a high class centre forward could expose him

I have to agree here. IMO O'Mahoney is a great "hurling" (as in he will play hurling all day but shy away from the tough stuff) centre back. He is not a centre back in the Ken McGrath mould.

eoinmaclove

As a tipp man, I'm really hoping we can at least get to the final after the disappointments of the last few years. If we did, then there'd be no shame in losing to KK, but we'd really have to fancy our chances against Cork in croker having had the better of them already this year.

That said, I think Waterford present a major challenge for us. Added to all that was said above, I'd also be hugely mindful of the 'Davy factor' with the Deise too. God only knows how fired-up he'll have them for the Tipp game :eek:

I suppose this time last year when we lost to Wexford, we'd have been very happy with winning munster this year and showing so much progress in a few short months.

I'm really looking forward to the games though - both semi's. I think the hurling championship has been fabulous this year so far and the prospect of at least 3 more cracking games left is great.

much better than the football :cool:

pyramuid man

Tipperary ftw.

Erin Go Brath

Strongly fancy Tipp here, leaving aside Waterfords tendency to bottle it in AI semis, Tipp are without doubt the form team and should be much to strong for Waterford.

Daysha

Erin Go Brath wrote: »

Strongly fancy Tipp here, leaving aside Waterfords tendency to bottle it in AI semis.

And what about Tipps tendency to bottle it in Croker in general? Here's their Croke Park record since they won the All Ireland in 2001:

2007: Lost to Wexford
2006: Lost to Waterford
2005: Lost to Galway
2004: DNP
2003: Lost to Kilkenny
2003: Beat Offaly
2002: Lost to Kilkenny
2002: Beat Antrim

Played 7, lost 5, and beat 2 teams who were hardly world beaters at the time

Orizio

Yes but this is Tipp at their strongest, and Waterford at their weakest, for a few years now.

Tipp for me, although I'm sure it will be tight.

Erin Go Brath

deise59 wrote: »

And what about Tipps tendency to bottle it in Croker in general? Here's their Croke Park record since they won the All Ireland in 2001:

2007: Lost to Wexford
2006: Lost to Waterford
2005: Lost to Galway
2004: DNP
2003: Lost to Kilkenny
2003: Beat Offaly
2002: Lost to Kilkenny
2002: Beat Antrim

Played 7, lost 5, and beat 2 teams who were hardly world beaters at the time

They are both bottlers (to a degree) if you want to look at it like that. Waterford have lost i think 4 or 5 semis in the last decade and haven't made a single final , but certainly last year they had by far the more talented players than Limerick but bottled it in spectacular fashion.

Waterford didn't impress me against Wexford, and they face a much tougher task against Tipperary. It would be nice to see this Waterford team who have given so much to the hurling championship in the last few years, make it to a final. I just don't think this is the year though.

Daysha

Kilkenny it is then that awaits the winner. I would guess that both camps would've quietly preferred Cork given both Tipp and Waterfords recent record against them but to be the best you got to beat the best, and Kilkenny are far and away the best team in the country.

tonc76

What time is this game scheduled for next week? Ticketmaster has a 2pm throw in - is this right? I presume there is a minor semi on before the game and no game after it so why a 2pm start?

Mossy Monk

The tv program finishes at 5.20 rather than 6pm last week so it will definately be on earlier.

tonc76

In light of that I'd say the minor game is at 2:00 and the senior game will have a 3:30 throw in

Deedsie

Tipp will win it sunday. Waterfords Eoin Kelly will be marked out of it. Lets see how Ken gets on with Tipps full forward line. Eoin Kelly, Lar Corbett switching & Webster for the last ten minutes to finish it off. Goals a plenty id say. Dismal record in croker of late, but we have been a divided county. 5 managers since 2002. Things are different this year, unity and pride are back in the team.

Players would only love a crack at Kilkenny, and when tipp teams get to all ireland finals its always a competitive match. Kilkenny are deserved favourites for AI and it would take a monumental effort for Tipp to stay with them. But tipp have done everything else asked of them this year. So for that alone they deserve a crack at the best...

Mushy

I dont know what to think regards this one. I think its a big challenge for Tipp, and the pressure is huge. Wasn't expecting the team to get tto this stage this year, but they have, and they've overcome some big obstacles to do so, so in that respect I dont see why they cant go one further. Just once they dont get too far ahead of themselves I think Tipp will maintain the advantage, and go through. I wont say any more!

Daysha

1 Clinton Hennessy
2 Eoin Murphy
3 Ken McGrath
4. Aidan Kearney
5. Declan Prendergast
6 Tony Browne
7 Kevin Moran
8 Michael Walsh ( Capt )
9 Jamie Nagle
10 Dan Shanahan
11 Seamus Prendergast
12 Stephen Molumphy
13 Eoin McGrath
14 Eoin Kelly
15 John Mullane

Looks like Davys started to use some Justin McCarthy psychology, because i'll be very surprised if the two half back lines start like that, although I am surprised to see Moran ahead of Murray. I wont be surprised now if Declan Prendergast started at full back, Tony moved out on the wing and Ken started in the centre back

HeatLoad

Cant see Waterford doing it, would like to, but cant. Tipp v Kilkenny final with kilkenny to win by a few points but handy enough. Not doing any good for the sport with the big three back in contention, waterford excluded. Thought Loughnane might have made a difference with galway this year but no show. Anyone know if hes still in the job? Cant see anything happening in other counties bar maybe erm....

CyberDave

HeatLoad wrote: »

Thought Loughnane might have made a difference with galway this year but no show. Anyone know if hes still in the job? Cant see anything happening in other counties bar maybe erm....

I think there was to be a county board meeting last Tuesday to decide whether or not he stayed. I didn't hear anything about that though. The longer it goes on the more chance it seems that he will stay. It would be better if he stepped down.

Pigletlover

HeatLoad wrote: »

Not doing any good for the sport with the big three back in contention, waterford excluded.

Call me biased, but I think it's great to see Tipperary back in it, it's been 7 years since Tipp had any success so I don't think it's entirely fair to label them as another Cork or Kilkenny, who have dominated hurling for the last while. I think it's great for hurling that a team who fell apart last year have turned things around to this year win the League (having beaten, Waterford, Kilkenny and Galway), the Munster championship, and to still be in the running for an All Ireland Final.

I'm not going to make any predictions for Sunday, obviously I'm hoping that Tipp will win, but I'm not taking anything for granted. Some people on here are talking of an easy win for Tipp, but I think it will be very close, all the pressure is on Tipp and Waterford will be happy with their underdog tag. Waterford haven't been impressive this year, but I see that as more of a worry and I can see Davy Fitz having them fired up to ninety, so I won't be writing them off.

deisedevil

deise59 wrote: »

1 Clinton Hennessy
2 Eoin Murphy
3 Ken McGrath
4. Aidan Kearney
5. Declan Prendergast
6 Tony Browne
7 Kevin Moran
8 Michael Walsh ( Capt )
9 Jamie Nagle
10 Dan Shanahan
11 Seamus Prendergast
12 Stephen Molumphy
13 Eoin McGrath
14 Eoin Kelly
15 John Mullane

Looks like Davys started to use some Justin McCarthy psychology, because i'll be very surprised if the two half back lines start like that, although I am surprised to see Moran ahead of Murray. I wont be surprised now if Declan Prendergast started at full back, Tony moved out on the wing and Ken started in the centre back

How can you be that surprised that Moran is in ahead of Murray. Murray for the last two years has been hopeless. Last year he was taken off in EVERY game he started and this year he has played no competitive hurling whatsoever. I'm surprised Moran is starting but damn glad it's not Murray

Daysha

Sorry, my mistake. Meant to say him ahead of Brian Phelan, not Murray.

deisedevil

deise59 wrote: »

Sorry, my mistake. Meant to say him ahead of Brian Phelan, not Murray.

Ah, that would make more sense alright. Moran must have been seriously impressing in training to have got in ahead of Sullivan, Kennedy and Phelan. I hope it pays off, bit worried about it to be honest. Wth the current team selection I'd like to see the defense line up with:

Kearney Prendergast Murphy

Browne McGrath Moran

tonc76

deisedevil wrote: »

Ah, that would make more sense alright. Moran must have been seriously impressing in training to have got in ahead of Sullivan, Kennedy and Phelan. I hope it pays off, bit worried about it to be honest. Wth the current team selection I'd like to see the defense line up with:

Kearney Prendergast Murphy

Browne McGrath Moran

You've got it in one

Thats how we'll start

Roll on Sunday:pac:

Kojak

I'd say Tipp will take this one with about 3 points to spare.

They seem to have a more settled/well balanced team than Waterford. The obvious instability is putting Ken McGrath back at full-back. IMO he is not suited to the role (i.e. too loose and still thinking like a player playing at number 6).

Tipp are not as reliant on Eoin Kelly this year, and the likes of Lar Corbett and John O'Brien are finally delivering on all the talk that was about them for the last few years. In fact, IMO Corbett is in line for an All-Star given the way he is playing this year.

Tipp to reach the final, but on last weeks showing by KK, I dont think either team on Sunday will beat the cats.

phase-3

I would love to see waterford beat Tipp. Waterford have been knocking on the door for so long and only being edged in the semi's everytime. Look waterford have a great record in beating tipp so they have nothing to fear. I know its stupid in saying waterford deserve an all ireland but the like of Tony Browne and co need one. Like a lot are coming to the last hurdle and this is really it..do or die. I would love like a lot of Dub's to see waterford win. They are like our football team in getting to semi finals quite frequently. So hopefully a Waterford and Dublin win this weekend. And I would love to see big Dan back to his best for sunday. Mullane is flying at the moment and will no doubt kick some bit of fear into that tipp back line and of course brendan cummins. Waterford to win by 2!

CantGetNoSleep

deisedevil wrote: »

Ah, that would make more sense alright. Moran must have been seriously impressing in training to have got in ahead of Sullivan, Kennedy and Phelan. I hope it pays off, bit worried about it to be honest. Wth the current team selection I'd like to see the defense line up with:

Kearney Prendergast Murphy

Browne McGrath Moran

Hope we start like that too, Ken has to play CB, him CB and Brick in midfield firing on all cylinders is what we need

One in a row - we can do it lads

Flukey

I have a good ticket for the upper Cusack Stand for Sunday. From there I hope to see a Waterford win, and then in a few weeks I hope to see them win another match in Croke Park.

BIG-SLICK-POKER

As davy Fitz says i would rather go in to a game not having played to there full potential yet rather then have given there all so far.

For those who doubt Waterford i ask How can Tipp have improved so much in One year last yaer they were terrible they win the Munster this year and its their year same boat as Waterford were in last term , Our boat sank .

I feel if Waterford Perform in the BACKLINE they will take this its not a problem through midfield or forwards . Ken is out of position and it leaks goals he is usually the oe driving forward after the catch but its hard where he is .

My prediction

Waterford by 4 Points

cruiserweight

Great start by Waterford but Tipp are coming back into it. My usual source for watching it is not available today so I am listening on the radio

taidghbaby

missing a good match cruiserweight!!

waterford are playing as a team more than like a bunch of individuals than they normally do!
however they really should have a 5/6 points lead for the amount of hurling they've done!

Sully

What a game.. so tough to call.

sam34

nailbiting! and im a neutral...

Sully

GO ON THE DEISE!!!!

Fair play Tipp, ye played a wonderful game. Fantastic game. Thanks for making it such a great day!

cruiserweight

Fair play to Waterford, first final since 1963

Nalced_irl

Congratz to Waterford.

Fran1985

fantastic game. fantastic scene in croke park too. some dodgey camera work explained with the fact that the camera man was from waterford and was obviously excited.

great stuff tho from Davey Fitz and the boys

johnnyq

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Euro_Kraut

Incredible stuff. Real sport that. Event though I was up for Tipp - Well done Waterford. Deserved it for all the excitement they have given the game over the 6/7 years.

Now go beat the cats!

sam34

excellent game, well done waterford

smashey

I think Waterford would be a good place to be tonight.

Congratulations to them. I really enjoyed that game although it got a bit nerve wracking near the end and I'm neutral as well.

Het-Field

Very enjoyable. Put all my troubles behind me after yesterdays debacle. Shame that one team had to lose, however, I congratulate Waterford and I hope they do us all a favour !

run_Forrest_run

certainly not an excellent game but it was an exciting game.
Waterford were the better team and deserved to win possibly by more. Tipp were too wasteful and too sloppy, perhaps they peaked too soon. Sixth time lucky for the blues.

dreamer_ire

But for my dog I'd have been there today... what a fantastic result, well done boys. Tipp made a great match of it but I think Waterford just shaved it

ps my dog is free to a good home on Sept 7th!!

KevIRL

Just back home from the game. After all the years of leaving Croke Park as beaten semi finalists, the feeling at the end of the game today was incredibile.

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

A well done to Tipp aslo, they provided a great game and really it could have gone either way.