Friend never had job

Claire121

I'm just posting this on behalf of my friend who doesn't have an account here. She will be 24 next month and has never had a paying job. She has just finished college with a 2:1 in modern languages. She is currently abroad for a few months but when she comes back she wants to work for a year or two before going back to college, just temping in an office or something to do with languages. I think it's going to be very difficult for her since she has no experience, especially right now. I started temping a few months ago and a lot of recruiters told me I needed a lot more experience, and I did have reception and some admin on my CV, and 7 months in a call centre. She also doesn't have any references from a paying job, would this also matter? She has done some voluntary work but I was told this isn't really acceptable (I also have some on my CV) as a) not as much is expected of you when you're working for free and b) you're pretty much doing them a favour so they can't really give you a bad reference. Any advice?

Pete4779

If her degree is in languages, does that mean she can speak something besides English fluently? There are loads of jobs eg. in Brussels for people with several langages and translators or interpreters.

Claire121

Yes she speaks French but I think she wants to stay in Dublin and do office work, as its not a long term plan.

Not to mention I think it's actually very difficult to get work in Brussels (see my thread 'what to do with languages?)

the_syco

Claire121 wrote: »

She has done some voluntary work but I was told this isn't really acceptable

How much, was it full or part time, etc? Usually useless, unless the same skills would be used in her job. Eg: she did volunteer work with the homeless, and the job she went for was working with the homeless.

Heisenberg.

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Deadeyes

The Scientist wrote: »

I dont mean to pry but how does someone go 24 years without any work experience?

I dunno, I wanted to go 80 years without having to work but I failed miserably.
How seriously does your friend want a job? I mean how hard would it have been to set up an account herself to ask the question? Since she's looking for a first job, and with no experience, I guess she going to have to lower her expectations a bit and try a Mc job, waitress, part-time shop assistant, supermarket or something like that.

Claire121

How much, was it full or part time, etc? Usually useless, unless the same skills would be used in her job. Eg: she did volunteer work with the homeless, and the job she went for was working with the homeless.

It was only about a month in the summers as far as I know. It was abroad so she would have used her French, but she hasn't done any admin work or anything, only volunteering in youth camps and the like.

I dont mean to pry but how does someone go 24 years without any work experience?

I would consider her a bit spoiled, meaning that she gets everything she wants handed to her by her parents. They paid for all her college accommodation and costs, they pay for her to go away in the summer, her clothes etc. I tried to tell her that she should really have gotten paid employment, even if just for her CV but she didn't see the point when her parents paid for everything. My personal view would be that 23, 24 is way too old to be doing that but she doesn't seem to agree. She thinks her voluntary experience is the same thing, again I don't agree.

How seriously does your friend want a job? I mean how hard would it have been to set up an account herself to ask the question? Since she's looking for a first job, and with no experience, I guess she going to have to lower her expectations a bit and try a Mc job, waitress, part-time shop assistant, supermarket or something like that.

I don't think she has thought about it seriously. She seems to think she'll just walk into an office job because she has a degree tbh.

niallk

Tell her to go on the Dole. Give up on life. Become bitter. Squeeze out a few ankle biters. That's my plan. Don't wreck my buzz maaaaaaaan.

Heisenberg.

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Firetrap

I still remember two things the careers officer said to us when I started in college. One was that going to college wasn't the same as getting a job. The other: that even if your summer job entailed nothing more than selling ice-cream or something, it did show that you could hold down a job.

Having a McJob for a few months would do your friend's career prospects no harm at all. Mind you, in these times getting one is another story. If I was an employer and someone came to me with a CV with no work experience on it, I would be asking why. Generally people omit to mention jobs on their CV if they got sacked from them and hide the evidence with something else.

Your friend's voluntary work - can some of it be "changed" so that it looks like paid employment? I don't think realistically that most Irish employers are going to start chasing down places in France.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Lie on the CV. Put down a couple of summer jobs with a sandwich company that has since gone out of business and she unfortunately lost touch with the owner. Worked for me.

Try call centres with high staff turnover. Directory Enquirires (are Conduit still hiring just about anyone?!), mobile phone customer service, ebay, google (assuming they're still in Dublin) where languages are an advantage. But try DIRECTLY - don't wait for ads or agencies - just mail the CV.

Crumble Froo

Firetrap wrote: »

Your friend's voluntary work - can some of it be "changed" so that it looks like paid employment? I don't think realistically that most Irish employers are going to start chasing down places in France.

on that note... im in nz working for 50c more than min wage, and my employers rang my last boss, as well as my old school before employing me... just thought i'd throw that one out there.

Firetrap

It can happen of course. I was thinking more of the language barrier coming into play, though if she was going into a job where French is spoken, that could put the kibosh on that.

spinandscribble

trust me, finding jobs in shops is VERY difficult at the moment, even with some good work experience.
could she not teach french grinds? be a sub?

Gillo

The Scientist wrote: »

As i thought.. Silver Spoon Syndrome.
Hmm, i dont think there is any advice to offer.

That's what I thought also, the only advice I can think off is to lash out as many CV's as she can and be prepared for a lot of "No". Start looking for a basic or Mcjob, work her a$$ off for a few months and it'll be easier to move up to a slightly better job.

Maybe it's envy on my part, but I really don't have any sympathy for; her living off her parents at the age of twenty four- WTF:eek:

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Gillo wrote: »

That's what I thought also, the only advice I can think off is to lash out as many CV's as she can and be prepared for a lot of "No". Start looking for a basic or Mcjob, work her a$$ off for a few months and it'll be easier to move up to a slightly better job.

Maybe it's envy on my part, but I really don't have any sympathy for; her living off her parents at the age of twenty four- WTF:eek:

Hey - a lot of us would have done it if we could.

jimi_t

Given her proficiency with languages, she would probably do herself a favour by starting a TEFL course - you're almost guaranteed employment in Ireland, and certainly abroad. Not great money, but for someone in her early 20s it would be perfect.

Running Bing

Claire121 wrote: »

It was only about a month in the summers as far as I know. It was abroad so she would have used her French, but she hasn't done any admin work or anything, only volunteering in youth camps and the like.

So it was a fell good vacation? i.e. a holiday where you do a bit of volunteer work? That will count for even less tbh.

Claire121

I don't know all the details, but I know she was cleaning the toilets, making the beds, serving food etc. It's probably still no use though, I had paid employment in France as a maid and it doesn't really count for anything.

TEFL is a good idea, that's what I'm hoping to do very soon as well.

jimi_t

Claire121 wrote: »

TEFL is a good idea, that's what I'm hoping to do very soon as well.

As am I - there's always going to be work in it, and the Irish are apparently valued for having a more neutral (:D) accent overall. I know of a person who's been over in Vietnam doing it for about 2 years now and absolutely adores it.

von Neumann

It will just be a matter of who she knows,
and lets face it most people get there jobs this way, particularly in hard times!
She'll be grand as long as she's not to "work shy" and is willing to use her contacts.

funky_monkey

You are too good a friend and you remind me of myself when I printed off job after job for my friend who constantly complained about her job and did nothing about it herself!

She should pick up a job in a call centre no problem. They are always crying out for people. And having an extra language is a great advantage!

krd

She'll be fine. If she applies to someone like my previous boss. He really liked to employ and promote people with no experience or no real knowledge of what they were doing.

Her degree might be a problem. Any sign of intelligence could mark her out as a 'trouble maker'

She shouldn't have a problem. She can be one of those thick lazy people, who never turn up for work but get paid loads. Like a payroll clerk - av pay 50K ... alot of money for unskilled work ,, but that's what they get paid.

irishbran77

I'm in sort of the same situation myself right now. I graduated from college but in between I spent every summer working in tough manual labour jobs abroad. Sadly these jobs didn't come with the necessary visas for the country I was in, so none of my previous employers would dream of being a referee for me! And the jobs I had in school were all short term factory ones with businesses long gone.

I'm guessing for myself the best route would be to enter an unpaid voluntary position in any field even slightly related to a masters program I want to enter into. This will mean that when I'm out of the grad course, I can ignore the work employment section and put down this unpaid position as my only RELEVANT work experience. On the other hand your friend can look for a masters that gives part time work experience placements as part of the package. It was all a concern of mine last year but now with the economy the way it is I've has entered a higher level of stress!!

corkgal1981

I also have a degree in languages as well as an MA in another area and I certainly wouldnt have been able to stroll into an office job after uni just because of my qualifications. I worked since I was 16 and all the way through college (except one year I had to study abroad - which I saved for).
I have friends like yours and they have loads of qualifications but nothing to prove that they are capable, reliable, independent-thinkers etc. I have a decent enough job at the moment and its all down to me having a good track record with past employers.
I would advise your friend to take whatever job she can get for now. Its no easy matter securing a job at the moment and she needs to lower her expectations. At the same time she should keep on applying for jobs that she wants. She doesnt have to stick with a job she hates for ages. She should also look into doing something postgrad, a skill would be great, from my experience the only jobs with languages alone are call-centres and I really didnt find those jobs secure or fulfilling.

Royale with Cheese

Definitely lie on the CV. Get her to stick down people she knows as fake references. What's the worst that could come of it?

toiletduck

The Scientist wrote: »

I dont mean to pry but how does someone go 24 years without any work experience?

Amazing alright.

Ishmael

Call center or TEFL would be her best bet i would say. Probably her biggest difficulty would be getting an interview for an office job as quite a lot of places look for any reason to eliminate C.V's when considering people for a role. Lack of experience will probably get it thrown out faster than anything else.

Although i don't agree with it, lying on the C.V. could boost her chances of getting an interview, but she should make sure to be well prepared to talk about the work she didn't do and be able to answer questions on it. Any half-competent interviewer will see through it fairly quickly otherwise.

Shiny

Royale with Cheese wrote: »

Definitely lie on the CV. Get her to stick down people she knows as fake references. What's the worst that could come of it?

Pretty silly.

All they have to do is ring one of the "people you know" and they will
find out after about 3 questions that they are not the person you
stated them to be.

Lying on your CV will only get you so far and will at most get you the
interview where they will catch you out.

Then if you manage to get past those hurdles and get a job they will
soon see that you have not actually done the work you have claimed
to have done. They will then recheck your references and then bye bye.

the_syco

irishbran77 wrote: »

I'm in sort of the same situation myself right now. I graduated from college but in between I spent every summer working in tough manual labour jobs abroad. Sadly these jobs didn't come with the necessary visas for the country I was in, so none of my previous employers would dream of being a referee for me! And the jobs I had in school were all short term factory ones with businesses long gone.

I'm betting your work etiquette is better than the one born with a silver spoon, who may see certain jobs "beneath" her. If you go for a job, they could ask questions about stuff you did in the jobs. Leadership, following orders, accountability etc, etc.

Royale with Cheese

Shiny wrote: »

Pretty silly.

All they have to do is ring one of the "people you know" and they will
find out after about 3 questions that they are not the person you
stated them to be.

Lying on your CV will only get you so far and will at most get you the
interview where they will catch you out.

Then if you manage to get past those hurdles and get a job they will
soon see that you have not actually done the work you have claimed
to have done. They will then recheck your references and then bye bye.

As in lie to say they did some summer work in tescos etc, or some cafe that's mysteriously gone out of business. They're not gonna care about what you did there. And it will look a lot better then never having worked a day in your life at 24.

Actually OP get your friend to just go to a temp agency. I hadn't ever had an office job before this year and I really don't think the agency checked my references (I'd worked in a place part time all the way through college, I said it involved a lot of officey things when I really just sat in an office in the evening letting people in and out). If she's in any way likeable and has some kind of computer skills she should be at least in with a chance of getting something (I'm not sure what the demand for temps is at the minute)

Claire121

So, my friend got a job in a shop after searching for a good while. She couldn't get office work or temping - thanks for all the suggestions though.

She's still totally clueless about the real world however - she said she didn't understand why other people needed so much to live on while job hunting, that she was managing fine on 30 quid a week and shopping at Lidl - well of course she's living rent free in a house daddy bought :rolleyes: I said if she had to get 500e plus bills out of nowhere every month she mightn't be so relaxed. Ah, she just doesn't get it, but the thing is she probably never will, as her parents are always going to be paying for her and helping her out. She'll never ever have to worry about saving for her Masters or paying the rent, her money is all for food and and entertainment. Nice for some

Raskolnikov

Your friend should have no problem getting a semi-relevant job using her degree. Lots of technical support jobs there, I wouldn't let that frighten you though, they're generally pretty handy.

http://www.jobs.ie/Jobs.aspx?Categories=61&Keywords=french

Oh, and this talk of unpaid work/nixers/etc being irrelevant is nonsense! I have never once heard of an employer dismissing unpaid/seasonal/nixer type work. It all counts!

mountainyman

Lie, Cafe Irie in temple bar changed hands a few years ago. She worked there as a student.
She worked for a builder that's gone bust, you are her her referee.

She can be her own reference buy a sim card for 5 euro. She worked in Brussels, New York, Tokyo

Lie

Celtise

i recently got my first office job. now i have worked before its just it was for family and thus a lot of employers discounted it without realising it was actual real hard graft i had to do. i found that employers prefered the truth and knew what capabilities were rather than lying which i have previously done using the friend as reference thing mentioned above.

noel farrell

i dont think she is looking too hard for a job she is happy with ma and da payrooling her she will continue to do course after course she will tell you its adding to her cv she will become a pro student cop on cheers:D