JD Power survey in Germany - Honda tops it again with BMW second

E92

VW might be Germany's most sold car but it comes in 10th from the bottom, only 1 better than Renault, 2 better than Ford and 3 better than FIAT.

Chevrolet, Suzuki and Citroen take the wooden spoons, in last, 2nd last, and 3rd last respectively.

At the top end Honda are first again, while BMW is second, followed by Toyota, Audi, Mazda, and Daihatsu. Merc are 7th, while Skoda are 8th and the second best VAG brand.

In terms of best individual performers in the various classes, well the Aygo is the best city car, the Jazz is the most satisfying supermini, the Civic and Prius are the best small cars and family cars respectively, the Corolla Verso is the best MPV, the X3 is the best SUV(how?), the CLK is the best sports car, and the 3 series is the best executive car.

Story here(apologies to all the non German speakers here:o).

ninty9er

23 marques isn't a very complete survey now, is it??

(Und ja. Ich spreche deutsch)

copacetic

ninty9er wrote: »

23 marques isn't a very complete survey now, is it??

(Und ja. Ich spreche deutsch)

actually it is, it covers every marque with a statistically significant amount of sales.

unkel

Always interesting to see the results of surveys like this. But let's remember, the JD Power surveys are only about one thing - customer satisfaction!

A simplistic example: a housewife only interested in a white goods car that is very reliable and has a big boot will vote 10 out of 10 for a Skoda Octavia. A status symbol sensitive executive spending big money on a Mercedes E-class will expect top dollar customer service if something should go wrong (which itself is a below expectation situation). Mark downs here would be sharp and swift

E92

JD Power has a reputation worldwide and is also found in the UK and the US(it started off in the US actually).

Interesting that most of the results are similar over there to what is found in the UK.

Most Japs doing very well, a few not so well, some German brands doing well, others not so well, and the usual suspects doing badly.

Sounds familiar?

JHMEG

Where is Lexus? When it comes to reliability, luxury, prestige, dealer service, badge snobbery, etc etc they pretty much have it all.

copacetic

just a note that they say, porsche, alfa, chrysler, mini, smart and subaru were included in the study but not ranked due to sample size. Maybe lexus are included in their parent? Weird though.

Zube

JHMEG wrote: »

Where is Lexus?

Nowhere. It's a survey in Germany. Why would the Germans buy Japanese imitation BMWs and Mercs when they can get real ones?

copacetic

Zube wrote: »

Nowhere. It's a survey in Germany. Why would the Germans buy Japanese imitation BMWs and Mercs when they can get real ones?

:rolleyes:lexus cars have won out in these surveys in the past

Anan1

Zube wrote: »

Nowhere. It's a survey in Germany. Why would the Germans buy Japanese imitation BMWs and Mercs when they can get real ones?

Reliability?:)

Zube

OK, how many Lexusses have been sold in Germany? Ever?

JHMEG

Zube wrote: »

Why would the Germans buy Japanese imitation BMWs and Mercs when they can get real ones?

The same reason they prefer Honda to BMW I guess.

Zube

JHMEG wrote: »

The same reason they prefer Honda to BMW I guess.

Except that Honda appear in the survey results, and Lexus don't.

Because Honda are a real brand, and Lexus are just a Xerox of last years BM and Merc models. Ooh, with Hybrid technology!

copacetic

sweet jebus, is there any brand that someone on boards isn't rabidly and irrantionally against?

Zube

copacetic wrote: »

sweet jebus, is there any brand that someone on boards isn't rabidly and irrantionally against?

Fiat.

bazz26

copacetic wrote: »

sweet jebus, is there any brand that someone on boards isn't rabidly and irrantionally against?

Its called tunnel vision.

The fact that VW is 10th from bottom in that survey but yet is the best selling brand says alot about a coutries patriotic buying hapits too.

bazz26

Zube wrote: »

Nowhere. It's a survey in Germany. Why would the Germans buy Japanese imitation BMWs and Mercs when they can get real ones?

They buy Audis don't they?

Climate Expert

Honda scored 84.9% and VW scored 80.5% which is as near as makes no difference.

They might they might be 13 places down the list but the list is fairly meaningless given the margins.

JHMEG

Zube wrote: »

Lexus are just a Xerox of last years BM and Merc models. Ooh, with Hybrid technology!

Lexus is the one brand that has it all.

maidhc

Climate Expert wrote: »

Honda scored 84.9% and VW scored 80.5% which is as near as makes no difference.

They might they might be 13 places down the list but the list is fairly meaningless given the margins.

Very good point.

JHMEG

J.D. Power and Associates and AUTO TESTS Report:

Honda Ranks Highest for a Second Consecutive Year in Satisfying
Vehicle Owners in Germany

Toyota’s Prius Remains the Most Satisfying Model to Own in Germany

Munich: 20 June 2008—For a second consecutive year, Honda ranks highest among automotive brands in satisfying new-vehicle owners, according to the J.D. Power and Associates 2008 Germany Customer Satisfaction Index (CSI) StudySM released today in cooperation with AUTO TESTS.

Now in its seventh year, the study examines customer satisfaction with new vehicles and vehicle service after two years of ownership. Owners provide detailed evaluations of their vehicles and dealers, which cover 77 attributes grouped in four measurements of satisfaction. In order of importance, they are: quality and reliability (30%); vehicle appeal (25%), which includes performance, design, comfort and features; dealer service satisfaction (23%); and ownership costs (22%), which includes fuel consumption, insurance and costs of service/repair.

In the nameplate rankings, Honda leads with a customer satisfaction score of 849 on a 1,000-point scale. Honda performs particularly well in service satisfaction. Following Honda in the rankings is BMW with 845, an increase of 13 index points from 2007. BMW performs well in appeal, and quality and reliability. Toyota, Audi, Mazda, Daihatsu, Mercedes-Benz, Skoda, Volvo and Nissan also perform above the industry average in overall customer satisfaction.

“Overall satisfaction is at its highest level since the launch of the study in 2002, improving by 48 index points from 2002 to 815 in 2008,” said Martin Volk, senior research manager at J.D. Power and Associates in Europe. “More customers report being ‘delighted’ rather than merely satisfied, which could lead to financial benefits for manufacturers. For example, customers who are particularly pleased with an exceptional product and service experience are more than twice as likely to repurchase the same vehicle brand compared with those with lower satisfaction levels.”

With an index score of 888, the Toyota Prius ranks highest among all models in the study for a second consecutive year. The Prius performs particularly well in the ownership costs, and quality and reliability measures.

“A hybrid car leading the customer satisfaction rankings for a second year indicates the industry’s shift to more environmentally friendly vehicles,” said Olaf Schilling, chief editor of AUTO TESTS. “The Toyota Prius receives high ratings from customers in fuel consumption, which will become more of a factor in overall satisfaction as fuel prices increase.”

Toyota captures three top model awards, while Honda and BMW each earn two.

The highest-ranked models in each of the study’s seven segments are:

* Toyota Aygo (basic car)
* Honda Jazz (small car)
* Honda Civic (lower medium)
* Toyota Prius (upper medium)
* BMW 5 Series (executive/luxury), which earns an award for a second consecutive year
* Toyota Corolla Verso (MPV), which earns an award for a fourth consecutive year
* BMW X3 (SUV)

The 2008 Germany Customer Satisfaction Index (CSI) Study is based on the evaluations of more than 19,000 car owners in Germany after an average of two years of ownership. The study includes 23 brands and 103 models. J.D. Power and Associates conducts CSI studies around the world, including Europe (France, Germany, United Kingdom); North America (Canada, Mexico, United States); Asia Pacific (China, India, Indonesia, Japan, Malaysia, New Zealand, Philippines, Taiwan, Thailand); and Africa (South Africa).

A summary overview can be found in the June 20, 2008 edition of AUTO BILD. More comprehensive study results are published in the June 25, 2008 issue of AUTO TESTS.

maidhc

JHMEG wrote: »

J.D. Power and Associates and AUTO TESTS Report:
....

Toyota’s Prius Remains the Most Satisfying Model to Own in Germany

Yeah, but, you see at least 90% of Prius owners will probably vote a cucumber or carrot as the most satistying piece of food they have ever eaten.

JHMEG

maidhc wrote: »

Yeah, but, you see at least 90% of Prius owners will probably vote a cucumber or carrot as the most satistying piece of food they have ever eaten.

Or sauerkraut and strudel?

Their emphasis, not mine.. Fact remains tho that the Germans love it more than any other car.

peasant

JHMEG wrote: »

Fact remains tho that the Germans love it more than any other car.

Fact is that those that own a Prius are happier with it than those that own something else.

That's easily explained...no other car comes with a Hollywood endorsed bootfull of environmental one-upmanship.
That's hard to beat. Plus it trumps any and all other minor concerns like looks, practicaility, speed, comfort, etc

JHMEG

Fact is that the nay-sayers forget that most people have owned more than one car. The lad that didn't give his Golf a thumbs up last year may be over-joyed with this Prius this year. Prius is no-one's first car.

cancan

Funny how in the usa bmw and vw struggle.
Perhaps they add more problems for the worlds biggest car market?

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings/quality-ratings-by-brand

Both are loosing money hand over fist in the usa over quality problems.....

copacetic

cancan wrote: »

Funny how in the usa bmw and vw struggle.
Perhaps they add more problems for the worlds biggest car market?

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings/quality-ratings-by-brand

Both are loosing money hand over fist in the usa over quality problems.....

is that the right link? it shows BM gettin 2 3* marks, 2 4* marks and a 5* mark?

L1011

Zube wrote: »

Fiat.

No, we've plenty of people with irrational rants against them too, generally people who've never driven one and are going on 'a friend of a friend...' experiences on 1990s models.

S.I.R

Zube wrote: »

Fiat.

i truely hate faits.... its not even funny.... i refuse to work on them, alot of money to be made but jasus there a pain in the bum with all them bosche parts !

L1011

MYOB wrote: »

No, we've plenty of people with irrational rants against them too, generally people who've never driven one and are going on 'a friend of a friend...' experiences on 1990s models.

S.I.R wrote: »

i truely hate faits.... its not even funny.... i refuse to work on them, alot of money to be made but jasus there a pain in the bum with all them bosche parts !

The prosecution rests its case....

copacetic

pretty sure Zube meant it as a joke, and a funny one at that, did ye not hear the whoosh sound?

E92

I wouldn't be getting too excited.

Honda's overall quality rating is the same as BMW's(3 out of 5). BMW's Powertrain quality and Body and Mechanical quality were 4 and 5 versus Honda's 3 for both too. Honda did beat BMW's features and accessories getting 4 to BMW's 3.

Loads of supposedly more reliable brands than BMW get 3 out of 5 as well.

Scion, Toyota's youth brand in the US gets 2 out of 5 overall.

Only Porsche manages 5 out of 5 overall.

Where's the evidence that BMW "struggle"? For everything to do with durability they get 4 out of 5 or better barring the mechanical quality of features and accessories where they get 3 out of 5. They do pretty sh!t in the design alright I admit.

Remember that the JD Power survey is a measure of whether a car lives up to the owners' expectations, and therefore whatever comes first simply means that it lived up to its owners hopes and expectations better than anything else.

L1011

copacetic wrote: »

pretty sure Zube meant it as a joke, and a funny one at that, did ye not hear the whoosh sound?

If it was trying to be a joke, it wasn't in any way funny.

JHMEG

E92 wrote: »

I wouldn't be getting too excited.

Honda's overall quality rating is the same as BMW's(3 out of 5). BMW's Powertrain quality and Body and Mechanical quality were 4 and 5 versus Honda's 3 for both too. Honda did beat BMW's features and accessories getting 4 to BMW's 3.

Flip over to the second page and BMW gets pasted. No more than 2 stars under any heading. Honda gets 3, 3, 5 and 3.

copacetic

MYOB wrote: »

If it was trying to be a joke, it wasn't in any way funny.

yes it was, I asked did any brand not have rabid and irrational haters on boards and he replied fiat. as we all know they have plenty of irrational haters on boards.

The whoosh sound was the joke going waaayyyy over your head.

L1011

copacetic wrote: »

yes it was, I asked did any brand not have rabid and irrational haters on boards and he replied fiat. as we all know they have plenty of irrational haters on boards.

The whoosh sound was the joke going waaayyyy over your head.

I understood what you meant by the whoosh sound.

The point still stands that as a joke, it was absolutely and utterly terrible.