BA 747 at DUB this morning?

irlrobins

Parked on the apron near the B gates. Any one know what it's doing here?

highlydebased

Diverted in due to a late departure from JFK due to weather meaning it missed slots etc at LHR - bush was there also.

Crew went out of hours, 777 came into get pax.

irlrobins

Cheers! Unusual sight in DUB these days to see a 747

Davidth88

I bet the crew were happy about that !!

On the way home and they get diverted. Surprising they didn't go into somewhere in the UK ( Birmingham or somewhere like that ).

I remember a 777 dropping into DUB a few years ago because of an engine failure or something, I had to get a tkt from the BA desk which is usually deserted and there was a huge queue of disgruntled Americans there.....I used the ' I have a flight to catch ' line and jumped the queue I am afraid ( well I had a flight to catch and I was just picking up tkts )

FunkyDa

Taken, in the wee hours.

Tenger

Davidth88 wrote: »

I bet the crew were happy about that !!

On the way home and they get diverted. Surprising they didn't go into somewhere in the UK ( Birmingham or somewhere like that ).

They were in the take off queue in JFK when they refiles a flight plan JFK-DUB as at that stage they only has fuel for that. Bad weather at JFK caused havoc with all flights. (EI had to return to gate with an aircraft as the delays was so long) The BA plan was to refuel at DUB however the closure of LHR due to GW Bush scuppered their plans and the crew went "out of hours".
Flight and Cabin crew have very strict limits on how mnay hours they can be on duty for.

muppet01

there was also a virgin a340 on the apron yesterday as well,must have been for the same reason

My Thoughts

I saw the 747 take-off as I waited for my flight - the dust she kicked up was great:D

Davidth88

Flight and Cabin crew have very strict limits on how mnay hours they can be on duty for.

Yep well aware of that.

JFK is a nightmare for delays isn't it, I flew out of there 3 weeks ago and we were nearly 1 hr late taking off after pushing back on time

Quite surprising that the B747 didn't have enough fuel ( or the A340 for that matter ) , do the 747's still hve the regulation in place to fill up the underbelly fuel tank since the Air India explosion ?

I have to laugh about the US president , the security is a bit over the top to say the least , The Queen I think would only have a purple corridor posted on the NOTAMs ( from my flying days 16 years ago .... )

Foggy43

There was no fuel issue! The Virgin / BA flight and cabin crews were out of hours. All at LHR knew Geroge Bush was coming but know one knew the time until he left Paris. LHR went to a one runway operation and the stack would mean holds of over an hour. With the delays both sides of the pond the crews went out of hours.

I have never known fuel in the CWT tank for a LHR JFK LHR service. Not even full wings. 105,000kgs max. A 747-400 full wings is 110,800kgs approx. Obviously it can be more or less depending on the fuels relative density. My figures are for a RD of 0.8.

ian_m

FunkyDa wrote: »

Taken, in the wee hours.

Thanks for that...

Tenger

Foggy43 wrote: »

There was no fuel issue! The Virgin / BA flight and cabin crews were out of hours. All at LHR knew Geroge Bush was coming but know one knew the time until he left Paris. LHR went to a one runway operation and the stack would mean holds of over an hour. With the delays both sides of the pond the crews went out of hours.

Yes but a BA flight would divert into MAN or BHX. I was told that they refiled the flightplan on the ground in JFK to get take-off (delays expected into LHR due GW) The current fuel on the a/c at that stage apparently restricted them to DUB as final destination,they planned to refuel in DUB. I read this info on airliners.net. Personally have no idea of the fuel onboard or needed for a B747 JFK-DUB.

Whichever it was that happened, it was good for the DUB spotters to see a change of scenery.

Rowley Birkin QC

First post in aviation forum so I'm sorry if it's a silly question.....

Is Dublin airport not strictly able to handle 747's or do they just usaully have no reason to be there?

I'm a student planner and one of our lecturers was involved in the planning of the extension of the airport, he seemed very frustrated as I think he said they wouldnt be able handle the A380 even after the extension. Is this true?

As I said first post here but have been interested in flying for a long time, went for Air Corps cadets twice with no luck, so apologies if it's been answered before.

ian_m

Dublin can handle 747s alright. Aer Lingus used to have a few of them operating the trans-atlantic routes up until about '95. Singapore Cargo used to fly in and out of Dublin up until last year. It was a 747.

Not so sure about the A380. I doubt Dublin is anywhere near ready for it.

Foggy43

All planned diversions are based on an airport with enough hotel accommodation in close prox to the airport. Spare aircraft are not always available. MAN and BHX are used as emergency diversions.

BA sent a B777 with crew to bring back the passengers.
Virgin sent a crew on an scheduled filght to DUB to bring back all in one go.

DUB can cater for 747's. It just no operator there operates them currently.

robinph

I thought Dublin was too short for a full 747 to get off the ground?

dats_right

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Aer-Lingus/Boeing-747-148/0673893/L/

Steyr

robinph wrote: »

I thought Dublin was too short for a full 747 to get off the ground?

Nope, infact you would be suprised what EIDW can take, However the runway and taxiways at Dublin Airport have not been designed to accommodate the A380, But planning has allowed for future modifications to allow A380 operations.

Also anybody got a heads up on the Second parallel RWY for EIDW?

IRLConor

robinph wrote: »

I thought Dublin was too short for a full 747 to get off the ground?

If Wikipedia's right, then so are you.

10/28 is the longest runway at 2,637m.

Takeoff runs at MTOW:

747-400: 3,018m
747-400ER: 3,090m

Foggy43

Just been checking the 747-400 flight manuals and there is a weight restriction for take off in DUB.
MTOW for DUB is about 370,000kgs on a standard day.

The MTOW for a 747-400 with RB211-524G2 Engines is 396,894kgs.

A small restriction really!

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/airports/acaps/7474sec3.pdf if anyone is interested maybe helpful.

robinph

So it would have been able to take off again without unloading all the passengers for a short hop to LHR after a touch of extra petrol. I guess they would not have been able to make it to the US in one go though when Aer Lingus were flying them without a stop in Shannon first?

IRLConor

robinph wrote: »

So it would have been able to take off again without unloading all the passengers for a short hop to LHR after a touch of extra petrol.

From the sound of things it was the crew hours that stopped them doing this.

robinph wrote: »

I guess they would not have been able to make it to the US in one go though when Aer Lingus were flying them without a stop in Shannon first?

I reckon they could have, at least to the east coast.

Aer Lingus had Boeing 747-100s which have a range, fully loaded of 5,300nm. DUB-JFK is 2,763nm (great circle). Remove a whole bunch of unneeded fuel (max fuel is about 140 tons, MTOW is about 330 tons) and you'd probably get the weight down to the point that you could have done DUB-JFK direct.

Foggy43

DUB JFK is a short trip in terms of the 747-400 and the 100/200/300 series for that matter. Considering these aircraft will fly sectors 12 to 14 hours and DUB JFK a 5 to 6 hour trip the aircraft leaving DUB will be no where near it's MTOW.

FunkyDa

Steyr wrote: »

Nope, infact you would be suprised what EIDW can take, However the runway and taxiways at Dublin Airport have not been designed to accommodate the A380, But planning has allowed for future modifications to allow A380 operations.

Also anybody got a heads up on the Second parallel RWY for EIDW?

http://www.dublinairportauthority.com/Airport_Development/Parallel_Runway/

highlydebased

As mentioned above 747s would have no problem leaving EIDW with fuel for JFK or BOS etc

The shannon stopover was a political thing, not due to technical reasons

Our man in Havana

Aer Lingus had Boeing 747-100s which have a range, fully loaded of 5,300nm. DUB-JFK is 2,763nm (great circle). Remove a whole bunch of unneeded fuel (max fuel is about 140 tons, MTOW is about 330 tons) and you'd probably get the weight down to the point that you could have done DUB-JFK direct.

I would say they would have reached LAX (5181nm) and SFO (5098nm) direct from DUB no bother.

FunkyDa

Dublin Airport, last Sunday.

gaff85

It was only a day late arriving this week.