Feel a little stupid, but anyway........

LegacyUser

Hi folks,

As the title says I 'feel a little stupid' coming on here to look for advice over what many may consider to be quiet trivial a matter. I guess its gonna be 'what would you do?' type of thread, just that the situation has my head all messed up and left my heart ruling my head, you know the feeling.

Well, met this girl in October of '06 whilst in college, she was a foreign student and I a quiet, shy and retiring Irish bloke. We ended up working together in college (project) and sort of hit things off, although it was her that was making all the moves. She eventually won me over and got me to come out of my shell and we started to get on really well, although nothing serious ever happened. After a number of months it was time for her to go back home, I was heart broken, I was losing a friend whom had come to mean so much to me. When she got back home she eventually revealed her feelings for me, and......also the fact that she was in a realtionship!! Although, this, as she told me was on the rocks and was more or less over.

I couldnt help myself at this point, (perhaps now would have been a good time to get out!) but I stayed in really close contact, as did she, always texting, sending stuff to each other etc etc. I, stupidy assumed, that with her close interest in me, and the fact that her relationship was on the rocks that it was finished, so, I invited her over to see me last year, and over she came. We got a little closer when she was here, and again, on her return home informed me she was still in this 'dead' relationship. She eventually plucked up the courage and put an end to her 'relationship', and still we continued to get closer and closer, almost to the point where we believed ourselves to be a couple. She had deep feelings for me, as I had for her, at this stage it was nightly MSN chats and texts.

So, earlier this year I got to go visit her, but oddly, before I go she informs me to come as a 'friend' only, and no more! I thought this odd, was more than confused after how we had been, all the things we talked about etc, but still went. Again, when I was there we got on like a house on fire, we forgot the 'friends' thing and got very close, again, acting as if we were a couple!

So, to cut a long story short, I come home after visiting her, completely love struck, head over heels about her, feeling stronger for her than I had before I went and she informs me that a couple of weeks after I going back she decided to give things with her ex another go..........WTF??!!

Naturally I was knocked for 6, was not expecting this at all, especially after how well we had gotten on together!

I've told her how I feel, what she means to me etc etc. But she is insistant that we can only be friends, but the thing is I still see (or feel) the spark there (if I didnt believe this I would let things drops), she still wants to be extremely close to me. I even told her that I would break contact and allow her space to work things out with her ex, but she wasnt for that at all!

This is the first time that I've really had such an experience with a girl, the first time in fact that I've felt so strongly about a girl. My head just feels so messed up now that I dont know what to do. One minute I'm so angry at her, I never want to talk to her again, and the next I need to talk to her so bad, I need her to make me feel happy again!

What do I do??? Can I do anything??? Please dont say 'just forget about her'........I wish I could do that, but I just cant.


(I guess if nothing else writing this down has made me feel a little better)

c-90

listen all you have to do is forge...... only messin:D

remember you are not at wrong here, she is. but you need to pluck up the courage to talk to her about it tell her how you feel, thats the only way you will sort it properly otherwise it could go on like that for ages and you may ruin any hope of a good relationship

Overheal

You dont want to hear this, but you are the backup guy. A friend that she can fall back on when she is feeling lonely. I know some girls that surround themselves with guys just like that; they have their own issues.

You'll learn like I did that nothing will ever happen with this girl, and the longer you keep hoping it will happen the worse it will get. I suspect you've already thought about that a few times.

If you want my advice, phase her out.

iPoker

Overheal wrote: »

You dont want to hear this, but you are the backup guy. A friend that she can fall back on when she is feeling lonely. I know some girls that surround themselves with guys just like that; they have their own issues.

You'll learn like I did that nothing will ever happen with this girl, and the longer you keep hoping it will happen the worse it will get. I suspect you've already thought about that a few times.

If you want my advice, phase her out.

cut feelings for her...but don't cut contact. If you're the "failsafe", she's been using you. I'm guessing you're still in college, or just out of it, in which case you're still young, and my advice would be to repay her the compliment use her for a while until you meet someone better

Wibbs

Confused08 wrote: »

So, to cut a long story short, I come home after visiting her, completely love struck, head over heels about her, feeling stronger for her than I had before I went and she informs me that a couple of weeks after I going back she decided to give things with her ex another go..........WTF??!!

Well for a start he had the advantage of being there, but the biggest advantage he has is that she fancies him. More than she fancies you at least.

Naturally I was knocked for 6, was not expecting this at all, especially after how well we had gotten on together!

Getting on is fine, but did it get physical? If not then you were on a hiding to nothing. Hugs don't count BTW. I suspect she was yours for the taking if you had gotten physical with her early on. You didn't so she put you in the intimate(emotionally) friendzone. She get's the intimate(sexually) from him.

Indeed IMHO you in a lot of ways precipitated her going back to him. She was going to leave him as she wasn't getting her emotional needs met by him. She sees you as a possible replacement. She finds she likes you, but you don't make enough of a strident move into the next level. She gets more and more attached to you emotionally, but the spark that you didn't engage in her early on is made up by her ex. He's happy to go along with this as he gets his girlfriend back. You appear(to her, by your actions) to be happy with this, so she goes back to him. She's now got the best of both worlds.

I've told her how I feel, what she means to me etc etc. But she is insistant that we can only be friends,

Listen to her and act accordingly.

but the thing is I still see (or feel) the spark there (if I didnt believe this I would let things drops),

Nope. You have the "spark", she doesn't. If she did wild horses wouldn't keep her away. Look at it this way, she claimed the ex relationship was on the rocks, she was emotionally close to you and you were apparently "like a couple". Who is she with? Yep the guy she has the "spark" for.

she still wants to be extremely close to me.

Of course she does. It's of great advantage to her. She gets her bread buttered on both sides. She has the boyfriend with all that entails and the bits he's not making up, you get to fill that void for her. You're actually helping him by doing so. Let that sink in.

I even told her that I would break contact and allow her space to work things out with her ex, but she wasnt for that at all!

Of course she wasn't. See previous about her having the best of both. No offence but you're acting like a wuss to boot. What you're telling her is that you're willing to suppress your on feelings and life for her. Ehhhh No. Just no. Again you're helping her make her mind up for her, by acting like that. You will look weak in her eyes. Death to attraction for most women.

What do I do??? Can I do anything??? Please dont say 'just forget about her'........I wish I could do that, but I just cant.

Forgetting about her won't be a goer for a while, so what can you do? You have left it late, but friendzone can be gotten out of in some circumstances. I've seen it done. What stops it is nearly always the guy and his actions. The type of guy that ends up in friendzone is also nearly always the type of guy not equipped to get out of it, hence it being seen as the kiss of death.* You may have heard a woman say, "I used to think of him just as a friend, but now I see him differently". What happens there? Usually the guy starts to look more attractive as a man basically.

OK alls fair in love and war so here we go.

She clearly is attracted to your personality, but she doesn't feel the spark for you. At least as I said not enough to drop the other bloke. So you're in friend zone. More to the point you're in the zone where she's making up the perfect boyfriend between two of you. Great for her and him, but frankly crap for you.

To change that is going to be an uphill struggle. Add in the distance and you realy have a difficult one. Basically you have to jumpstart the spark and physical attraction that I would suspect was there at the start, but not acted upon by you.

Don't settle for less than what you want and make this clear by your actions. Talk is cheap.

Things easily gotten or taken for granted are not valued so don't chase her or contact her as much as you have been. Let her do the running and she will, because if he was fulfilling her needs she wouldn't be talking to you. She's essentially "cheating" emotionally with you. You're her "bit on the side". No offence to women, but in my experience women emotionally cheat far more than men and it's also more accepted by women and men.

Back off. Be less available emotionally for her. She didn't get from him what she gets from you before so that's not likely to change. This also plugs into the human trait that we want what we can't have. We really really want what we thought we had, but don't anymore. Enough women will tell you that. They dump a guy who isn't attentive and suddenly he's don juan in the attentive stakes. Use this to your advantage.

Don't think this will make her forget you. It won't. It'll do the complete opposite, though you will doubt it at first. You don't believe me? Look at you now, trying to forget her and what's happening? Exactly.

Don't criticise her ex/boyfriend. Even if she does. All that will do is force her to defend him. In fact if she mentions him, say that you think he seems like a nice guy now. It sounds counter intuitive but....

If she brings up the "lets be mates" thing, agree but don't expand on on it and continue to back off. Your actions will tell her what she needs to know.

If you get the chance to visit her or better yet she comes to you, ramp it up then. Bring her out, show her your great fun side. Be more physical with her. Hug her more etc. If she gets anyway flirty make a move. If she backs off, agree with her and back off and laugh it off.

In the meantime, go out more and talk to, flirt with and even practice chatting up other women. This will help your confidence and she will sense that. Do NOT start something with another woman though. That would not be fair on her. Down the line you may even find that this woman is not what you want. After all she's one of the first women you've fallen for so it's highly unlikely she's the "one". Think of her as a lesson that you needed and maybe she needed too.

Will this work? Maybe, maybe not, but it's worth a try until you get to the point where it's not as big a deal for you. What's as likely to happen is that she wil find a third guy that makes up what you current two give her.

Best of luck anyway.



*I say guy here and I'm taking it from a male perspective as it's mostly a male problem. Sure it happens with women, but this kind of scenario is much more a guy thing. Plus as a guy my perspective is in play here.

LegacyUser

Talks very much for the responses c-90, overheal, ipoker and wibbs, I appreciate it.

Wibbs wrote:

Getting on is fine, but did it get physical? If not then you were on a hiding to nothing. Hugs don't count BTW. I suspect she was yours for the taking if you had gotten physical with her early on. You didn't so she put you in the intimate(emotionally) friendzone. She get's the intimate(sexually) from him.

Yes, things did get physical, a lot more more hugs, probably shouldnt have happened at all, but it did.

Nope. You have the "spark", she doesn't. If she did wild horses wouldn't keep her away. Look at it this way, she claimed the ex relationship was on the rocks, she was emotionally close to you and you were apparently "like a couple". Who is she with? Yep the guy she has the "spark" for.

I still sense doubth there, its as if she is just waiting for me to say something, always leaving me hanging, as if one word will make everything ok, but I just dont know what to do or so. I've told her exactly how I feel, she knows it. I know myself I was a little slow on the uptake (first time for such a thing and all) and it almost.....almost, feels as if she's punishing me, making me feel bad for making her wait, just by little things she says, like 'once' 'there was a time', 'perhaps things could have been different', etc etc.

I appreciate your advice Wibbs, its sounds solid and well founded, I'll try put it into practice and see what the outcome is. Thanks again.

RedXIV

Confused08 wrote: »

I still sense doubth there, its as if she is just waiting for me to say something, always leaving me hanging, as if one word will make everything ok, but I just dont know what to do or so. I've told her exactly how I feel, she knows it. I know myself I was a little slow on the uptake (first time for such a thing and all) and it almost.....almost, feels as if she's punishing me, making me feel bad for making her wait, just by little things she says, like 'once' 'there was a time', 'perhaps things could have been different', etc etc.

I hate being the one to say things like this but the above really does scream at me that she's decided to try and take the easy option out and instead of laying it out for you, she's just trying to make excuses for what never happened. I'm sorry mate, I know it sucks, but this really does sound like a case of where you should leave it be

Wibbs

Confused08 wrote: »

Yes, things did get physical, a lot more more hugs, probably shouldnt have happened at all, but it did.

Good. Why the hell shouldn't it have happened btw? If it's becuase it got a tad complex, then OK I can see a reason, but even there, life is complex and it doesnt always go to plan. No reason not to jump in. If it's for some weird romantic notion picked up from movies then no. You're a man she's a woman etc. It was up to both of you or either of you to say no. Get that overly romantic idea out of your head as it's a big reason why a lot of "nice" guys don't get women. Women like men. Women like sex and women like sex with men they like.

I still sense doubth there, its as if she is just waiting for me to say something, always leaving me hanging, as if one word will make everything ok,

Oh she's leaving you hanging alright, but not for the magic word.

but I just dont know what to do or so. I've told her exactly how I feel, she knows it.

Right. First thing, don't mention how you feel again. As you say she knows it. This shifts the choice entirely to her and that makes it unbalanced and not in your favour. It puts her off too. It's not nice being up on a pedestal. She will want an equal relationship or indeed if shes the insecure type one where she's the one a little unbalanced. She won't want one where she's the one in complete control. 90% of all men women relatonships fall into the first two. Ease up on emotional outbursts with women who are undecided about you. Kiss of death. Indeed I would even go so far as to suggest to any inexperienced guy that he should not tell a woman he's mad about her until she makes her feelings clear. This is nothing against women, I'd say the same to them. There are exceptions, but in the majority of cases no.

I know myself I was a little slow on the uptake (first time for such a thing and all)

Ok we all screw up and that's cool. You'll know next time and even with this woman you'll know what to avoid.

and it almost.....almost, feels as if she's punishing me, making me feel bad for making her wait,

Partially

just by little things she says, like 'once' 'there was a time', 'perhaps things could have been different', etc etc.

IMHO, if you listen carefully you'll hear how and what she really feels, but more about herself. I reckon that she's projecting her confusion and disappointment over how this has panned out onto you. She's also telling you what she wants or at least wanted. She's keeping you on the backburner in case ex guy doesn't work out. She's keeping him on the go because she doesn't want to be on her own and she fancies him more than you and he's close by of course. Neither of you fulfill what she reckons her needs are. If either of you did, she wouldn't be intimate with both of you and she is being.

Now you can't go back in time, so you have to act the way she wanted you to act back then. Basically do the stuff in the previous post and keep your head. Be freindly and fun, but don't get too emotionally intimate with her unless she gives you a reason to. Doing so will lower your standing as it has. A reason would be her suggesting that it may change in your favour and soon. A reason would be her making plans to see you. Even so do not jump right back into emotional incontinence. Now she will spot the change and if she asks, just say that (in a non heavy way)you agree with her that you should be friends and that the distance is a problem and you're mad busy anyway. Be busy too, don't just act it.

She expects a man who is her boyfriend to be emotionally engaged with her. She also expects him to be emotionally strong and consistent and to have boundaries. I strongly suspect she was leaving her ex because he wasn't emotionally engaging with her and also if he was a dick she may have confused this with him having boundaries. She has gone back with him because he was fulfilling other things in her though. She was going to go for you because you looked like you were willing to give her what her ex couldn't, but you didn't step up and give her what her ex was. Now she has both and is a happy little camper(she thinks).

Put it this way if it was her ex here asking for advice I would tell him to be more like you, so as it's you, I'm suggesting that you be more like him. It's a balancing act and she's in the middle of the see saw with both of you at the end.

I appreciate your advice Wibbs, its sounds solid and well founded, I'll try put it into practice and see what the outcome is. Thanks again.

No worries. I've seen it work too. On more than one occasion too.

PS If people reckon this is playing games. It is and it isn't. We all play games in love to a greater or lesser extent. Those that are successful in love just play the game naturally so it doesnt look like one.

RAIN

Friend its a crappy situation but you have to understand also that you are giving this person Attention, and as I have seen so so so many times in the past some people are perfectly happy having a boyfriend and stringing someone else along so they get the emotional and physical support they need in there lives from two (sometimes even three) different people.

You need to ask your self some tuff questions, if she is doing this to her boyfriend now what do you think would happen if you were in a relationship with her?

Your giving this girl so much of yourself and she still prefers the guy she's with???? Are you ever gna be able to please this girl?.

You need to move on man ,either the sight of you being happy will drive her into your arms (because she just wants your attention) or she will be happy that your happy (and you wont be with her) either way its not looking good.

Move on ,best advice you will ever get.
all the best.

mrsdewinter

OP, I like Wibbs' style. Give it a go. The very worst that can happen is that you'll make it clear to her that you're not moping at home, over analysing the last couple of years...

fuzzywiggle

I know you said the last thing you want to hear is just forget about her but that's what you need to do. She played you for a fool. Although you cant see it right now, eventually you'll be glad you're rid of her. Time is a healer, i can't stress that enough and you really have to believe that.

LegacyUser

Hi again guys,

Many thanks for the time taken to reply and offer advice to my situation, it really is appreciated and has helped me immensly in sorting my head out, should have come here sooner! )

I guess I'll just start backing off and see what the outcome is. I know, I do know that common sense says just cut her loose, move on, but that is easier said than done. I know she messed me about and is 'having her cake and eating it', but I'm not in a posistion to make a clean break, I still 'need' her of sorts, and then there's than feeling of where on earth will I ever find a girl that gave me as much time, attention and such a good feeling as she did (haha, although perhaps it'd be best if I didnt find someone exactly like her :op).

Hmm, god damn! I had such hope, it all seemed to be going somewhere, a new adventure, something exciting, something to focus on and look forward too! Now what is there?! Nothing! Bahhh.......back to square one.

Cheers guys.

Overheal

Yea I was right there not too long ago OP. I know how hard it is to try and get out of it and I chose a rather abrupt approach that I cant recommend here but trust me when its said and done you wont be needing her at all.

LegacyUser

Well, just to update this thread, been a year since I last posted! I'll try keep it short!

After a couple of failed attempted of breaking contact I finally did it in October 08. Several months of no contact. It hurt, like hell! I had my good days, bad days, ok days, but generally felt I was getting on well.......no, I WAS getting on well! I thought about her a lot, everyday in fact, but, I could deal with it.

Couple of weeks back 'girl' contacts me, tells me how much she has missed me, has this feeling that we might get on 'intimate terms' again and would like me in her life.

Heated words exchanged, things calm down, we agree to have a go at friendship again as we had something good before and wanted to get back to that. I thought at first that perhaps Mr X had recently left and she thought she'd pick me up again, but, apparently Mr X did leave her, but a number of months back!

Me, happy to at least have her back in my life thought I could deal with having her as a friend but how wrong I was.......BANG, like a floodgate opened and all the feelings came flooding back until I feel now as if I've been catapulted back to this time last year!!!!!

I havent said anything about this just got on with the 'friend' thing, now, head is in uproar, emotions all over the place........disaster! I'm such a dummy! There has been the mention of her visiting Ireland at some stage now that we 'know each other again', so I dont know how to handle that one, just go with the flow I guess and see where it takes me. I'll avoid any emotional outbursts as suggested by Wibbs, but on the other hands I'm afraid that if I dont make enough of a move or do the right things then history will repeat itself!! Argghhhhhhhhhhhh........

Dont know if I'm actually looking for advice, just felt I had to write this down and perhaps try clear my mind a little. Does this stuff happen to anyone else or is there something wrong with me? I thought I was a pretty strong, no nonsense, serious guy but this one has me drove 'round the twist!

So, yeah! There you have it!