Sharia compliant financial services in Ireland?

arybvtcw0eolkf

Want an interest free mortgage?

Change religion!.


Not bad if you think about it...

Interest free mortages, interest free car loan's - interest free credit cards etc..

Not bad if you can get it.

mikemac

I'd expect better from you Mairt as a longtime poster :rolleyes:

It's not interest free! It's true that Muslims are forbidden to pay interest.
So they just repackage the mortgage or loan and pay "fees" instead of interest.

It's just like a normal loan, it's just structured another way. Banks will still make their money out of this. If there is a market for it, one of the major banks will start selling them.

Edit: and I've no doubt Irish banks will rip off Muslims like the rest of us if they think they can get away with it

Sherifu

Credit Unions ftw.

arybvtcw0eolkf

micmclo wrote: »

I'd expect better from you Mairt as a longtime poster :rolleyes:

Its After Hours, I rarely post here these days so don't spoil the fun

mikemac

Ah but people are going to read the headline and post:
"Feckin Muslims are getting better treatment from banks then me :mad:"
And they won't even read the link they'll just jump to conclusions and post some blanket statement

What, there's no intelligent debate in After Hours? :eek:

Guy:Incognito

Religion (all of it) should be killed.

AckwelFoley

muslim women ftw.

Dudess

It raises the question of multiculturalism v assimilation. I mean, to be quite honest, why in the name of **** really should banks here pander to muslim customs? Seriously? Outside of the western compounds in Saudi countries I'd have to damn well comply with customs there and I certainly wouldn't expect provisions to be made for my culture if I moved over there.

Before anyone accuses me of being racist, then I'd suggest you read my past posts.

Dave!

Dudess wrote: »

It raises the question of multiculturalism v assimilation. I mean, to be quite honest, why in the name of **** really should banks here pander to muslim customs? Seriously? Outside of the western compounds in Saudi countries I'd have to damn well comply with customs there and I certainly wouldn't expect provisions to be made for my culture if I moved over there.

Before anyone accuses me of being racist, then I'd suggest you read my past posts.

Racist

AckwelFoley

Dudess wrote: »

It raises the question of multiculturalism v assimilation. I mean, to be quite honest, why in the name of **** really should banks here pander to muslim customs? Seriously? Outside of the western compounds in Saudi countries I'd have to damn well comply with customs there and I certainly wouldn't expect provisions to be made for my culture if I moved over there.

Before anyone accuses me of being racist, then I'd suggest you read my past posts.

i dont think ur a racist.... but..

we are a different society here so we dont base our laws on whether or not they do it over in saudi or not.

we dont chop the hands off people for stealing.

mikemac

Dudess wrote: »

why in the name of **** really should banks here pander to muslim customs?

€€€€ more money.
It's all management of a bank are interesting in.
If one bank can launch this product and tie up the Irish Muslim market then there is some serious money to be made

Guy:Incognito

snyper wrote: »

we dont chop the hands off people for stealing.

Mores the pity.

Dudess

Yeah but it's more the following that I have a bit of a problem with:

THERE IS an “urgent need” for sharia-compliant financial services to be made available in Ireland so that Muslims living here do not contravene religious teachings, representatives from Irish financial institutions were told at a seminar on Islamic banking

The way muslims are expecting it - I'm sorry, but if you move to a new culture, while you have every right to practise your customs in your home or in such a way that doesn't affect others, I fail to see why you should expect others to pander to you.

mikemac

It's an urgent need for them.
They can't get an Irish mortgage so they are stuck renting. And we all know that renting in Ireland sucks

I don't see your point Dudess and I do know you are one of the most balanced posters in AH. If they launch this product (and I work in a bank and rip people off with fees :pac:) then it makes money for the bank, maybe provides more jobs and the Muslims get credit to do whatever they want to do.
Maybe setup a business or buy a house.

It doesn't affect the Irishperson on the street in anyway at all. Costs the government or the taxpayer nothing so you aren't paying for it

Guy:Incognito

micmclo wrote: »

They can't get an Irish mortgage .

Yes they can, but they wont because they are letting their religion makes their decisions.

mikemac

Stekelly wrote: »

Yes they can, but they wont because they are letting their religion makes their decisions.

Ok, pedantic point. That's what I meant but didn't explain it fully. Sorry, seemed obvious to me.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Mairt wrote: »

Want an interest free mortgage?

Change religion!.


Not bad if you think about it...

Interest free mortages, interest free car loan's - interest free credit cards etc..

Not bad if you can get it.

FAIL

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Dudess wrote: »

Yeah but it's more the following that I have a bit of a problem with:

The way muslims are expecting it - I'm sorry, but if you move to a new culture, while you have every right to practise your customs in your home or in such a way that doesn't affect others, I fail to see why you should expect others to pander to you.

wow - Dudess. This - from a moderator? It's wrong on so many levels.

Paying or receiving interest is against their religion. Are we also expecting muslims and jewish people to eat pork because that's what we do? Did the irish export any of their culture when they emigrated?

EDIT to add: micmlo expressed this better than me!

wes

Last I checked will live in a capitalist society, if a business can make money they will pander to there customers. So in this case, I don't see why they shouldn't, the simple question should, can they make money and if thats the case then they should go ahead.

Also, this sort of thing help banks do business with Muslim countries, as some investors from those countries will only do business when its sharia compliant and there is a lot of money in some of those countries.

So its really a win-win for the customer and the bank and doesn't effect anyone.

Also, in UAE and Turkey (and others probably), they have specialist Pork butchers for foreigners. Then in other countries they serve alcohol in hotels for foreign customers. Would people call that pandering over here? Of course not, its just businesses making money.

Guy:Incognito

Roundtower2 wrote: »

wow - Dudess. This - from a moderator? It's wrong on so many levels.

Paying or receiving interest is against their religion. Are we also expecting muslims and jewish people to eat pork because that's what we do? Did the irish export any of their culture when they emigrated?

EDIT to add: micmlo expressed this better than me!

If I make up a religion (which is all they are in the first place) tomorow, how many followers do I need to get before I can start expecting to get things my own way?

mikemac

Roundtower2 wrote: »

EDIT to add: micmlo expressed this better than me!

I've lost count of the times my username has been spelt like that :mad::(
It isn't long

Thanks anyway, I know a bit about the area.

wes

Stekelly wrote: »

If I make up a religion (which is all they are in the first place) tomorow, how many followers do I need to get before I can start expecting to get things my own way?

If a business can make money off your group, I am sure they will cater to you.

Dinter

I can't really see an issue here. Banks aren't offering anything and it's just replacing the word interest with fees.

It's all smoke and mirrors and if that helps Muslims pretend they're not involved in usury than why not?

Seriously there couldn't be any difference or else the banks would be wide open for discrimination cases from all other people of all other religions.

mikemac

Was about to post above ^^.
This loan product is no different to Meteor Mobile doing advertisments in Polish or that Polsh supplement that the Evening Herald do. It increases sales

A business exists to make money and if Stekelly has a group who need something and money can be made, then someone will offer it

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Stekelly wrote: »

If I make up a religion (which is all they are in the first place) tomorow, how many followers do I need to get before I can start expecting to get things my own way?

when you have enough followers to have sufficient political or spending power. Surely, thats fairly obvious?

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

micmclo wrote: »

I've lost count of the times my username has been spelt like that :mad::(
It isn't long

Thanks anyway, I know a bit about the area.

you've only been here for 4 years, give it a few more and people will start to catch on

mikemac

Here two months longer than you noooooooooob! :pac:

flanum

:eek:wtf? Those muslims are gettin cheap mortgages? im not even going to click on the link, bah..pesky muslims...grumble..grumble...

*goes off to build burning cross*

Degsy

So now muslims want to own property?Whatever happened to the maxim that "Allah Will Provide"?.It seems to me that Muslims,like Christians want thier religion A La Carte..they can choose the bits that suit them and gloss over the rest.

DonJose

I want a Sharia credit card!!!

Pros : No interest

Cons : Miss a payment and they cut your hand off

Blisterman

I'm pretty sure, if any non muslims wanted to, they could take out a Sharia loan.

It's not like Muslims are getting special treatment here.

It's virtually the same as a regular mortgage anyway.

You pay a deposit on the house, live there, while making regular payments to the bank. After many years, in which you've paid back much more than the house initally cost, you stop paying money and own the house.

JC 2K3

If it's purely the bank's choice to offer this, then it's fine by me.

If a law were passed saying that all banks had to provide Sharia mortgages, then I'd be píssed off.

javaboy

It's pretty funny that so many people missed Dudesses'es point.

I think she is objecting to the fact that people are expecting to be accommodated rather than the fact that they are being accommodated. It's a subtle but important difference.

The banks can repackage the mortgage so it is fees instead of interest if they want to corner the market. That's fine. That's capitalism at it's finest. I would just object to the concept being imposed on banks by some statuory instrument.

aidan_walsh

I don't see anyone expecting to be accommodated, but requesting to be. Its a subtle but important difference.

Dave!

JC 2K3 wrote: »

If it's purely the bank's choice to offer this, then it's fine by me.

If a law were passed saying that all banks had to provide Sharia mortgages, then I'd be píssed off.

yah, +1