RTE's Prime Time - Shooting/licensing to be featured Tuesday night...

Kramer

I'm told that RTE's Prime Time is to feature a report on Superintendents refusing to issue licences for pistols/full bore rifles etc.
AFAIK, they conducted interviews at the Midlands range & filmed there. Some of the crew had a few shots there too :eek:.

Now, it's not known how shooting will be portrayed - are Supers wasting tax payers' money or are they right i.e. the judiciary is wrong to issue licences for these "weapons".
I'm led to believe the former is the case.

Tuesday 20th May (tomorrow night) at 9.30pm on RTE1.............might be worth a watch .

It wasn't me!

Should be interesting. Cheers for the heads-up.

Oh, this will be interesting - on Wednesday morning every layperson who watched the show will be able to speak with the greatest authority on the legal use of firearms.

Not trying to tar all the public with the same brush, but opinions will be coloured by what is usually regarded as a reasonably objective program.

Of course, if it comes out in favour of ourselves, so much the better!

Bananaman

Thankfully Miriam O'Callaghan doesn't allow the politicians too long on their soap box.

I am tempted to send an email to the show to point out

[1] Legally Held Firearms are not used in Crime so that there is no inferred association.

[2] Olympic disciplines form a very small % of the shooting disciplines in Ireland have no real input in the centrefire disciplines so that it does not become the focus of the sport side of it as that would be a mistake.

[3] Supers in conjunction with Clubs decide who gets a pistol license, regardless of the recent court decisions. If the club does not sanction the individual to give them membership then they will never get to the super. If the Super decided he's not getting the license then he doesn't. The only caveat to that is that, now, the super is not to take the calibre of the firearm into consideration when issuing a license. There is still the question of demonstrable use which should keep the manners on most people. If their range cannot handle something or they have no demonstrable use for it then the calibre may come into consideration. i.e. nobody has a use and no range will allow a .50 or a 20mm so nobody will get one.

We would like, but it will not happen, for the discussion to focus on Supers who deny licenses without reason and waste court time so a judge will "make" them make a decision. However, the firearms issue is too juicy and with some politicians having just got a new job - and some who didn't - I fear we will have a very mis-informed debate.

B'Man

Sparks

This should be interesting...

Vegeta

Sparks wrote: »

This should be interesting...

interesting in the "their going to paint us in a really poor light" way


I'm a, glass is twice as big as it needs to be, kinda guy

Sparks

I'm generally a "someone's stealing my pint" sort of guy, but given the work of the FCP and how closely they've been working with the DoJ and Gardai, there's a reasonable chance that this could be even-handed.

fingers crossed....

Hezz700

Does anyone know who's going to be on the panel? The light in which shooting sports is seen will depend on weather the panelists are friends or foe's. I would hope it goes well but i would'nt like to bet my life on it.

dimebag249

Right on Bananaman, send a reasonable e-mail outlining your concerns now. We'll all be whinging about it afterwards if they take the approach of "OMG DANGEROUS GLOCK ASSAULT MACHINE WMDS THINK OF THE CHILDREN", but maybe we can persuade them now to take a more balanced approach.

Sparks

Was talking to one of the chaps from the midlands about it - it sounds like the footage filmed was good stuff - .308s, various fullbore pistols, all straight target shooting, nothing looking too dodgy. However, it's remarkable what biased editing can do. However I'd take care with any emails sent that they be as reasonable and level-headed as is possible for obvious reasons.

Grizzly 45

Abit late guys&gals to do anything about it now.If it is going out tomrrow night,nowt can be done about footage unless there is a seriously libellous or other inaccurate piece of footage. And the chance of seeing the footage now is nil..Emails and whatnot will be ignored or,"lost in transmission" or didnt get it in my inbox until after the shoew..

Having met and had some dealings in my travels some of the above mentioned crew of that show,and seen their performances and tactics to get information,in some very underhanded ways too,not to mind one of the hired in camera crew who is totally anti gun.I wouldn't be optimistic about this being fair and balanced.I would like to think that this will be good publicity for us ,but with TV and current affairs crowds "it bleeds it leads" is the watchword.:(

Actually,quite amazed at Midland for allowing them into the range in the first place.In this case IMO it will be better letting sleeping dogs lie.Somone should be aware of how media can backfire your best intentions of showing somthing in a positive light.The most innocent thing can be made look nasty.
Very much the glass is empty on this one.:(

rrpc

I disagree with you there Grizzly. Firstly we've had very positive showings on RTE (both on OB Sport) from shoots in the Midlands, secondly there's absolutely no benefit in closing doors because that gives the impression of us 'hiding' and therefore we've obviously got something to hide.

Sure, stuff can be edited and made to look bad, but if there's nothing to show then you'll get speculation which will always be bad.

Agree on the emails though. At this late stage, it won't achieve anything and without any idea of the footage or slant, you'd be emailing in the dark. Far better to wait until after the show and get a right of reply or at least a promise of a more balanced showing (if that's what's required) at a later date.

civdef

I'm just surprised it took them 4 years to notice.

cavan shooter

I would hope its going to be a balanced approach regarding why are legitimate sportsmen being obstructed when they try to license a firearm for legitimate competition.

But have fears it is going to play on the sensationalism which can occur in the press as they feed on peoples fears. Anyone from midlands in the know??

Grizzly 45

Indeed RR ,there is nothing like being "open",but "open on our terms".
There is nothing stopping us from doing a documentary on shooting in Ireland showing it in a pro light,on our terms as well.There are plenty of small film production companies in Ireland who would do this project,and would get it on RTE,no problem either.I know the dirs of one,and they are approachable.PM me if intrested

What would be better.A hour of a programme showing Irish shooters and gunowners as safe&harmless in their multi faceted sportsor a half hour of soundbytes with somthing possibly with an agenda??,and then a half hour of talking heads,not discussing any points,but trying to one upmanship each other,by interruptions and talking over each other,egged on by the presenter?

:cool:Had a chat today with one of the folks involved,and who posts here as well,and shall stay nameless [unless he/she wants to reveal themselves.;)]

The Good news;the anti gun person on the crew was apprently not present at this filming.
The Bad news[depending on outlook] there was some trickery attempted by the director [an Italianio] of the filming and interviewer of those involved.

The directiore wanted dramatic shots of mags being slammed into pistol butts ala any good action movie.And was told there is no reason for this as the targets are paper and not likely to run away from being shot at.:D
Nor is there any reason to do this as this damages ones mags and firearm as well.
Interviewer referring to guns as weapons and being politely reinformed that they are firearms,and how to know the difference.The 9mm "inaccruacy ,unsuitable for competition and civvie ownership"chestnut should be put to bed most intrestingly.IF it is shown.

Those interviewed were breifed to watch for trick questions from PT.All in all,our side sounds like we handled our end of the log well enough.So kudos to those involved in Midland on this;):D

Now,the thing is will this be shown fair and square or will it be chopped with the good bits on the cutting room floor,and the rest being stuffed to fit an ,or somones agenda??

One thing for sure,good,bad or indifferent.Watch the anti gun/hunting /shooting/fieldsports and anything remotely involved with"animal rights" brigade usual suspects now wearing their anti gun hats spew their misinformed emotive mass mailings to all the local and national press by the weekend to piggyback this issue.:rolleyes:

By 22:00 tomrrow we will be smarter.:eek:

Sikamick

Following a phone call from one of our club members yesterday.

Member has two shotguns, two full-bore rifles, one rim fire rifle, two pistols, all are fully licensed. He is a member of our club and is a licensed deer stalker.

He has made an application to his local Garda station for an air rifle to control vermin (Rats) around his house (He lives in the countryside in Offally). The air rifle he wishes to purchase is the same type as one would see at a carnival.

He has received a reply from his Local Garda Inspector that under no circumstances would he issue a license for an air rifle.

This has to be a complete contradiction of the results of the two courts cases we have being hearing about where the Judge stated that you license the person not the gun.

The department of Justice should be able to step in here and sort this out before in ends up wasting more tax payer’s money on a court case.

I would like to see a question on the above been asked of the Garda representative on the Prime Time show tonight, can one e-mail question into to the show.

rrpc

Sikamick wrote: »

I would like to see a question on the above been asked of the Garda representative on the Prime Time show tonight, can one e-mail question into to the show.

No, the show is pre-recorded.

Sparks

Merging threads and stickying for today only.

Sikamick

rrpc wrote: »

No, the show is pre-recorded.

Does anyone know who will be on the show and will there be someone from the shooting fraternity on it.

rrpc

No, bar the fact that they did a spot in Midlands and presumably interviewed people there.

Because Prime Time is a news show and because it deals in potentially controversial issues, you can never be sure what is going to be on the program before it airs. I've heard of it being edited at the last minute because of legal issues.

As a result, there's very little information about a show before it airs. Sometimes on Morning Ireland there's a preview of it. Anyone listen to Morning Ireland this morning?

Grizzly 45

You can try,but it has a Hell of a way to go before it will reach Caroline's or Marks script.Most of this stuff is now set in concrete as to what the researchers have produced and what the script will be.

Sparks

Anyone watching?

Our man in Havana

I will record the late night repeat. Sky+ is working overtime on other stuff.

rrpc

It's going to be late on the show: bullying and cancer care being the first two items.

Not boding well: "The increasing power and availability of guns in Ireland" was the tag line as far as I can recall.

Rew

rrpc wrote: »

It's going to be late on the show: bullying and cancer care being the first two items.

Not boding well: "The increasing power and availability of guns in Ireland" was the tag line as far as I can recall.

Yeah I was about to say the same thing, not good at all...

chem

Yep lads. Opening lines don`t look like its going to be a good view point of shooting sports:mad:

"Increasing number of firearms and power" bat down the hatches for this one:o

It wasn't me!

Well, let's take a look, just sat down to watch it now, but that doesn't sound good alright...

TrapperJohn

chem wrote: »

"Increasing number of firearms and power" bat down the hatches for this one:o

Groan ........ I suspect Paddy Power has just stopped taking bets on this report being balanced.

Sparks

Wonderful...

Dvs

We are making a segment for Primetime about the court cases involving Superintendents and firearms applications and the waste of public funds could we come and get some input from you for the show........

Sure come on over and we will show you around....

Primetime
Tonight we look at the increasing number of increasingly powerful guns in Ireland!

Positive coverage I think not !


Dvs.

TrapperJohn

Any word if someone from the shooting world might be on the interview panel or is just going to be paranoid antis

rrpc

TrapperJohn wrote: »

Any word if someone from the shooting world might be on the interview panel or is just going to be paranoid antis

Depends on the slant really, if it's anti, then you'll probably see a Super bemoaning the courts and the serious misunderstandings judges have of the firearms acts. If it's the other way, then possibly Des Crofton would have been a good choice.

Place your bets now

rrpc

It's on now... Oh dear "military"

Dramatic increase: 8% in 6 years Ohmigod.

Des Crofton and Tom Clonan so far, Tom Clonan sounding very sensationalist, but that really depends on the question he was asked. Clips are very short from him.

johngalway

And it happens yet again...

Sparks

Wonderful. Hey everyone, feel like taking your air pistols to Iraq?

TrapperJohn

Hatchet job .... can't believe RTE can ever do a balanced report

Sparks

The papers are going to get a run of letters from paniced people expecting the second coming of Charlton Heston now

rrpc

Tom Clonan was especially scaremongering. His parting line was about the possibilty that with the number of "weapons" out there it was only a matter of time before one of them was "used inappropriately.. in a shoolyard.."

Des Crofton was emminently sensible and factual.

johngalway

rrpc wrote: »

It's on now... Oh dear "military"

Dramatic increase: 8% in 6 years Ohmigod.

Des Crofton and Tom Clonan so far, Tom Clonan sounding very sensationalist, but that really depends on the question he was asked. Clips are very short from him.

Des Crofton was very good I thought.

Not so sure on Clonan, as you say the clips may be out of context when "embedded" in that propaganda I just watched. Very negatively spun I thought.

Glad I don't pay the licence fee in this house. Newstalk in my car anymore.

bigred

Well that went well.....
Didn't count it but Clonan must have said weapon about 100 times. I especially liked the way your man held the .308 with the bolt closed and his finger on the trigger....

It wasn't me!

A lot of dodgy bullshít spoken there. The schoolyard comment at the end? It's an unbalanced assertion, with no justification, very harmful and emotive. I liked Des Crofton's contributions, but I feel he was treated less seriously than the scared ones.

It wasn't me!

bigred wrote: »

Well that went well.....
Didn't count it but Clonan must have said weapon about 100 times. I especially liked the way your man held the .308 with the bolt closed and his finger on the trigger....

I actually balked at that. The people blethering about how dangerous they are and they themselves not showing the blidest bit of respect!

Sparks

Or the Gardai for that matter?

Sparks

And why wasn't even one of the DoJ interviewed?

Our man in Havana

Terrible, absolutely terrible. Cue letters in all the main papers complaining about the armed militia that the Gardaí are allowing to be formed across the land.

Well done RTÉ on setting back our cause. Well worth €158 a year. Not! :mad:

rrpc

Sparks wrote: »

And why wasn't even one of the DoJ interviewed?

I would suspect that they knew better. Would you go on RTE now?

Grizzly 45

Well that was what I thought it was going to be a sensationlist soundbyte.:(. Started already with the man targets in the opening credits
Fair play to Des Crofton,nicely put points,only to be warped by editing craftily in "I am an expert on everything regarding Guns & military and I write for the Irish Times,so I am Really brainy" Tom Clonan:mad:.

Just goes to show,that you can NEVER expect a fair play from the TV media on gun ownership either here in Ireland or anywhere else for that matter. Primetime is consistent I am glad to say at warping their stories as ever before. And we pay a TV liscense for this rubbish???:mad::mad:

Sparks

Damn right I would, now's when we need airtime to counter that load of ****e we just had excreted all over us.

Vegeta

wow thought that was awful

The the Dr. was talking out his wing wang

Stercus Accidit

Just saw this, god love yez lads.

Utter drivel from the "schoolyard" chap, nonsense and definitely shows a lack of any credible argument, red top tactics the think of the children nonsense.

And the "correlation" between legal ownership and gun crime was bull, I'll wager not one of those crimes had even a whiff of a legal firearm involved, but it was implied all the same, utter crapola.

Jonty

rrpc wrote: »

Tom Clonan was especially scaremongering. His parting line was about the possibilty that with the number of "weapons" out there it was only a matter of time before one of them was "used inappropriately.. in a shoolyard.."

Des Crofton was emminently sensible and factual.[/QUOTE


Spot on RRPC. Another scaremongering mission completed by RTE. Fair play to Des, not half enough of him. Clonan is a drama queen. Sh1tin on about schoolyards and I loved his "effective range of a 308 is a mile and a half" I live on the foothills of the slieve blooms and I honestly think I won't bother getting up and going stalking next season, I think I'll take my quarry from my bedroom window. And as for our troops in Chad, I hope they are doing OK, According to Clonan if they get pinned down in some ****ty village we'll be better tooled up than the cavalry on the way to the rescue. He should not have been drawing parallels between members of the shooting community and the defence forces.

There wasn't enough on our side TBH. Congrats to the editing team.