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Scotland's Shame

24567

Comments

  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 10,886 Mod ✭✭✭✭PauloMN


    Eirebear wrote: »
    Considering there was over 100,000 people there....yes it is a minority.




    Nope, it was GMC who organised it.


    I would like to personally apologise to the people of Manchester on behalf of the tens of thousands of Bears who went down there and behaved themselves.
    The scum element in our support has been a bit of a topic for many of us during this campaign, as many people are fed up going to a home european game and being seated beside some sort of degenerate.
    Rangers FC must do something about this.

    Good post Eirebear. I can only imagine that watching the different footage this morning annoys genuine Rangers fans.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,951 ✭✭✭DSB


    What a terribly sensationalist thread title. But yeah, shocking behaviour.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    Tauren wrote: »
    maybe the fans without tickets should have stayed at hime like they were told to.

    thats bull****, its part of the carnival atmosphere for a final to have large travelli ng support, its why Uefa and councils sets up fan zones etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,014 ✭✭✭Eirebear


    PauloMN wrote: »
    Good post Eirebear. I can only imagine that watching the different footage this morning annoys genuine Rangers fans.

    Its horrible mate. And sad.

    I was talking to a friend about an hour before the game and he was saying that he had just walked to the stadium in the company of a group of Zenit fans and that the atmosphere was extremely friendly wherever they had been that day.

    But these stories will be forgotton about because of the scumbags who couldnt act like human beings.


  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    Imagine what it will be like in Moscow next Wednesday. It will be the shame of English football as there will be guaranteed trouble me thinks...

    Ah Liverpool fan trying to drag this thread towards Man united bashing....imagine that.



    Rangers should be banned for at least 1 season for this, theyre an absolute disgrace.


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  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Eirebear wrote: »
    Its horrible mate. And sad.

    I was talking to a friend about an hour before the game and he was saying that he had just walked to the stadium in the company of a group of Zenit fans and that the atmosphere was extremely friendly wherever they had been that day.

    But these stories will be forgotton about because of the scumbags who couldnt act like human beings.

    Unfortunately it looks like the trouble kicked off after Rangers fans werent able to deal with defeat in a sporting manner and decided to just wreck the place instead. Yes its a minority when u consider the amount that travelled but by all accounts Manchester is absolutely wrecked this morning and there were a few thousand ans involved.....a minority in the overall picture but an awful lot nonetheless.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,585 ✭✭✭patmac


    A bit of deja vu wasn't there a lot of trouble the last time Rangers played in a European final around 1973 and were they not banned for a few years afterwards? Feel sorry for Eirebear and genuine Rangers fans. Also a bit wrong to lump Celtic in amongst it all the same as their fans behaved impeccably in Seville.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,014 ✭✭✭Eirebear


    Unfortunately it looks like the trouble kicked off after Rangers fans werent able to deal with defeat in a sporting manner and decided to just wreck the place instead. Yes its a minority when u consider the amount that travelled but by all accounts Manchester is absolutely wrecked this morning and there were a few thousand ans involved.....a minority in the overall picture but an awful lot nonetheless.

    No, it looks like trouble kicked off when the TV broke.

    I wish people would get their facts right i really do, it had nothing to do with defeat.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,176 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    Imagine what it will be like in Moscow next Wednesday. It will be the shame of English football as there will be guaranteed trouble me thinks...

    Perhaps if you put a bit more thought and research into this post you would of realised that :-

    *Moscow is very expensive, there won't be that many fans going over, thus reducing the amount of idiots that could go there

    *Security at the airports would again refuse a lot of thugs that try and go over

    *match ticket fans being escorted by police

    but yeah a big +1 to you for being ignorant


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,441 ✭✭✭Killme00


    This is very embarassing for everyone involved, GMC, UEFA and Glasgow Rangers especially.

    The behaviour of Rangers fans is attrocious and has been for years. There has always been a thug element that travel with their support and it is more prevalent than any other UK based team IMO. Compare the behaviour of Rangers fans on their travels, to those of Celtic and you will see a huge difference.

    While steps have been taken to stamp out sectarianism in Scottish football by the SFA, Rangers and Celtic, it obviously isnt enough.

    Also, some fans will come on here and say that it is a minority, i dont believe that is an excuse.


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  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Eirebear wrote: »
    No, it looks like trouble kicked off when the TV broke.

    I wish people would get their facts right i really do, it had nothing to do with defeat.

    Said it in the other thread, Zenit fan stabbed outside the COMS directly after the game, rumours of a fan stabbed IN THE GROUND....cant blame it all on the big screen.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,441 ✭✭✭Killme00


    Eirebear wrote: »
    No, it looks like trouble kicked off when the TV broke.

    I wish people would get their facts right i really do, it had nothing to do with defeat.

    really, a zenith fan was stabbed inside the ground because the Tv broke. Thats bollox and you know it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,595 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Unearthly wrote: »
    Perhaps if you put a bit more thought and research into this post you would of realised that :-

    *Moscow is very expensive, there won't be that many fans going over, thus reducing the amount of idiots that could go there

    *Security at the airports would again refuse a lot of thugs that try and go over

    *match ticket fans being escorted by police

    but yeah a big +1 to you for being ignorant

    And last but not least guards with guns.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,449 ✭✭✭Call Me Jimmy


    This sort of stuff just completly baffles me. I try to understand it but it's like thinking about infinity, my mind just blocks.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,430 ✭✭✭Sizzler


    DSB wrote: »
    What a terribly sensationalist thread title. But yeah, shocking behaviour.

    What would you have called it?

    At the time of writing I had just read the youtube comments and a few scots had used the phrase, some of them decent Rangers fans like Eirebear who have no interest in such behaviour or enjoy being portrayed in such a poor light. I dont think I have exlcusivity on the phrase :

    http://www.scotlandsshame.com/


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 575 ✭✭✭5ForKeeps


    Ah Liverpool fan trying to drag this thread towards Man united bashing....imagine that.

    Man U bashing...the same would have happened if Liverpool had of got to Moscow as well. English rival supporters hate each other, the match isn't on til 10.45 local time, imagine the amount of drink will consumed and violence will occur just like last night. If i was bashing you Utd it would have been a lot worse.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 575 ✭✭✭5ForKeeps


    Unearthly wrote: »
    Perhaps if you put a bit more thought and research into this post you would of realised that :-

    *Moscow is very expensive, there won't be that many fans going over, thus reducing the amount of idiots that could go there

    *Security at the airports would again refuse a lot of thugs that try and go over

    *match ticket fans being escorted by police

    but yeah a big +1 to you for being ignorant

    1st point, won't be many fans going over are you for real. It will be Chelsea's first Champions League final and its Utd in the final of course they will go even though it is expensive. If they don't there no Liverpool fans, Istanbul and Athens in the last 3 years. How much that cost and still fans went. The Utd and Chelsea fans don't even have to pay a visa either.

    Security and Police escort, with UEFA's track record in evidence in recent years with planning these European finals and the venues they choose leave a lot to be desired.

    I hope no violence does occur but the chances are more likely espeically considering the environment the fans are going too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,606 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    Man U bashing...the same would have happened if Liverpool had of got to Moscow as well. English rival supporters hate each other, the match isn't on til 10.45 local time, imagine the amount of drink will consumed and volience will occur just like last night. If i was bashing you Utd it would have been a lot worse.

    again.

    Neither club have sold out their allocations - so there won't be a surplus of fans hanging around moscow.

    You won't get to Russia without a Visa (time consuming) or a match ticket (reduced numbers)

    Straight from the airport to segregated, police guarded 'fan zones' where no alcohol will be sold.

    Escorted from 'fan zones' to the stadium by police.

    Where do you see all this violent alcohol fueled fan interaction occurring?


  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    1st point, won't be many fans going over are you for real. It will be Chelsea's first Champions League final and its Utd in the final of course they will go even though it is expensive. If they don't there no Liverpool fans, Istanbul and Athens in the last 3 years. How much that cost and still fans went. The Utd and Chelsea fans don't even have to pay a visa either.

    Security and Police escort, with UEFA's track record in evidence in recent years with planning these European finals and the venues they choose leave a lot to be desired.

    I hope no violence does occur but the chances are more likely espeically considering the environment the fans are going too.

    They're ;)



    Do u have an idea how difficult the Moscow trip is proving to be for fans?! For Istanbul the viisa was waived, for Moscow the visa has been waived for ticketholders only. In order to get a visa u need to have a minimum of 3 nights accomodation booked and the prices are horrendous. I also personally know Liverpool fans who were in both Istnabul and Athens who told me before the SF that they wouldnt be going to Moscow if Liverpool made it due to all the difficulties. They told me that Moscow was proving more hassle to organise than Istanbul and Athens combined. BIG differences and something u should really research before u start talking nonsense.

    I agree about the UEFA thing but theyre not organising the police escorts, the Russians are (which may or may not be any better)


    I admit there COULD be trouble, course there could, just like there was trouble in Athens, but the main point Im making is that we're here, talking about Rangers last nigth and you're jumping in with your misguided assumptions about something that may or may not happen thats nothing to do with Rangers.

    There;s a CL Final thread, maybe u shoudl go over there and post this rubbish.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    Tauren wrote: »
    Neither club have sold out their allocations - so there won't be a surplus of fans hanging around moscow.

    You won't get to Russia without a Visa (time consuming) or a match ticket (reduced numbers)

    Straight from the airport to segregated, police guarded 'fan zones' where no alcohol will be sold.

    Escorted from 'fan zones' to the stadium by police.

    Superb work from Uefa. Sounds like it'll all be a right great party! :(

    Where next Uefa?

    Baghdad? Tibet? Northern Thailand? Palestine?

    ****ing clowns


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    They're ;)

    Neil, don't do that. Its patronising and rude as ****. Throwing a wink in after it doesn't make it any less so.


  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    Superb work from Uefa. Sounds like it'll all be a right great party! :(

    Where next Uefa?

    Baghdad? Tibet? Northern Thailand? Palestine?

    ****ing clowns

    In fairness they were asking for it by giving the Final to moscow in the first place. If the final were on in Paris, Athens, Amsterdam, Rome etc Id be going.



    This policy of giving it to Eastern Europe (Istanbul, Athens, Moscow) has to stop. Thankfully the next two are in Rome (:rolleyes::o:eek:confused:) and Madrid. And rumour has it 2011 is likely to be in Wembley. Thank god for that eh.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 575 ✭✭✭5ForKeeps


    Tauren wrote: »
    again.

    Neither club have sold out their allocations - so there won't be a surplus of fans hanging around moscow.

    You won't get to Russia without a Visa (time consuming) or a match ticket (reduced numbers)

    Straight from the airport to segregated, police guarded 'fan zones' where no alcohol will be sold.

    Escorted from 'fan zones' to the stadium by police.

    Where do you see all this violent alcohol fueled fan interaction occurring?

    How to do you know the allocation has been not taken up. It's like when Liverpool went to Istanbul and Athens, there will be a surplus of fans. They will get there by hook or by crook. The segregation thing with the fanzones will be difficult considering the only fanzone is at the Kremlin in Red Square. Alcohol - Heineken will be surely be able for purchase considering the sponsorship of the competition. Alcohol will be got at some stage which means anything can happen. The airport, as far as i know the flights for Manchester and London are coming into the only airport. Then you will have lads getting flights to Riga and then a train to Moscow. Then we come to the stadium itself, England fans had a hard time over there for the Russia match last October, considering this is two of the big 4 teams in England something is bound to happen. Black Market tickets etc....could cause problems both inside and outside the stadium.


  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    Neil, don't do that. Its patronising and rude as ****. Throwing a wink in after it doesn't make it any less so.

    Meh, I normally dont but given the content of his post (basically - "we're better fans than you") I make no apologies.


  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    How to do you know the allocation has been not taken up. It's like when Liverpool went to Istanbul and Athens, there will be a surplus of fans. They will get there by hook or by crook. The segregation thing with the fanzones will be difficult considering the only fanzone is at the Kremlin in Red Square. Alcohol - Heineken will be surely be able for purchase considering the sponsorship of the competition. Alcohol will be got at some stage which means anything can happen. The airport, as far as i know the flights for Manchester and London are coming into the only airport. Then you will have lads getting flights to Riga and then a train to Moscow. Then we come to the stadium itself, England fans had a hard time over there for the Russia match last October, considering this is two of the big 4 teams in England something is bound to happen. Black Market tickets etc....could cause problems both inside and outside the stadium.

    Now thats a bit more like it. Good post.


    I agree, and time will tell, my uncle was at the Ireland - Russia match a few years back and said that the locals were out in force trying to cause trouble and said he expects that to happen again seeing as they had no interest in the football.



    If u go on any United fan site u will know that whilst the allocations have been selling their mere price is pricing people out of the market. So they havent sold it out yet. Chelsea have sold even less AFIK.


    I got offered one, would have cost me over 2 grand and thats not including the spending money i would have needed. No thanks.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,372 ✭✭✭✭Mr Alan


    This policy of giving it to Eastern Europe (Istanbul, Athens, Moscow) has to stop. Thankfully the next two are in Rome (:rolleyes::o:eek:confused:) and Madrid. And rumour has it 2011 is likely to be in Wembley. Thank god for that eh.

    Sure wouldnt worry, you's are due to be in it again until 2017 ;):)
    Meh, I normally dont but given the content of his post (basically - "we're better fans than you") I make no apologies.

    that was not the context of his post at all.

    he is saying he thinks Utd fans and Chelsea fans will travel by the thousands and that you are underestimating how many will go.

    jesus neil don't be so paranoid.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 269 ✭✭PRman


    Can anyone explain why is there such a difference in the behaviour of Celtic in Seville and Rangers fans in manchester? A screen breaking down is no excuse for punching a cop in the head so hard that his earpiece has to be surgically removed. Rangers FC's statement appears to blame the violence on the screen breaking down but the truth is they aren't doing enough to stamp out this sort of behaviour...


  • Posts: 14,379 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mr Alan wrote: »
    Sure wouldnt worry, you's are due to be in it again until 2017 ;)

    Around the same season Liverpool mount a title challenge! :D:D:D Dont forget we won the European Cup in 68 at Wembley, history repeat itself?! Lets hope so!


    Mr Alan wrote:
    that was not the context of his post at all.

    he is saying he thinks Utd fans and Chelsea fans will travel by the thousands and that you are underestimating how many will go.

    jesus neil don't be so paranoid.

    Well there was that one line highlighted.

    As for the rest, I agree if large numbers of fans get there then there could be problems as one would expect from same country matches in a neutral venue but from what i have seen it is very very difficult and expensive just to get into Russia for next week, so thus far, the current evidence (which is obviously subject to change) suggests that it is set to go down with a lot less trouble than is being implied unless a horde of fans book last minute trips and find a quick and cheap way around the visa issue (border hopping might be an option!!!)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 575 ✭✭✭5ForKeeps


    Mr. Alan gets my point, all English clubs fans and as we seen last night with Rangers and Celtic before travel with big crowds no matter how much the cost. The clubs are the only ones who truly know the allocation been taken up and no one has even released anything as far as i can see or hear in regards to numbers.

    Neil, as for my post at the start it was to reflect my views on the crowds that follow English clubs and considering it is the biggest game for both clubs in there history, discounting Utd's two previous win's. The first all English final is massive that NO-ONE will want to miss. You ended up agreeing with me in the end so happy days!!!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,639 ✭✭✭Iago


    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    How to do you know the allocation has been not taken up.

    The fact that both clubs are advertising that tickets are available on their websites even at this late stage.

    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    The segregation thing with the fanzones will be difficult considering the only fanzone is at the Kremlin in Red Square.

    Anybody going to the match will be a team designated fanzone outside the stadium, there's one for each team as well as a central fanzone close to red square
    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    Alcohol - Heineken will be surely be able for purchase considering the sponsorship of the competition. Alcohol will be got at some stage which means anything can happen.

    Alcohol will not be available in either of the designated zones for supporters, and once you enter that zone you can't leave it.
    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    The airport, as far as i know the flights for Manchester and London are coming into the only airport.

    Which will have a huge police presence as a result of this, fans will be directed to seperate exits depending on whether the flight lands from London or Manchester. Then they'll be put on segregated buses to the interior fanzone.
    5ForKeeps wrote: »
    England fans had a hard time over there for the Russia match last October, considering this is two of the big 4 teams in England something is bound to happen. Black Market tickets etc....could cause problems both inside and outside the stadium.

    There will be a very small number of people who got a visa and don't have a ticket. There won't be anyone there without a visa so the problems are greatly reduced.

    As for the comments about celtic fans being better than Rangers fans, I've been to two Celtic v United games in manchester, and on both occasions there were big issues with so called celtic fans causing trouble.


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