Becoming increasingly racist

useful_contacts

I tried to post this unregged twice and both times it never came up, i didnt want to post it on my name as i know ill get abusive pms but ill just cancel the account afterwards

Im getting a little worried about myself, i am becoming increasingly racist the last few months. I dont know why at all.

First of all i hate Asian people and i have NO IDEA why, they never did nothing to me ever but when ever i see one i give out under my breath, yet im happy to sit in their restaurants and eat their food.

Its not just that its people from packistan(or anyone that looks like they are from there) I immediately class them as "suicide bombers" and try to avoid them at all costs. If there is one walking down the street towards me ill cross the road.

Its the same if i go into a shop and theres a polish person working behing the counter, i start giving out about it saying "They are letting anyone into the country", and this person never did anything to me they are just doing their job ya know...

I have a few foriegn friends and they are lovely people, but im still becoming increasingly racist and I dont like it.

What can i possibly do about it?

geminilady

i dont really know how to advise you, but whenever you hear these negative sentances just swap them and with positive ones. You'll soon get used to it. Or whenever you have the urge to say horrible things to the shopkeeper pinch yourself . You'll soon realise that your hurting yourself and the other people so most likely i will say you will get rid of it. Its good your nibbing it in the bud, as it could go out of control. You have taking a big step in acknowledging your problem so good luck!

truecrippler

I think you have too much pride in being Irish and who you are. Talk to a councilor and and try and get whatever it is off your chest. He/she will make you realise that you actually don't have anything against foreign nationals, just you're a bit wary because of things you may have heard in the news or what people around you say. You're probably just easily led by these things.

You don't seem that severe. You could be killing everyone not Irish around you.. but you're not.

useful_contacts

geminilady wrote: »

Or whenever you have the urge to say horrible things to the shopkeeper pinch yourself .

i dont actually say it to the shopkeeper, when i leave the shop i go into a rant to the person im with, or when i go home i rant off to my fiance about it

I hate it:(

useful_contacts

truecrippler wrote: »

I think you have too much pride in being Irish and who you are.

Thats actually very true i am very proud of my nationality and am very patiriotic

mikemac

useful_contacts wrote: »

Its the same if i go into a shop and theres a polish person working behing the counter, i start giving out about it saying "They are letting anyone into the countrty", and this person never did anything to me they are just doing their job ya know...

You know I feel the same way but I hate all people equally :pac:

Do you actually give out to people? Or just say it in your head? More info needed

Ultimatly, it comes down to insecurity. You're not happy with yourself so you find fault with others. Maybe set a few goals for yourself

Btw, if you are white and Irish I'd love to know how you are being racist against someone who is white and European!

useful_contacts

micmclo wrote: »

Do you actually give out to people? Or just say it in your head? More info needed

Btw, if you are white and Irish I'd love to know how you are being racist against someone who is white and European!

I say it in my head and sometimes mutter under my breath

You can be racist to anyone thats not the same nationality as you its not all about colour

mikemac

useful_contacts wrote: »

You can be racist to anyone to is not the same nationality as you its not all about colour

Ok, I'm not going to ruin your thread by being pedantic but your post is wrong.

Being racist means you believe your race is superior to others
Being xenophobic means you believe your nationality is superior to others

Big and important difference OP and from reading mainly rubbish threads in After Hours, most people on boards don't know the difference.

Chinafoot

All this patriotic nonsense is just that...nonsense. You're not any less patriotic if you don't despise foreigners in this country. Attitudes like that are so ignorant and insular and in the end, you're the person that ends up missing out.

You need to educate yourself to be quite honest. If you're serious about changing your attitude why not volunteer with some local support groups for non-nationals in your area....oh and try to avoid tabloid rags that seem to pander to this ignorance.

useful_contacts

micmclo wrote: »

Being racist means you believe your race is superior to others

I dont think that at all, maybe its partly the media that gives me the "suicide bomber" impresson but I in no way think im better than anyone whos not irish

useful_contacts

Chinafoot wrote: »

oh and try to avoid tabloid rags that seem to pander to this ignorance.

Honestly most of the impressions i get are from the news ya know

Romanians running scams
Polish working while on the dole
Asian suicide bomber kills 20

Have heard all them on the RTE and TV3 news, and it doesnt help, I know what your gonna say irish people do it more than them, and i know that which is why i dont get why i feel like this

Bottle_of_Smoke

What do you think makes you racist?

Do you have any family/friends affected by immigration? Lay offs, outsourcing, are you finding it difficult to get a job?

Are you insecure about your looks or physical presence? Asians(oriental & south Asian/Arabs) & Polish girls are very pretty & guys tend to prefer someone exotic. Whereas Irish women don't tend to be as interested in foreign men. I notice you didn't mention blacks, who are less popular among Irish men.

How do you feel about travellers?

I think the suicide bombing fear is just a mix of hype on the news & you building on your racism

Caoimhín

Dont worry about it. I think we all get a bit cranky/weird/racist as we get older. My gran was a fully signed up member of the KKK by the time she died. Its natural to be suspicious of others.

useful_contacts

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

are you finding it difficult to get a job?

Are you insecure about your looks or physical presence? Asians(oriental & south Asian/Arabs) & Polish girls are very pretty & guys tend to prefer someone exotic. Whereas Irish women don't tend to be as interested in foreign men.

I notice you didn't mention blacks, who are less popular among Irish men.

How do you feel about travellers?

I think the suicide bombing fear is just a mix of hype on the news & you building on your racism

Yes actually i am finding it very hard to get a job atm

Im insecure about my looks as most women are but i have a fiance i have been with four years and im very secure in my relationship so i dont think its that.

I dont mind blacks at all

Travellers, had a bit of trouble with them recently regarding them hanging around outside shops and throwing abuse at everyone who passed so i avoid them when i can. Actually went to the shop the other day and there was a bunch of travellers outside and i just walked to another shop instead of getting abuse for nothing.

Caoimhín

Its the Greeks i hate.

truecrippler

It's all news hype man. It's not how you really want to think, its just that you're taking stories to heart and you're believing them a little too much.
You said that you have foreign friends. Are they Polish or Chinese?.. Maybe they could know this guy that your saying stuff under your breath to? Maybe you could get to know him in the future.

They have a job, they persevered and got a job. Maybe you should take a little note from their book and try a little harder.

Were you brought up with grandparents and parents telling you how they used to "walk in the snow" etc and how life was tough and Ireland was Ireland? Thats just old talk. We're living in a modern age now, a lot of things and peoples perceptions on things have changed.

Overall, I don't really think you're racist. Just insecure and jealous. Those things are generally easily fixed over time and experience.

papillon66

Hi Op,

I don't think you are racist but as most pepople we are scared of the unknown and people we don't know- And foreigners are scared too as it's not always easy tolive in a foreign country surrounded by a new culture, diferent minds...we don't know if we can trust a stranger coming in our life...it's a normal defense- I believe if you go to your local shop, restaurant,pub often enough at the end you get to know them...s it takes just a little bit of effort to place trust between people, to know them and forget about this scary boundary of the person we don't know...of course sometimes as much effort you can put on it some people are not ready or don't want to cross this boundary...but that it is their problem then. Change your thought next time you go to a shop and think that the person is in front of you is as scared as you are in some ways...a smile and a hello how are you...always help to break the ice and install some trust-well it works for me usually;)

My suggestion will be keep the smile and be happy about yourself whenever you have to talk to a foreigner...I promise it works:)

lolli

I am from the country. I met my OH 3 years ago. He is European. I am sick to death of people where I live being so small minded. Oh your going out with a foreigner? If i hear that sentence once more I will scream. He was also told in a place where he was working that he should feck off back to his own country and stop taking Irish jobs. We should judge people by who they are not their nationality or their colour.

Another thing people have said to me is that if I have children they will get bullied for having foreign surnames. We are now a multicultural society. Live and let live, who are we to judge others!!!

Zen 2nd

lolli wrote: »

who are we to judge others!!!

Exactly

Sangre

I have never met a racist who wasn't an absolute idiot with no grasp on logic, reason or even basic concepts of the world around him. Do you want people lumping you in that category because they most certainly would if they noticed you act like that.

I'm surprised your finace lets you get away with it. Get him to give you a bollicking every time you do it.

delz0r

dont be worrying bout it its grand

The Sweeper

OP; just stop doing it.

Either that, or do something positive to educate yourself so you stop doing it.

For instance, you know those 'Oh the fordin nashnuls, dey get a socialisation allowance on de dole to go drinking wit like' rumours you hear in the pub - the next time you hear one of those, RING THE DOLE OFFICE AND ASK THEM.

The next time you hear 'Oh the polish are all running scams', phone the polish embassy and ask if someone could tel you how many polish they reckon are in Dublin, and what proportion the embassy are worried about.

You might get nowhere, but at least you're airing something with the people who seem to be bothering you so much.

togster

Educate yourself OP or at least know that not everything you hear is true.

Feelgood

I hate the Irish, your all a bunch of alcoholic leprachaun loving mofo's.

Caoimhín

Thats racialism ya Greek..

the_syco

Feelgood wrote: »

I hate the Irish, your all a bunch of alcoholic leprachaun loving mofo's.

Aye:cool:

=-=

OP: check out http://jobbank.fas.ie for jobs in your area.

As for the racist thing, meh. It seems that your subconsious mind is picking up all the racist crap, and making you feel paranoid.

You're not racist. A true racist doesn't know that they're racist, but hates others regardless. Me, I hate the roma's & knackers. And every romanian who I know agrees with me about the roma's, and every traveller I've met so far are good decent folk. Unfortunately, people think romanian = roma, and if you live in a caravan, you're a knacker. Ah well.

Rev Hellfire

I'm puzzled as to why you're even posting this.

If you don't like foreigners there's nothing per say wrong with that, we all have our likes and dislikes be they rational or not. Its part of been human.

As long as its not directly effecting your ability to function and you're not planning on burning their houses down you've nothing to be concerned about in my view.

Susannahmia

Op, I dont think the racism is the underlying problem here. I suffer from depression and anxiety occasionally and can become very paranoid. I suggest you see a counselor to try and resolve what is actually causing these feelings.

LegacyUser

A couple of years ago my friend and I slipped into a habit of making racist-type remarks when we were around each other. This was only ever a piss-take as neither of us actually are racist. It's hard to explain but it started after us talking about issues like immigration etc and laughing at how super-liberal she thought I was and how offensively right-wing I thought she was. We both have a fairly politically incorrect sense of humour- although I would never say anything in front of someone who would take me seriously or be offended by it. But me and her ended up adopting these complaining, Victor Meldrew type characters when we were together- it just became a running joke.

Thing is...as time went on, we moved in together and did this more often we both sort of lost sight of the fact that neither of us actually thought any of this **** in the first place! I found myself increasingly making remarks in front of people who did not share our sense of humour and were horrified by things I said- and I'd then be mortified trying to explain that I didn't mean it. Also, and more worryingly, whenever I encountered foreign people it was these thoughts that sprung to mind. Basically by constant repitition of racist/xenophobic remarks, I had rehearsed an attitude so much that became what I actually thought!

This was actually pretty scary- to realise that I suddenly had become this person I found offensive. It's a perfect demonstration of the fact that you can change your attitudes if you try. You need to individualise foreign people that you see and make them real people- start saying hello and smiling at your shopkeeper. Encounter others with a pleasant and friendly attitude and they will be more responsive to you- and because of that you willwalk away with a better impression of the encounter.

Similarly, when you think offensive things, force yourself to say that that is born of racism and is not a true reflection of the person. This practice is known as "mindfulness" and is actually really successful in teaching children to be tolerant of differences etc. If you police your opinions enough they will change.

topper75

Everyone gets a little llike this at times. It is no big worry - you seem like a decent person overall with a sense of fair play.

The technique I use to balance things out is just to meditate on how our shower behaved when we had no choice but to emigrate:

- enter countries illegally
- pull scams
- draw dole whilst working
- anti-social behaviour
- plant the odd bomb or two in civilian locations

Heh heh - we are nobody's master race anyway.

Take any race you like - Poles or whatever - for every one eejit who you would rather deport, there are a dozen sound boys/girls for whom it is an honour for us to give a leg up to.

Overheal

useful_contacts wrote: »

I say it in my head and sometimes mutter under my breath

You can be racist to anyone thats not the same nationality as you its not all about colour

trust me lady - you can be racist about your own nationality at times too

LouOB

Why dont you have nice holiday abroad?

Then you can see the other side of the coin

Overheal

LouOB wrote: »

Why dont you have nice holiday abroad?

Then you can see the other side of the coin

or move abroad a while even better. Worked great on me.

Sherifu

Moving abroad is not a bad idea, but no guarantee it will change the OP's attitude.

If you can't love then hate everyone the same. Works for me.

LaVidaLoca

a walk down Thomas Street if you wanna cure that.

You'll get to see hard-working, ambitious, good-looking, smartly-dressed Polish, Chinese, and other foreigners stepping over the toothless Irish dole-scum passed out on the pavement, on the way to one of their 3 jobs.

That'll take away any misguided patriotism you may have.

But, joking aside, the fact that you're aware of it, means you're not truly racist. It's probably anger about some other aspect of your life bubbling up into anger at an easy target. Maybe you're feeling powerless?

WellyJ

Did this lack of respect to other people, and general xenophobia happen to start around the same time you realised you were a Liverpool fan?

Seems to be the most probable explanation

topper75

Yeah...er... there are no foreigners playing at Liverpool or in the stands.

Suzette

OP you say you have some foreign friends - Do you have the same feelings of racism towards them or is it just strangers of other nationalities?

We are constantly bombarded with negative stereotyping from the media - suicide bombers/immigrants/travellers etc it is no wonder that you feel apprehensive/hostile when you meet people of other races that you don't know. If you have friends of other nationalities then you can't be racist, perhaps it is just the fear of the unknown and how the media stereotypes and portrays people.

I am Indian, I moved to Ireland 7 years ago and met my boyfriend who's Irish, I think on the whole Irish people are very friendly however in the last few years I have definitely noticed that there is more suspicion/negativity towards foreigners.

I remember when I first moved over here, I'd go to the pub on a friday/saturday night and get quite a few funny looks, it wasn't until one guy I spoke to said he hadn't seen an indian woman in the pub drinking before, it was unusual - that's why I got the stares, he also wasn't sure how to talk to me as he'd never spoken to an "indian woman" before!! I assured him women were women wherever they're from and the same goes for men. Sometimes people are just afraid of different cultures and traditions especially if you see your country changing with an influx of different nationalities - change is a good thing but it can take some getting used to.

It used to be the english that the Irish "hated" (too strong a term perhaps but u know what I mean), then it was the travellers, the blacks, the eastern europeans and now its the asians. Tomorrow it will be someone else, it seems there always has to be some group or race thats the scape goat.

You just have to remember that we are all individuals, there are good and bad people in all cultures and societies, don't judge the whole by the actions of a few.

Caoimhín

Suzette wrote: »

It used to be the english that the Irish "hated" (too strong a term perhaps but u know what I mean), then it was the travellers, the blacks, the eastern europeans and now its the asians. Tomorrow it will be someone else, it seems there always has to be some group or race thats the scape goat.

Might I suggest the Greeks?

MIN2511

Hey, i believe we all have a bit of racism in us be us black, white or asian. I would only worry when it gets verbal/physical but until then you can rant about the Polish and Indians taking the jobs or the Nigerians driving cabs....

I have encountered racism a few times, one in particular an elderly woman approached me in Dunnes Stores and told me to go back to my country e.t.c. i was quite offended but then i blamed ignorance on her part.....

MizzLolly

Useful_Contacts,

Stop feeling so guilty. You haven't actually hurt anybody, it would be far worse if you were confronting innocent people about their nationality when they were simply trying to do their jobs.

Ireland has changed - drastically. You are not the only person feeling this. I think that what is important to realise is that it is not the person you are feeling hate towards (or even their race) but rather the stereotypes that come with them. When a person says, "I hate when Roma-Gypsies come into the shop and steal/beg", they are not actually being racist. They simply do not like the fact that they are known to steal. The issue is not with Romanians (as many people suggest), it is what that particular group of people are doing. That does not make you racist as the same feelings would apply if a group of Irish skangers started vandalising a shop.

Speaking from personal experience, I have often, often felt this way. In fact I used to be part of anti-racism campaigns and all but not anymore. My views did change as more and more non-nationals came into the country. I worked in a hotel where there were 15 Polish girls and only myself and one other Irish girl. It was an awful experience and I do admit that for a long time my view on Polish women was very, very jaded. The job I am currently in has a couple of Irish girls but mostly non-nationals and I can't sing their praises enough. I have met some of the sweetest and most sincere people there. If I've learned anything from these two experiences, it is that sometimes we mistake 'racism' for a general dislike for certain behaviours. In my first job I did not like it when the Polish girls refused to work with me as they wanted to stay with their Polish colleagues. That belittled me as a worker and what they did was wrong, simple as. Their nationality was irrelevant but I just didn't see it at the time. Basically what I am saying is that, there are bad characteristics in everyone. No matter what nationality. Of course as immigrant numbers soar we are bound to come into contact with many other races. It goes without saying that while we meet some really genuine people, we will also meet some absolute animals. Nationality or race is not the issue. You seem to have difficulty with the stereotypes associated with certain races rather than the nationality of the people. To be honest, this is totally understandable. We are being exposed to more trouble from foreigners than ever before. Simple because there are more of them here now. You mention suicide bombers - that to me appears to be a fear issue rather than race. You are not responding to their religion, colour etc, you are responding to what you have been exposed to in the past and the negativity associated with Muslims. That is not racism as it is in response to behaviour rather than race.

I'm sure you are not alone in your views and anyone who sends abusive PMs and other such sh*te is a hypocrite. Your examples were not even that bad. Your problems seem to be linked more with behavioural issues rather than race!

LaVidaLoca

That is not racism as it is in response to behaviour rather than race.

No, it is racism to day that "All Polish are/do x"

It doesnt matter whether it's to do with behaviour or not.

That said I think we're all capable of racist feelings at times. Its to do with the inate human desire to find patterns in things. You see one Romanian begging, then another, then another, and so your mind makes a leap 'And says: "All Romanians are beggars!"

Its not your higher, intelligent brain that does this, it's your gut. And as Nick Hornby once said "Your gut has **** for brains."

A perfect example in me was after spending over a year of my life in India at different times, much of it living with an working with wonderful Indians, I remember one day in Delhi being hassled by rude touts on the street, and it was hot and I was irritable, and for a brief second I went "Jesus! ****ing Indians!" I had to laugh at the stupidity of myself in that moment.

Placebo

To actually even come in contact with a racist person in this century is disgusting, first of all enjoy ireland till you're on your death bed, since you hate 'these' people i'm sure you wont bother going to 'their' country on holidays.
I would advise you to start reading REAL newspapers and not the metro and i would also advise you to probably get a better job and a better looking fiancée, seems to me your life must be really sad and boring for you to even concentrate on anything remotely like this.
Live your life, let others live theirs, dont expect to raise any children with your attitude, it will only go down a wrong wrong road for them.
I have no sympathy nor a CURE for anyone like you. There is no cure, cop on.

wes

I don't think the OP is a real racist. The fact they posted this thread at all, I think shows that you think the way you feel is wrong. Quite frankly a racist would never think there wrong and would believe there a 100% right.

I don't know how you can sort you problem. Maybe, try to get to know more foreigners? Also, I think you need to talk to someone about this either a friend or maybe a professional as there may be a deeper issue here than your xenophobic feeling towards foreigners.

Also, don't believe everything you read in the paper, not every Asian is a suicide bomber, not every eastern European is a sponger. Many are just like you trying to get by every day.

Caoimhín

wes wrote: »

Also, don't believe everything you read in the paper, not every Asian is a suicide bomber, not every eastern European is a sponger. Many are just like you trying to get by every day.

What newspapers do you read?

Placebo

wes wrote: »

I don't think the OP is a real racist. The fact they posted this thread at all, I think shows that you think the way you feel is wrong. Quite frankly a racist would never think there wrong and would believe there a 100% right.

I don't know how you can sort you problem. Maybe, try to get to know more foreigners? Also, I think you need to talk to someone about this either a friend or maybe a professional as there may be a deeper issue here than your xenophobic feeling towards foreigners.

Also, don't believe everything you read in the paper, not every Asian is a suicide bomber, not every eastern European is a sponger. Many are just like you trying to get by every day.

Shes probably not a racist but she is definitely ignorant. At many levels.
Packistan?

cowzerp

Lots of people are a little racist, not nasty racist but have issues wih other nationalitys, the minute i hear someone is english i get the whole, there scum thing, stole our country etc.., Nigerians-stab merchant(most i know have stab wounds) and scammers, romanians, beggers and robbers, russians, bully's etc..

in saying that, 1 of my best mates is English and if i meet someone of any of these countrys and they are sound i'll treat them as sound, i'd never be racist to someone just to be nasty-its more in my head and from stereo types.

i like stereotyping though as it gives you a starting point of how people will be like then as you know them you can see the individual and wheter the stereotype is warranted or not!

wes

caoibhin wrote: »

What newspapers do you read?

I tend to get my news from the BBC News, RTE News, Independent, Guardian, Al Jazeera and Google News.

wes

Placebo wrote: »

Shes probably not a racist but she is definitely ignorant. At many levels.

Fair enough, but at least she accepts her problems and is asking for help. Which I view as a good thing.

Placebo wrote: »

Packistan?

No clue what your getting at here.

Something similar to this happened last week.

I was down in Lidl doing my shopping. The till next to me had a couple (both english, by the sound of their accent), and a black woman behind them. The couple are packing their stuff on the belt when the black woman puts hers behind them. Unbeknownst to her, they haven't finished. So the man puts her stuff on the ground. Black woman questions her and the couple suddenly starts lashing into her.

"Black b1tch"
"Go back to your own country"
"Get out of our country" (might I add once more that their accent sounded more english than anything else"

And all of this with other black people around and the place busy. The guy wasn't too bad. He would ask the black woman if she was ok, but his wife would start lashing into her saying, "don't ask her if she's ok, black b1tch".

Eventually they left the store with the man telling the black woman to have a nice day, to which the wife shouted, "don't say that, I fúcking hope she crashes".

Overheal

Overheal wrote: »

trust me lady - you can be racist about your own nationality at times too

Living in Kerry for 11 years taught me this... quite a few people thought I was a drug pusher or something.

Anyway, I'm in the same boat as the OP here and it somewhat came from my family, I always remember my da watching football matches saying something like "ya black pig" if a black player missed a shot but wouldn't say something similar about a white player. He's like that and his father was too so it brushed off on me. I've also had two scenarios where a Romanian and a Bulgarian took advantage of my usually generous nature to try to clean me out of money. So neither of these things have helped. At the moment Meteor have a big ad campaign in Polish on bus shelters and stuff, it makes my blood boil - "we're in Dublin not flippin' Warsaw" is what I usually think. It's like I'm replaying my da's life, he was in England in the 70s when they started appearing and he hated them too.

I also see one of my friends, a fully qualified electrician, out of work because Polish electricians are doing the same jobs for less pay. He's considering leaving the country himself because he can't find work, reeks of the 80s to me.

I know this hatred is wrong but I don't think there's anything I can do about it. It's not everyone, English speaking nations and those in "old" Europe I've no problem with, I'm even thinking of learning German. It's mostly those from countries which get bad press I suppose. It's only thoughts, I've never hurled abuse at anyone over it.