Update on 17.35 to Carlow

fitzyshea

Does anyone know what the current situation is with the 17.35 train to Carlow ie: the one that is cancelled since February as no drivers to drive it? Any light at the end of the tunnel yet? I think I read that the unions and management are back in the LRC this week and then that is it. If no positive decision from that then what happens?

Ham'nd'egger

fitzyshea wrote: »

Does anyone know what the current situation is with the 17.35 train to Carlow ie: the one that is cancelled since February as no drivers to drive it? Any light at the end of the tunnel yet? I think I read that the unions and management are back in the LRC this week and then that is it. If no positive decision from that then what happens?

There is only two ways out the current situation to revive this train. One is to take on more drivers to cover it and the other is for Irish Rail not to insist on drivers working overtime are exclusively to run it. The latter just means that other services may be culled to cover it so it isn't a good situation to be in.

If there isn't enough staff to cover shifts, then it is the duty of the company to ensure that there is. In times gone, it was the culture in CIE companies that overtime was almost compulsory and there was as much of it available to staff as they wanted or were told to work, such was the demand on their skills. Staff in any company are not obliged to work overtime as we all know and in this case the 48 hour working week limit is a priority to adhere to and is putting a spanner into the working of this ideal. One can blame the staff but they are doing their days work and going home as you and I would; they are merely following the rules.

Given that there is a recruitment embargo in many State and Semi State companies, the ability on Irish Rail to take on more staff lays on the shoulders of the Minister of Transport to ensure the staff numbers are adequate.

loyatemu

on a related note - there's an extra Gorey service supposed to start running next week (1640 weekdays from Connolly) - anyone know if this will actually run or will it also fall victim to the overtime dispute?

Ham'nd'egger

loyatemu wrote: »

on a related note - there's an extra Gorey service supposed to start running next week (1640 weekdays from Connolly) - anyone know if this will actually run or will it also fall victim to the overtime dispute?

Cancellations depends on if there are enough drivers on a given day to cover the required services. Connolly drivers and Heuston drivers don't really work each others services as they are different depots so they won't have a bearing on each others services.

penexpers

Hey the 0630 from Portloaise ran this morning and that's been cancelled since the same time the 1735 to Carlow has been cancelled. Maybe it's back running again? The cancellation notice has been taken down from the website too.

Victor

Hamndegger wrote: »

Staff in any company are not obliged to work overtime

Many contracts say that overtime can be required. The problem for IÉ is the way they structured their deal with the unions.

Employees have no entitlement to extra hours.

fitzyshea

Below taken from IE website today! Still no service to Carlow! Ahhhhhhhhhhhh

06 30 Portlaoise to Heuston RESUMES; 17 35 Heuston to Carlow remains cancelled by Corporate Communications


UPDATE 28th April 2008

Iarnród Éireann advises customers that the weekday 06.30hrs service from Portlaoise to Heuston, has now resumed daily operation, following its cancellation since 11th February last.

Unfortunately, the 17 35 Heuston to Carlow service remains cancelled until further notice due to ongoing driver issues.



Advice for 17.35hrs Heuston to Carlow customers

Customers for Sallins, Newbridge, Athy and Carlow are advised to travel on the 17.45hrs Heuston to Westport service. Customers for Athy and Carlow will be transferred by bus from Newbridge.



Iarnród Éireann apologises to customers for the inconvenience caused.

jjbrien

fitzyshea wrote: »

Below taken from IE website today! Still no service to Carlow! Ahhhhhhhhhhhh

06 30 Portlaoise to Heuston RESUMES; 17 35 Heuston to Carlow remains cancelled by Corporate Communications


UPDATE 28th April 2008

Iarnród Éireann advises customers that the weekday 06.30hrs service from Portlaoise to Heuston, has now resumed daily operation, following its cancellation since 11th February last.

Unfortunately, the 17 35 Heuston to Carlow service remains cancelled until further notice due to ongoing driver issues.



Advice for 17.35hrs Heuston to Carlow customers

Customers for Sallins, Newbridge, Athy and Carlow are advised to travel on the 17.45hrs Heuston to Westport service. Customers for Athy and Carlow will be transferred by bus from Newbridge.



Iarnród Éireann apologises to customers for the inconvenience caused.

Just a question re the rolling stock that opperates that train trains need to go back down the line to be in place for the next mourning. how does the rolling stock get to carlow to opperate its return service or is there a return service.

Ham'nd'egger

jjbrien wrote: »

Just a question re the rolling stock that opperates that train trains need to go back down the line to be in place for the next mourning. how does the rolling stock get to carlow to opperate its return service or is there a return service.

As far as I know, the 17:35 stock stays over for the 6:30AM service.

Ham'nd'egger

Victor wrote: »

Many contracts say that overtime can be required. The problem for IÉ is the way they structured their deal with the unions.

Employees have no entitlement to extra hours.

Employment Law would differ from this view and would override any unlawful contract, Victor.

In the situation in Irish Rail (Especially in the recession years), historically the man management with the various staff levels was that wages at basic rates were low, but with a combination of allowances and overtime, decent monies could be earned. Staff acknowledged that while OT was an accepted "evil", it was only done on the understanding that a man was doing so to cover a man of equal grade or standing for holidays, illness etc and that it did not take a job from a man that could be employed in that role. As a consequence, drivers would not cover missing guards, inspectors did not drive/operate machinery etc and it protected staff from underhand redundancy/lay offs.

The deal as I understand it was that staff and unions agreed to work a certain amount of OT. Where the difficulties are now is that the company maintain that staff and unions agreed to work to the old deal before negociations for a new agreement while the staff state that it isn't the case.

jjbrien

Hamndegger wrote: »

As far as I know, the 17:35 stock stays over for the 6:30AM service.

But then is the 6:30am cancelled due to the train never left Heuston the day before or does a ghost drive it to carlow overnight? My point is if the train set is able to get to carlow for the 6:30am service then how come they say they have no staff to drive it at 5:35 when the train is able to go down the track with no passengers to be in Carlow for the 6:30am service. I could be wrong but someone has to drive this set to carlow in order for it to run at 6:30am?

Ham'nd'egger

jjbrien wrote: »

But then is the 6:30am cancelled due to the train never left Heuston the day before or does a ghost drive it to carlow overnight? My point is if the train set is able to get to carlow for the 6:30am service then how come they say they have no staff to drive it at 5:35 when the train is able to go down the track with no passengers to be in Carlow for the 6:30am service. I could be wrong but someone has to drive this set to carlow in order for it to run at 6:30am?

The 17:30 was cancelled as it was intially covered by an unrostered driver who would have worked the OT to cover the movement. If it didn't work down in the evening, it would simply be worked down empty that morning from Dublin at the beginning of his rostered day.

KC61

Hamndegger wrote: »

As far as I know, the 17:35 stock stays over for the 6:30AM service.

This is incorrect.

The 0630 ex-Carlow is worked by a Mk 3 Push Pull set that operates empty from Heuston to Carlow at about 5am every morning. No stock is left overnight in Carlow station.

The stock that operates the 0630 ex-Portlaoise (until Portlaoise depot opens) also operates empty from Heuston each morning.

The stock that operated the 1735 Heuston-Carlow was rostered to work empty back to Heuston.

This is because the traincrews are all based in Inchicore.

When Portlaoise depot opens, and when the 1735 resumes (once there are sufficient drivers), the stock will work empty from Carlow to Portlaoise Depot each evening in order to operate the 0630 Portlaoise-Heuston - they will then be operated by Portlaoise crews.

fitzyshea

Ok still no sign of the 17.35 to carlow coming back however Gorey get a new commuter service from today no offence to anyone from Gorey but how can IE start a new service while they dont even run the exisitng ones?

From IE website 6th May.

New Gorey Commuter Service to Start on Tues 6th May by Corporate Communications


A new Gorey Commuter Service will commence on Tues 6th May next. The service will depart Connolly at 16:40hrs and a return service will operate from Gorey at 19:23hrs.

This service will be operated by the new Intercity Railcars

penexpers

The 1640 has apparently been on the timetable for a while, they only have the stock to run it now.

The 0630 will be cancelled again this week, apparently.

fitzyshea

Any sign of the 17.35 returning yet? Now that the Cork boys had there day out I wonder will the Waterford lads follow suit!

KC61

fitzyshea wrote: »

Any sign of the 17.35 returning yet? Now that the Cork boys had there day out I wonder will the Waterford lads follow suit!

No sign yet - this should be operated by a Portlaoise based driver when it restarts operating, as the set will operate empty back to Portlaoise for servicing.

Victor

I wonder if some of these will see improvement in the next week.

It would appear that a number of long standing alterations are continuing. Of course this includes the Kildare Route Project works.

Cork & Kerry & Limerick service alterations, Sundays
http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/general_news.asp?action=view&news_id=371

Millstreet / Banteer timetable alteration
http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/general_news.asp?action=view&news_id=370

17 35 Heuston to Carlow cancelled
http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/general_news.asp?action=view&news_id=331

13 30 Westport to Dublin, Sundays, deferred to 14 25
http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/general_news.asp?action=view&news_id=306

Heuston services: Saturday evenings, Sunday mornings, May to August 2008
http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/general_news.asp?action=view&news_id=319