Punto - What to look out for?

JohnCleary

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=51582

Gonna drive up to that car this weekend. Apart from the usuals which I can check myself (suspension, gearbox, clutch, crashed etc) is there any particular weakness in these model cars?

It's a first car for the GF so I don't want to be spending mega bucks, and I want somethign small as she'll be using it for city driving. I hate the colour but she likes it

Any advise appreciated

itarumaa

If you can afford, buy Yaris instead, I have heard nothing good for puntos.

Or Ford Fiesta, Nissan Micra etc

kona

puntos are fine as a run about, easy and cheap to fix too:)

check the head gasket, if its been replaced, the head may needed to be skimmed so check this, somtimes it doesnt need skimming.
check when the timing belt was done last too.

as you know gearbox and diff are weak in them too

btw i wouldnt touch a fiesta, they are ****e, even worse than puntos, although 2,3 sounds quite high for a 7 year old punto.

youd import a clean jap car for that,in much better nick than a irish car

S.I.R

the headgaskets go on these on a daily bases aswell as the rear struts are weak and the exhaust begins to melt as you pass 4k rpm , check for lag in mid-gears at low revs aswell as you Need a FSH ( full service history ) , without that Alone , don't touch it with a barge pole :rolleyes:

itarumaa , you can do much better then a punto , the car may be a year or two older but should last much longer and be cheaper to run

JohnCleary

Bah are these things prone to HG failure? I don't want something with a soft HG, i've had a Rover before and the worry about the HG going is just nuts

The GF doesnt like the look of a Yaris/Micra etc. but thanks anyways

S.I.R

polo/106/saxo/clio then ??? all of them are as sound as a micra but with euro looks

kona

does anybody know why the HG is weak on the punto??id love to know??

i know the rover K-series was ****e because of the thermostat and thrermal shock, but it was adressed by rover, k-series is a fantastic engine, lotus used them too.

polo/saxo/clio106???

sure the french cars are fine, till ya hit the brake and the indicator comes on!lol or a airbag flies out,lol and the polo...heap of ****, the engine and box in the polo is poor as is the interior.

Tony H

as has been said by previous posters the head gasket is the main problem , i had one for 4 years and the ecu went at about 50,000 miles (cost €460 to fix ) the wiper link went (another known fault) i fixed that myself , and finally the head gasket went at about 97,000miles , it cost around €700 to get that fixed and a few months later it started to overheat again so i finally traded it in against a new colt for my son ,
the good points about the punto is that its cheap enough to run (aroung 45mpg) and its really easy to drive around town

mickdw

Head gasket and the electric steering motor too is troublsome I think.

sc4rf4ce

i have a mk1 punto at the moment. i got it as a project car, but ended up keeping it for the last few months. they are so economical to drive. Alot of you may disagree, but I find it very comfortable to drive.
but of course the head gasket recently went on it, and the front right headlight plug that connects to the bulb itself needs relplacing.
in fairness my punto had no service history what so ever.
other than that, the car has given no problems at all.
very easy to maintain and service. but i wouldnt call them the most reliable cars in the world.
but if you get a well looked after punto, you should be doing well. but i wouldnt pay too much for one at the same time.

JohnCleary

Seller above won't budge below 1550 for the 01 with 65k miles, no service history whatsoever

I think I should just keep the money and buy a colt/corolla

Alanstrainor

I would recommend a fiesta, my mother had 3 of them, and never a single problem. they're fun to drive too. In comparison to the punto they're a lot more reliable, i've heard countless stories of that generation of puntos giving tons of trouble, from power steering to head gasket to electronics to gearboxes...although it is hit and miss, you might be lucky and get one that will be just grand, but then again.

L1011

Head Gasket, head gasket, head gasket...
ECU/Coils/coil drivers - Fiat ream you for an official repair when (which is more likely than if) this happens. Cheap to do yourself, though. Starts off with an 'the engine lights on but it drives grand...' and moves to a misfire.

PixelTrawler

GF has a punto - head gasket went on that too
Country roads eat the shocks too. Power steering is a bit iffy at more then 3/4 lock

colm_mcm

Given the amount of Puntos around the place, I'd treat ELX or Elegance as the minimum spec to go for. and I'd go for a nice colour, you can afford to be picky.
Electric Windows, Central Locking, Rear headrests, Colour Coded Bumpers, etc aren't on the base spec.

E92

Puntos, both Mk1 and Mk2 hate bumps or even the slightest imperfection on the road. And they're not exactly a model for reliability either. And distances say even 15 miles on a national road...forget it, it's too noisy. You could say I don't like the Punto:).

colm_mcm

E92, to be fair to the Mk2 Punto, the 1.2 8 valve is very refined and not too noisy at all.

Masada

a punto isnt a bad choice at all, ive had loads of them over the last few years particularly the MK1s which are better than the MK2, there can be problems with the mk2 ECU which usually just needs reseting and the electric steering can give trouble., id reccomend a mk1 ELX for instance, they cost very litle these days and come with colour coded mirrors, electric sunroof, electric windows and all the other bells and whistles aswell as a 16v engine over the usuall 8v fire engine. even if the HG does go in the usual 8v it shouldnt cosy more than about 300-400 quid from a decent mechanic since it such an easy engine to work on and the fact that its non interfereance.,

monkey27

Ha please don't get a punto...they are a death trap!! the HG went on mine a day after buying it and since I bought it privately I had no comeback!! I only paid 1100 for it and paid 400 for parts to be fixed(HG) being one of them... It takes about an hour to heat up and you can hear everything!!
oh the list goes on...just get something cheap and cheerful...the fiesta woulg do her grand!!

FearDark

If u love your girlfriend dont buy her a punto. I bought my GF a punto in March 07, got her a 96 1.6 GLX model, it was imported from UK at some point, had way more extras than an irish model, p/s, e/w all round, ac, elec sunroof! I honestly couldnt name a part in the car that didnt fall off or break. The build quality was awful!! One thing I did like though was all the little boy racers in their starlets and crap dropping their jaws as the punto owned them...

Probarbly the only time u'll see a fast punto! What was i sayin, oh yeah dont buy one, theyre called a *unto for a reason...

JohnCleary

A colt or corolla it is!

zilog_jones

kona wrote: »

btw i wouldnt touch a fiesta, they are ****e, even worse than puntos, although 2,3 sounds quite high for a 7 year old punto.

Care to elaborate how they're worse than Puntos? I've never heard of anyone have head gasket trouble in any Fiestas for starters, or anything else expensive like gearboxes, ECUs, premature timing belt failures, etc.

I've had one since '06 ('98 1.3 LX) - had to replace the thermostat and temperature gauge sender (€12 and €40), the heater control valve (€45), and the recently rear shock mounts and axle bushings (about €350). The first two problems aren't that common (but cheap), the heater control valve is known to be crap in these (still cheap enough and easy to change), and in all fairness the last two are not exactly out of the ordinary for a car that's been in Co. Limerick for most of its 10 years.

kona

zilog_jones wrote: »

Care to elaborate how they're worse than Puntos? I've never heard of anyone have head gasket trouble in any Fiestas for starters, or anything else expensive like gearboxes, ECUs, premature timing belt failures, etc.

I've had one since '06 ('98 1.3 LX) - had to replace the thermostat and temperature gauge sender (€12 and €40), the heater control valve (€45), and the recently rear shock mounts and axle bushings (about €350). The first two problems aren't that common (but cheap), the heater control valve is known to be crap in these (still cheap enough and easy to change), and in all fairness the last two are not exactly out of the ordinary for a car that's been in Co. Limerick for most of its 10 years.

em my aunts one a 1998 example:rolleyes: is falling apart, the trim is ****ed, the paint looks ****, and the engine had to be replace in it due to head gasket failure, leading to the engine seizing up.
granted this isnt 100% fords fault but, ive seen video on youtube of ancient jap cars abused just to get themto stop and it takes AGES:)

so replacing a engine is a serious cost;)

Alanstrainor

kona wrote: »

em my aunts one a 1998 example:rolleyes: is falling apart, the trim is ****ed, the paint looks ****, and the engine had to be replace in it due to head gasket failure, leading to the engine seizing up.
granted this isnt 100% fords fault but, ive seen video on youtube of ancient jap cars abused just to get themto stop and it takes AGES:)

so replacing a engine is a serious cost;)

Trim and paint can hardly be fords problem after 10 years, wear and tear after 10 years could take it's toll, especially if it wasn't "well" looked after, and as for the head gasket issue, it's not a common issue on the fiestas of that era, although there are always lemons. I mean that 1.3 engine went into production in 1976 and although slightly revised was largely the same in the 98 model! I would agree that the jap cars tend to be better but aren't we comparing it to a punto? and you pay over the odds for a civic, corolla, etc compared to a fiesta.

rmurf

if you're not going to get a punto, what would you advise for similar cheapness and improved reliability??

the trade off in getting one is that you are buying a car that is a fair bit younger than a similar priced hatchback and if you can get decent mileage and fsh than why not a punto??

i am well aware of the term 'false economy' but surely they cant be THAT bad?????

klaus23

I had a 00 Sporting and couldn't fault it much, car did an effortless 60k miles then my brother had it and he sold it to his (ex) gf with 110k on the clock.

Gearboxes are weak, wiper linkage breaks (assembly costs €180 but it's an easy DIY job), watch that the passenger side wiper isn't sitting a little high suggesting that someone did the temporary fix of swopping the linkage around. The expensive job is the power steering vaccum motor which stops working when the sensor fails. The part is integrated into the steering column and costs a staggering amount new. It can also be hard to track down secondhand, I rang what seemed like every scrappie in the country. Also the back box on the exhaust passes through a rail under the car and will rust around there, before the weight of the suspended back box breaks the pipe. Check the exhaust isn't blowing and have a look at where the pipe passes through.

Check the power steering by going lock to lock a few times while stationary - it's cruel but the problem can be intermittent - and use the wipers at maximum speed when the windscreen is try to make sure the linkage doesn't pop off.

To be honest, it's a buyers market with these and a lot have been neglected. Go for an ELX or a Sporting over a base model, and prepare to haggle like mad. Otherwise they're a great car, I've gone back to Italian stuff after a few years and it's refreshing.

People give these a lot of bad press but as you say, it's a tradeoff. They also - in 3dr form - look better and are more enjoyable to drive than a Yaris or a Micra.

chris85

Be careful about the power steering. Its electric on the punto. If you feel anything wrong with the steering (such as a tighness while turning) during the test drive just run away.

Check that all the electrics are working as they are a terrible problem with the Punto.

Bring a mechanic

zilog_jones

kona wrote: »

em my aunts one a 1998 example:rolleyes: is falling apart, the trim is ****ed, the paint looks ****, and the engine had to be replace in it due to head gasket failure, leading to the engine seizing up.

Sounds like neglect TBH.

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I mean that 1.3 engine went into production in 1976 and although slightly revised was largely the same in the 98 model!

1959 actually . It had gone through a lot of revisions though - the head's been completely redesigned at least 3 times, and by the time of the Mk. IV Fiesta it had electronic fuel injection and sounded slightly less like a bag of nails The Mk. IV also had a more modern 1.25 litre 16V twin cam engine.

Alanstrainor

zilog_jones wrote: »

1959 actually .

Ah, right you are, it went into the feshty in 76 though, and was revised for front wheel drive, dag nammit, there was me thinking i had my feshty trivia down!
Cheers

Teh Russ

Get a Polo.

But a tip if you decide on the Punto (or any post-'97 Fiat) - always make sure the red key's with it. You need it for the immobiliser - if you need to change the battery or disconnect it, you'll need the red key to restart the car. It'll cost you a fortune otherwise (new ECU and immobiliser, for a start).

klaus23

Teh Russ wrote: »

But a tip if you decide on the Punto (or any post-'97 Fiat) - always make sure the red key's with it. You need it for the immobiliser - if you need to change the battery or disconnect it, you'll need the red key to restart the car. It'll cost you a fortune otherwise (new ECU and immobiliser, for a start).

That's complete and utter nonsense, you'll be telling us they rust next.

For those of you tending to believe this crap, for a start FIAT dispensed with the red key system post 1998 - so this would only apply to the Mark 1 Punto anyway - and even if you don't have the red key it can be reverse coded off the ECU. Check the Fiat Coupe Owners Forum for information if you don't believe me.

I've had two Cinq Sportings, one Sei Sporting, one Punto Sporting and a Coupe and not once did I need the red key, even after changing or disconnecting batteries.

rmurf

cheers for that advice.

is it better to get a polo that is a few years older and probably a (gud) few decent miles more on it than a younger, less used punto??

zilog_jones

I wouldn't recommend older Polos - poxy 1.0 litre engines, usually no power steering, no airbags until at least '99 on Irish models, and gearboxes have been known to break in '98 models (not sure about the extent of this issue). Before anyone suggests anything about German build quality, they were built in Spain

If you're getting a Polo, at least look for a 1.4

L1011

klaus23 wrote: »

That's complete and utter nonsense, you'll be telling us they rust next.

For those of you tending to believe this crap, for a start FIAT dispensed with the red key system post 1998 - so this would only apply to the Mark 1 Punto anyway - and even if you don't have the red key it can be reverse coded off the ECU. Check the Fiat Coupe Owners Forum for information if you don't believe me.

I've had two Cinq Sportings, one Sei Sporting, one Punto Sporting and a Coupe and not once did I need the red key, even after changing or disconnecting batteries.

My dads 94 Uno rusted... after a Dublin Bus took the side off it

Refering to the poster about the key:

Even if you lose the code card (which replaced the red key) and destroy the ECU you are not in any real trouble. I've *replaced* the ECU in a Punto with an original Magneti Marelli one and it reprogrammes off the key. You'd need to lose both keys, the code card to order new keys, and your ECU before you're in real trouble. You might want a new car if you managed to do all of that in a short enough time span to not get one element replaced first.

And I suspect the original dealer would still be able to obtain the codes for you then!

Meath999

JohnCleary wrote: »

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=51582

Gonna drive up to that car this weekend. Apart from the usuals which I can check myself (suspension, gearbox, clutch, crashed etc) is there any particular weakness in these model cars?

It's a first car for the GF so I don't want to be spending mega bucks, and I want somethign small as she'll be using it for city driving. I hate the colour but she likes it

Any advise appreciated

Instead pick up a ford fiesta, even an old version, very relaible good car. I have a 95 ford fiesta since 2002, and in daily use, never broke down, though over 100K miles on the clock now, once left in the car park for 2 months and was up and running fine with a mere stroke of the ignition key !!!!!

macroman

klaus23 wrote: »

That's complete and utter nonsense, you'll be telling us they rust next.

For those of you tending to believe this crap, for a start FIAT dispensed with the red key system post 1998 - so this would only apply to the Mark 1 Punto anyway - and even if you don't have the red key it can be reverse coded off the ECU. Check the Fiat Coupe Owners Forum for information if you don't believe me.

I've had two Cinq Sportings, one Sei Sporting, one Punto Sporting and a Coupe and not once did I need the red key, even after changing or disconnecting batteries.

The red key is to reprogramme the ECU/Immobiliser, or to clone more 'Blue' keys. But only for the Punto Mk1 (94-99) - known as CODE1 system. Chances are you'll never need it. On another note, never use the red key to start the car daily, as each time it is used in the ignition it resets the ECU and erases all information.

MK2/3 Punto's (99-present) don't have a 'red' key, instead their CODE2 system recodes the key everytime it's inserted into the ignition. The way to find out if you're system is CODE2, is by checking the key for a triangle and circle and the number 2. These keys can only be cut from FIAT!