Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

help my 16 year old has decided he wants to leave school.

  • 04-04-2008 5:44pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3


    Hi my son has just turned 16 and is refusing to return to school. He did do his jc and did very well and i was very proud.He is adamant that he wants to join the army and we have done alot of research. He has to be 17 so has a year to do what???? Im all up for letting him take it easy for the year,before enrolling in army, but as a single parent, worried about our benefits. He went into fas today looking for work but there's nothing around.Any advice on our predicament i will be very grateful. thanks


Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,560 ✭✭✭DublinWriter


    If he had said that he wanted to basically hang around and drink cider then that would have been a totally different matter.

    As it is, you said that he's done a lot of research and the army is what he wants to do. Fair play to him; he's got a lot more direction than most his age.

    You mentioned being concerned about 'our benefits'. Are you more worried about them than him?

    If he did well academically then why not pursued him to hang on and do the Senior Cert if he can't join for another year anyways?

    As soon as he gets back into fifth year peer pressure might kick in and he might stay the extra year and complete the SC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,772 ✭✭✭jameshayes


    What about trying to convince him that he will do better in the army if he does his leaving cert?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3 spillane47


    Thanks Dublinwriter and james for the reply. He's not the drinking type thanks be to god. Im very lucky. Im all up for letting him take the year out before army but he is worried about us getting less benefits because he's not attending school. Im all up for struggle if my bens do decrease!!!!! He's the most wounderful son any mother could wish for. Ive tried my best regarding the leaving cert.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,844 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    It's a bit of a bad age to leave at. Only for the fact that if he leaves now, the last 11 years of his schooling will be voided by most employers if he doesn't have that little piece of paper at the end. Tell him skip transition year, go straight to 5th year and just stick it out till at least the end of 5th year. If he does that, he might just think ok another summer holiday, and then it's just a few months of torture after that. Tell him don't stress about the LC, just do it to get it over and done with. Don't annoy him about studying or anything but offer to help him if he needs it.

    I did the leaving myself but it hasn't made an ounce of difference to my life really. I'm 23 and I run my own business now which is doing pretty well. I never studied at all, even though I did supervised study, my mind wasn't in it, I just sat back and listened to music for most of it or sketched on my copy books. I'm not an academic, I'm the other side of the brain :pac: I passed the leaving on General knowledge pretty much. I didn't get "nothing" out of school though, it was where I got a lot of experience with business having set up my first little business in 1st year and carrying it through to 6th year.

    If your son is determined and is 100% sure about the Army, that's great, but if it's just a way to get out of school then you may want to lay down the law as he might just end up dropping out of that too and depending on his personality, may go downhill from there. But if he has his head screwed on, the leaving cert doesn't mean a thing :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,144 ✭✭✭Bally8


    Maybe you could look into him doing the Leaving Cert Applied. Some schools and teachers look down their noses at it but in reality it is a very good course which helps develop students in a much more practical way giving them skills necessary for the real world of work. He could even try it for just the year- he will still get credits which may make it easier to get into the army. If he is determined to leave the school he is in you could look into Youthreach if there is one in your area.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭PeakOutput


    if he wants to be in the army he should do his leaving and go for a cadetship

    iirc(and im open to correction) enlisted men get 5/6 year contracts with no guarantee of renewal so what happens if they dont want him when he is 23?

    leaving school after the junior cert is a bad idea, the army is great sure but not for a 17 yr old with very little education imo.

    maybe im a cynic(sp) but i would place a large sum of money that if he isnt a drinker now he will be by the end of his "year out"

    i think your letting him off easy by being so supportive of this my cousin left when she was 16 and now 4 years later is back doing the leaving cert course in 1 year this year coz she realised how few her options were with no leaving not to mind no college education.

    im not casting any aspertions(again sp) on you as i dont know your personal situation but you are worrying about your benefits right? do you want your son to need to worry about his benefits in 5/10/15 yrs time or would you prefer he did not have to worry about money to the extent that you do? assuming its the latter do you think letting him leave school at 16 is the best way to this goal?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,632 ✭✭✭SligoBrewer


    Hi OP. I'm 17 and I am currently in part-time employment but yet in 5th year in school.

    My advice to your son would be to stick it out at least 'til the Leaving. From my experience in work, being 17 and in the workplace is terrible. I deal with people and while for the most part its fine, the people who refuse to talk to me 'cause I'm so young is frustrating. I have seen people who although they may not be smart, because they have some education they excel in life. They tend to excel far more than those with none.

    Have you asked your son about what happens if he doesn't like the army?
    No one can be fully sure what they want at 16, my mind changes on my career choice once a month. And I thought I was 100% going to follow one path at his age. If he doesn't like the army after 2/3 years, he is really and truely up sh*t creek. The day of manual labour by and large in this country is gone and the amount of options open to him will be very limited.

    My advice would be to get him to continue with education as far as possible and to join the army reserve if he wants to go that way in life as well.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,784 ✭✭✭Dirk Gently


    When I was 16 I was convinced I wanted to leave school too. by the time I was 23 I was still sitting around in lecture rooms at college jotting notes down. A little dose of reality will kick in soon enough when he realises no one will take him on. Going to FAS and appling for jobs at his age is the best dose of reality he can get cos he will be told by everyone he needs to at least stay for his leaving cert.

    convince him to stay in school till he's 17. A year down the road I'd be surprised if he hadn't changed his mind somewhat. At that stage whats another year staying on in school to finish his leaving. One step at a time.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3 spillane47


    Thankyou all so very much for your replies
    Ive entered into everything that all of you have replied with so far, believe me ive tried everything. My only hope now is to show him what Ive posted on this board and the replies. Keep them coming is all I can say. He won't listen to me and why should he Im only his mother.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,330 ✭✭✭Gran Hermano


    Might be worthwhile starting a thread on the Boards Military Board here
    Several of the posters there have experience of the Irish army first hand
    and should be able to give the pros/cons of applying to the army without
    a leaving cert. I'd be surprised if any of them will recommend enlisting
    without. Whilst not always enjoyable education is rarely wasted and if in
    your shoes I'd do everything possible to keep him in school.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,784 ✭✭✭Dirk Gently


    It really is the wrong time to be leaving school early. I don't know how aware he is of the bigger picture but the economy is heading down at the moment. Highly educated / qualified people are losing jobs and jobless numbers are increasing all the time.

    The next few years don't look great for the country as a whole tbh. He would be doing well to ride out any recession/ period of non growth by staying in education and hoping times will be better when he gets out of school, or at least give himself a fighting chance of getting what little jobs that might be available by having some kind of education behind him.

    The more options he gives himself the better because everyone’s options (including experienced qualified people) will be limited in a recession situation.

    In any case, I would at least make sure his application to join the army is accepted before he quits school. Do not allow him to quit and hope that in a year’s time he will automatically walk into a career in the military. He can always join the reserves in his last year of school if he wants to get a taste for it. http://www.military.ie/reserves/join/index.htm
    The army will still be there when he finishes the leaving.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,401 ✭✭✭DublinDilbert


    spillane47 wrote: »
    Im all up for letting him take the year out before army but he is worried about us getting less benefits because he's not attending school.

    It all depends on what you mean by taking a year out....

    Is it a year for him to go out in to the working world get some life experience, see how little you do get paid starting off and how hard you have to work for it....
    Or
    Is it a year for getting up late every day and maybe doing a p/t job for some pocket money.

    By the tone of your post i would guess you wouldn't mind him having an "easy" year before going into the army.

    I guess you can't force him to do the leaving cert, but it would be good if he could experience the working world, he'll realise that its not easy... Also a few years ago people with no qualifications could get paid decent money to fill skips on a building site, unfortunately them days are gone...

    It would stand to him for life if he could finish his leaving, by the sounds of it he is well capable of it.

    As an aside:- I know people who train recruits in the army and there is a fair amount of literacy problems, which is hard to believe in this Celtic tiger generation, the army does try to help people out in this regard during training...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭damnyanks


    If he really wants to join the army you should try and point him towards officers / cadets. He'll need the leaving cert to do that but it will give him better prospects in life.

    He could go straight into 5th year now so 1 extra year in school and he'll come out with the leaving cert and in the army with plenty of opportunities made available.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭damnyanks


    Oh yes in the meantime get him into the FCA. (Part time army).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,010 ✭✭✭gubby


    I am wondering if its the school that is turning him off? would there be any chance of him doing the leaving in another school. just a thought


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,288 ✭✭✭✭ntlbell


    spillane47 wrote: »
    Hi my son has just turned 16 and is refusing to return to school. He did do his jc and did very well and i was very proud.He is adamant that he wants to join the army and we have done alot of research. He has to be 17 so has a year to do what???? Im all up for letting him take it easy for the year,before enrolling in army, but as a single parent, worried about our benefits. He went into fas today looking for work but there's nothing around.Any advice on our predicament i will be very grateful. thanks

    look into yout reach and see if they have a centre near you


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 54 ✭✭light123


    Hi there,

    I would make a serious effort to see a carerr officer in the army that you would see yourself first.

    I would see what the officer would think, what they could impress upon your son, ie that leaving school and only wanting to go into the army maybe easy but not good thinking, ie, you want the officer to impress the idea that not finishing school will make for a very foolish private. Being a private is one thing but being a uneducated private is another.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭cronos


    spillane47 wrote: »
    Hi my son has just turned 16 and is refusing to return to school. He did do his jc and did very well and i was very proud.He is adamant that he wants to join the army and we have done alot of research. He has to be 17 so has a year to do what???? Im all up for letting him take it easy for the year,before enrolling in army, but as a single parent, worried about our benefits. He went into fas today looking for work but there's nothing around.Any advice on our predicament i will be very grateful. thanks

    Sorry to have to say this but the JC means nothing from a employer perspective. So doing well in it also dosent matter. Its a prep test for the LC. If you only take the prep test and not the real version which is the LC then you get nothing.

    Can you do the leaving cert in one year instead of two. It would be a lot of work but all he would need to get is somewhere between 300 and 350 points and he would have a lot of options in the future.

    Being educated is as usefull in the army as it is in the rest of your life.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭Jo King


    He may not be able to enter the Army at 17. He will have to make an application and wait for a call. It often takes months. Priority will be given to members of the reserve. The first thing the army will want to do is send him to night classes for his leaving cert.The army will not be impressed to learn that he has been idling before making an application to join. Your son should get a job or stay in school. He should not doss around under any circumstances.
    He will likely end up not getting into the army if he dosses around.
    Even if he does get in, staying in the army after the initial contract depends on passing courses. Not doing the leaving is likely to hinder his chances severely.
    The army looks for balance. Being hard working, interested in learning and sport are the qualities sought.
    Maybe your son has a problem at school. Is he being bullied? How about a different school?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,844 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    cronos wrote: »
    Being educated is as usefull in the army as it is in the rest of your life.

    He has probably received all of the education he's ever likely to use in the "real world" already. Most of what you do in 5th and 6th not being of any practical use.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭PeakOutput


    cormie wrote: »
    He has probably received all of the education he's ever likely to use in the "real world" already. Most of what you do in 5th and 6th not being of any practical use.

    coz no1 needs a good command of the english language(how will he write a good letter of application to get this wonderous job that will hire him with no lc) or maths to get by on life. he has the basics he dosnt even have average education after the junior cert he is at least 2 years below average.

    education is not about preparing you to "just get by" in the "real world" were u stop once you know you have had just enough.

    for example without my education i would not now be in college if i wasnt in college i wouldnt be able to afford to go to scuba diving lessons(free with the college club) i wouldnt be able to afford to go to martial arts class's(free with the college club) and i especially wouldnt have jumped out of a plane 6 times this year and be going to the states this summer to pack parachutes and skydive. even if i never get my degree sticking threw the bull**** of a leaving cert and making a few mistakes of choices afterwards was worth it so that i could experience all these things.


    sure there are people who are great success's who never did a junior cert and there are even ones who never had a formal education at all but why do things the hard way? i guarantee you there are more success's who went threw an entire education.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 314 ✭✭buckfast4me


    Well.. Mcdonalds are always hiring if the military doesn't work. Seriously tell him to cop the feck on. I was the same when I was in 3rd year, thought I could take the world on bla bla etc. But luckily my parents didn't let me drop out - and now I am about 3 weeks away from finishing a 4 year honours degree.

    I think he is insane to be honest, leaving cert isn't even that difficult (well I would imagine it's a lot easier than life in the military).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,844 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    PeakOutput wrote: »
    coz no1 needs a good command of the english language(how will he write a good letter of application to get this wonderous job that will hire him with no lc) or maths to get by on life.

    The Mathematics and English we are taught in our education system up to the Junior cert level should be enough to be able to write a properly crafted letter and work out most mathematical obstacles we're ever likely to encounter.

    There is also the option of going back to college as a mature student at 23, where the leaving cert is not a necessity.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭PeakOutput


    cormie wrote: »
    The Mathematics and English we are taught in our education system up to the Junior cert level should be enough to be able to write a properly crafted letter and work out most mathematical obstacles we're ever likely to encounter.

    There is also the option of going back to college as a mature student at 23, where the leaving cert is not a necessity.

    to do what exactly with only a jc education? sure he might be able to get in(its interview based iirc) but will he be able to put 2K-10K word essays together required for arts or get threw the basic maths required for business and god help him if he decides to do engineering or computers.


    once again im not saying he wont do fine im just saying he has a much higher chance of being able to do what he wants for the rest of his life if he gets his leaving cert


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,481 ✭✭✭Fremen


    I honestly don't know much about the army, but as far as I know they're pretty big into developing people who work for them- sending them to college and so on.

    Is it possible that if he does well in the army, they'll end up getting him to do his leaving cert anyway?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,639 ✭✭✭PeakOutput


    Fremen wrote: »
    I honestly don't know much about the army, but as far as I know they're pretty big into developing people who work for them- sending them to college and so on.

    Is it possible that if he does well in the army, they'll end up getting him to do his leaving cert anyway?

    they send officers to college not enlisted men as far as i know but op it would be a good idea to ask in the military forum about that sort of thing

    anyway think thats me done in this thread


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭cronos


    cormie wrote: »
    He has probably received all of the education he's ever likely to use in the "real world" already. Most of what you do in 5th and 6th not being of any practical use.

    With respect I would have to disagree (but only in defence of certain subjects and their importance in the army). If at some point in the future the cadette wants to become a senior officer they will need to understand maths and physics.

    Why is this important...
    One good example is the physics experiment where the speed of a bullet is discussed. Also another experiment discusses bullet trajectories. And trajectories of other objects.

    In the past when their has been the biggest war efforts. (EG World war 2). The war was won by mathematicians working a long way from the front line. Building new advanced weapons and also from generals who had an understanding of the organization of troops (organization of people is discussed in business but obviously not exactly the same as the army but parallels can be drawn) Its also important to note that if the cadette is sent to far away lands as is generally the case with UN peace keeping which is the majority of what our army does. They will prob have to learn a new language and learning languages is covered by (irish, german, french, spanish) Of course it may not be the case that these are the languages required however it is a lot easier to learn a new language if you have previously learned a language that is not your mother tounge.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,844 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    Of course more education would be of great benefit to those who progress to such levels or choose certain subjects in college. I just meant most people will never come across anything they studied in 5th and 6th year again once they go out and start working.

    I don't know anything about what happens in the army and I'm sure there are specialist routes of promotion etc that can be taken with a better education. I'm just saying that most wont encounter these and in a lot of cases, not just in the army, specialist training will be provided as the individual progresses.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,429 ✭✭✭testicle


    The Army won't take him without a Leaving Cert these days. While it isn't a formal requirement, enough applicant have it.


  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,316 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    Some interesting and downright strange and snobby attitudes coming out in some of the replies here.

    OP - your possible loss of benefits is neither here nor there - even mentioning it rings alarm bells for me.

    Speak to the child's school. This should have been the first thing you did.

    Of course, he should try to get a Leaving Cert., but if he doesn't, he joins 20% of school leavers who don't have one (boards users do not reflect society) - he will not be alone. 'Only 300 or 350 points' is actually way above an average Leaving Certificate level.

    He can always return to education later - indeed a dose of reality might make him realise this is what he needs to do. No amount of you telling him this will make it happen though. He has to realise it himself.

    If he is accepted into the army, he will soon realise that there is only so far he can go with his level of education. This may be OK by him, we're not all born to be leaders, but it might become a great source of frustration.

    As pointed out by others, outside the army he will be in the bottom 20% for getting jobs/training etc.. Inside the army he will not progress as quickly and easily as the cadets (with their Leaving Certs) do.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,288 ✭✭✭pow wow


    I dropped out after my Junior Cert. much to the chagrin of my parents......and I'm ok. However it does make things so much more difficult for you, and I really wouldn't recommend it. In his head he has the army 'lined up' so the LC is to him an unnecessary accessory. There are success stories but why risk it?

    As everyone else has said you really do have to make him realise that that you always need a backup plan, and these days the army isn't always a job for life. What if he doesn't like it? What if he fails some of the requirements? For the sake of another 18 months of school it really is in his interests to stay on (you know this already I think!). Having the LC means you can pretty much do anything, not having it closes a lot of doors to you. Trust me I know! In the end I went to university as a mature student and am about to graduate with a degree so the issue of not having the LC is a bit redundant (people assume when you've been to college that you must have had the LC to get there!) but really if I had my time over I would probably have stayed on when I was younger. You're talking about the quality of the rest of his life....for another few months at school.

    Dropping out wouldn't make him a failure or a waster but it will come back to bite him......eventually.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,606 ✭✭✭Jumpy


    The army is VERY bad if you start as a private. I would recommend him to do his LC and then enlist as an officer.
    Personally I left school at 16 and while the first few years were very hard and low paid I worked my way into a very sucessful career in IT. If he is smart then it doesnt matter what year he leaves.
    However I also joined the army as a reserve in a very tough regiment and it grates on you to take orders from macho idiots who couldnt find their arse with both hands.
    The officers were very different, a very smart very professional bunch. But you needed the HSC (australian equivalent of the LC) to be able to enlist as an officer.


    edit: You should suggest he join the airforce, I hear they are looking for a pilot for their plane. *snigger*


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,442 ✭✭✭Firetrap


    There's no guarantee that your son will get into the army. Leaving that aside, not having a Leaving Cert will affect his prospects of promotion in the army and seriously limit what jobs he can have on the outside. Unless he wants to flip burgers for the rest of his days. Also, as someone else has said on this thread, if he "takes a year out" and does nothing it will look very bad on his application form. Worse it'll make it harder for him to knuckle down if he gets into the army.

    I'm not in the army myself but I know some people who are and who have been. The poster above me speaks the truth.

    Maybe the OP should use the losing benefits line to make her son stay in school. Perhaps he might cop onto himself while he's in there. i have some former classmates who dropped out of school early and they've definitely done far worse in life than those of us who stayed on for the Leaving.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 617 ✭✭✭biZrb


    What will happen if after a few years your son has had enough of the army and wants out? With only a JC he might find it really hard to get a decent job.
    For the sake of less than two years he should do his LC and then if the army doesn't work out he will have something that will mean work/college is easier to obtain.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 4,575 Mod ✭✭✭✭dory


    I dropped out of college first time I went. With over 550 points in the Leaving I figured I didn't need a degree to 'make it'.
    Turns out I did. The thing that helped me the most was that my parents didn't financially help me at the time, to let me see how much things cost in the real world, and that life is a little easier when you don't have to worry about bills. I had to pay my parents rent and bills while I was working too. I quickly filled out the CAO again.
    So maybe that might work with him? A tight budget might help him make a few decisions..


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,914 ✭✭✭✭tbh


    tell him the main thing having the leaving cert will give him is an example of how he can stick things through to the end. If he's just leaving to join the army, it might be seen as him taking the "easy" option. Also, if he's leaving school, tell him he'll be expected to act like an adult -if he wants money, he'll have to earn it. A couple of weeks of getting up at 6am to do a manual job for feck all money and he should be begging you to go back to school.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14 miss lilac


    I am in this very situation now....my 16 year old thinks he knows it all...does not want to stay in school....gets very frustrated if its even mentioned and there are so few options for him as we live in rural Ireland...i have just noticed that the above posts were in 2008.....would love an update on what the chap is doing NOW ?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭smcgiff


    miss lilac wrote: »
    would love an update on what the chap is doing NOW ?

    Whatever he did, I doubt very much he got into the IRISH army at 17 without a leaving cert. Could be wrong, but I thought it was quite hard to get into the PDF.

    Has your child said what they want to do?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,065 ✭✭✭Miaireland


    I am not quite sure how you go about joining the army but could he contact the office that he applies to and see what their recruitment process is. They might be able to explain to him the importance of the Leaving Cert and what subjects he should focus on. Have you got a Youthreach nearby that might also be another place he could do his leaving without being in School.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    miss lilac wrote: »
    I am in this very situation now....my 16 year old thinks he knows it all...does not want to stay in school....gets very frustrated if its even mentioned and there are so few options for him as we live in rural Ireland...i have just noticed that the above posts were in 2008.....would love an update on what the chap is doing NOW ?
    I would tend to look at the environment in school - not just whether he's got some crappy teacher, but the people he hangs around with too. At 16 I wasn't planning on leaving school, but I had for one reason or another developed such a hatred of where I was, that I wanted to leave and go to another school to do my leaving cert.

    That never happened, but one of my mates left after 4th year and went somewhere else, and suddenly school became a little more bearable. I was still bored in school, but I wasn't mitching off 3 days a week or looking for excuses to stay at home. In hindsight, it was really the environment I was in that was causing me to be so blasé about school at the time.

    Interacting with more people in school rather than this one guy all the time broadened my horizons and I didn't spent my leaving cert years with one foot out the door.

    I would also push very strongly the fact that leaving school in Ireland with no leaving cert is as good as leaving with nothing. No employer in the country even acknowledges the junior cert as a qualification of any kind. When his friends are heading off to Dublin to university and later on getting jobs and going out and having fun, he will have at best a minimum-wage job and very little money left over. If he even has a job.

    There was a time when the leaving cert was something you went for if you were really smart and driven, and a junior/inter cert was good enough proof for most employers that you were a hard worker. Now leaving school without a leaving cert instantly flags you as a workshy waster.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 456 ✭✭highlandseoghan


    What does your son plan to do if he leaves school?

    The Army ( when they recruit ) Most positions need to be over 18 except for apprenticeships. The army receive 1000s of applications for apprentice positions.

    Its quite hard to give much advise without knowing what your son plans to do if he leaves school.

    Living in a rural area I believe it is even more important to stick with school get a good leaving cert and consider college. There is less work and opportunity in rural parts of Ireland and someone thats got no leaving cert has even less chance again to get a good decent job.

    At the age of 16 a job looks like the best thing ever and earning €300 roughly seems amazing but you need to explain the reality of work to your son. I have a few different businesses around Dublin and surrounding counties. The last few years we are getting 100s of cv's for basic jobs like cleaners and cashiers. Out of the 100s we get the majority would have gone to college and are still applying for these positions.

    When I was growing up, I used to spend a lot of the summers and weekends in Carlow. A lot of my friends back then dropped out of school after completing there junior cert because they though a job was better. Most of them have been in and out of work since leaving, some have been on the dole for a few years and 4 of them have returned to study for the leaving.

    Sit your son down and show him how much he can earn if he gets a job on minimum wage. Then write down expenses, the cost of a mortgage / rent, ESB, Gas, food, living expenses etc.... and ask him to explain how he can afford all these expenses.

    Try to remain calm with him the more you get angry the more he will sa he wants to leave school. If you still cant make him see sense ask him to stay in school till the summer and then let him see how hard it is to get work during the summer and you charge him rent and for food to show him the reality.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4 TerryTree


    It's admirable that your son wants to join the army and that he seems sure that this is what he wants to do, however, I would highly recommend he stay in school. It would be a shame when he did well in his junior cert. I wouldn't be recommending a year out as in my area there are zero part time jobs so though your son may intend to work while on the year out, it may not work out that way and that could be very depressing for him and it could affect his confidence. He can still join the army but do the school first to allow for a back-up plan, in case he changes his mind about it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,435 ✭✭✭wandatowell


    As a member of the Defence Forces and having talked quite a bit with personnel conducting the interviews with potential recruits, the standard (education-wise) is high (higher than previous years anyway). There are quite a few people applying that have completed college for example and your son will be at a disadvantage competing with them.

    I'd advise him to stick with his studies while applying for the Army as soon as he can and if it doesn't work out with the Army the first time then reapply. Of course completing his leaving cert and attending college will be better for him than just having a JC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 835 ✭✭✭dogcat


    Just to let you know the legalities in case you don't know already, this is perfectly legal and it is at the end of the day his decision. However, I would lean towards convincing him to do his LC. Even if he did not do fantastic in it, having a LC is better than having a JC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14 miss lilac


    I think a lot of people who replied to my question today think its my son who wants to go into the Army but that is NOT the case...I just added my post to the other persons post to see how he got on after the intervening years .....I greatly appreciate all your replies and hopefully he will see that he has to further his education in order to go places in this country and the world....he is very artistic and wants to do art in college but because of being dyslexic he finds school just not for him....we have now sourced a fetec level 5 course in Sligo which may suit him from September this year so hopefully he can work on his dyslexia in the meantime with classes in order to be able to complete the other course which will be over a year....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,030 ✭✭✭Lau2976


    A lot of students face this situation at you sons age imo, and it's great that he has something in mind because most of them do not, but an education is so valuable. Some people have success without the leaving cert but a lot do not and why make it harder on yourself in the long run? It's great that your supportive but I think it's important that you speak with the school and before that get as educated as you can on how this will affect him, both in the army and in the job market after the army.

    If it's an issue with the school he attends there is an array of options open to complete either streams of the leaving cert.

    Having faced this issue (mainly due to dyslexia) myself I was glad I had made the decision to stay in school. At the time it didn't feel that way but getting that leaving cert really opened doors for me that probably would never have opened and sticking out with the hard work made me even more hard working than I already was because I had to push myself to work.

    At the end of the day your son will make the decision for himself, with your blessing or without, and the only advice anybody here can give is through their own experiences, but dropping out of school is a mistake, at any age, but especially when he is still so young and has such a clear goal.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 456 ✭✭highlandseoghan


    Is the school aware your son has dyslexia? A family member struggled through school for years and he decided to go onto college. The college told him to get tested for dyslexia and it turned out he had dyslexia. The support and help he is getting from college is excellent and he is delighted going to college everyday.

    The school should be able to help him with his dyslexia and this should not be a reason to leave college. Doing a fetac course is a good idea but I would still urge you to talk with your son and try to make him see that a leaving cert is very important.


Advertisement