Banned School Lunches

oh well

my kids schools have banned certain food items in lunchboxes (crisps, fizzy drinks, gum, etc). I didn't have a problem with this until yoghurts/yops were banned. However, I've since heard that schools can't actually ban anything, just encourage healthier eating. Does anyone know the official line on this? what does your school do?

Nevyn

Healthy lunches only, no fizzy drinks, no crisps, no chocolate, no sweets.
The no yougart/yop rule is there as well but that I think is more to do with the horrendus smell when it gets split on carpets, in school bags on on books, it's messy and in a warm class room it's not long before it's stinking.

KoolKid

While I think this is generally a good idea the problem I have is that it is not across the board. So you have kids in one school feeling they are being treated different fron the kinds in the school down the road.

themadchef

All our local national schools / secondary schools have lunches provided by a local restaurant Paid for through the school system.

Usually contains, sandwich, fruit juice, piece of fruit and yoghurt. No junk was allowed anyway (previous to this). Is the "provided lunch" thing not all over ireland

rainbowtrout

koolkid wrote: »

While I think this is generally a good idea the problem I have is that it is not across the board. So you have kids in one school feeling they are being treated different fron the kinds in the school down the road.

Is that such a huge problem? I can't imagine primary school kids feeling too hard done by because they can't bring junk food to school and neighbouring schools can, i could only see the problem arise if it wasn't being implemented right throughout one school. Most children in an area would generally go to the same school anyway.


I'd say schools can implement a ban on certain foods under their policies. When students enrol in the school I work in (secondary) they and their parents sign a code of behaviour/school rules/policies type thing and they are admitted on the condition that they abide by that code. So while we don't have a ban on certain foods, things like wearing shoes only - no runners are part of the code and a parent can be contacted to come in with proper shoes for their child, should they show up wearing runners. I would imagine that a primary school would be able to implement a similar policy with regard to food.

Yoghurts do make a mess, i've seen plenty of students come into class with bags dripping and smelling and books ruined.

Nevyn

Far as I know it is only in schools that are deemed to be in disadvantaged areas.

oh well

In our local school there are spot checks on lunch boxes. Offending items are confiscated and returned at home time. And...although teachers insist on healthy lunch boxes for children, their own fridge and cupboard is bursting with bikkies and sweets. One particular teacher even eats Taytos while on yard duty! Go figure.:rolleyes:

oh well wrote: »

my kids schools have banned certain food items in lunchboxes (crisps, fizzy drinks, gum, etc). I didn't have a problem with this until yoghurts/yops were banned. However, I've since heard that schools can't actually ban anything, just encourage healthier eating. Does anyone know the official line on this? what does your school do?

BostonB

Not a bad idea.

Toots

When I was in primary school we weren't allowed crisps or yoghurts or oranges. The reason was the smell they created (schools weren't so pushed about the healhy eating in the 80s/early 90s). They recently banned them in my nephew's school and the letter sent out to the parents cited the smell issue as the reason. They also banned those Yazoo things for the same reason.

Shelli

Yep, my head Nun while I was in primary school banned cheese and onion crisps becuase she didn't like the smell. Any other type of junk was allowed, just the old C&O was a problem for her!

Quality

My daughters school also has a "healthy lunch" rule... as far as I know yogurts are ok...

Every year the school will run a program on healthy lunches for the kids..

They send home information on healthy lunches... Different ideas, rather than the normal aul sandwich. They try to encourage the kids to eat lots of fruits and water rather than juices or dilute.

I am delighted that the school has a no tolerence rule on treats...

TequilaMockingBird

My daughters school are okay with yogurts, but it depends on the flavour!

My girl is terrible with dairy, trying to get her to get any kind of calcium is a nightmare. For awhile she would eat Tesco Finest Fudge Yogurt, but her teacher told her it was a dessert, so not allowed. The same happened with those Muller Corner yogurts, granted it was the plain one but with chocolate krispies in...

As a result she won't look at a yogurt now.

Cheese strings are saving the day though! (Yech!)

deisemum

Our school has a healthy eating policy which I think is a good idea. However some teachers turn a blind eye if someone brings in something that's deemed unhealthy. On special occasions pupils are allowed bring in a treat.

The teachers often dole out sweets and chocolate at the end of the week. Popcorn is banned because it makes a mess if spilt

I heard a solicitor on the radio a while back and he stated that a school can have a healthy eating policy but legally it's down to parents and guardians to decide what their children eat.

Teachers are not qualified nutritionists so I don't think this responsibility should be placed on them.

oh well

deisemum wrote: »

Teachers are not qualified nutritionists so I don't think this responsibility should be placed on them.

my point - teacher stopped slice of pizza as unhealthy yet it was a home made pizza with fresh veg on top...... where does a teacher get the idea that its unhealthy.

I fully support a policy of encouraging healthy eating but at the end of the day surely its up to parents to give their kids - even if it is junk. my neighbours child is a devil to feed. anytime i'm minding him its a nightmare trying to feed him. He lives on litterly 3 or 4 different things for the last few years. If he was to follow the school policy he'd starve from 8am to 3pm - surely even junk would be better than nothing in this case.

TequilaMockingBird

oh well wrote: »

my point - teacher stopped slice of pizza as unhealthy yet it was a home made pizza with fresh veg on top...... where does a teacher get the idea that its unhealthy.

I fully support a policy of encouraging healthy eating but at the end of the day surely its up to parents to give their kids - even if it is junk. my neighbours child is a devil to feed. anytime i'm minding him its a nightmare trying to feed him. He lives on litterly 3 or 4 different things for the last few years. If he was to follow the school policy he'd starve from 8am to 3pm - surely even junk would be better than nothing in this case.

Schools should promote healthy eating, but what is healthy for one child may be impossible /junk for another. I want my girl to get dairy anyway she can, I'd rather she would have a glass of milk, but if Fudge Yogurts are the only way she'll get a little calcium, I'm giving them to her.

I'm lucky that otherwise she eats really well. They have a new scheme in her school this week, offering the children Fruit and Vegetable snacks, which if they eat, they may get a little prize at the end of the week. My girl said "I should get a prize every week, because I always eat veg." If she's eating tuna or egg she gets a ribbing. The other kids tell her it "stinks", and she says "but they are eating chocolate spread or jam, thats not healthy". Its hard, I'm telling her such and such isn't a healthy lunch, yet other kids, who probably won't eat anything else in school can eat this stuff. I've seen kids who won't eat a thing, but if you can feed them anything at all, its great.

Stopping a child eating a home-made pizza, topped with veg is daft. What do they think, the kids will start bringing in a slice of Dominoes Pepperoni Plus, can of coke and a fag?

muckety

I don't believe a state school can dictate what you put in your child's lunch box. They can promote a healthy eating policy but would be on sticky ground (no pun intended) if they implemented a complete ban on certain foods.

In my kids' school there is a healthy eating policy which most of us (but not all) adhere to (no sweets, crisps, fizzy drinks). The problem I have with it is that all the teachers use sweets as their reward system! So what does that teach them?

noby

deisemum wrote: »

I heard a solicitor on the radio a while back and he stated that a school can have a healthy eating policy but legally it's down to parents and guardians to decide what their children eat.

School can have lots of policies that might not stand up to scrutiny by a solicitor, but if you're sending your child to the school you're committing yourself to abide by these policies. The pizza slice seems a bit ridiculous, but perhaps a word with the teacher or principle would clear it up.

Sueme, sounds to me you're talking about the "Food Dudes". My eldest did it before Christmas. I think it's a great idea, as it introduces children to fruit and veg that they may not have tried (or may not have realised you can have as a snack at lunch time).

TequilaMockingBird

noby wrote: »

Sueme, sounds to me you're talking about the "Food Dudes".

Yes "Food Dudes and Junk Punks"! Starts today, big excitement. She's gonna win this one, I just know it... GO BABY GO!!!

Nevyn

My youngest did that program and she said it was werid that some of the kids in her class had not heard of the fruits never mind had tasted them.

The teachers in my kids school use either goldens time or a no homework voucher as rewards.

Each is based around the table getting a certain ammount of rewards and merits over the course of the week/month. Golden time is the last hour on a friday and if they get the number of stars needed they get to do games/activites/art or story time.

The table of the week in my sons class gets the no written homework voucher for one day in the coming week, also the school has a merit sytem with 5 possible merits per day and then awards and certs when the reach a target number per term.

traceybere

My daughters school has a strict healthy eating policy

I gave my daughter home made - unsalted popcorn and was told this wasn't healthy and it was confiscated. I enquired as to why this was unhealthy and the real reason was the risk of choking.

Yougurts (such as frubes and yops) had a temporay ban - this was because the younger children couldn't open them and had to get assistance but that has since been lifted :rolleyes:

TequilaMockingBird

I got the unsalted popcorn ban too.

noby

A lot of things can be banned for reasons other than nutrition.

SarahMc

oh well wrote: »

I fully support a policy of encouraging healthy eating but at the end of the day surely its up to parents to give their kids - even if it is junk. my neighbours child is a devil to feed. anytime i'm minding him its a nightmare trying to feed him. He lives on litterly 3 or 4 different things for the last few years. If he was to follow the school policy he'd starve from 8am to 3pm - surely even junk would be better than nothing in this case.

School's healthy eating policies are just that, policies.. not law. Bound to fail in district court, never mind European Court.. but that is not the point.

It is not a bad idea to have a policy so that your child does not feel disadvantaged just because all they have is a sandwich and piece of fruit compared to x who has crisps and a chocolate bar.

Try teaching children in the afternoon who have had chocolate and fizzy drinks for lunch!

I doubt your neighbour's child would starve, (v. rare in Ireland) but they might be forced to nibble, and heaven forbid, like healthy food.

fruitbat

I'm intrigued... what happens when something is confiscated at lunch time? Are children given a replacement or left to go hungry?

TequilaMockingBird

No, I doubt they are left to starve! My daughter just gets embarressed (:mad:)if teacher tells her its not allowed so will never do it again. The healthy eating policy is a good idea of course, but maybe a little too strict sometimes.

seamus

It's in the schools interests to ensure that the children are eating properly.

Children who eat carb and fat-rich foods are more likely to be sluggish than their peers. Children who eat foods high in sugars are likely to be hyperactive and have difficulty concentrating. Both types of child will have trouble learning, thus having an effect on the ability to teach and affecting the education that the other children get.

It's firmly my opinion that the bulk (> 90%) of children diagnosed with "behavioural disorders" or the overdiagnosed ADHD have poor diet as one of the root causes of their "problem".

The problem with this is that it must be enforced as a blanket policy or you may as well not enforce it. So you can't dispensate for home-made pizza versus normal pizza (as mentioned above), because kids don't understand the difference. All they see is one kid getting preferential treatment - they don't care that it's healthy, all they see is "pizza".

As for different schools having different policies - not an issue. Every school has different policies - I can remember other schools starting later than use, finishing earlier than us, being allowed to wear whatever they want, being allowed to do what they wanted at lunchtime. It's a valuable lesson to accept that things aren't always equal and life isn't fair.

Weidii

maybe with the pizza try to make it look like something else. Perhaps fold the pizza over when it's cooked and cut it into squares instead of the typical triangles. You can make it healthy and the teacher probably won't have a problem with it.

BanzaiBk

My parents are away in Russia at the mo' and I'm taking care of my 4 y/o sister. I was literally speechless when I took out the "banned lunches" list on Sunday night. Most of it contains what's already been posted but other notables include;

• Mashed potato
• Plums, apricots and passion fruit (I presume due to the stones/seeds)
• Rice (probably messy when spilled)
• Any kind of "sauced" food
• Chocolate milk (seems a bit OT to me but what do I know really)
• Soup with "chunky pieces"

I think some exception has been made in the case of my younger sister or the list is not adhered to because as far as I am aware she religiously demands to bring borscht with her for lunch on Fridays. We're lucky that she's a very good eater (fruit, veg, etc) but I can imagine it being a nightmare for some people.

noby

Most of those seem to be "messy" foods. Especially when you're talking about a room full of four year olds.

Crea

Can understand the yogurt given that lunches aren't kept in the fridge and over 4 hours in a warm classroom might make them turn.

BanzaiBk

noby wrote: »

Most of those seem to be "messy" foods. Especially when you're talking about a room full of four year olds.

I know, I totally understand where they're coming from. I've no objections at all to the list.

deisemum

When I used to do school collections most days you'd see pupils going home with yogurt spilt down their jumpers.

TequilaMockingBird

I wish they were encouraged to wash their hands before eating. Can you just imagine the germs! I wouldn't eat anything if I had spent a morning around 20/30 kids without washing my hands. Ewwww...

the dee

Crea wrote: »

Can understand the yogurt given that lunches aren't kept in the fridge and over 4 hours in a warm classroom might make them turn.

My mum used to put my yoghurt in the freezer the night before. Then when lunch time came around it would still be nice and cold

Khannie

oh well wrote: »

He lives on litterly 3 or 4 different things for the last few years. If he was to follow the school policy he'd starve from 8am to 3pm - surely even junk would be better than nothing in this case.

Hunger is good sauce.

seamus wrote: »

Children who eat carb and fat-rich foods are more likely to be sluggish than their peers. Children who eat foods high in sugars are likely to be hyperactive and have difficulty concentrating. Both types of child will have trouble learning, thus having an effect on the ability to teach and affecting the education that the other children get.

Exactly. Who the hell would want to teach 30 sugar'd up lunatics? Not me I tell ya. No harm in eating healthily.

seamus wrote: »

So you can't dispensate for home-made pizza versus normal pizza (as mentioned above), because kids don't understand the difference. All they see is one kid getting preferential treatment - they don't care that it's healthy, all they see is "pizza".

Agree with this too. Home made pizza is probably a well balanced meal but it would be very difficult to differentiate the two to a child.

FakeRedHead

seamus wrote: »

It's firmly my opinion that the bulk (> 90%) of children diagnosed with "behavioural disorders" or the overdiagnosed ADHD have poor diet as one of the root causes of their "problem".

Making up nonsense statistics based on your own 'opinion' and prejudice against children with additional needs isn't acceptable.

Do you have no idea of the methods and criteria involved in diagnosing those with ADHD and other disabilities?

TequilaMockingBird

FakeRedHead wrote: »

Making up nonsense statistics based on your own 'opinion' and prejudice against children with additional needs isn't acceptable.

Do you have no idea of the methods and criteria involved in diagnosing those with ADHD and other disabilities?

I agree. If only it was just down to diet. Wishful thinking.

Nevyn

Diet can play a part even when a child has add or adhd or is on the autism specturm but
it is not the cause or the cure.

seamus

FakeRedHead wrote: »

Do you have no idea of the methods and criteria involved in diagnosing those with ADHD and other disabilities?

Yes. Method: Pay doctors tonnes of money to promote your behavioural drug. Criteria: Any child described as "troublesome"

I'm not saying there are no genuine cases, but the bulk are taking the easy way out IMO.

Nevyn

In the usa but not here seamus and I am speaking as a parent who has had her child through that very process here in the last 9 months.

TequilaMockingBird

seamus wrote: »

Yes. Method: Pay doctors tonnes of money to promote your behavioural drug. Criteria: Any child described as "troublesome"

I'm not saying there are no genuine cases, but the bulk are taking the easy way out IMO.

Very few children with these conditions would be taking drugs.

IMO your opinion is very wrong.

Talk to a few parents about how easy "the easy way out is".

Femelade

My daughter is an extremely fussy eater...so lunch is always a big problem..
The kids in her school are only bring in "something nice" on fridays..
She doesnt eat any fruit or veg...believe me, i have tried..
Her lunch usually consists of a tuna sandwich (No mayo) and a bottle of water / mi wadi and a cereal bar..i used to give her yoghurts but she said its takes her too long to eat it and she never gets to finish it on her first break (she's a slow eater) so she has to leave it sitting there until the next break by which time it is horrible. the only other thing she will eat in a sandwich is that horrible billy roll stuff, or else she just has a buttered toasted bagel.

Khannie

Femmy wrote: »

She doesnt eat any fruit or veg...believe me, i have tried..

:eek:

Honestly my advice is to try harder. I know parenting is a very subjective art but the damage a diet without fruit or veg will do to the human body (slowly and over time) is not worth considering.

Without knowing what you've already tried... Maybe things like smoothie, or pizza with veg on it or corn on the cob or something like that. "Fun foods" kinda thing. I'm sure there are plenty of tips available on the internet for getting healthy food into them.

Possibly worth a thread on its own.

seamus

It's not the place for it, so I won't continue on this line.

I don't recall there ever being "banned" foods when I was in school. I guess back then teachers were expected to take on a wider role of carer/cleaner/teacher than these days. Schools probably focus themselves more as a business now too, so if it's cleaner (and therefore cheaper) to ban messy foods.

Femelade

Khannie wrote: »

:eek:

Honestly my advice is to try harder. I know parenting is a very subjective art but the damage a diet without fruit or veg will do to the human body (slowly and over time) is not worth considering.

Without knowing what you've already tried... QUOTE]

Like you said, you dont know what i've tried, so how can you say for me to "try harder"...
i've tried plenty..and i have loads of books for healthy eating for kids..

Nevyn

I have told my two that as their body grows and changes so does their tougue and that is why I will get them to try again things they didn't like before.

It also helps if they see me eating fruit and veg and enjoying it.

Femelade

i eat fruit and veg infront of her alot and i often try and get her to try it, i have recently gotten her to like beans..so i'm hopefull about other foods , if i keep at it..

TequilaMockingBird

Update on Cool Dudes: Today was Cabbage and Orange.

For kids who are fussy eaters, raw cabbage probably isn't the best thing to offer. Raw Turnip yesterday. I wouldn't eat either of those raw myself! Maybe they are keeping the best till last - peppers, tomatos etc. I'm half expecting raw potato tomorrow!

Great scheme though

lizzyd66

I had to deliver some Parent Association stuff to class rooms last week right after lunch - the stink in most of the class rooms was unreal, so I can understand why smelly/messy food is banned . I think there is a big issue in not having a dedicated dining hall (in my friend in the UK school they have really clever fold away tables and benches all in one that they use at lunch time in the PE hall). Another issue seems to be the amount of time the kids get to eat. I think it is 5 min little break, 10 min big break (may be less). By the time they get their stuff out and have a chat the time is gone! They are only supervised by kids in older classes so there is no one encouraging them to eat /get on with their lunch. Some days my dd comes home having eaten none of her lunch.

We had the Food Dudes programme last year - very good, my dd now eats peppers and cucumber as a result of it and tried everything. My only quibble was that the food arrived pre packaged - individually wrapped in plastic. The teachers said there was a lot of waste. I am disappointed that it isn't an ongoing programme as my ds is now in JI and has "missed" the programme. In playgroup the teacher used to cut up a banana or apple and each kid would have one slice if they wanted. I thought that was a great idea. Often I send dd in with an apple but she only takes one bite where as if there was a plate of fruit on the table she would probably eat more. We were at a party in a playcentre recently and they put out a fruit platter first and lots of the kids dug in (with a few proclaiming loudly that they didn't like fruit - my ds included!). Might suggest it to ds JI teacher - maybe see if I bought a bag of fruit would she try it for a week. I know her quite well (my dd was her pet two years ago and now ds is the thorn in her side) so she might be receptive to it.

Khannie

Femmy wrote: »

Like you said, you dont know what i've tried, so how can you say for me to "try harder"...
i've tried plenty..and i have loads of books for healthy eating for kids..

Sorry....should have said "keep trying".

parsi

seamus wrote: »

I

It's firmly my opinion that the bulk (> 90%) of children diagnosed with "behavioural disorders" or the overdiagnosed ADHD have poor diet as one of the root causes of their "problem".

It is my opinion that your opinion is Tosh.
It would be so much easier if diet was the root cause. Really great.

There weren't banned foods back in the days of old because all we had was sandwiches with some form of paste or other and God knows Calvita didn't make any mess.