Paleo Diet

Frank Bullitt

Iv only really read about this on the crossfit site, has anyone any experience with or are currently trying it?

Im just unsure about how you meals would look with it and how many times you are supposed to eat a day etc?

Edwardius

I've been at it for a good few months, although I apply zone quantities to paleo foods. You should read "the paleo diet" by Loren cordain if you want to understand some of the biochemical stuff behind it. Information coming from the source of the research is IMHO superior than asking on a place where people can have opinions about things as that can confuse people. ALthough I should mention that this board seems to have its head screwed on.
Regarding what I do, I'd eat 5 meals a day (3 large meals and two snacks) with about two to three hours between meals if I can. A decent guide would be to have a lump o' lean dead animal flesh the size and thickness of the palm of your hand, fill the rest of the plate with green veg/low gi stuff and top it off with a handful o' nuts (fnarr fnarr etc etc)

Also some folk have trouble with constipation, I don't personally, and that's all you need to know about my bowel movements. You'll be grumpy, tired and hungry for about a week at the start as your body switches to using fat as the primary fuel source but once that's in place you'll be hoppin' around like nobody's business. Make sure that when you try it that you do it strictly for about three weeks. If it doesn't work then you can simply walk away and be satisfied that you have tested it properly, so no sugar, little caffeine, little starch, no bread, grains, rice, pasta. Lots of LEAN meat, nuts, veg, olive oil some fruit etc. You can play with spices if things start to taste bland but it's very easy to eat like a king! Good luck with it, stick with crossfit too, it's mighty!

Edit: drink lots of water too, 2-3L a day.

Frank Bullitt

Cool, ill have to read up on it a bit more,i just read the part on crossfit.com, if it helps with that then im all for it.

Frank Bullitt

Actually, could you post up what your meals comprise of, just so i have a point of origin and something to go by.

Cheers.

Edwardius

I'll give you an example of what I had this morning:
6oz homemade burger (lean mince),
handful of cashews
a large pile of broccoli and green beans
some lemon juice and mustard.


You can also cook stir-fries, curries soups etc. There's some pre-planned meals in this PDF http://www.crossfit.com/journal/library/cfjissue21_May04.pdf. I tend not to plan meals in advance, they usually usually go like
1. Get meat
2. Add a handful of nuts
3. fill the rest of the plate with green veg

Vary the types of vegetable used so you don't get bored of eating the one thing all the time.

ApeXaviour

Like ed I follow a diet that's mostly paleo, but sorta zone-esque too, and a bit modified again.

I had broccoli and smoked salmon this morning (on seperate plates), it's my favourite and most decadent breakfast.

Sometimes I make this kind massive pot of vegetable soup/stew. Basically I blend a load of vegetables (not too many root ones, mostly onions/leeks/cauliflower/broccoli and some carrot and garlic). Simmer it for 90 mins, add some butter, olive oil, herbs, ground chilli peppers and blue cheese. Lasts me a few days refridgerated in tuppaware. Handy way to eat lots of veg, and damn tasty IMO. Plop some in a bowl heat it in the microwave while you prepare some meat and hey presto.

Otherwise I'll micro steam up some frozen veg, cook some meat (you have so many combinations with your choice of meat veg) and put it in a bowl with a pasta sauce, or some not too sweet chinese sauce and some nuts. Almonds, walnuts, pecans, brazil nuts and sometimes cashews are all good, not peanuts.

Snacks might consist of a piece of fruit (not too sweet) and two hardboiled egg with seed mustard for flavour.

The idea is to stay away from anything resembling a refined sugar, anything made from grain or rice, beans/legumes, salt (and other additives) dairy and nightshades (tomatoes, potatoes, peppers), vinegar, vegetable oils, sunflower oils etc. Though tbh I still eat peppers, tomatoes and dairy in moderation.

Things like olive oil, organs, seeds, nuts are all great. Supplementing with fish oil is up there as a pretty crucial element. Okay so caveman didn't have fish oil, true but (s)he had a much lower omega 6:3 ratio than us, as did the game meat they ate. Modern non-organic meat is much higher in omega 6 fatty acids. So reducing veg oil or seed oil and taking (preferably pharmaceutical grade) fish oil will generally result in quite positive consequences.

Supplementing magnesium too (I'm told), and 9+ hours sleep per night in a completely darkened room are also elements you might want to include.

JonnyF

is it a waste of time to ease myself into paleo? like go paleo a few days a week until i get inot the swing of it? almost like i did with crossfit, or am I would i be undoing the good work o f the paleo stuff by eating normally (healthy but not paleo) the other days

ApeXaviour

Personally I find the switch-over is the hard part. Grumpiness, dehydration and sometimes hunger as your body switches over to ketosis. They go away after a few days and like ed said you feel like you're flying. Once the rest of your diet is relatively low carb (no sugar, relatively low on starches, decent protein and fat) then you shouldn't have much problem.

And I believe you can (after reading some of lyle mcdonald's work) have two "normal" or free meals per week and still maintain ketosis. This where you can have a few spuds etc. along with your meat and veg, and a small dessert. Very important for the aul' social life and I find helps you stick with the diet a lot better.

What are your goals btw? Lose a good few pounds? Are you relatively lean and trying to get leaner? Get a competitive edge in some sort of sport? Or just trying to eat better?

JonnyF

i'm just always interested in finding new things that will help me.
I'm a rugby player and am following the programme on crossfitfootball.com and they keep pointing back to paleo diet as a real boost to help you get over the edge. I'm relatively lean right now, haven't done by body fat in a while but i'm 6'4 and 14st6, i like the idea of eating paleo and i'm trying to gather as much info as i can. saw a book on amazon called paleo for athletes, only a fiver so might grab it and see how it goes.

ApeXaviour

Sounds like you know what you're at. That's one of Cordain's books. It'll give you more and better information than any of us could

Good luck and enjoy!

El_Dangeroso

Hi Jonny,

I've been paleo for about 2.5 years now and 'properly' paleo for about a year.

Paleo runs the gamut of macronutrient ratios, but tends to have the following in common: No grains, no sugar(refined), no soy.

There are different degrees of strictness, Cordain would be vehemently anti-dairy, but Kurt Harris of PaNu doesn't have a problem with it if you can tolerate it ok. Kurt does crossfit too and I highly recommend PaNu's 'Twelve Steps to get started' if you want a more gradual approach.

Also worth mentioning that although Cordain advocates lean meat in his books this was based on the fact that current wild game is leaner than domesticated, Cordain forgets that we hunted big game in the paleolithic era which we hunted to extinction and would have a much higher fat percentage. I could never personally reconcile his eschewing natural sat fats in favour of industrial rapeseed oil, but it seems he is softening on his position lately, from a recent Q&A:

The bottom line is that we do not recommend cutting down saturated fatty acid intake, but decreasing high-glycemic load foods, vegetable oils, refined sugars, grains, legumes and dairy.

Another great resource is the blog of Robb Wolf, the up-to-recently Crossfit annointed nutrition guru:

http://robbwolf.com/

He has just been ousted in favour of Barry Sears of the 'Zone' fame, which seems to be a purely commercial decision as Robb has a huge amount of integrity and knowledge and some of Sears' 'science' is deeply questionable, but he sells more books and will probably raise the profile of Crossfit better than Robb could, which is such a shame.

As to how I eat, It could be summarised as thus

Sapsorrow

Whats the deal with the nightshades? Is it the solanine?

Edit: Thanks temple good to see someone remembering to mention the ever so vital exercise side of things!

Khannie

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

There are different degrees of strictness, Cordain would be vehemently anti-dairy, but Kurt Harris of PaNu doesn't have a problem with it if you can tolerate it ok. Kurt does crossfit too and I highly recommend PaNu's 'Twelve Steps to get started' if you want a more gradual approach.

I was with you there until it said no grains. I'll always have oats in my diet. They just make too many delicious things with not enough good reason not to eat them IMO. In fact, I'm off to make some flapjacks. :cool:

When I'm training I'll maintain a "near paleo" type diet (as I said, there will always be oats in there). Can I ask what a typical days diet looks like for you?

Mellor

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

Sex is the wrong end of the pyramid imo

Khannie wrote: »

I was with you there until it said no grains. I'll always have oats in my diet. They just make too many delicious things with not enough good reason not to eat them IMO. In fact, I'm off to make some flapjacks. :cool:

I'd be the same, I was thinking that I actually eat a palao diet. Then I remembered oats every morning. And then beer.
So close. But meh.

I'll just keep eating low cal and try to get the BF% down. I've been a bit depressed lately, i'm putting too much importance on the numbers on the scales. Up since xmas, but i'm not as big as I was. I know its due to muscle growth, but since I can't measure this with before, it's driving me mad.
sigh

El_Dangeroso

Khannie wrote: »

When I'm training I'll maintain a "near paleo" type diet (as I said, there will always be oats in there). Can I ask what a typical days diet looks like for you?

The paleo diet is neither prescriptive nor dogmatic, no one 'owns' it or 'invented' it per se (Cordain might disagree lol!) so in that sense you can follow as much or as little of it as you like. For example I got rid of nightshades and dairy for a while, absolutely zero reaction when I reintroduced them and there is no good science to prove there are any long-term consequences to eating them in an otherwise healthy person (those with rheumatoid arthitis or leaky gut syndrome might not be so lucky). I go with science first, evolution second.

As far as oats go, the real measurable damage is done by gluten grains, I got a paper last week (abstract here - If you have academic access I highly recommend reading the full text) this paper stated that gluten grains damage the gut of 83% of people that consume them. So it's up to you if you think your in the lucky 16% that can tolerate them, me, I have IBS which is highly indicative of some level of gluten intolerance.

White rice is probably the most innocuous grain, probably followed by oats. But one thing, you ALWAYS want to soak the oats overnight with a tblsp of live natural yoghurt prior to consuming, this will allow the bacteria in the yoghurt to vastly reduce the anti-nutrients in the oats and make them far more nutritious. My parents always did this with buttermilk but when I asked them why they didn't know, it was just a tradition, amazing how the science can now explain what was already known for centuries.

My own personal favourite of the twelve steps is to start using real fats and completely avoid vegetable fats. Real fat tastes so much better and the switch to vegetable oils in the latter part of the 20th century was the greatest disaster for our health in recent times in my opinion. There's some preliminary research coming out that an imbalance of omega 3 and 6 causes the appetite signalling to go awry. Obesity epidemic anyone?

A typical day for me would be:

Brekkie : Egg muffin with pancetta, spinach and onion or plain ol' bacon and eggs fried in goose fat and mushrooms fried in butter.

Lunch (if I'm not still full from breakfast): Big assed salad with 4 boiled egg yolks, roast chicken, sardines or tuna, avocado, chives, lettuce, cucumber etc with a lot of homemade vinaigrette or last nights leftovers

Dinner: Some fatty meat and veggies like sweet potato, carrots and parsnips and something green just to hedge my bets or something fancier like a goulash or chilly if I have the time to prepare it.

I also intermittently fast for at least 20hrs once a week, so that means eating nothing after 7pm one day and not eating again until 2-3pm the next day. Some people do 36hr fasts and then do a big workout at the end before eating. Sort of emulating the 'running for your dinner' thing we've been doing for about a million years or so. Lots of good research backing up the benefits of this too.

Mellor wrote: »

Sex is the wrong end of the pyramid imo

LOL! For the record I didn't write it..

corkcomp

Khannie wrote: »

I was with you there until it said no grains. I'll always have oats in my diet. They just make too many delicious things with not enough good reason not to eat them IMO. In fact, I'm off to make some flapjacks. :cool:

When I'm training I'll maintain a "near paleo" type diet (as I said, there will always be oats in there). Can I ask what a typical days diet looks like for you?

big +1. i CANT live without oats

El_Dangeroso

Good thing no one is forcing you to then!

shift

ApeXaviour wrote: »

Almonds, walnuts, pecans, brazil nuts and sometimes cashews are all good, not peanuts.

Just wondering why not peanuts? Cos they'd be my favourite of the above

El_Dangeroso

shift wrote: »

Just wondering why not peanuts? Cos they'd be my favourite of the above

Peanuts are legumes, not nuts.

Sapsorrow

Cheers for the article Temple, interesting point out the yoghurt and oats never knew that one so will defintely start it up. Stupid question ut what are the anti-nutrients in oats exactly?
Can anyone answer my question bout the nightshades Im really curious now!?
Also would the cooking process not affect the gliadin the way the starch is released from the cells when the walls are broken, does this make the gliadin (I know its a protein not a starch) more accessible or change it's structure? bsically I mean are raw oats better?

El_Dangeroso

khrystyna100 wrote: »

Cheers for the article Temple, interesting point out the yoghurt and oats never knew that one so will defintely start it up. Stupid question ut what are the anti-nutrients in oats exactly?
Can anyone answer my question bout the nightshades Im really curious now!?
Also would the cooking process not affect the gliadin the way the starch is released from the cells when the walls are broken, does this make the gliadin (I know its a protein not a starch) more accessible or change it's structure? bsically I mean are raw oats better?

I don't think oats have gliadin. Anti-nutrients would be lectins and phytates, the usual suspects!

Re: nightshades, yep it's the solanine. I don't think solanine is a problem unless you have arthritis or similar condition. A few prospective studies showed no association with nightshade consumption and ill effects, but hey, if a new one comes out tomorrow showing it's the worst thing since high-fructose corn syrup then I'll adjust accordingly

Ultimately eliminating gluten grains, sugar, legumes and soy will get you 90% of the way there in terms of health benefits. If you start worrying about every little toxin you'll go slowly mad, and starve! I figure I have a liver for a reason.

corkcomp

oats do contain a little phytic acid, but anybody who would advise against consumption of oats for that reason is talking complete bollix

edit: previous post above was not present before i posted!

El_Dangeroso

corkcomp wrote: »

oats do contain a little phytic acid, but anybody who would advise against consumption of oats for that reason is talking complete bollix

Oh really? Do tell us of the research you've done on the subject.

Sapsorrow

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

Ultimately eliminating gluten grains, sugar, legumes and soy will get you 90% of the way there in terms of health benefits. If you start worrying about every little toxin you'll go slowly mad, and starve! I figure I have a liver for a reason.

Is the phytate the main problem with beans too or is there more to it? I love my beans!
You reckon fermented soys still ok for girls though right?

El_Dangeroso

khrystyna100 wrote: »

Is the phytate the main problem with beans too or is there more to it? I love my beans!
You reckon fermented soys still ok for girls though right?

Yep, It's the phytate (also reduced by soaking), along with lectins and protease inhibitors (which despite the protein content of beans actually interfere with protein absorption) But if you can't live without them, then you can't live without them, like I said, it's not prescriptive.

Actually funny you mentioned soy, I was reading an article today that the phytic acid in soy is not neutralized by ordinary preparation methods such as soaking, sprouting and long, slow cooking, fermenting helps, but not by much. I would also avoid it on the grounds that it's an endochrine disrupter, we don't need any extra oestogen, if we need it, we'll make it.

Sapsorrow

I don't think I've ever wanted anyone to be really wrong about just about everything as much as I do you Temple!
Here's hoping I survive th next decade I'll keep yas posted!

El_Dangeroso

khrystyna100 wrote: »

I don't think I've ever wanted anyone to be really wrong about just about everything as much as I do you Temple!
Here's hoping I survive th next decade I'll keep yas posted!

LOL! I'm sure the rest of your healthy diet will offset it.

Red Cortina

Just want to add my tupence worth here. I have suffered from IBS for the last 10 years. On the suggestion of the trainer that I go to I started following the Paleo Diet and have seen a notable decrease in my symptoms.

I have tested negative for Celiac Disease but am fully convinced that this is not the case. In learning more about the test methods used to diagnose this problem, I am coming to the conclusion that they are possibly not the most up-to-date. Has anyone heard of or had done fecal analysis to diagnose this disease?

El_Dangeroso

I had the exact same experience with my IBS, which is now non-existing unless I transgress.

Enterolab.com tests for gluten sensitivities over the net, but I think you already know the result you'd get if you get a reaction from eating gluten.

Red Cortina

I had heard about them alright from someone I know in the states who has been tested by them.
I would just like a definite diagnosis for my own sake. I find it particularily difficult in family and social situations to explain that I can't eat bread etc. It would be much easier to say that I am Celiac and then hopefully people would understand a bit better and not be mortally offended when I say I can't eat certain food.

strawdog

I've also been trying a switch to a more paleo type diet due to a mystery digestive disorder and the at times debilitating brain fog that goes with it. I haven't found it a cure but it seems to be the type of diet that least exacerbates the condition while still allowing a decent food intake. Have done the rounds in terms of all the relevant doctors, nutritionists and quacks but this diet seems to be the only thing that makes a noticeable difference.

Same as you red cortina, I suspect gluten could be a major culprit despite negative coeliac test results (bloods and biopsy - the gold standard test) and tbh I get tempted to just say I'm coeliac because it seems to be about the only way people might take it seriously and not see you as weird and neurotic about food. But alas I just can't bring myself to do it without some sort of diagnosis for cover. I'm a bad liar (tho a good twister of truth!).

Just out of interest, you say a trainer turned you on to the diet. What type of training? How has paleo impacted your training? The one major downside to this diet is that I find I struggle with prolonged aerobic exercise such a footy training/matches.....

El_Dangeroso

strawdog wrote: »

I've also been trying a switch to a more paleo type diet due to a mystery digestive disorder and the at times debilitating brain fog that goes with it. I haven't found it a cure but it seems to be the type of diet that least exacerbates the condition while still allowing a decent food intake. Have done the rounds in terms of all the relevant doctors, nutritionists and quacks but this diet seems to be the only thing that makes a noticeable difference.

Same as you red cortina, I suspect gluten could be a major culprit despite negative coeliac test results (bloods and biopsy - the gold standard test) and tbh I get tempted to just say I'm coeliac because it seems to be about the only way people might take it seriously and not see you as weird and neurotic about food. But alas I just can't bring myself to do it without some sort of diagnosis for cover. I'm a bad liar (tho a good twister of truth!).

Just out of interest, you say a trainer turned you on to the diet. What type of training? How has paleo impacted your training? The one major downside to this diet is that I find I struggle with prolonged aerobic exercise such a footy training/matches.....

Blood tests can show negative in true celiacs too. It is only when the immune reaction has been present for long periods of time and/or the process is far advanced that antibodies are produced in quantities sufficient to leak into the blood. Testing for antigliadin antibodies in stool is far more sensitive if you can convince your doctor to do it.

Re: training, you can always up the root veggies like carrots and parsnips before prolonged aerobic activity. They are lovely mashed up. Or I have heard smoothies made with coconut milk can help too. The MCT's in coconut milk convert straight to energy.

Red Cortina

strawdog wrote: »

Just out of interest, you say a trainer turned you on to the diet. What type of training? How has paleo impacted your training? The one major downside to this diet is that I find I struggle with prolonged aerobic exercise such a footy training/matches.....

I go to a personnel trainer and he strongly (under-statement) recommends the Paleo Diet. The type of training I would do in a week would be 2 full body, weight training sessions and 2 interval sessions.

I read this article http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/2009/12/25/panu-eating-and-high-intensity-training.html which was linked on the Crossfit Ireland website and the gist of it was that the Paleo Diet was seen to improve athletic performance.

But to be honest I have no reference point for training on a non-Paleo Diet vs Paleo Diet as I started both the training listed above and the Paleo Diet at the same time so no help there tbh.

Have you ever sat down and worked through the number of calories you are eating everyday? And looked at the number of calories you are getting from Carbohydrate, Fat and Protein? There is a link in the Fitness section of boards to calculate how many maintenance calories you should be eating etc

Red Cortina

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

Blood tests can show negative in true celiacs too. It is only when the immune reaction has been present for long periods of time and/or the process is far advanced that antibodies are produced in quantities sufficient to leak into the blood. Testing for antigliadin antibodies in stool is far more sensitive if you can convince your doctor to do it.

Am planning on having this testing done in the next few months by Enterolab if they accept samples from Ireland. Will let you guys know how I get on....

El_Dangeroso

Red Cortina wrote: »

Am planning on having this testing done in the next few months by Enterolab if they accept samples from Ireland. Will let you guys know how I get on....

Don't forget to eat gluten for a few days prior to collecting the sample, otherwise you might get a false negative.

Catenaccio!

Just started off trying this way of eating.

Started yesterday evening - Dinner was a full head of broccoli, 2 grilled lean pork chops and a small bit of pepper. Snack before bed was a small handful of brazil nuts.

This morning I had a few slices of pineapple along with a leftover pork chop. Must say that eating the cold pork chop was extremely boring. Had an apple when I got to work. Lunch was a chicken breast, some baby spinach leaves and a small number of brazil nuts.


Must say that I'm feeling hungry/tired at the moment. Nowhere near what I'm used to eating. Is this normal?

By the way, I'm 13.5 stone and intend on staying 13 stone +.

El_Dangeroso

Catenaccio! wrote: »

Just started off trying this way of eating.

Started yesterday evening - Dinner was a full head of broccoli, 2 grilled lean pork chops and a small bit of pepper. Snack before bed was a small handful of brazil nuts.

This morning I had a few slices of pineapple along with a leftover pork chop. Must say that eating the cold pork chop was extremely boring. Had an apple when I got to work. Lunch was a chicken breast, some baby spinach leaves and a small number of brazil nuts.


Must say that I'm feeling hungry/tired at the moment. Nowhere near what I'm used to eating. Is this normal?

By the way, I'm 13.5 stone and intend on staying 13 stone +.

I'd swap the high-sugar fruits like pineapple for berries to begin with while you're improving your insulin sensitivity. Get the extra calories you need from added fat such as olive oil as a dressing or butter on cooked vegetables.

There is definitely an adjustment period of about two weeks where you can feel lethargic and get various withdrawal symptoms. During this adjustment period it's important to eat enough food and to never go hungry. Appetite will adjust to normal levels after this.

Also, a good recipe book for inspiration is essential, an advantage of the paleo diet is that you don't have to eat boring rabbit food. Some of my favourite recipes are:

Pork goulash served with coconut milk and steamed cauliflower

Bacon and avocado omelette with grilled tomatoes and side salad.

Chicken curry with cauliflower

Portabello mushrooms stuffed with pancetta, herbs and mashed butternut squash.

Baked chicken breast marinated in pesto with mashed carrots and parsnips with herb butter

Snacks I always have to hand include:

Walnuts, pistachios, mortadella slices (cheap in aldi and no nasty additives), boiled eggs, gherkins, pickled beetroot.

It does take a bit more planning and cooking but most diets do.

Catenaccio!

Hey, thanks for that.

Get the extra calories you need from added fat such as olive oil as a dressing or butter on cooked vegetables.

I boil my broccoli etc, so just pour some olive oil over it once it's on my plate? I thought butter was a no no in this diet?

There is definitely an adjustment period of about two weeks where you can feel lethargic and get various withdrawal symptoms. During this adjustment period it's important to eat enough food and to never go hungry. Appetite will adjust to normal levels after this.

I'm feeling hungry now and all I've got on me is an apple and an avocado. Suppose it's better than nothing.

Also, a good recipe book for inspiration is essential, an advantage of the paleo diet is that you don't have to eat boring rabbit food. Some of my favourite recipes are:

Where did you get these recipes from?

Baked chicken breast marinated in pesto with mashed carrots and parsnips with herb butter

This one sounds sweet!

El_Dangeroso

Catenaccio! wrote: »

I boil my broccoli etc, so just pour some olive oil over it once it's on my plate? I thought butter was a no no in this diet?

I'd actually recommend including high-fat dairy at the beginning in order to get enough calories unless you have any issue with dairy. It's not the fat that paleo people take issue with but the dairy protein, butter and cream have very little protein.

I gave up dairy for two months and it made zero difference besides making my life really awkward. So I guess you could call me lacto-paleo. Makes the diet an awful lot more do-able socially in my experience.

I know what you mean, as much as you plan you can get caught out. In a pinch I buy sliced ham or babybels from a shop and munch on that, Worst comes to absolute worst, fast food burger and ditch the bun. It's not ideal but better than the alternative. Eating an avocado and an apple just sounds too depressing for words

They are recipes I have collected over a while. You can find them anywhere online. Just sub in cauliflower for rice, butternut squash or mashed root veggies for potato and sliced sweetheart cabbage for pasta. You'll be surprised the range of food you can eat with just a few substitutions.

You do have to make pretty much everything from scratch though, which can be time consuming. I find myself cooking huge batches of things at weekends, like the goulash, chicken soup or shepherd's pie and then freezing them in small one portion containers for future convenience.

Catenaccio!

Don't think I could even do the fast food burger if I'm honest! I used to make my own burgers at home a while back and just used a load of spinach to make a bun out of it. A little bit awkward but better than eating the bun.

An avocado and an apple isn't too depressing as a snack - I thought this was what most people ate as a snack as part of the paleo diet?

Do you use any specific recipe site for your foods?

Also, what are your thoughts on this pancake recipe - Coconut Pancakes. I was contemplating making a batch this evening for consumption as a night snack and as a kick start to my morning. I could only locate dessicated coconut in the shops, will that suffice do you think?

Transform

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

I'd actually recommend including high-fat dairy at the beginning in order to get enough calories unless you have any issue with dairy. It's not the fat that paleo people take issue with but the dairy protein, butter and cream have very little protein.

I gave up dairy for two months and it made zero difference besides making my life really awkward. So I guess you could call me lacto-paleo. Makes the diet an awful lot more do-able socially in my experience.

I know what you mean, as much as you plan you can get caught out. In a pinch I buy sliced ham or babybels from a shop and munch on that, Worst comes to absolute worst, fast food burger and ditch the bun. It's not ideal but better than the alternative. Eating an avocado and an apple just sounds too depressing for words

They are recipes I have collected over a while. You can find them anywhere online. Just sub in cauliflower for rice, butternut squash or mashed root veggies for potato and sliced sweetheart cabbage for pasta. You'll be surprised the range of food you can eat with just a few substitutions.

You do have to make pretty much everything from scratch though, which can be time consuming. I find myself cooking huge batches of things at weekends, like the goulash, chicken soup or shepherd's pie and then freezing them in small one portion containers for future convenience.

agreed re the higher fat intake - big fan of butter and the MCT's in butter

Catenaccio!

What do you make of the coconut pancake recipe Transform? Uses a lot of coconut milk and almond flour but I'm not entirely sure if that's a bad thing. Sound so damn tasty tbh

Just checking before I run off to the shops after work!

El_Dangeroso

Catenaccio! wrote: »

Don't think I could even do the fast food burger if I'm honest! I used to make my own burgers at home a while back and just used a load of spinach to make a bun out of it. A little bit awkward but better than eating the bun.

An avocado and an apple isn't too depressing as a snack - I thought this was what most people ate as a snack as part of the paleo diet?

Do you use any specific recipe site for your foods?

Also, what are your thoughts on this pancake recipe - Coconut Pancakes. I was contemplating making a batch this evening for consumption as a night snack and as a kick start to my morning. I could only locate dessicated coconut in the shops, will that suffice do you think?

Oh sorry, thought you were eating an apple and avocado as a meal! Perfect snack.

That recipe looks ok as a weekend treat, but not for every day as there's a fair amount of omega 6 in almonds so you don't want to throw off your ratios.

And shredded coconut = desicated coconut.

Transform

Catenaccio! wrote: »

What do you make of the coconut pancake recipe Transform? Uses a lot of coconut milk and almond flour but I'm not entirely sure if that's a bad thing. Sound so damn tasty tbh

Just checking before I run off to the shops after work!

sounds good to me

tribesman44

hi all. been following kurt g. harris' PANU diet now for about 3 weeks and feel FANTASTIC. found out i was gluten intolerant back in september of 2009 and started buying all gluten free foods. i thought maybe this would help, but i was wrong. ive been reading on paleo diets now for some time, but wanted to really psych myself up to do it as to not fail. it wasn't until i read the 12 step guide to PANU approach that i decided it was time. i loved how it said dairy was OK and that some foods in the neolithic time are exceptional. i am a pretty big workout nut. i loved how panu actually told you to work out less and focus more on interval cardio and high intensity lifting. its more about what you are putting into your body. so as of now i weight train 3 days per week, do 20 minutes of interval cardio 3 days per week (biking, weighted hikes, hill walking) all focusing on quick sprints of some type, followed by 1 minute normal pace.

also, i am doing one 20-24 hour fast per week and every day i do at least 12-15 hours fasting. i am not starving myself at all. i simply eat when i am hungry. no need to graze all day like an herbivore. i dont even eat breakfast anymore. i wake up around 8-9am and have a cup of tea. off to the gym at 10am and dont really get hungry until around 12-1pm. its amazing how eating proper fats keeps you satiated so much longer.

right now i am eating a lot of cheese, heavy cream, coconut oil, coconut milk, whole milk, almonds (unsalted), butter, lamb and beef. not a huge fan of fish, so i am taking cod liver oil and omega 3 and 6 supplements along with a male multivitamin and glucosamine. i am loving this and wouldn't refer to it as a diet. its more like a way of life. my wife has also started it too and is loving it. she has lost 8lbs already and feels so much better being off the refined carbs. i wish more people would at least read about this. it seems like people think we are insane for eating this way, but they have never done their research. our bodies are simply designed to eat this kind of food.

cmyk

corkcomp wrote: »

big +1. i CANT live without oats

I thought that too, I tried this a few years ago, and have gone back to it for the last month. Basically paleo +dairy to make up the calories. I've just substituted my oats for a 5 egg spinach/red onion/cheese omelette in the morning...don't miss them at all now really.

Main benefits I've seen...nothing miraculous, slightly more energy but more stable, no dips at all. Workout intensity hasn't really increased. (I've just been getting through them due to back injury) so can't really guage that. One strange side effect, my gums used to bleed quite a lot when brushing and flossing...completely stopped now. I do think that it's effecting body composition too...but i'll keep going and monitor that.

tribesman44

cmyk wrote: »

I thought that too, I tried this a few years ago, and have gone back to it for the last month. Basically paleo +dairy to make up the calories. I've just substituted my oats for a 5 egg spinach/red onion/cheese omelette in the morning...don't miss them at all now really.

Main benefits I've seen...nothing miraculous, slightly more energy but more stable, no dips at all. Workout intensity hasn't really increased. (I've just been getting through them due to back injury) so can't really guage that. One strange side effect, my gums used to bleed quite a lot when brushing and flossing...completely stopped now. I do think that it's effecting body composition too...but i'll keep going and monitor that.

i never thought i could not eat porridge in the morning either. truth is, i dont miss it at all. now i can eat all the REAL food i want. eggs, beef, lamb, cheese, full fat yogurt, BUTTER. truth is, breaking those habits are not that hard. you just have to mentally prepare yourself and think of the benefits in the long run.

El_Dangeroso

cmyk wrote: »

I thought that too, I tried this a few years ago, and have gone back to it for the last month. Basically paleo +dairy to make up the calories. I've just substituted my oats for a 5 egg spinach/red onion/cheese omelette in the morning...don't miss them at all now really.

Main benefits I've seen...nothing miraculous, slightly more energy but more stable, no dips at all. Workout intensity hasn't really increased. (I've just been getting through them due to back injury) so can't really guage that. One strange side effect, my gums used to bleed quite a lot when brushing and flossing...completely stopped now. I do think that it's effecting body composition too...but i'll keep going and monitor that.

Paleo is AMAZING for dental health, I used to get a cavity a year, even though I was brushing and flossing religiously and avoiding sugar. I started some vitamin D and completely kicked the grains and I've actually witnessed small cavities heal over!

From: http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2009/03/reversing-tooth-decay.html

Thus, in dogs, the factors that affect tooth healing are the same factors that affect tooth development:

- The mineral content of the diet, particularly calcium and phosphorus

- The fat-soluble vitamin content of the diet, chiefly vitamin D

- The availability of minerals for absorption, determined largely by the diet's phytic acid content (prevents mineral absorption)

What about humans? Drs. Mellanby set out to see if they could use their dietary principles to cure tooth decay that was already established. They divided 62 children with cavities into three different diet groups for 6 months. Group 1 ate their normal diet plus oatmeal (rich in phytic acid). Group 2 ate their normal diet plus vitamin D. Group 3 ate a grain-free diet and took vitamin D.



In group 1, oatmeal prevented healing and encouraged new cavities, presumably due to its ability to prevent mineral absorption. In group 2, simply adding vitamin D to the diet caused most cavities to heal and fewer to form. The most striking effect was in group 3, the group eating a grain-free diet plus vitamin D, in which nearly all cavities healed and very few new cavities developed. Grains are the main source of phytic acid in the modern diet, although we can't rule out the possibility that grains were promoting tooth decay through another mechanism as well.

cmyk

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

Paleo is AMAZING for dental health, I used to get a cavity a year, even though I was brushing and flossing religiously and avoiding sugar. I started some vitamin D and completely kicked the grains and I've actually witnessed small cavities heal over!

Yep I've read up on it since, to be honest it's the biggest thing I've noticed. Not to take it off topic, but how do you take your vit D? I have read that absorption is difficult and sprays are being developed for this reason? I've been supplementing with it in tablet form but not sure if that's a waste of time.

columok

cmyk wrote:

Yep I've read up on it since, to be honest it's the biggest thing I've noticed. Not to take it off topic, but how do you take your vit D? I have read that absorption is difficult and sprays are being developed for this reason? I've been supplementing with it in tablet form but not sure if that's a waste of time.

Last bunch of vit D I had was some american 5,000 iU caps that I got from the lads in CrossfitIreland. (original source iherb) I take 10,000 iU a day. If I get 20 minutes of good sun I skip the next day's tablets!

Paleo rocks. If I go paleo + dairy I find I feel mucousy!!! (sp?) It's exciting to read about benefits to my teeth as years of poor diet combined with the sugar intake of a masters has ruined them and to not just keep them static but to heal/improve them is quite a prospect.

cmyk

columok wrote: »

If I go paleo + dairy I find I feel mucousy!!!

I get this a bit too, and it isn't great for the bowel movements either (I realise this means there's an intolerence there to a certain degree)

In a nutshell I've just taken on too much at the moment and these two months are crazy busy for me, and am ashamed to admit it's purely as a means to an end for me to fill the calorie deficit. Dairy seems to be the lesser of the two evils depending on what you read too. I'm genuinely looking forward to dropping the dairy and giving full paleo a go.