Restricted List out

cavan shooter

I have just gotten eyes on the restricted firearms/ammunition list. Not to bad unless your a pistol shooter and 308. I will sumarize but someone will need to check actual wording.

Anything 308 (7.62) and above is classed as restricted (Cant remembr if this includes 308 or above)

Anything above 22 caliber in pistol restricted

Any shotgun which fires more than 3 or has a folding stock, pistol grip or generally falls into assault category restricted

22 semi auto with capacity for more than 10 rounds

silencer for a 22 rim fire not restricted

explosive/sabot/slugs ammo is restricted. No mention 223.
Please excuse font etc in post as it is being posted via a hand held pda. Will be driving for nxt three hours so unfortunately won't be able to respond till pm

thed4king

Where abouts did you read this from? Would you have a link by any chance?

cavan shooter

thed4king wrote: »

Where abouts did you read this from? Would you have a link by any chance?

in agun shop saw it at the till aaked could I read it we read it and mulled over it check doj website. letter landed today for owner with copy of legislation

peter-pantslez

what about silencers for 22 centre fire???

IRLConor

Was it an official release from the DoJ?

I can't see anything on their website listing it.

Rew

Its been around for a few weeks but DoJ and the FCP were keeping it under wraps. AFAIK its only claibers above .308 that are restriced but not .308 its self.

peter-pantslez

heres a stupid one for you.........

when they say restricted do they mean that

a) there is no way you can have one ever.........

or

b) you can have one once you fit certain criteria and check certain boxes and have good reason to own one??

foxhunter

The actual wording is "Essentially all pistols (bar Olympic pistols) ,rifles greater than .308 calibre and shotguns holding more than three cartridges will be regarded as restricted."
Applications for restricted firearms will have to be made to the applicant's Chief Superintendant.

Remmy

any centrefire suppressor you need an authorisation for your FO.Thats nothing new you need a authorisation for a moderator now.I needed one for my .177 with a built in moderater.Aslong as you can justify a reason for needing a moderator the authorisation should be straight forward.

Kramer

Remmy wrote: »

Aslong as you can justify a reason for needing a moderator the authorisation should be straight forward.

In an ideal world, yes. Not always the case though .

cavan shooter

peter-pantslez wrote: »

heres a stupid one for you.........

when they say restricted do they mean that

a) there is no way you can have one ever.........

or

b) you can have one once you fit certain criteria and check certain boxes and have good reason to own one??

b, you can but there better be a very very good reason when you apply and no other caliber will do.
I rang my local dealer he got it today (Letter) pity about centerfire 22 from what I read its 22 rimfire silencers not restricted. Looks like they are now using the word rimfire with 22. At least its out now (list) no more second guessing. Dealer also said monitored alarms is becoming the new hobby horse (See other thread)

DeVore

I understand that this is a seismic event in the shooting community and as such is obviously the sort of thing we want to support the discussion of. Please keep this focused on the guns and the laws. Personally issues are not to be aired here, just the facts ma'am...

Thanks,
DeV.
ps: This thread could do with some sources too to ensure you are discussing the truth without anyone's filter being applied...

peter-pantslez

foxhunter wrote: »

The actual wording is "Essentially all pistols (bar Olympic pistols) ,rifles greater than .308 calibre and shotguns holding more than three cartridges will be regarded as restricted."
Applications for restricted firearms will have to be made to the applicant's Chief Superintendant.

i have a 22 semi auto pistol coming in to the country as we speak, am i going to get hassle over this????

rrpc

peter-pantslez wrote: »

i have a 22 semi auto pistol coming in to the country as we speak, am i going to get hassle over this????

What is it?

Sparks

If it's coming into the country now, you have the licence for it already, no? In which case, you're okay until renewal time in August, by which time we'll know more.

bitemybanger

Think Ivan might have a bit of hastle getting a 50cal with mod,night vision and folding stock with the new list:D

Remmy

Kramer wrote: »

In an ideal world, yes. Not always the case though .

yeah very true!I'm thinking of getting a a10 for the .243 i'll let ya know how I get on.Can't forsee it being any major shakes.When's this legislation going to be all done and dusted?,seems like it's been dragging on for so long.:rolleyes:

rrpc

bitemybanger wrote: »

Think Ivan might have a bit of hastle getting a 50cal with mod,night vision and folding stock with the new list:D

If that list is accurate, then xbows must be restricted as well.

The DoJ have obviously been reading Ivan's posts :eek:

rrpc

Remmy wrote: »

yeah very true!I'm thinking of getting a a10 for the .243 i'll let ya know how I get on.Can't forsee it being any major shakes.When's this legislation going to be all done and dusted?,seems like it's been dragging on for so long.:rolleyes:

If it's out with the dealers, then it must have been signed by the Minister which means it's now law.

Remmy

Ah great.I suppose the next thing is how long it'l take to be implemented by the Gardai.I'm happy enough with it could have gone alot worse on the rifles end of things.Whats everyone else's opinion on it?

Sparks

I think the important thing is not so much what's on or off the list (important though it is), but rather what the implications of being on the list are/will be; and those we won't know for some time yet.

(Personally, I remain as pessimistic on this as I've always been, though I'd be happy to be proven wrong)

IRLConor

Well, I haven't seen any entries in Iris Oifigiúil mentioning an SI for it. Maybe it's not law yet and the list sent to dealers is a "heads up" of some sorts? Then again, maybe it's in today's issue of Iris Oifigiúil which isn't on the web yet.

Cavan shooter: Do you know if your local dealer get that letter directly from the DoJ or via some other body (Gardai/FCP/ICABS (:D)/etc.)?

rrpc

From my popint of view, I think it's a sensible approach to have an unrestricted list rather than a restricted one. It's far simpler to understand and less likely for there to be ambiguities which is what has bedevilled the shooting community for decades.

I agree with Sparks that what restricted actually means will require a wait and see approach. Being a glass half full kind of person, I'm hopeful that it won't be too onerous.

It's good to see that the centrefires up to .308 are not restricted. That should put an end to the nonsense about .223's that we've been hearing about lately.

I'd like to see the final document published before I make any further comment, but on balance it seems better than originally expected.

rrpc

IRLConor wrote: »

Well, I haven't seen any entries in Iris Oifigiúil mentioning an SI for it. Maybe it's not law yet and the list sent to dealers is a "heads up" of some sorts? Then again, maybe it's in today's issue of Iris Oifigiúil which isn't on the web yet.

Cavan shooter: Do you know if your local dealer get that letter directly from the DoJ or via some other body (Gardai/FCP/ICABS (:D)/etc.)?

Stuff that gets signed in sometines takes up to three weeks to appear in Iris. If you look at the last issue (Feb 12th) there was an SI published that was signed on Jan 25th

IRLConor

rrpc wrote: »

Stuff that gets signed in sometines takes up to three weeks to appear in Iris. If you look at the last issue (Feb 12th) there was an SI published that was signed on Jan 25th

Good point.

chem

So a .303 is as easy to get as a .22 now? keeping in mind you are a range member or have a deer permit. :D

Its going to be interesting to see how the Gardi deal with restricted items. Will it be the same old line from them "sure will a .22 pistol not do yea instead of that big dirty harry yoke yer after?"

When I applied for my pistol I was told 9mm is not an olympic cal. Told the garda I did not intend going to the olympics I just want to use it on the range to which I got a face something like this:mad:

Traumadoc

is a 303 not in actual fact .310 inches?

cavan shooter

I won't be able to get hold of it untill Monday evening. The document I saw was the Legislation which ran to 2 pages essential

interpretation and definitions, then it listed what was not restricted under firearms and then dealt with calibers. A covering letter sumarized the main parts covering letter from DOJ

I understand De Vores comment but I couldn't keep this to myself:D

TomBeckett

Hello all
i have a mate of mine who just bought a glock 9mm last week. he is in the Thpmastown/Graignamanagh district of Kilkenny. does this mean that his licence will not be issued??
Also what about pistols that are allready out there will there licences not be renewed next year...

cavan shooter

Restricted doesn't mean banned Straight out of CJA in relation to restricted

Any person wishing to own, use or carry such a firearm
must apply to the Garda Commissioner, rather than their local
Garda Superintendent, for a firearms certificate for it.

He will be very very busy, or You will probabally see chief super getting involved. Gardai will do 1 of two things:

1. Once FAC expires re apply via restricted route
2. Draw line in the sand and from this day on anyone who applies...... (thats not going to happen is it???)

The Legislation is now in place, how will it be applied is the next great mystery,

bob lee swagger

even with this list does anyone still feel everything is just still vague as hell?

bunny shooter

Sparks wrote: »

I think the important thing is not so much what's on or off the list (important though it is), but rather what the implications of being on the list are/will be; and those we won't know for some time yet.

(Personally, I remain as pessimistic on this as I've always been, though I'd be happy to be proven wrong)

+1

rrpc

Traumadoc wrote: »

is a 303 not in actual fact .310 inches?

It's actually anything from .303" up to .318". The variance is due to the way in which the bore is measured. AFAIK, the round itself is nominally .303" but some handloads can be made to bigger diameters depending on the bore of the rifle.

There is some confusion as to whether 7.62 and .303 are the same round. In actual fact they are not and the 7.62 was the replacement for the .303 and is nominally .300" diameter.

V Bull

This is the biggest load of rubbish I've come across in a long time.

Everyone scare mongering yet again.

If the so called restricted list is published and is now law why not PRINT IT ON THIS THREAD for all to see and read.

Where is it, I've searched all websites without success, whats the website address for all of this...........................????

rrpc

V Bull wrote: »

This is the biggest load of rubbish I've come across in a long time.

Everyone scare mongering yet again.

If the so called restricted list is published and is now law why not PRINT IT ON THIS THREAD for all to see and read.

Where is it, I've searched all websites without success, whats the website address for all of this...........................????

V Bull, if you've read the thread, you'll see that people have had sight of it in gun dealer's premises. Publishing of S.I.'s is done in Iris Oifiguil, which usually only happens when (a) the SI is signed, (b) it's been given an SI number (c) it's actually printed and sent to the Government Publications Office.

The dealers have probably been given a printed version of a soft copy. It may not even have an SI number.

The last thing to bear in mind is that most SI's are given a commencement date which usually allows for (a),(b) and (c) to have been carried out first.

So even if it's published, it may not be law until some future date. An example of this is the new VRT and motor tax rating system.

The first place to look for publication is http://www.irisoifigiuil.ie/ and click on the 'current issues' link. Iris Oifiguil is published twice weekly.

José Alaninho

So, according to the restricted list, any shotgun that holds over 3 rounds is restricted. I am currently waiting for the result of an application for a Remington 870. Will this affect it, i.e the fact that the list came in right in the middle of the application process? Or would it exempt the 870 from the list if the magazine plug was installed to reduce it to two in the tube, one in the chamber?

meathshooter

Where does this leave people who are currently waiting for pistol certs above .22,I know a good few in that predicament,I agree Its good there some type of criteria set,puts a lot of fears to rest in .233 anyway thats
a good outcome,DOES this mean that If want to take up fullbore pistol say
ipsa,1500,issf centrefire,ect I will be told no,or if I meet a certain critea
they would grant a cert,What is the criteria or will they make it up as the go

Slug chucker

The creature has a name: S.I. No. 021 of 2008
I can't find any mention of it on the web but I have read a copy of it.
I won't try to quote any of it as it would only be done by memory and that’s not exact enough to put into print. But as above, rifle shooters are fine unless you own something like an AR 15 or it's over .308 in caliber but there is bad news for the pistol shooters. There was a mention of ISSF rimfire rules, so if it is a .22 and fits into the target category it's ok but anything bigger is on the restricted list.

I'd go with the optimists, let’s just wait and see what happens but I will be contacting my firearms officer to get clarification of my position well in advance of the renewals in August as I possibly have three on the restricted side of things.
As the old saying goes “forewarned is forearmed”

No doubt I’m sure our well informed colleagues in the SSAI will have a copy of the S.I. in their possession which would have been supplied to them during there interaction with the FCP and will publish it on their website so we can all read it. I’d like to think this is going to be the case so we the shooters will not be the last people on the face of the planet to actually officially read the document?

Cheers,
Slug

rrpc

Slug chucker wrote: »

The creature has a name: S.I. No. 021 of 2008

Here's the link to the issue of Iris Oifigiuil that announces it. It's not available yet from the menu of issues, but it's there for those who know how to look

http://www.irisoifigiuil.ie/pdfs/ir150208.pdf

I can see a queue developing outside the Government Publications Office for when it opens first thing on Monday morning

Sparks

That Irish Oifigiuil bit is a tad annoying:

S.I. No. 21 of 2008.
FIREARMS (RESTRICTED FIREARMS AND
AMMUNITION) ORDER 2008.
The Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Brian
Lenihan, has made an Order declaring specified firearms and
ammunition to be restricted by reference to certain criteria.
Copies may be obtained from the Government Publications Sale
Office, Sun Alliance House, Molesworth Street, Dublin 2 or by
mail order from Government Publications, Postal Trade Section,
Unit 20, Lakeside Retail Park, Claremorris, Co. Mayo, fax 094
9378964.
Price: \2.54
DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, EQUALITY AND
LAW REFORM.
[14]

Sparks

rrpc wrote: »

I can see a queue developing outside the Government Publications Office for when it opens first thing on Monday morning

Perhaps not - they don't open till half nine so you can't really drop in on the way to work. On the other hand, I've the day off so I'll grab a copy if one's not shown up here by then.

Our man in Havana

Mail order ftw!

IDon'tKnow!

I was In a dealer on Saturday and he told me the changes will be in from May this year. Might have just said this because my friend was looking at hand guns.

But maybe there is a dealer who have this letter who could put a copy on the board. They could remove any personal details that were on it first.

cavan shooter

Slug chucker wrote: »

The creature has a name: S.I. No. 021 of 2008

At last vindication, thank you Slug Chucker, for a while there I didn't know what way things were going to pan out I'll try get a copy tomorrow,and pick the bits out and post

sidneyreilly

Here ye are.

IRLConor

Cool. Thanks.

I wonder did they have any reason for restricting shotguns with pistol grips and bullpup rifles other than "they look scary".

rrpc

Thanks for that Sidney. I've run it through my OCR and stripped out the front page stuff leaving the meat in a word document.

here.

It's a bit easier to read. Any mistakes are mine or the software's

rrpc

IRLConor wrote: »

Cool. Thanks.

I wonder did they have any reason for restricting shotguns with pistol grips and bullpup rifles other than "they look scary".

I'd say it's for overall length reasons. Bullpups can be very short and more concealable I suppose, same goes for pistol grip shotties.

Interesting to see that the barrel length of the shotgun is now specified in cm and inches. I remember a discussion here recently as to whether the length was 24" or 60cm.

IRLConor

rrpc wrote: »

I'd say it's for overall length reasons. Bullpups can be very short and more concealable I suppose, same goes for pistol grip shotties.

I guess, but then they already have overall length restrictions which should take care of those concerns.

rrpc wrote: »

Interesting to see that the barrel length of the shotgun is now specified in cm and inches. I remember a discussion here recently as to whether the length was 24" or 60cm.

Yeah, it's nice to see that they're being more explicit.

rrpc

IRLConor wrote: »

I guess, but then they already have overall length restrictions which should take care of those concerns.

Hmmm. The only thing is that those restrictions are on barrel length. If they were introduced assuming a standard stock length, then it would have to be changed to take stock shortening into account. I'm just making assumptions here, but it's conceivable that you'd have a pistol grip shottie with a total length of 24" which perhaps was not the intention of the original restriction?

Mellor

The defination of a silencer is also technically accurate too.

“silencers”, in relation to firearms, means any devices fitted or capable of being fitted to the firearms for the purpose of moderating or reducing the sound made on their discharge;