What to do

LegacyUser

Going unreg on this one.
I have been married a long time. During the course of this long time the marriage has had it's ups & downs like most. Some of the downs were serious enough though.
In more recent times some of the ways my partner behaves have been very 'wearing' on me. I really began to think there was not much future for our marriage. We talked about our differences and it would end in a row or my wife would just walk off & refuse to talk.
We went for marriage guidance starting just before Christmas. The counsellor allowed us both to speak without interruption, took notes, asked questions and tried to get us thinking about stuff that she felt was the real reason for our difficulties. We each went to the counsellor alone for a one to one session. In my case she concentrated on my childhood, family history, teen years & twenties.
The last session was where she threw out a few observations (no blame attached). She started with me, some of the things she said were disturbing but I took them on board. I had to agree with some of the stuff, the rest I didn't agree with. Anyhow, she was finished with me after about 10 mins. Then she addressed my wife. She spoke for almost 30 mins, my wife tried to interrupt but she stopped her. Some of this stuff was very heavy, disturbing details I knew nothing about. Some of it really struck home to me and at last I was at least satisfied that someone else might think the same as me. All in all my wife was not happy and tried to argue with the counsellor, her reply being that this was just her opinion based on her observations and that there was little point in becoming aggressive. The counsellor then recommended that my wife would need further counselling alone, either with her or someone else. I paid up, thanked her for her help & we left.
In the car on the way home my wife described the whole process as 'a load of shyte' and picked a row. She doesn't accept anything this counsellor said.
We havent spoken in 3 days. How do I break this impasse? She wont even respond to the simple things like 'cup of tea?'. I am getting really pissed off now. Maybe I was right about our not having a future together, certainly I dont feel for her the way I used to.
Opinions please.

JuliusCaesar

I'm really sorry to hear this, balding. And there's nothing helpful I can say either. You can't talk with someone who refuses to listen. Did she always do this? Is she liable to get over her snit soon? Does she care if the marriage breaks down? You can't support the marriage on your own, but you're being left in a very lonely place here. You can't break the impasse - she has to come out of it. Hope she does, good luck.

biko

You should make clear to your wife that the path you're on at the moment is not working. Suggest further counselling, together or separate. You both heard thing about yourselves you don't like.
You may want to think about separation/divorce if all else fails. Kids?

Jack B. Badd

balding man wrote: »

Anyhow, she was finished with me after about 10 mins. Then she addressed my wife. She spoke for almost 30 mins, my wife tried to interrupt but she stopped her. Some of this stuff was very heavy, disturbing details I knew nothing about. Some of it really struck home to me and at last I was at least satisfied that someone else might think the same as me. All in all my wife was not happy and tried to argue with the counsellor, her reply being that this was just her opinion based on her observations and that there was little point in becoming aggressive. The counsellor then recommended that my wife would need further counselling alone, either with her or someone else. I paid up, thanked her for her help & we left.

The above line in bold really caught my eye. Marriage counselling is not an opportunity for you to be right and get the counsellor on your side against your wife.
It may be harder for your wife to take observations about herself than it apparently was for you which could explain her reaction. It may take her some time to fully absorb what's been said and if she has serious issues (regarding your marriage or otherwise) then one or two counselling sessions probably aren't going to magically fix it. If you want your marriage to survive (and I presume you do since you've started counselling) you might try to help your wife deal with what's been discussed so far instead of holding it over her - this may seem a bit harsh but you asked for an opinion and this is mine. It may very well be that your marriage is effectively over but it's probably a sure thing if you maintain the attitude you've shown in the above paragraph.
As for breaking through your wife's silent treatment, maybe being persistently supportive will help. It sounds like she's being bloody childish but if you want to try to make things work you'll have to find some way of getting her to act like a responsible adult again - at least until you get totally sick of her behaviour. If she's downright refusing to talk to you though you could see the counsellor again on your own and discuss it. She may be able to give you some advise. Good luck.

TequilaMockingBird

I agree, I don't think there should be an element of "blame" or "I KNEW it" after these sessions, although I'm sure it must feel good to you!! If your feeling like that, that "FINALLY someone understands me" then try to imagine how furious your wife is feeling, she has had no such back-up. She thinks the counsellor/all counselling is shyte, because they didn't back her up. Imo, thats a fairly human reponse!

Try to keep at at, try to talk and maybe don't crowd her too much. Talking is the only way through.

Good luck.

Racing Flat

balding man wrote: »

We went for marriage guidance starting just before Christmas.

*Excellent. Gives ye a chance

the rest I didn't agree with.

*Why? You need to think about this - are you being defensive? Maybe easy to disagree when on the spot, but if you reflect afterwards maybe you'll understand the counsellor was being reasonable?

disturbing details I knew nothing about.

*This is a shame - maybe the reason behind the problems? Communication is SO important. No bottling up, no secrets. Ye're married.

All in all my wife was not happy and tried to argue with the counsellor,

* natural reaction - noone likes to hear not nice stuff about themselves, especially if they know they're true.

In the car on the way home my wife described the whole process as 'a load of shyte' and picked a row.

* as above

She doesn't accept anything this counsellor said.
*not that she's admitting to...

We havent spoken in 3 days.
*...maybe because she does accept what the counsellor said but is having difficulty dealing with it, so she is reacting by withdrawing. But this will not help. She must communicate.

How do I break this impasse? She wont even respond to the simple things like 'cup of tea?'.
*would she read something if you wrote it?

I am getting really pissed off now.
*Don't - that may be the reaction to the silent treatment she's 'seeking'. Be supportive.

Maybe I was right about our not having a future together, certainly I dont feel for her the way I used to.

*I think a married couple have such a strong bond they can always have a future together if both are prepared to work at it.
Opinions please.

To me it sounds like your wife is really hurting and needs your support. Be available, supportive and if she'll talk to you, calmly suggest going to counselling again - maybe another one? If 2 tell her the same thing she may be more willing to accept.
Feel for you buddy. Best of luck.

LegacyUser

Lot of valid stuff there.
Have you ever been in a situation where someone keeps saying/doing things that you feel are wrong but they insist are right? In our case the counsellor listened to both our points of view and at the end reckoned that some of the stuff my wife says/does is destructive in a marriage. TBH I had started to doubt my own sanity and had started thinking that maybe my objections to the stuff she did were unreasonable. The counsellor at least reassured me that I was not losing my marbles and that I was really just a very average, normal sort of man.
I did not agree with all she said - 'sometimes a cigar is just a cigar' and said so. She asked me to consider some points and I honestly am doing that.
I am going to corner my wife at some time today and just let her know that change will have to happen or there will be no future for us. If she chooses to withdraw there is little I can do about that.
I am scared tbh, I dont know what more to do or where to go.

Racing Flat

balding man wrote: »

I am going to corner my wife at some time today and just let her know that change will have to happen or there will be no future for us. If she chooses to withdraw there is little I can do about that.
I am scared tbh, I dont know what more to do or where to go.

I'd approach it a little differently. As you are scared, a natural reaction can be to go into attack mode, so you wish to corner her and give her an ultimatum. The best outcome would be if she decided herself (or ye decided together) that change needs to happen. You telling her it has to happen will lead to her withdrawing, I'd bet money on it.
So, instead, I'd very gently say that you'd love to talk about things with her, whenever it suits. Maybe let her know that you love her and that you would love things to work out and you're prepared to work at this (so you both have to do things, not just her). Then give her a bit of space, but be available and let her come to you. If she does, great. Once ye're communicating be supportive, calm, and not reactive, and take it slowly. If she will not communicate with you after this approach, well then perhaps there's no more you can do.
Best of luck.

Jack B. Badd

balding man wrote: »

In our case the counsellor listened to both our points of view and at the end reckoned that some of the stuff my wife says/does is destructive in a marriage.

Did she attribute all of the destructive stuff in your relationship to your wife or did she reckon that some of the stuff you do is destructive also?

balding man wrote: »

I did not agree with all she said - 'sometimes a cigar is just a cigar' and said so. She asked me to consider some points and I honestly am doing that.

I'm confused about this. Is it a case that you didn't agree with some of the stuff she said and are going to take them on board regardless or are you just going to consider what points you want to? If it's the latter then you would be doing exactly the same thing that your wife is doing, albeit on a smaller scale. Tbh, your posts make me think you're hearing what you want to and ignoring the rest.

Personally, I don't think giving your wife an ultimatum is the best way to go but I guess it depends on whether you want to be right or married at the end of the day.

Oryx

Id go with what is being said here. I think some of your words and phrases are illustrating your anger and frustration, which otherwise you have been trying to play down in your posts. All this has been mentioned above, but if your wife is withdrawn, it could be because she is having a hard time absorbing the blame that has been given to her. It is very hard for anyone to accept when they may be in the wrong, and mostly when this happens, we come out fighting instead of admitting it could be the case.

If you want to fix your marriage, then you need to stop feeling that either your wife or you 'caused' the breakdown you are in now. Regardless of whats gone on or been said and done in the past. Nothing can be achieved if you keep raking over all that. It was a combination of both of you that brought you to this. Accusations will only build up resentment and anger on both sides.

Try and keep trying to talk to your wife without any anger or cornering. (which will push her further into a defensive stance) She can only row if you row back, so if it gets heated, refuse to react in the same way. Only talk if you are both calm. Tell her this, so she understands she needs to stay calm.

Maybe it will work. Maybe it wont. But talk talk talk is the only way to know.

WindSock

The counsellor may brought up some deep questions that hit home with your wife. She may need a bit more time to mull it over before she can take on a suggestion of going for personal counselling. She could be quite fragile inside, so having it out with an argument may not be the best way to go just yet. Perhaps wait another short while to see if she comes out of it? I know it must be terribly frustrating for you to be living with it.

estar

get a second opinion if you want

but tbh if she isnt open to change and your life together isnt happy
and you dont have kids (dont know if you do or not)

then why bother if she wont even engage?

this is what you have to decide

for better or for worse, but there is an implication that you work together
as a team in a relationship and think of the other person before yourself

you need to tell her that either she engages with the process or
she takes some space. anger comes from fear. she is terrified
of change and of facing her problems.

you cant force her to, all you can do is act in your own best interest
if she wont.

funloving

Communication is very important in a relation.
From what happened to 2 relatives of mine who were getting divorced I can say that what saved their marriage was something different.
They were trying to sort things out with counselling and therapy but they found a solution starting to do nice things together...
The quality time they spent reminded them how happy they could be and how much they love each other despite their differences.Then they began talking about those issues that made them fight a lot but this nice in a more genly an calm way,listening to each other and now they're happy again..

Hope it works out for you in a way or another.
Good luck