Vrt error?

Bluehair

Lets say, hypothetically speaking, the nice people at the vro office made a mistake when calculating your vrt payable by misreading the engine size (to a much lower one) and consequently slashing the vrt payable by thousands.

Lets imagine you, not realising the mistake, handed over the cash and drove off, put your new plates on the car and taxed it all up etc.

Insurance is properly informed of the real engine capacity and it is insured as such. Nct people don't seem to care, notice or comment.

Can the nice folk at the vro now come back and demand a bigger chunk of change if they realise their mistake (or i point it out? :rolleyes: ) or alternatively what if i, still hypothetically speaking of course, simply phone the tax office in a couple of months and advise them that i've swopped the motor to a much larger one and would like to keep the road tax accurate and legit?

(and before anyone asks it is purely hypothetical..... )

Seth Brundle

I would imagine they could!
Its tax so they can do what they like (putting it bluntly)!

Feelgood

Bluehair wrote: »

Lets say, hypothetically speaking, the nice people at the vro office made a mistake when calculating your vrt payable by misreading the engine size (to a much lower one) and consequently slashing the vrt payable by thousands.

When you get the Vechicle reg cert back, if it has the correct engine size and model type of your car say nout and have a good long laugh...

Otherwise you will have problems down the line, particularly if you have an accident or are trying to sell it....

Bluehair

Feelgood wrote: »

When you get the Vechicle reg cert back, if it has the correct engine size and model type of your car say nout and have a good long laugh...

Model type is correct but the vro don't appear to realise there is a newer version with the larger engine capacity, there is only one engine choice for the car.

Feelgood wrote: »

Otherwise you will have problems down the line, particularly if you have an accident or are trying to sell it....

Insurance are quite aware of the true engine capacity and it is insured for exactly what it is.

Has anyone ever had experience of changing the engine size for road tax purposes? I'd rather stay completly legit so while i'm happy the car is insured properly i'd rather not (still hypothetically speaking of course ) be driving around with a bigger engine than is on the tax disc.

Hence my 'engine swop' idea. I presume the road tax people couldn't care less if i want to pay more road tax (it would be the max actually) but would they raise an eye and start back tracking etc or would they simply hit a few buttons, take my credit card details and send out a new disc?

Biro

Hard to know really.... the V5 document states the engine cc's though, doesn't it? They just take it from that.

deegs

Bluehair wrote: »

Model type is correct but the vro don't appear to realise there is a newer version with the larger engine capacity, there is only one engine choice for the car.

right, which will lead to the "you knew but didnt say" senario.

Bluehair

Biro wrote: »

Hard to know really.... the V5 document states the engine cc's though, doesn't it? They just take it from that.

V5 is correct. Only one model in the vro system for this car though and it's the old one. Nice people in vro office didn't query any further. Not my place to tell them how to do their jobs.....

Feelgood

Bluehair wrote: »

Insurance are quite aware of the true engine capacity and it is insured for exactly what it is.

Right but if you have a smash and the Vech Reg Cert engine size is different to what you actually insured it for your fcuked...you won't get a penny...

Basically if your Vech Reg Cert actually matches the exact spec of your car your golden, otherwise I would go back to them.

Bluehair

Feelgood wrote: »

Right but if you have a smash and the Vech Reg Cert engine size is different to what you actually insured it for your fcuked...you won't get a penny...

Incorrect. I happen to know someone in the industry and phoned them immediately as i wouldn't drive with dodgy insurance under any circumstances. Essentially as long as the car is 'as described' in the policy statement then the insurance is valid. They don't particularly care if the car is even taxed in the first place never mind taxed correctly, the two simply aren't connected.

Henry Ford III

Interesting one this. If you present the car to the VRO with all the correct docs. incl. correct engine c.c. and they make an incorrect assessment I'd imagine it's ok.

However if you go on to tax the car on the basis of a knowingly incorrect VLC, you may be commiting a fraud.

Bluehair

Henry Ford III wrote: »

Interesting one this.

It is a bit isn't it

Henry Ford III wrote: »

If you present the car to the VRO with all the correct docs. incl. correct engine c.c. and they make an incorrect assessment I'd imagine it's ok.

I've brought a few cars in from the UK over the years and the vro tend to be pretty bullet proof about the well known scams so i was pretty surprised when the assessment came back. Like i said though it's not for me to tell them how to do their jobs everything was presented as it should be and the car was even inspected briefly.

Henry Ford III wrote: »

However if you go on to tax the car on the basis of a knowingly incorrect VLC, you may be commiting a fraud.

The thought has crossed my mind and since the car is properly insured i can't exactly claim i didn't realise the error at that point hence wanting to change the engine size offically to match what it actually is.

Ultimately what i'm getting at here is since the car is now offically on Irish plates if i simply now inform the motor tax office(i.e. not the vro) of the 'new' larger engine size would they happily comply and change the info or would they start phoning around. Being civil servants i'm kinda hoping the former in which case i'm home free as the car would be then on it's proper model type and engine size.

Has anyone done an engine swop and what was the proceedure with the motor tax people?

JHMEG

kbannon wrote: »

Its tax so they can do what they like (putting it bluntly)!

When you get a Tax Clearance Certificate they don't take it back.

OldmanMondeo

If the VLC has the correct engine size then you are ok. I presume you are taking about a 2.0 car VRO'd as say a 1.4. If the VLC (Log Book) states car as a 2.0 then smile and be happy, if, however, the VLC states the car as a 1.4, you will then need to change it for the correct road tax.

Guy:Incognito

I assume the VLC has an incorrect engine size on it?

I never read my insurance disc with more than a glance, is the CC of the car shown on it. If it is I'd imagine at some point a Gard at a checkpoint may notice the tax disc and insurance disc are showing different cc's and start checking things. Could cause problems. Plus a potential buyer is likely going to be wondering why the vlc is wrong and will most likely walk away thinking something is dodgy.

Lon

I changed my car a few months ago and have a similar thing.
Insurance wanted a copy of the VLC and they noticed that the cc was different (I never noticed) but it is insured as what it should be but my broker advides to get it corrected asap in case of any problems
Did a bit of digging and it turns out the cc on it related to the previous model.
Here is where it gets awkward - after many phone calls I went to the Tax Office (complete with a signed and stamped form filled in by a main dealer with what the cc should be) and they told me I would have to go to the VRT office to get the car checked. The car had been a brand new private import in 2002.
They basically said they would have to look at the original paperwork and I would be liable to pay any difference due even though I am a subsequent owner.
Luckily it had been Vrt'd correctly originally so I dont owe anything.
Checked with a mate who had worked in the motor trade and he confirmed that if there is any balance due it has to be paid by whoever owns it at the time

rebel.ranter

Lon, that is an interesting fact about subsequent owner's liability.
OP as much as it kills me to say it, the only way out orf this is to go back to the VRT & sort it out now, otherwise you could be creating problems for yourself down the line.

MercMad

I would simply get a main dealer to type a letter which shows what the engine, chassis and reg numbers are and stamp it.

You can then type a letter explaining that the original engine was swopped for a bigger one and you want to pay the correct rates for same.

Dont mention anything about having imported it, and if I were you I'd tax it at the current rate and possibly wait a few months before doing it.

Lon

Yes, I was amazed that I could possibly be liable.
Not sure the story with the OP but for me the engine is over 3.0 so makes no difference to the road tax.
There is a form on Revenue.ie that you can fill out to show engine changes and bring this along to get stamped by a main dealer.
I guess I could have done this but I thought that it would always show that the engine was changed which could affect trying to sell it on in the future.
The tax office did ask if mine had an engine change and when I said no then they sent me to the Vrt office - it might be easier to do I gues if you say the engine was changed.

Barr

I cant really see you having any dificulty with regard insurance.Your honestly declaring the engine size to them so you should have no further difficulty down the line.