[Eve] my eve experience !!!

Tyrant^

Ello

I tried eve a few months ago... Played it for a couple of weeks

Joined a corp we went on mining trips once or twice and that was fun... the missions I did seemed boring and repetitive... the missions were the same all the time and the scenery was also the same... I eventually quit the game after this as i couldnt find much more to the game except a boring grind for a better ship...

Today I see the new trinity expansion advertised everywhere... I really wanted to give this game a chance and I thought I did... But am I missing something did I forget to do something?? This is a game that really appeals to me cause of the sci-fi setting.

SO ... ! Im just trying to find out is there something I did wrong and is there any new really good gameplay features in new expansion...

Thanks!

R0ot

You didn't try the PVP side? Probably what your missing tbh

The Trinity expansion was really just an overhauled GFX engine with shiny ships, and a few new new classes.

Maddzy

As I always say to people who are trying out Eve, don't let the initial days in game fool you. This game is PvP based, it is not intended as a single player game, and the missions and mining aspects are a tiny part of something that is really huge. At the start, when you have no money, they are necessery, but as soon as you can fit a frigate for combat you should get into the pvp asap because thats what the game is about.

My advise to you is to join a pvp based corp, perhaps an empire "griefing" corp, and engage in some light pvp with a frigate class ship. They are cheap so don't worry about losing it, just get in there and have fun. Even a 2 week old character can be an importent part of a pvp gang in the Tackler role, as it is the least skill and cash intensive, so research and ask questions about how you can help by being a tackler.

Reku

Well I'd discourage joining a griefer corp since lets face it they're just jerks who's only pleasure in life is ruining other peoples' fun, rather a sad existance....
However there are many, many, PVP corps, who regularly wardec other corps and make fleet ops into red space (non-empire, PvP space) and loads of whom have permanent bases in red space that always need more defenders or players to raid neighbouring corporation's bases.

Also you were probably doing lv 1 missions for the trial, as you do higher level missions they get much harder. Different agent types give different mission types too, with some (e.g. manufacturing) giving mostly courier missions (take x to station y) and others (e.g. security) giving mostly PvE missions.

Zillah

farohar wrote: »

Well I'd discourage joining a griefer corp since lets face it they're just jerks who's only pleasure in life is ruining other peoples' fun, rather a sad existance....

What exactly do you think the purpose of PVP is? To make the other guy sigh in satisfaction and wish you luck?

Reku

Zillah wrote: »

What exactly do you think the purpose of PVP is? To make the other guy sigh in satisfaction and wish you luck?

PvP and griefing are very different things, PvP is a skill and only happens if you agree to it, griefing is using the game mechanics to ruin other people's game experience.

http://www.eve-online.com/faq/faq_12.asp wrote:

A grief player, or "griefer," is a player who devotes much of his time to making others’ lives miserable, in a large part deriving his enjoyment of the game from these activities. Grief tactics are the mechanics a griefer will utilize to antagonize other players.

This should not be confused with standard conflict that might arise between two players. At our discretion, players who are found to be consistently maliciously interfering with the game experience for others may receive a warning, temporary suspension or permanent banning of his account.

Zillah

We are totally griefing Bob to be honest.

farohar wrote:

PvP is a skill and only happens if you agree to it

If by "agree to it" you mean "ever undock from station"...

Reku

Zillah wrote: »

We are totally griefing Bob to be honest.



If by "agree to it" you mean "ever undock from station"...

Tut, tut...


As to undocking from station being an agreement to partake in PvP, only really if your corp/alliance has been wardeced or you're in redspace, otherwise as long as you don't encounter any griefers who'll either use the suicide gank (why CCP haven't fixed this I don't know, there are enough forum posts complaining about it and all it'd need would be to have losing a ship to concorde invalidate the insurance policy, you'd still get the odd instance where the transport was carrying an obscene amount of wealth in items, but it'd be much, much rarer) to attack or tricking you into allowing them to legally attack you shouldn't have to give so much as a second thought to it. But yup, in theory undocking puts you at risk, I actually know one player who claims to have undocked for the first time in months the other night, he seems to make his isk playing the market.

Maddzy

farohar wrote: »

.... griefers who'll either use the suicide gank......to attack or tricking you into allowing them to legally attack you ....

By "Grief" corp I meant a corp who war decs bigger alliances in Empire and fights them in fair pvp engagements. This is a good way for new players to train themselves in PVP. I did NOT mean some pussy pricks who can bait noobs or "trick" players into pvp.

Also I've never heard the term "redspace" before, do you mean low-sec or 0.0?

Reku

Maddzy wrote: »

By "Grief" corp I meant a corp who war decs bigger alliances in Empire and fights them in fair pvp engagements. This is a good way for new players to train themselves in PVP. I did NOT mean some pussy pricks who can bait noobs or "trick" players into pvp.

Also I've never heard the term "redspace" before, do you mean low-sec or 0.0?

Ah, I'd simply consider those PvP corps, no problems with them, though I know some who do:rolleyes:, as lets face it you get 24hrs warning to refit your ships accordingly or to simply sit in station until it blows over. So while I can understand it might upset a player's schedule and does tend to put a halt to recruiting new members it's just a nuisance if you play sensibly, fun if you decide to use it for some PvP action yourself (in a jump clone though!).

Redspace = anything below 0.5, so low sec and 0.0, basically anywhere you're definitely fair game for shooting at without a wardec or an aggression timer.
0.5 = yellowspace
>0.5 = greenspace

Ry

Are Pirates Griefers then in your opinion farohar?

Reku

Ry wrote: »

Are Pirates Griefers then in your opinion farohar?

Pirates as in rats (npc enemies) or as in players who hunt in redspace?
The rats have no sentient thought and do not use trickery to ruin gameplay, players who hunt in redspace do not usually use it either and since you've entered redspace you've effectively aggreed to the possible PvP combat that may result while in redspace.

Sand

You agreed to PvP when you logged in tbh, nowhere is or should be safe. Theres no such thing as PvP space, and you shouldnt give new players the wrong idea about that. They need to know that they can be ganked anywhere, anytime if theyre sloppy and give people the chance and motive.

does tend to put a halt to recruiting new members

Meh by the time the war dec goes in theyve got their spy alt in already. War decs were great for filtering out the high SP, low IQ idiots and station jockeys though.

Oh and advice for the new guy - youre caldari, so get skills for a Caracal/Drake and use it for missioning/ratting to make ISK. Take that ISK and train for something small, fun, and useful for PvP like a interceptor/interdictor so you can offer something to PvP corps [ most guys are costantly moving up roles in gangs/fleets, leaving slots to be filled by new people].

Listen and learn from them - 80% of what they say will be opinionated bull**** and nostalgia, the other 20% will be vaguely useful at some point. Grow into whatever ships/roles seem interesting & fun to you - Rohk fleet ships, Torp Ravens for close up gankery, Scorpion/Falcon jammers, Cerebus for passable nano gangs, Vulture to help give bonuses to your gangmates etc etc. Check out the different races too before you commit to one line of ships. I crossed trained from Caldari to Gallente, but if roaming gangs are more fun for you its hard to beat Minmitar ships like the Vagabond.

Your corp choice is important, make sure theyre focused on what you think is interesting and that their attitudes are decent. Starting corp can determine if you stick with the game and get past the first 6-7 months, or give up.

R0ot

Every time you enter your username and password and click connect you are agreeing to the possibility of you being shot or you shooting someone and one of you end up dying. This isn't Hello Kitty Online ya know

Reku

Sand wrote: »

You agreed to PvP when you logged in tbh, nowhere is or should be safe. Theres no such thing as PvP space, and you shouldnt give new players the wrong idea about that. They need to know that they can be ganked anywhere, anytime if theyre sloppy and give people the chance and motive.

The problem being that there is no fair warning given as to the various methods of griefing. CCP claim that can-baiting in starter systems will result in a suspension yet there's regularly cans with stuff in them just sitting outside the station (it seems to be a permanent fixture in most systems), and I seriously doubt it's because there's some generous soul leaving stuff there to help out the newbies.
And if by ganking you mean suicide ganking many players consider this an exploit and are requesting that something be done about it since the idea behind concorde "providing consequences" is void when the players can actually readily make profit from such actions.

Sand wrote: »

Meh by the time the war dec goes in theyve got their spy alt in already. War decs were great for filtering out the high SP, low IQ idiots and station jockeys though.

Which is why any decent alliance requires all recent members to also be kicked until after the war.:rolleyes:

kyp_durron

Everytime you log in to the game you concent to pvp ... This isn't Hello Kitty Online ... suicide ganking ss a exploit .. same **** different thread

kyp_durron

farohar wrote: »

The problem being that there is no fair warning given as to the various methods of griefing. CCP claim that can-baiting in starter systems will result in a suspension yet there's regularly cans with stuff in them just sitting outside the station (it seems to be a permanent fixture in most systems), and I seriously doubt it's because there's some generous soul leaving stuff there to help out the newbies.
And if by ganking you mean suicide ganking many players consider this an exploit and are requesting that something be done about it since the idea behind concorde "providing consequences" is void when the players can actually readily make profit from such actions.

For all the above to work it requires your target to be a complete retard. If you have played the game long enough to lose something worth while to can baiting in a noob system then you must have ****ing brain damage or be inbred. If anything they get thought some important game mechanics (Should have joined Eve Uni anyway, then they would never have lost that Bantam). There have been a million and one whine threads about Suicide ganking, mostly, if not all by people who like to think they can auto pilot their t1 frig with officer/faction mods in their cargo through the Jita/Amarr pipe. These are the people that consider it an exploit. **** those people is what I say and it seems CCP agree cause they haven't called it as a exploit after all these years.

farohar wrote: »

Which is why any decent alliance requires all recent members to also be kicked until after the war.:rolleyes:

What the christ, seriously?:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Fake Edit: forgot the rolleyes emot :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Reku

kyp_durron wrote: »

For all the above to work it requires your target to be a complete retard. If you have played the game long enough to lose something worth while to can baiting in a noob system then you must have ****ing brain damage or be inbred. If anything they get thought some important game mechanics (Should have joined Eve Uni anyway, then they would never have lost that Bantam).

New players will not be aware of Eve university and should not have to join any specific corp, or even join a corp for that matter, in order to be made aware of the pathetic playstyle of some others. For a new player every last isk is important and the loss of a ship that costs a few k can be a major set back, do you want a closed off game where no-one new joins in to play?
Then there's the issue as to if it's the loss is supposed to not be worth while to the new player who only just started then whatever salvage the griefer gets is definitely not worth while to them => clearly the only point to it is to put the new player off playing. If I went up to a 5 year old, lure them somewhere with a load of chocolate and beat the crap out of them to get their pocket money I could argue that they

must have ****ing brain damage or be inbred

for falling for it, still clearly a ****ty thing to do since the amount would be meaningless to me yet mean a lot to the kid and it's picking on someone who hasn't a hope of defending themselves against me since I'm bigger and stronger (better ship and more skils in the case of Eve).

kyp_durron wrote: »

There have been a million and one whine threads about Suicide ganking, mostly, if not all by people who like to think they can auto pilot their t1 frig with officer/faction mods in their cargo through the Jita/Amarr pipe. These are the people that consider it an exploit. **** those people is what I say and it seems CCP agree cause they haven't called it as a exploit after all these years.

Joining alliances simply to escape wardecs, and then quitting them has also been around for a VERY long time and yet was only recently declared an exploit so the fact that CCP haven't yet done so for suicide ganking doesn't mean a thing. Since this prevented PvP corps from being feasible in Empire space it's a good thing, and as I said you get 24hrs warning to find somewhere to sit low or refit your ship accordingly anyway so wardecs tend to just be a nuisance IMO.

If someone manages to bait me fair enough, I've been around long enough to know the story, but then lets face it the people who fall for it are usually new with only a minority of more experienced players letting themselves get duped so such griefplay is really targetting the newer players.

kyp_durron

farohar wrote: »

New players will not be aware of Eve university and should not have to join any specific corp, or even join a corp for that matter, in order to be made aware of the pathetic playstyle of some others. For a new player every last isk is important and the loss of a ship that costs a few k can be a major set back, do you want a closed off game where no-one new joins in to play?

No, a ship that cost a few k can not be a 'major setback' for ****sake, thats just nonsense. I was about 2 days old when I learned that taking from other peoples cans flagged you, it's not ****ing rocket science. Also what's that **** about a closed off game, the amount of subs have risen exponentially the past year.

farohar wrote: »

If I went up to a 5 year old, lure them somewhere with a load of chocolate and beat the crap out of them to get their pocket money I could argue that they for falling for it, still clearly a ****ty thing to do since the amount would be meaningless to me yet mean a lot to the kid and it's picking on someone who hasn't a hope of defending themselves against me since I'm bigger and stronger (better ship and more skils in the case of Eve).

That's a terrible analogy. This is not RL, and applying your RL morals and ethics to Eve is stupid. It's a sandpit, you can be what you want to be and do what you want to do. You don't own anything in Eve, it's the proptery of CCP and you have no god given right to expect to it be kept safe.

farohar wrote: »

Joining alliances simply to escape wardecs, and then quitting them has also been around for a VERY long time and yet was only recently declared an exploit so the fact that CCP haven't yet done so for suicide ganking doesn't mean a thing. Since this prevented PvP corps from being feasible in Empire space it's a good thing, and as I said you get 24hrs warning to find somewhere to sit low or refit your ship accordingly anyway so wardecs tend to just be a nuisance IMO.

If someone manages to bait me fair enough, I've been around long enough to know the story, but then lets face it the people who fall for it are usually new with only a minority of more experienced players letting themselves get duped so such griefplay is really targetting the newer players.

I remember a dev saying that they don't plan to change it and saying they liked the idea that you could suicide gank, I will try and find a link later. New players don't get suicide ganked. They dont have the items expensive enough for it to be worth their while.

Part of Eves appeal is that it's a harsh universe, it's what set's it apart from other MMO's. If people like you got their way it seems like we would be playing WOW in space and that is not a good thing. I'm sure most Eve players would tend to agree.

Reku

kyp_durron wrote: »

No, a ship that cost a few k can not be a 'major setback' for ****sake, thats just nonsense. I was about 2 days old when I learned that taking from other peoples cans flagged you, it's not ****ing rocket science. Also what's that **** about a closed off game, the amount of subs have risen exponentially the past year.

A ship that cost a few K CAN be a major setback for a new player since a few k is all you start with and due to what funds & the kind of skill selection you start with you are very much just trying to scrape together funds to get better stuff and skills. Just because a few K, perhaps even a few mil is no big thing for you don't go assuming that all players should also feel the same.
"closed off game", as all the new players have such bad experiences in the trial time that they couldn't be bothered to pay a subscription (have encountered quite a few of these).

kyp_durron wrote: »

That's a terrible analogy. This is not RL,

Which is the only reason why it's not a good analogy, people feel it's ok hide behind the anonymity of the internet so they can bully others as they are detached from the event as they don't witness how the other person reacts & feels about it.

kyp_durron wrote: »

and applying your RL morals and ethics to Eve is stupid. It's a sandpit, you can be what you want to be and do what you want to do. You don't own anything in Eve, it's the proptery of CCP and you have no god given right to expect to it be kept safe.

Just as you've no right to expect the service to continue if the flow of new players is stopped simply because some pathetic people need to pick on players who haven't a hope of defending themselves against them just to feel big. Heck for all you know the person piloting that little frigate may in fact be some 5 year old kid who's now wondering where his ship went and what he did wrong, highly unlikely but still possible.

kyp_durron wrote: »

I remember a dev saying that they don't plan to change it and saying they liked the idea that you could suicide gank, I will try and find a link later. New players don't get suicide ganked. They dont have the items expensive enough for it to be worth their while.

Part of Eves appeal to me is that it's a harsh universe, it's what set's it apart from other MMO's. If people like you got their way it seems like we would be playing WOW in space and that is not a good thing. I'm sure most Eve players would tend to agree.

Fixed that for you. Being in a corp that's mostly in empire space and recruiting from there, as well as having read many posts on forums for Eve and for the other games I've played I can tell you that the griefing does put many people off Eve. Perhaps that is a significant part of the reason why as MMOs go it has a very small number of subscribers.
As to if most Eve players would agree, if that were so why are there regular complaints about the game being top heavy, in that most players are sticking to empire space, where the universe is less "harsh"? Also why are there entire alliances who's uniting ethos is that they are anti-grief-play?
And WoW and Eve are VERY different games, even on the PvP WoW servers the games have little in common.

Canis Lupus

It's a game. If the rules allow it then you do it if you feel like it. I would have thought it was quite simple really.....

Reku

Canis Lupus wrote: »

It's a game. If the rules allow it then you do it if you feel like it. I would have thought it was quite simple really.....

Except that CCP have gone on the record as saying that can baiting in starter systems is not allowed and that excessive grief-play tactics will result in disciplinary actions, so clearly, while the game mechanics may allow it, the rules do not:

http://support.eve-online.com/Pages/KB/Article.aspx?id=336
Grief play
What is grief play?



A grief player, or "griefer," is a player who devotes much of his time to making others’ lives miserable, in a large part deriving his enjoyment of the game from these activities while he does not profit from it in any way. Grief tactics are the mechanics a griefer will utilize to antagonize other players.
This should not be confused with standard conflict that might arise between two players. At our discretion, players who are found to be consistently maliciously interfering with the game experience for others may receive a warning, temporary suspension or permanent banning of his account.


An example of grief play would be the so called "Can baiting" in starter systems. An experienced player drops a cargo container with some items in front of a station in a starter system and waits for a new player to take from it. The new player is flagged and promptly attacked and killed by the owner of the container. Doing the same in starter tutorial complexes is also considered grief play and will not be tolerated.

Zillah

Suicide ganking is only ever going to happen to someone who's stupid enough to think they can autopilot in a frigate/destroyer with very very valuable cargo. If it happens them more than once then they're complete retards who deserve to die repeatedly.

Reku

Zillah wrote: »

If it happens them more than once then they're complete retards who deserve to die repeatedly.

Well other than the word "retards":p, I'd pretty much agree, if you can't learn from your mistakes then you're dead meat in Eve. So yeah, "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me" is pretty apt here.

Have a corp mate who even after all the enemies in a mission have closed to within ~40KM he still insists on warping to zero everytime and yet can't understand why this makes the mission much harder for him.:(

kyp_durron

farohar wrote: »

Well other than the word "retards":p, I'd pretty much agree, if you can't learn from your mistakes then you're dead meat in Eve. So yeah, "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me" is pretty apt here.

Have a corp mate who even after all the enemies in a mission have closed to within ~40KM he still insists on warping to zero everytime and yet can't understand why this makes the mission much harder for him.:(

I ****ing said the exact same thing as Zillah did there earlier in this thread. Now it seems you 'pretty much agree'. Not the responce I got. I've had it with you. One v One Nonni 8pm. Battleships. I'm gonna rip you a new one mother****er. It's on now.

mamolian

You know.. I've never once heard of CCP enforcing that rule.. I can understand the starter systems being offlimits .. at least in some ways.. But I've never once heard of anyone even being warned for griefing..

kyp_durron

mamolian wrote: »

You know.. I've never once heard of CCP enforcing that rule.. I can understand the starter systems being offlimits .. at least in some ways.. But I've never once heard of anyone even being warned for griefing..

I'm sick of your **** Mamo. Frigates. Amarr local 9pm. It's on now mother****er.

Sand

The problem being that there is no fair warning given as to the various methods of griefing. CCP claim that can-baiting in starter systems will result in a suspension yet there's regularly cans with stuff in them just sitting outside the station (it seems to be a permanent fixture in most systems), and I seriously doubt it's because there's some generous soul leaving stuff there to help out the newbies.

Meh, Im a strong believer that the splash screen on EVEs first loadup should be "Dont take from the ****ing can you tool!" Anyway, dont they get a criminal flag warning when they steal from the can? Its on by default.

Worst come to worst, they undock in their noob frigate, steal, get wasted and receive a valuable lesson. Would it be better to get their first introduction to can baiting when theyre in their first, hard earned BC? Thats when theyd quit if they were going to. If they quit on losing their noob frigate, well okay, close the door behind you.

Which is why any decent alliance requires all recent members to also be kicked until after the war.

Dont have to kick all of them, just kick the spy tbh. Theyre not hard to spot. Its just some gimp on the other side of a monitor, not the CIA.

New players will not be aware of Eve university

Which is a shame, be good for CCP to include a reference to the work they do so new players can get a good introduction to the game.

Being in a corp that's mostly in empire space and recruiting from there, as well as having read many posts on forums for Eve and for the other games I've played I can tell you that the griefing does put many people off Eve. Perhaps that is a significant part of the reason why as MMOs go it has a very small number of subscribers.

Id say the reason is that EVE isnt some tired derivative of UO - no furries, no dance moves, no "opt-out" from PvP, no level grinding etc etc. EVEs different from WOW and its clones, it doesnt appeal to a mass audience, thats not a bad thing.

If I went up to a 5 year old, lure them somewhere with a load of chocolate and beat the crap out of them to get their pocket money I could argue that they

How do you know it isnt a 5 year old can baiting noobs outside the starter station tbh?

As to if most Eve players would agree, if that were so why are there regular complaints about the game being top heavy, in that most players are sticking to empire space, where the universe is less "harsh"? Also why are there entire alliances who's uniting ethos is that they are anti-grief-play?

Probably because empire war dec corps need soft, lazy targets that dont take responsibility for their own security and assume Concord will protect them from their own failings? Empire is the safest space in the game, but its not safe. A player whose smart, plans ahead and doesnt take silly chances will need to be very unlucky to get suicide ganked in or near Jita. Some players refuse to take those steps and get put out when theyre punished. If you give someone the motive [ loot!] and opportunity [AFK autopilot in untanked ship] to gank you, then they will. Thats part of EVEs appeal.

mamolian

Ok frigates at dawn.. Send you home in a new clone Just like Rive and Kilona :cool: Building up quite the irish corpse action figure set

Coranor, spyra gyra, Mr Rive, Kilona :laffo:

BillyCom

farohar wrote: »

Except that CCP have gone on the record as saying that can baiting in starter systems is not allowed and that excessive grief-play tactics will result in disciplinary actions, so clearly, while the game mechanics may allow it, the rules do not:

Anyone here ever heard of a corp called 'The Really Awesome Players'? [TRAPS]. They're pretty much the kings of empire griefing in Eve. Their ceo has a website where he writes stories about his wars in Eve, often boasting when their targets leave the game permanently.

kyp_durron

BillyCom wrote: »

Anyone here ever heard of a corp called 'The Really Awesome Players'? [TRAPS]. They're pretty much the kings of empire griefing in Eve. Their ceo has a website where he writes stories about his wars in Eve, often boasting when their targets leave the game permanently.

Yeah I have, worked with them once to kill a target (Crimson Federation). Nexa then wanted to interview me for a article, but I am dumb and inarticulate v:ov

He does seem to take the moral high ground in all his wars though.

BillyCom

kyp_durron wrote: »

Yeah I have, worked with them once to kill a target (Crimson Federation). Nexa then wanted to interview me for a article, but I am dumb and inarticulate v:ov

He does seem to take the moral high ground in all his wars though.

Yeah, I'm actually a member of the corp that started the whole Crimson incident which shall remain nameless on these boards I'm sure you recall the 800 cap charger theft incident.

After reading his story re. that particular campaign, he seems to tend to exaggerate things. He constantly referred to being up against a '180 man corp'. Bullsh*t, he had a spy in the corp a while after the war started.

He knew our original ceo had indiscriminatly recruited by spamming local chat. about 3/4s of the listed members were long term inactives, but he failed to mention this in this story. In fact during the war, we rarely had more than half a dozen actives online at any one time.

There was a new ceo appointed a while before the war started, this guy had a close family death so he wasnt online for the first couple of weeks and hence we never figured the reason for the wardec. (Nexa seems to just email the ceo right after the war dec goes out)

Then the spy trys to stir things up on our internal forums by claiming that the ceo is 'hiding info' and trying to scam us somehow. Then he accuses him of making up his RL problems just to avoid logging in during the war. His spy alt even started sh*t stiring by Pming me in game and claiming the other corp members were smacking him on chat while I wasn't logged, which was total bo***cks as it turned out.

After reading the eve pirate story, he mentions our corp and its 'outrageous smack' - strangely he doesn't highlight the fact he's posting corp internal chats logs.

Only good thing for me about the war is they didn't seem to bother probing me out when I was running missions in low sec placid. They rarely seem to try to gank their targets in low sec systems for some reason, plus the fact most of their kills seem to be achieved when I'm asleep, most of them are US west coast players afaik.

Ok, sorry for the borefest, but just letting you know that there was a lot of exaggeration in that story, so I wouldn't be surprised if he stretches the truth in his other compositions. We have new management now, and the corp is selective about recruitment and removes anyone inactive over 6 weeks. No war decs since that war ended and things are going well.

mamolian

BillyCom wrote: »

I'm sure you recall the 800 cap charger theft incident.

Thanks i needed that laugh.