13yr old wants laptop

DinoBot

Hi,

My 13 yrs old son has been asking for his own laptop now for the last few months. But myself and my wife are unsure. Our main concerns would be that he would be on it all the time in his room and have less and less need for interaction with the rest of the family.
But isn't that a bit of what being a teenager is all about ? Are we just being old fashioned by not getting one ?

Has anyone experience with this ? Whats your thoughts on this ?

SarahMc

Children should not have laptops in their rooms (but then again, I believe children should not have TV in their room).

Computers, like TVs, should be in a family space where content can be monitored. You could get him a laptop (big pressie though, surely he should wait until Christmas, unless of course its his own money?), but have basic ground rules.

plonk

I would say no to the laptop, but tell him he can build a home pc and you can help him and put it in the living room. Its a comprimise but i dont think he would need a laptop till hes at least 17.

Also it will teach him how to build pcs and will be pretty cool

greenkittie

Laptops can be a more social thing than a PC which would mean that he would be sitting facing the wall with his back to everyone. With a laptop he can sit with it on his knee and interact with the family whilst using it. Get him the laptop just only allow its usage in the living room.

mukki

when i was 13 i got a pair of jeans and a fry-up for my birthday

starn

No

legs11

when i was 13 i would be lucky to get a digital watch

i would say no to laptop, it could be that if you got him a laptop he will become anti social, he is just 13 and there is many many years left for a laptop.

by all means get a desktop for family use if not already done.

17/18 is old enough for a laptop....;)


* goes back to my xps

Susannahmia

No way think of all the weird porn and chat rooms he could have access to! 13 year olds are capable of getting around filtering software.

Rev Hellfire

There's certainly no reason not to give him a laptop if you are prepared to police it a bit, for example a lot of routers can limit access to within particular times.

Its certainly not significantly worse than a 13 year old having a telly in their bedroom.

That said having them use the family PC (assuming there is one) is preferable in that they will be less likely to use sites of a less than acceptable nature.

egan007

Get the laptop if you can afford it but make a deal.
It comes with conditions.

Something like, only 3 nights a week including weekends.
It stays in the Kitchen when he's going to bed.
You get to check it out every so often.
It comes with any software you say - i.e net nanny etc...

This way you can, minimise the risk of exposure to things you don't want him seeing on the net. He has time for other things. He might be the next bill gates and you might nourish a talent.

The main point i'm making is that you don't have to break for him but you can bend.
If this is the course you take You as much as Him need to follow the rules.

High&Low

Like what egan007 said, I agree that if you limit access and have some net nanny type software and carry out a bit of snooping yourself, there is nothing wrong with them having a laptop.

DinoBot

Thanks for the replies,

He only wants one because he feels he cant get on the family PC because he has a younger brother who also plays on it.

I suppose my biggest concern is not just the social aspect but the fact he is ONLY 13. I dont think its good to get everything you want at that age. But is that just being old ?
I recall my dad saying "all I got when I was your age was a spoon of jam, and I was glad of it" :D

x in the city

I didnt even get a spoon of jam,:p

buy him a laptop with linux

he might learn something then.

Nevyn

Well why not scheule the time so that they both get a fair share of the family pc ?

My 9 year old has been asking for a laptop, he has a pc which he can use in a room that is supervised but wants a laptop as he knows he is not allowed a pc in his room.

I would suggest you have a long hard think about what may happen as he grows older and has the laptop to himself.

Also it is an expensive item and I don't agree with kids getting everything they want,
personally i would be more inclinded to spend the money on a bike for him or building another low end pc to net work with the one that is still there.

the_syco

Man... I got (well, family got) a 386 when I was around that age. Didn't have broadband then, only dial-up. Also, no internet at the time, only Bulletin Boards. Still went through the entire thing looking for porn:cool:

Now, I only have to go onto google, type porn, and I can get anything.

My advice: either get a sh|t slow notebook (Vista, with 512MB RAM is sh|t slow), or get him a bicycle.

metrovelvet

Thirteen is different now than when I was [and probably you were] thirteen. But even then I remember privaleged children having their own televisions with cable, their own phones, etc in their rooms. By children, I mean children, as in 9 year olds.

It is not unusual for teen agers to have their own pcs, laptops whatever. My main concern, would not only be access OTHERS have to the child on various websites, but how sedentary your thirteen year old would become with it, and how it would discourage him or her from getting enough excersize.

paulksnn

One option that I haven't seen mentioned is to get him the laptop, but remove any wireless router in the house. This leaves him free to play games or whatever, but without any access to the internet, unless he comes down stair and uses a cable to connect directly to the router.

Scheduled access on the family PC might be an idea alright, but Net Nanny or a free version called Naomi http://www.radiance.m6.net/ is a must.

You yourself must get up to speed on all things to do with MSN messenger and all similar programs. You need to be able to enable logging, and check the logs, as well as spot gaps in the logs, if the 13 year old figures out how to disable logging.

dame

Let him and his younger brother learn a bit of give and take and how to compromise and share the family PC. There is already computer and internet access in the house. Giving the kids their own laptops (the 9 year old would expect his own too in a couple of years) is neither necessary nor desirable.

He shouldn't actually need a laptop (in my very honest opinion) until he's in 3rd year of college and even then he could easily do without (use computer rooms in college and family PC). I'm not long out of college so I do know what I'm talking about with that.

ExpectantMum

haha thats nothing my lil 8 year old brother was askin for one for christmas just gone.. needless to say he didnt get it...

A lot of 13y olds get laptops... theres a secondary school near me that give out grants for laptops.

But again, i wouldnt suggest geting hm one because there will b no way of monitoring what he is going on.

My lil bro got a psp instead... but did u kno u can get internet acess on the psp??? we didnt wen we got it for him... had to block it off all together cos theres no way of filtering the content on it.

Deliverance

DinoBot wrote: »

Thanks for the replies,

He only wants one because he feels he cant get on the family PC because he has a younger brother who also plays on it.

I suppose my biggest concern is not just the social aspect but the fact he is ONLY 13. I dont think its good to get everything you want at that age. But is that just being old ?
I recall my dad saying "all I got when I was your age was a spoon of jam, and I was glad of it" :D

I would only let my kid have a laptop if i thought that it was of some kind of benefit to them in some way educationally in the technological sense. And even then it would be purely under supervision at that age.

The best scenario in this case would be to have the desktop and laptop side by side in the room for both kids to use under adult supervision (that should be the condition and rules made before purchase 'if expense is not an issue').

I bet they will still fight over who uses what though. But at least they will get the benefit of both technologies for their own future usability of said technologies, potentially for college work and so on.

The tech is great, the using of these technologies for the right purposes under supervision by adults for kids at an early age is very important. So buying a laptop could be beneficial.

Your in a position at the moment which is negotiable, and teens appreciate negotiation. Negotiate some rules before the buying of the laptop and re-adress the terms in the event of any arguments after the event and your sorted.

So my view is: yes get a laptop but only after setting some serious ground rules (tis all about tactics).

dame

Deliverance wrote: »

at least they will get the benefit of both technologies for their own future usability of said technologies, potentially for college work and so on.

?
Am I missing something here? How different is working a laptop from working a PC?

Don't worry. He'll be well able to use a computer when he goes to college, whether he gets a laptop or not.

Nevyn

Laptops can be picked up and moved to anywhere in the house or out of the house a lot easier then a pc.

Deliverance

dame wrote: »

?
Am I missing something here? How different is working a laptop from working a PC?

Don't worry. He'll be well able to use a computer when he goes to college, whether he gets a laptop or not.

Tis all about tactics in the family sense and the question asked I guess. Your right about the working from one to the other but I feel it would be no harm to have experience of both in the technological experiential sense at a young age.

dame

Deliverance wrote: »

Your right about the working from one to the other but I feel it would be no harm to have experience of both in the technological experiential sense at a young age.

The technology is the same. One simply comes in a smaller all-in-one package with a battery, which is more easily transported.


OP, how long do your sons spend on the computer? Why is there such a problem of access? Surely an hour or so each per evening would be plenty of time on it?

Deliverance

dame wrote: »

The technology is the same. One simply comes in a smaller all-in-one package with a battery, which is more easily transported.


OP, how long do your sons spend on the computer? Why is there such a problem of access? Surely an hour or so each per evening would be plenty of time on it?

OP might also benefit by the simple networking of the two 'simple' technologies. Kind of adds another dimension to the mix. The siblings might enjoy doing this / or not. No harm to see how it goes though. And a good learning experience to boot which would be no harm.

dame

Deliverence, do you sell laptops/computers by any chance?

Deliverance

dame wrote: »

Deliverence, do you sell laptops/computers by any chance?

Why, do you want to buy one? Get you good deal, not many sheckles, you buy?;)

Nevyn

please don't be dragging the thread of topic with banter with a post who is currently banned.

Deliverance

Thaedydal wrote: »

please don't be dragging the thread of topic with banter with a post who is currently banned.

?

rainbowtrout

dame wrote: »

Let him and his younger brother learn a bit of give and take and how to compromise and share the family PC. There is already computer and internet access in the house. Giving the kids their own laptops (the 9 year old would expect his own too in a couple of years) is neither necessary nor desirable.

He shouldn't actually need a laptop (in my very honest opinion) until he's in 3rd year of college and even then he could easily do without (use computer rooms in college and family PC). I'm not long out of college so I do know what I'm talking about with that.

+1
I don't really see why a laptop or any other computer needs to be purchased at all. I don't agree with giving children everything they ask for, especially expensive items like laptops. There is no real need for it, just a very expensive want.

Surely they would be better off in the long run learning to share the PC that already exists, or having an allocated time on it. It seems ludicrous to me to even contemplate buying a laptop just so a child can use it for internet/games. Because realisitically that's all they will use it for. Learning to share is a much better lesson in the long run and it also solves the issue of supervision of time spent on the computer when the current PC is in a room where they can be supervised.

di11on

Our 4 year old has a laptop - a very old one that I got from work which had been retired from service. She is only allowed use it in the living room and we have a predefined list of shortcuts she can use. She's only allowed use it once every other day, and that in place of TV (she can watch TV, or use the laptop once every other day). She only plays very simple flash numeracy and literacy games... uptoten.com is a fun site also. The good thing about it is the laptop is so old it doesn't have wireless access, so she has to use the wired ethernet connection in the living room.

There are two aspects to this which need to be dealt with seperately in my opinion:

Useage: I would definitely confine usage to a common living area and I would back this up with firewall/router restrictions limiting access. I presume the OP isn't even considering allowing unrestricted access?

Magnitude:A laptop is a HUGE present! That's obviously for a parent to decide if that's an issue or not. You could mitigate this by buying a second hand one or an old model. I had a computer (Amstrad 464!!!!!) when I was 13. A budget laptop today wouldn't be a million miles away from that in terms of the size of the present. I'm not sure I agree with other posters saying it's too big a present. A budget laptop wouldn't cost much more than an X-box 360 or a PS3... could even be cheaper.

dazftw

13 is a bit young.. When I was 15 - 19(19 now) I had a pc I spent all my home time in my room cause I had what I needed in the room games/internet/msn/music/movies.. When I look back on it.. it was a waste to spend all that time while I could have spent it with my mother at times like for dinner lol I use to bring my dinner to my room! but hey I didnt turn out to be a loner headcase and i learned more from the computer than I did in school! Anyone else have this lol?

but then again from 10 up there basically adults they want new hair. ears pierced etc etc if you must give it to him do it in moderation! I remember being that age wanting that stuff! Do you know why? Cause every other kid had it, but it my day it was like a PS2 lol

Explosive_Cornflake

I only finished a computer sceince degree last year,and I didn't have a laptop until I was in 3rd year. I'd be worried about what he could get up to. As mentioned before, at 13 he can probably get around any safe guards. I know i could of, and kids seem to know more these days.

di11on

Explosive_Cornflake wrote: »

...As mentioned before, at 13 he can probably get around any safe guards. I know i could of, and kids seem to know more these days.

That's why you need a double barrelled solution:

1. Hardware and software safeguards and
2. Confine useage to a common living area.

Without 1 and 2, a laptop is an absolute no no for me.

I suppose you can have most of the benefits and fewer of the risks if you went with a dekstop pc. I suppose there isn't any need for a 13 year old to have their own laptop. They can do all they want with a dekstop. The things they can do with a laptop they can't do with a desktop, you probably don't want them doing!!!

DinoBot

well we have decided not to get him the laptop.

Thanks for the replies. I was against getting one in the first place but I wasn't sure if I was being "old" in my decision, but after reading the replies I know I'm not
My concerns are valid.

So we told him not to even ask again until he is 16 (at least it gives us a bit of breathing space) He was okay with it. I think its the idea of getting something new rather than the actual thing itself that kids like !!

Victor

I would say no, too young, too expensive and you won't be able to 100% control it. What happens if it is removed from the house?

One teenager was allowed a laptop if they put a real effort into studying fo the Junior Cert (effort rewarded, not results as such).

Demonique

Tell him he can have a lap top if he pays for it himself

mackydacky07

This Is My Opinion.

The internet and computers are a perfect learning tool.

I always had a PC in my house from the early days of MSDOS for all those computer nerds out there.

If he wants a laptop tell him, yes he can have one if he pays for half of it. Obviously say to him, get one that isnt too expensive, maybe €600.00 so if he destroys it, it won't be as annoying as if it is a €1,000 pc, however still show him the value of money. He should pay half to maintain it, if it breaks down he should pay half to have it fixed, etc. Also set up your home internet connection so he can only access it on a short cable, i.e. in a family room.

Relax this policy by 16, he wont be discovering anything that isnt on Channel 4 at 12pm on a Friday night or his friends mobile phone.

Typically people will think I am maybe a bit relaxed with my ideals on the subject, maybe I am, all I know is I have been using with computers for 12 years, I now have my own computer business than earns a good living and if my parents hadn't given me the opertunity to learn how to use a computer and the internet earlier I would have been totally wrecked every morning in school, as I would have had to work in a garage rather than working at home instead of watching tele designing websites.

In conclusion, let him have it, restrict how he uses it.

Hotblack Desiato

paulksnn wrote: »

One option that I haven't seen mentioned is to get him the laptop, but remove any wireless router in the house. This leaves him free to play games or whatever, but without any access to the internet, unless he comes down stair and uses a cable to connect directly to the router.

That just will not work unless you live in a one-off house, preferably a very remote one. I can pick up several unsecured networks from my neighbours with a stronger signal than my own!

You yourself must get up to speed on all things to do with MSN messenger and all similar programs. You need to be able to enable logging, and check the logs, as well as spot gaps in the logs, if the 13 year old figures out how to disable logging.

That's just it, people buy the gadget (not just a PC or laptop) then turn a blind eye. My 7 year old nephew was bought a 15s PS2 game for his birthday :rolleyes:

IMHO the 'educational' benefits of laptops at third level are way overstated, never mind secondary or primary. Few people really need one, but they're a kind of status symbol ('my daddy/boss bought me a cool laptop' - thirtysomething employees are every bit as bad as teenagers ) and even if you lock down your network, it can be brought somewhere with a signal/plugged into ethernet.

Hypocrite alert - I didn't really really need a laptop either, but it was a birthday present to myself

Hotblack Desiato

mackydacky07 wrote: »

I always had a PC in my house from the early days of MSDOS for all those computer nerds out there.

I had a computer when I was 13 too, but the worst thing I could do on it was play pirated games copied on a mate's Amstrad tape-to-tape hi-fi. It's just not comparable to giving a teenager a connection to the internet, it's an adult medium by adults for adults (or in some cases, by perverts for perverts?) and any other use has to be approached with great caution.

It's kind of funny that the 80's marketing lie - stick a child in front of a computer (playing a game 90+% of the time) somehow makes them into an IT genius - hasn't quite died off

Quality

I wouldnt see a problem with the laptop, However I would be very careful with what he can view on it.

A girl I know bought her 10 year old a laptop, and they gave her unrestricted access to the net. Her mother checked her history on the laptop one day and was shocked by what she had accessed.

I allow my dd (8) supervised use of my laptop.

What about them net nanny's are they any use?

mikemac

Quality wrote: »

What about them net nanny's are they any use?

They're ok but not great.
Imagine the child wants to do a project on animals. Any products I've seen instantly ban the Blue Tit bird.
And getting info on horses can be blocked too due to keywords like "ride" or "whip".

Maybe they have advanced since I've seen them. Wasn't impressed.

echosound

ninja900 wrote: »

I had a computer when I was 13 too, but the worst thing I could do on it was play pirated games copied on a mate's Amstrad tape-to-tape hi-fi.

Ditto


OP I see you have come to a compromise re the laptop, sounds like a fair one. Personally speaking, I would be of the opinion that a rota system where each child gets to use the family PC in a common area (for supervision) for a set amount of time would be the best option.

I don't think there is any harm in kids learning that everything they ask for doesn't just fall from the sky into their laps, gives them a better expectation in life for when they start to get older and fly the nest - the idea of budgeting and saving for something, the idea of having to share items and not having everything their own way etc. Not saying your 13 yr old is like that, just I don't personally think every item (especially large, expensive items!) should be handed up on a plate as they'll be in for a shock when they become young adults.

I'm also of the opinion that PCs and the internet are valuable tools for anyone, young or old, but for now, a shared family PC is more than sufficient for two younger children. My brother in law's two kids have access to one PC, and there's only the usual old rumblings about "get off, it's my turn now" now and again, and the older teen (just gone 16) is a natural whizz, so much so that when he did a bit of work experience in an architectural office as part of his curriculum, he picked up CAD and other programs/applications amazingly quickly. Having his own personal laptop or not didn't hold him back

DecTenToo

I have a while to go before my daughter wants to use the pc for anything other than a drawing program or downloading dora/fifi pictures to colour in, but as regards restricting PC time, there is stuff out there that will allow you to set up usage and access timetables per child. My brother in law uses it to great effect.

Toto Wolfcastle

My parents bought me a graduation present of a laptop last year, but only because I was about to move away for a Postgrad and needed one in my apartment. Before that, I shared the family PC with a sister who was also in college and needed to type essays, etc, a brother in secondary school with projects to research, etc, a father who was a local expert on Tripadvisor and had to be on regularly, and a mother who updated her budget daily on the computer. I still managed to get through college, I still managed to use the computer.

That's how things were, and still are, in my house. We share things. Kids need to learn this. Compromise is important.

I'm so glad you decided not to get the laptop. In my opinion even 16 is too young. The earliest someone should need a laptop is college, especially if they live away from home and can't rely on computers in college.

And I don't think this is an old-fashioned opinion.

harryharry

i have a laptop! sometimes look up naughty things! but its not the end off the world! he's going to do it anway

di11on

janeybabe wrote: »

...I'm so glad you decided not to get the laptop. In my opinion even 16 is too young. The earliest someone should need a laptop is college, especially if they live away from home and can't rely on computers in college. And I don't think this is an old-fashioned opinion.

The internet access issue aside (which can be managed), I really don't see why people perceive this as an inappropriately large present. If we were talking about a PS3 which costs more than some laptops, I don't think people would have the same problem with it. Why? A laptop has the potential to be so much more constructive than, say, a PS3 or an XBOX live.

Don't get me wrong, a PS3 is a huge present also and I think the suggestions about junior paying for part of it and/or the present being given as a reward for some large, sustained effort are good ideas.

Toto Wolfcastle

di11on wrote: »

The internet access issue aside (which can be managed), I really don't see why people perceive this as an inappropriately large present. If we were talking about a PS3 which costs more than some laptops, I don't think people would have the same problem with it. Why? A laptop has the potential to be so much more constructive than, say, a PS3 or an XBOX live.

Don't get me wrong, a PS3 is a huge present also and I think the suggestions about junior paying for part of it and/or the present being given as a reward for some large, sustained effort are good ideas.

I think a PS3 is too big a present too. But the idea about it being a reward of paid for in part by the child is a good idea.

My 16 year old brother got a PSP for Christmas last year, which is cheap compared to a PS3 or laptop. My mother has ended up taking it away from him a good few times as a punishment for bad behaviour. (He's fairly immature for his age.) This has resulted in him behaving better and he's even started to read for pleasure which is something he has never done before.

So while I still think a laptop is too big a present, it could be used to teach the child about responsibility, etc. The child should know that he/she cannot have everything he or she wants, and that it can be taken away as easily as it is given, more easily in fact.

Also, my main point is that a 13 year old does not need a laptop! Especially if the issue is that the child cannot share the family PC with a sibling. That's just letting the child know that they don't have to share, that they can have whatever they want and don't have to share it.