Digital Terrestrial Boxes on sale in Maplins 49.99

Romero

Just passed the Maplins in Jervis Street and they have a stack of them in the window, just in case anyone is interested, forget the brand but never heard of it before. Looks like a Spanish box that I have though.

Mossy Monk

Has it got MPEG4?

Romero

Here is the one Mico is manufacturer, I would say made for UK market so Mpeg2 compliant.

http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?ModuleNo=96872&doy=2m1#overview

wheres me jumpa

noob question: this needs an antenna also?

Romero

wheres me jumpa wrote: »

noob question: this needs an antenna also?

Yes you would neen an antenna, if your in the border counties it would be fine for picking up freeview, and at the moment you should be ok for test transmissions of the 4 national channels if your in an area that is covered by the test transmissions. Check the sticky threads above.

watty

Waste of money. This will be totally obsolete by August 2008 unless for UK freeview. Even in the UK, the card/pay TV part of DTT will go MPEG4 by next year or 2010 at latest.

Romero

So your saying that the irish tests will switch fully to MPEG4 in August 2008??

TM

Just passed Maplin - the box in question is a Mico STB238 in case anybody was wondering... Can't see it listed here

http://www.micoelectric.com/EN/SetTopBox/

but Google finds a few hits...

a bientot

Romero wrote: »

Just passed the Maplins in Jervis Street and they have a stack of them in the window, just in case anyone is interested, forget the brand but never heard of it before. Looks like a Spanish box that I have though.

Do not buy MPEG2 tuners..........
Just how many times must posters be told that they should keep on walking if they spot these MPEG2 tuners.....they are for the U.K. market and were probably dispatched here by a senior manager in the U.K. who thought/thinks that Ireland is still an 'integral part' of the U.K. or who thought the 'paddies' wouldn't know the difference anyway.......

The same problem exists for those with HD ready tv sets(MPEG2)....... Those who subscribe to UPC or BskyB are supplied with a decoder so all they need is a top class tv monitor -one , two or maybe three channels.
Having five hundred numbered channels is irrelevant to them.

As I've said elsewhere there was major hassle in France when they adopted MPEG2 and are now adopting MPEG4 for the pay service.
Ireland will certainly adopt MPEG4.........

(May I emphasise that this matter only concerns the 400,000 households that do NOT have cable or satellite tv- Terrestrial)

BowWow

a bientot wrote: »

(May I emphasise that this matter only concerns the 400,000 households that do NOT have cable or satellite tv- Terrestrial)

a bientot - I would be inclined to disagree with you. I have cable, but when DTT is rolled out officially I'll probably drop it. By that stage we should have Freesat (with Channel 4 hopefully). I know several others who will do likewise. Its no wonder UPC are not in favour of DTT and have even applied for control of some muxes.

Doodler

Have to disagree with Watty and a bientot. Even if MPEG2 turned off by August 2008 (and if that is the plan what's been the purpose of these trials?), €50 for 8 months of crystal-clear telly with a nice EPG, plus the radio channels is not a bad deal.

Main thing for intending purchasers is to be aware of risk, plus also make enquiries about reception where they live.

lawhec

BowWow wrote: »

a bientot - I would be inclined to disagree with you. I have cable, but when DTT is rolled out officially I'll probably drop it. By that stage we should have Freesat (with Channel 4 hopefully). I know several others who will do likewise. Its no wonder UPC are not in favour of DTT and have even applied for control of some muxes.

Also it'll be of interest to many people whom may have cable or satellite available but whom have other members of the household who may want to watch a different channel on a second or subsequent television.

watty

If too many people have MPEG2, for RTE it will be Like BBC and 405lines after war.
The Beeb knew it would have to change eventually to 625, but because of the number of 405 sets they restarted on 405 rather than 625.

MPEG4 lets you have twice the channels at the same quality as MPEG2. By time a national service is real there is little penaly (less than €25) for MPEG4 to user. If too many MPEG2 sets go out now we will be held back on a two tier system for years. Like 405 Line in 50s/60s for BBC/ITV when they could have been 625 only.

SPDUB

watty wrote: »

If too many people have MPEG2, for RTE it will be Like BBC and 405lines after war.
The Beeb knew it would have to change eventually to 625, but because of the number of 405 sets they restarted on 405 rather than 625.
.

Well if the plan is to go with MPEG4 then they need to tell people now that is what they will be going with

watty wrote: »

MPEG4 lets you have twice the channels at the same quality as MPEG2. By time a national service is real there is little penaly (less than €25) for MPEG4 to user

Like the same which was said about DAB+

And what content exactly are they going to put on the RTE Mux with MPEG4 when they seem to struggling to fill it with with MPEG2

a bientot

lawhec wrote: »

Also it'll be of interest to many people whom may have cable or satellite available but whom have other members of the household who may want to watch a different channel on a second or subsequent television.

Yes, I would agree wholeheartedly.....it's nice to receive a constructive reaction to a simple point of view.......
At the moment the actual target audience for obligatory DTT is a rather optimistic 400,000 households. Any extra will be cream on the cake for the providers. In fact, the service will be provided for all 1,300.000 homes in the republic.
It is time we ignored the situation in the U.K. that cannot be compared with Ireland. Belgium (francophone) has launched its official service TNT with four channels only and they are still negotiating rights with the neighbouring country, France, and nothing is sure on the outcome. Only 5%, mainly older citizens, are involved so it is possible that these subscribers do not want extra channels otherwise they would have opted for satellite or cable already.
One can keep on hoping on seeing the U.K. terrestrials on Irish DTT but I fear that it will be in vain.
Once again the Irish DTT service is NOT yet in operation.....plans will be announced in late Autumn or early 2009 by the commercial company selected to operate it and pay channels will be included in the line up to offset costs involved.

Sponge Bob

a bientot wrote: »

Once again the Irish DTT service is NOT yet in operation.....plans will be announced in late Autumn or early 2009 by the commercial company selected to operate it and pay channels will be included in the line up to offset costs involved.

And THAT company will be allocated BCI muxes and will be forced to use MPEG4. It strikes me that RTE is attempting to queer the pitch by the simple expediency of launching MPEG2 transmissions and getting MPEG2 boxes out there as fast as possible....even if only by keeping schtumm and letting Dixons and Maplins sell away to the consumer.

Not one consumer program on RTE , not one news item, has been broadcast about 'unsuitable' UK boxes for sale in Dixons / Currys / Maplin . Harvey Norman ....never mind the €1500 flat screen tellys with 'unsuitable' tuners built in .

RTE launched an MPEG2 transmission from Mt Leinster a few weeks back but as soon as it was mentioned on this Board it mysteriously stopped :cool: , there was no "Interference in Clonmel" by the way :cool: it being a tad too far away.

The industry gossip on possible future RTE network rollout partners would tend to support my theory that RTE want to get MPEG2 boxes out there on a vast scale and most especially during the commercial mux licencing round this year.

Its sort of about the facts on the ground and all that jazz. The commercial Mux licencing round will be a disaster and even if there is a winner the BCI will be sued by UPC delaying matters even further.

maxg

Due to the OFCOM specs the irish dtt provider are allowed to use either mpeg2 or mpeg4.
Beside mux1 for RTE nothing is fix and there is no official statement from RTE about the broadcasting method.
I don't think RTE is planing to present the irish channels via dtt only for people who are willing to shell out 200 euro and more for a mpeg4 box or 2000 euro and more for a lcd screen with integrated mpeg4 tuner.
What will happen with the other muxes time will tell.
If sky or any other firm is willing to kick in and supply all subscribers with mpeg4 boxes or not has no affiliation to the rte mux.
Beside that the parole from some bigmouths in this forum last year was "there will be no irish dtt after august 2008".

Sponge Bob

maxg wrote: »

Beside mux1 for RTE nothing is fix and there is no official statement from RTE about the broadcasting method.

There is indeed, RTÉ stated they would follow whatever technical standards are laid down by the BCI , namely MPEG4.

SPDUB

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Not one consumer program on RTE , not one news item, has been broadcast about 'unsuitable' UK boxes for sale in Dixons / Currys / Maplin . Harvey Norman ....never mind the €1500 flat screen tellys with 'unsuitable' tuners built in .
.

So what about TV3 or any of the newspapers who love to have something to kick RTE with or all the local radio stations

Sponge Bob

TV3 is interesting.

RTE has broadcast them in the clear on 'their' mux so far ...even on Mt Leinster . They are not obliged to carry them by law all the same ( 2007 Act) whereas they must carry tg4 ( more anon)

Maybe they can simply dump TV3 after the commercial muxes are awarded and go live . You could argue that TV3 have nowhere else to go at present , but that does not apply after a commercial mux is awarded and swutched on.

Logically that would mean that TV3 should ( must really) be part of every commercial mux licencing application syndicate or else people might think that TV3 don't care about DTT . I certainly think they have to make their own arrangements .

Its all in section 2 of the act

A national television multiplex established, maintained
and operated by the Authority under section 16(1) of the
Act of 1960 shall provide for the broadcasting by digital
means of—
(i) the national television broadcasting service commonly
known as RTE´ One and RTE´ Two,
(ii) the national television broadcasting service established
and maintained by Teilifís na Gaeilge under
section 45(1) of the Act of 2001.
(b) The national television multiplex referred to in paragraph
(a) shall be established as a matter of priority and shall,
in due course, ensure the availability by free-to-air digital
means of the national television broadcasting service
referred to in paragraph (a)(i) to an extent similar to that
such as is currently available by free-to-air analogue
means.
(c) Nothing in this subsection shall preclude the Authority
from making provision in a multiplex established, maintained
and operated by the Authority under section 16(1)
of the Act of 1960 for the broadcasting by digital means
of programme material and related and other data other
than that broadcast as part of a service specified in paragraph
(a).

Messy eh !!

A reading of that para obviously shows no obligation to carry the woeful mush of reality cack that is TV3 but appears to set an urgent temporal imperative which could be invoked by RTÉ to justify not following the BCI MPEG4 decision .

mcredmond over in tv3has been eerily quiet on the subject, he obviously read the Act and knows that he can be ditched at short notice and forced to make his own way on the commercial muxes....albeit in the clear unlike the others and in mpeg4.

Furthermore he can even apply for a whole mux himself and give us 6 channels of tv3 tv3 tv3, I can even see the lineup

TV3
TV3+1
TV3 a biteen HD
ITV West
TV3 News 24
24 Hour Breakfast TV for the bewildered .

Foggy43

maxg wrote: »

Beside that the parole from some bigmouths in this forum last year was "there will be no irish dtt after august 2008".

I am pretty sure the word unlikely was used. We are in 2008! Unless there is a lot going on behind the scenes an official roll out does still seem unlikely during this summer. When the 'trial' ends what will happen next?

Sponge Bob

The NDP was published showing no government funds were available. This time last year there was

1. No Money in the NDP bar trial funds
2. No plan

Therefore there was no evidence that there would be any DTT after August 2008 unless maxg read some funny tealeaves somewhere.

In september RTÉ punted out a flurry of tenders, after they thought they would get their licence increase.

A rollout this summer is now 'likely' , but only if its MPEG2

Romero

Yeah but if they try and roll it out without TV3 then Joe Public will kick up and say I'm not going to buy a box unless I have TV3 to watch as well, so its in RTE's best interest to carry it.
Also I bought an MPEG2 box last summer abroud for around 30 euros as I thought it was worth the cost for clear digital pictures of RTE & TV3, as the analog versions of these in my area are just crap compared to the analog uk channels provided by NTL. If it dies in the summer I'm not that pushed I got 12months of nice clear TV.

watty

RTE seem to be doing their own thing on the quiet, it may be MPEG2 in the short term. This RTE "National DTT" by 2008 seems to be by stealth, will not be true national coverage and other than animorphic WS will offer nothing more than good outdoor Analogue aerial. The transmitters, aerials and distribution is most of the expense and those will work on MPEG2 or MPEG4.

TV3 has 20% less coverage than RTE because they will not pay for it. RTE won't and isn't allowed to give them a free ride other than on tests.

Already they have had interference issues. So carefull what you wish for.

However it is irresponsible to sell, buy or promote MPEG2 only receivers in Ireland.

Of the groups consulted with, all bar one (11) expressed the view that Ireland should adopt
the most up-to-date technology in the development and roll-out of DTT. The
specifications of this would mirror, to a great extent, those of the UK’s D-Book
specification albeit with some minor changes (e.g. to Irish channel identifiers) and
anticipate future developments in the UK model (e.g. the adoption of MPEG 4 in advance
of the anticipated move by the UK to this compression standard in the coming months).
With regard to compression format, the stated desire for a national specification, “piggy-
backing” on the UK model, means the adoption of MPEG 4. This view, shared by
DCENR, CEDA, broadcasters, competition organisations and disability groups, was
informed by the feeling that technology evolves at such a pace that to guard against
Ireland being disadvantaged in a highly competitive media market, and to future-proof
the BCI licensing policy, the latest technology should be adopted by the platform from
the outset. This perspective was further supported on the basis of learning and
experience from the UK (and as referenced by DCENR, Sky, Mason Communications,
and BT/Arquiva among others), where the effects of the early adoption of DTT were now
being felt, to the point that the UK is now facing a situation where an upgrade from
MPEG 2 to MPEG 4 is, at best, highly desirable and, at worst, is required, to facilitate the
introduction of high-definition (HD) content.

Note (11): Only eircom proposed MPEG2 only.

The UK will have MPEG4, sooner rather than later if Sky succeeds.

Snake Plisken

Is it possible that the public who buy these MPEG2 boxes or more the people who buy their TV's with the built in MPEG2 decoders will get on to their TD's and complain that their big expensive TV's will not work with the service when it tolls out and force the MPEG2 standard to be adopted? I can see this being on Matt Cooper's Last Word as an issue in the weeks when it finally gets launched

Edit ah ok I see this point has been made on the other thread I suppose thats the real problem with UK retailers selling UK equipment here in Ireland.

watty

Sound of penny dropping ...

Dr.Mark

After reading yesterday's thread, I decided to spend the €50, regardless of the MPEG2/4 issue. I'll bin it in August if Irish Digital takes to the air.

I took it to my dad's house (who uses a DTT receiver in his TV to pick up the 4 digital Irish channels with a loft aerial) and set it to auto-install. Nothing. No channels. It appears that it only searches using UHF. Do we need VHF for the Irish channels?

Has anyone had any success with this Mico Mouse box?

Thanks in advance,

Snake Plisken

where are u based? the tests are on UHF band, maybe try rabbit ear aerial as the loft area might not be pointed at correct transmitter

John Dough

Has anyone looked at the COST of mpeg 4 ??? I think not as this is what will govern the Irish DTT service when it gets going.;)

Dr.Mark

Snake Plisken wrote: »

where are u based? the tests are on UHF band, maybe try rabbit ear aerial as the loft area might not be pointed at correct transmitter

UHF? Thats good.
Regarding the aerial, how come my dad can pick the 4 channels up using the DTT tuner in his LCD TV, but when he connects the same cable to the MiCO received, we get nada? This is confusing me.

watty

John Dough wrote: »

Has anyone looked at the COST of mpeg 4 ??? I think not as this is what will govern the Irish DTT service when it gets going.;)

MPEG4 is almost 1/2 cost for Network Operator as you get twice the channels. It also allows option of some HD.

Soon there will be no extra cost. Certainly before Analogue switch off, MPEG2 only will be obsolete. Since the MPEG4 boxes do MPEG2 also, the manufactures will not make both. For a PVR there is no real difference in price.

Dr.Mark

OK, I'm sending the Mico box back ... not because it is MPEG2 ... but because it can't tune in any channels even though the same aerial is sending 4 perfect digital channels to a DTT television (Mico and TV are side by side).

One other question. I bought this new aerial to install at my own house as it is much smaller the large 18 element.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?TabID=1&criteria=usb&ModuleNo=46230&doy=search&C=SO&U=Strat15

Before I take it out of the box, has anyone tried them? Are they as good as the larger 18/48 element aerials?


thanks in advance!

watty

It's a totally rubbish aerial. An expensive outdoor Amplified Rabbit ear.

Get a real aerial.


Even these work better than one of those.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?TabID=1&ModuleNo=33215&doy=9m1

Dr.Mark

watty wrote: »

It's a totally rubbish aerial. An expensive outdoor Amplified Rabbit ear.

Thats the straight talkin' I need. Back to Maplins

maxg

Dr.Mark wrote: »

UHF? Thats good.
Regarding the aerial, how come my dad can pick the 4 channels up using the DTT tuner in his LCD TV, but when he connects the same cable to the MiCO received, we get nada? This is confusing me.

Check the settings and enable the scan for scrambled channels.

Dr.Mark

Can anyone point me to a good DTT receiver that I can buy online or in Ireland? Thanks.

watty

The Humax the trial uses

Dr.Mark

Thanks (again) Watty even though you only answered 1/3 of my question

For any confused newbie such as I who starts at the Maplins €49 Mico Mouse box and ends up at this point, I think the box of choice is the Humax HDCI 2000T.

Details:
www.humaxdigital.com/global/products/new_leaflet/hdci-2000t.pdf

.... and sadly unavailable anywhere

stanley1

Dr.Mark wrote: »

Can anyone point me to a good DTT receiver that I can buy online or in Ireland? Thanks.

This is a link from a BBC forum, I don't speak French, maybe somebody out there can translate.

http://www4.fnac.com/Shelf/Article.aspx?PRID=1852300&SID=9e668d3c%2D652b%2Dc36d%2Da3f4%2Dc91b7a1c79dc&UID=06c5212fa%2D1091%2D9d4b%2Dbfe6%2D69ca05ea8e79&AID=&Origin=TELLAFRIEND&OrderInSession=1&TTL=100120082038&OriginClick=yes

watty

I'd wait a few months.

JHMEG

http://www.technomate.com/viewproduct2.php?product=81

Richard

stanley1 wrote: »

This is a link from a BBC forum, I don't speak French, maybe somebody out there can translate.

http://www4.fnac.com/Shelf/Article.aspx?PRID=1852300&SID=9e668d3c%2D652b%2Dc36d%2Da3f4%2Dc91b7a1c79dc&UID=06c5212fa%2D1091%2D9d4b%2Dbfe6%2D69ca05ea8e79&AID=&Origin=TELLAFRIEND&OrderInSession=1&TTL=100120082038&OriginClick=yes

"Compatible DVB-T, 2 prises péritel, 1 HDMI, 1 USB 2.0, sortie analogique"

DVB-T Compatible, 2 SCART sockets, 1 HDMI, 1 USB 2, analogue out (RF presumably)

Compatible MPEG-2, MPEG-4

"MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 compatible"

"Le Netbox 7600 HD TV est le premier adaptateur TNT qui permet la réception des chaînes TNT gratuites en SD et en Haute Définition*. C'est aussi un terminal évolutif pour accéder à de futurs services en la connectant à Internet."

The Netbox 7600 HD TV is the best digital adaptor that allows digital channels free in Standard Definition and High Definition. It is also upgradable to allow access to future services via the internet


"Ce terminal numérique évolutif est équipé d'un lecteur de cartes à puces, d'un port Ethernet de raccordement à l'Internet à haut débit et d'un connecteur USB. Il dispose d'une fonctionnalité de mise à jour à distance de logiciel permettant à tout client équipé d'une netbox HDTV de bénéficier gratuitement des évolutions nécessaires à l'activation des nouveaux services. Ainsi, pendant la période de lancement, les acquéreurs de la netbox HDTV pourront télécharger gratuitement la fonction " media center " permettant d'accéder depuis leurs téléviseurs, dans une ergonomie adaptée, à leurs contenus multimédia personnels (photos, musique, vidéos) stockés sur leurs PC."

The evolutionary remote control is equipped with something, not sure, an Ethernet Port for connecting to the internet and a USB port.

It goes on to talk about new services and that you can use it as a media centre for your photos, music and video.

Dr.Mark

I could *not* get the Maplins Mico box to work, even in a house where they are currently watching the 4 digital channels. I tried to manually tune on channel 54 but despite "Signal very Good" and strength about 60%, it found nada.

I'm taking the box back to Maplins tomorrow. I will also take back the booster aerial (even though it improved the signal considerably) and buy the same type of aerial as everyone else.
Question: 18-element ok? I'm in D7 and it appears that there is no problem with Three Rock from here.

I will wait and but an MPEG4 box in France. I like the look of that Segem but I know that the supermarkets in France sell these boxes for little money.

SPDUB

Dr.Mark wrote: »

I could *not* get the Maplins Mico box to work, even in a house where they are currently watching the 4 digital channels. I tried to manually tune on channel 54 but despite "Signal very Good" and strength about 60%, it found nada.

It sounds like it is ignoring the signal because the encrypted tag is on the signal even though the signal isn't encrypted on those channels. People have reported that as a problem with some other receivers .

Dr.Mark

SPDUB wrote: »

It sounds like it is ignoring the signal because the encrypted tag is on the signal even though the signal isn't encrypted on those channels. People have reported that as a problem with some other receivers .

I think you're right and maxg made the same point earlier in this thread.

I went through all options and there is *no* facility for options such as scrambled. It is pure sh*te.

Dr.Mark

JHMEG wrote: »

http://www.technomate.com/viewproduct2.php?product=81

This looks interesting albeit very expensive. I have been using a technomate for a few years now and altho the interface is a bit "spartan", it has no problem shifting between astra and hotbird and has never caused any trouble.

It also does MPEG4. Has anyone bought one of these?

Any opinions on suppliers?
http://www.pulsat.com/satellite/site/details.php?product_id=46
http://www.sateuropa.co.uk/product_overview.asp?id=1719&catid=1&subcat=56
http://www.satellitesuperstore.com/technomatehd.htm

thanks in advance,

JHMEG

Dr.Mark wrote: »

This looks interesting albeit very expensive.

Yeah, it's fairly new and hasn't come down in price. Cheapest I found it is £279 stg. I asked on here about the future-proof-ness but didn't get many meaningful replies, tho it looks to me like it is pretty future proof.

Have a TM1500CI+ myself at moment + Dragon Cam for the C4/five FTV card, which I'd be looking to upgrade from.

Also Dr.Mark, I bought a Bush DTT receiver in NI for £25 a while back, and it too had the "ignore scrambled channels" option set. For some unknown reason all the channels from Three Rock have the scrambled flag set, so the box couldn't pick up anything initially.

Sponge Bob

JHMEG wrote: »

tho it looks to me like it is pretty future proof.

yeah well the trial is conax but one knows not what the crypto will be on commercial DTT muxes of which there will likely be one within a year.

Conax is not a given after august 2008

Dr.Mark

JHMEG wrote: »

Have a TM1500CI+ myself at moment + Dragon Cam for the C4/five FTV card, which I'd be looking to upgrade from.

..... I bought a Bush DTT receiver in NI for £25 a while back, and it too had the "ignore scrambled channels" option set. For some unknown reason all the channels from Three Rock have the scrambled flag set, so the box couldn't pick up anything initially.

Thanks for the info ... I'm certainly better informed after this thread. My technomate is the TM5500 DAPCI. Its getting a bit old now but it served me well.
I have one of the original BBC (I think!) FTA cards from about 6+ years ago so can use that on a SKY box for C4/C5.

If I can get digital RTE working, it's bye-bye SKY

Dr.Mark

Sponge Bob wrote: »

yeah well the trial is conax but one knows not what the crypto will be on commercial DTT muxes of which there will likely be one within a year.

Conax is not a given after august 2008

Presume this means nothing if I never intend getting a CAM/card? DTT for me is only FTA home channels. Am I future-proofed?

watty

You will likely only get 3 or 4 channels FTA DTT. Even that is not definate, You might need an Annual payment and Card.. YOu'd want FTA Satellite too.