Upgrading Headlights Bulbs - Anything I should know in advance?

ToxicPaddy

I'm thinking of changing the bulbs in my lights as when any dirt gets on the lights, the amount of light emitted drops fairly noticebly.. I keep the car clean
but this happens a lot mid journey so dont want to be stopping every 50 miles to clean the lights..

Anyone done this before?
Any recommendations for makes of bulbs?
Any long term negative effects on the system?

I've an A6 by the way.

Tox

Owen

55W/60W bulbs are the ones that are road legal, if you exceed this and use 75W or 100W bulbs, you risk dazzling other drivers, and/or overloading the headlights themselves, which can cause melting of either the lamp's reflector housing, or the wiring feeding it.

C_Breeze

ned78 wrote: »

55W/60W bulbs are the ones that are road legal, if you exceed this and use 75W or 100W bulbs, you risk dazzling other drivers, and/or overloading the headlights themselves, which can cause melting of either the lamp's reflector housing, or the wiring feeding it.

Not really what he was asking but true none the less.

Although higher wattage bulbs are technically not illegal - they are a stupid choice for the reasons outlined above ... not only are they dangerous as they dazzle oncoming drivers but i have seen them cause electrical problems on a friends volvo s40. (and melted wires)


OP, the obvious choice is a HID xenon kit , if you'd rather not go down this route - get yourself a set of OSRAM Nightbreaker bulbs .. have only heard and read good things about them.

Owen

C_Breeze wrote: »

Not really what he was asking but true none the less.

He's asking about any long term effects on changing his bulbs, and about bulbs that can shine through the grime, which implies he's contemplating upgrading the bulbs to ones of higher wattage.

A HID Kit will improve things for certain, and having seen an aftermarket kit, installed, they work wonders. You must make certain though that you adjust your headlights though OP if you install them, as they have the potential to dazzle drivers also if you've people sitting in the back of the car and don't compensate for it.

Ideally, when you change your car next time, buy something with factory installed Xenon lamps, they come with headlamp washers, and will cure all your ails.

bottletops

C_Breeze wrote: »

HID xenon kit , OSRAM Nightbreaker bulbs

Whats the difference between these two? Which is better? Any ideas on Prices and the best place to purchase?
Thanks

ToxicPaddy

ned78 wrote: »

A HID Kit will improve things for certain, and having seen an aftermarket kit, installed, they work wonders. You must make certain though that you adjust your headlights though OP if you install them, as they have the potential to dazzle drivers also if you've people sitting in the back of the car and don't compensate for it.

The HID kit def sounds like what I'm looking for.. I dont really want to risk doing any damage to the car by using higher wattage bulbs, more looking for ones that give better lighting on the road.. I see a lot of newer cars have bulbs that give off an almost blueish light when on.. are these the Xenon bulbs??

Any idea what one would cost to buy and install?

ned78 wrote: »

Ideally, when you change your car next time, buy something with factory installed Xenon lamps, they come with headlamp washers, and will cure all your ails.

Well considering I just bought this car in Sept, I dont think I'll be changing it for a while, so I'm looking to improve things until then

Owen

ToxicPaddy wrote: »

I see a lot of newer cars have bulbs that give off an almost blueish light when on.. are these the Xenon bulbs??

Most are on newer cars, and on older cars they're just bulbs. The bulbs only have a blue tint though, and despite wild claims on the packaging, do little for night vision. As C Breeze said, the only bulbs that do make a difference seem to be Osram Nightbreakers.

ToxicPaddy wrote: »

Any idea what one would cost to buy and install?

A mate of mine installs HID kits into standard lamps, and they make a huge difference. The wiring isn't just as simple as changing a bulb though, HID kits use a lot higher voltage than a standard bulb, so there's a transformer to step up the voltage that needs to be put in there too. You will have a decent HID kit installed by most people for around about 400 squid.

CJhaughey

TBH dirt on the lenses will block a lot of light, whether you have HID or incandescent bulbs.
It is like fitting a dark lense that absorbs a lot of light.
I have installed the Philips X-treme power and they are a noticeable improvement on standard.
Headight washers are probably the best thing but getting out every now and then and cleaning is the only way if you don't have that luxury.

ToxicPaddy

Hmmm.. €400 for something that might work is a bit much..

Ahh I'll keep researching and see what I can find..

Del2005

CJhaughey wrote: »

TBH dirt on the lenses will block a lot of light, whether you have HID or incandescent bulbs.
It is like fitting a dark lense that absorbs a lot of light.
I have installed the Philips X-treme power and they are a noticeable improvement on standard.
Headight washers are probably the best thing but getting out every now and then and cleaning is the only way if you don't have that luxury.

Have to agree with this, with the state of our roads unless you have headlight washers and even better wipers then the only thing is get out and clean the lenses. Putting in better bulbs only means you need to clean the lense less:D

jayok

Just to clear the air on this:

1. The bulbs are actually called High Intensity Discharge lights, not "Xenons". Xenon is a gas that is used in most standard halogen bulbs so referring these bulbs to "Xenons" is actually incorrect.

ned78 wrote: »

A mate of mine installs HID kits into standard lamps, and they make a huge difference. The wiring isn't just as simple as changing a bulb though, HID kits use a lot higher voltage than a standard bulb, so there's a transformer to step up the voltage that needs to be put in there too. You will have a decent HID kit installed by most people for around about 400 squid.

2. Retro-fitting HID bulbs to a head-light not designed for such bulbs is not recommended. The shape of the light-beam from HIDs differs from standard halogens and if you pop in those HIDs into a halogen head-light the scatter pattern will be unfocused and will generally dazzle other drivers - you may even notice that the amount of focused light you have yourself is less that a standard halogen bulb. HID almost compensates for this by outputting 3x time the light of a standard halogen, but alas its all over the place.

For €400 your getting a pretty sh1tty upgrade kit. If you want to do this, then do it right. Get it factory fitted or a proper OEM kit. This kit will include:

1. Proper HID lenses with sharp-beam cut-off
2. Self-leveling lenses and sensors
3. Headlight washers

And will cost in the region of €1,500-€2,000 fitted. If you're not willing to spend this stick to a halogen set

3. There is no requirement to use 55/60W bulbs in your car from the legal perspective. All the law states is that they must be correctly aligned. This is how HIDs are legal. The actual light output is no measured, but the alignment of the beams are. So in the case of a HID with 3x the halogen output they are correctly aligned so will pass. In the case of a 60/80W bulb in the correct lens, they too will pass. However, current overload and driver dazzle can still occur.

Owen

jayok wrote: »

2. Retro-fitting HID bulbs to a head-light not designed for such bulbs is not recommended. The shape of the light-beam from HIDs differs from standard halogens and if you pop in those HIDs into a halogen head-light the scatter pattern will be unfocused and will generally dazzle other drivers

My brain hurts. Do these new bulbs revolutionise physics and make light travel in circles, or around corners? Light travels in a straight line from the source, just like an ordinary bulb, and can be focused just the same as a H7 Bulb. The difference is that without a self levelling mechanisim that's in an OEM Xenon Kit, if the driver does not adjust the height of his beam, it risks dazzling oncoming drivers, the same as a H4/H7 headlamp.

jayok wrote: »

For €400 your getting a pretty sh1tty upgrade kit. If you want to do this, then do it right.

I actually have a HID kit installed on one of my cars. The same car also has OEM Xenons for the dipped beam. The difference the HID kit has made to the full beam is exceptional, and worth more than the 400 quid I paid. I do a lot of night time driving due to playing in a band and it's made driving home a real pleasure on the smaller roads with no catseyes/illumination. There's nothing wrong whatsoever with either the standard HID kits, or the more expensive Xenon HID kits.

Alun

ned78 wrote: »

My brain hurts. Do these new bulbs revolutionise physics and make light travel in circles, or around corners? Light travels in a straight line from the source, just like an ordinary bulb, and can be focused just the same as a H7 Bulb.

But that's the problem, real life bulbs aren't point light sources like you get in physics text books, the actual light source in, say, an H7 halogen bulb is a different shape to that in a HID replacement, and the pattern of light coming from it is therefore also different. The reflector and optics of a headlight cluster are designed around the characteristics of the light pattern emanating from an incandescent bulb, not an HID bulb.

See http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

Spit62500

ned78 wrote: »

There's nothing wrong whatsoever with either the standard HID kits, or the more expensive Xenon HID kits.

Some (a lot) of the aftermarket kits are made in China and are of variable quality (some are branded Bosch but its not certain that they are). I'm not sure that I'd be happy to put a fire hazard like that under my bonnet unless I was sure of the quality.

The light from a headlight bulb doesn't actually travel in a straight line. It's either reflected back onto the reflector and bent in the appropriate direction, bent by the headlight glass or focussed using a projector lens, depending on the headlight design. Furthermore, bulbs themselves are designed to point the light in a given direction, which is why a headlight bulb can usually only be fitted on one position. If an aftermarket manufacturer is cutting costs they may not put the effort into correctly designing the light pattern.

Edit: looks like Alun got there just before me on a lot of the above...

jayok

ned78 wrote: »

My brain hurts. Do these new bulbs revolutionise physics and make light travel in circles, or around corners? Light travels in a straight line from the source, just like an ordinary bulb, and can be focused just the same as a H7 Bulb.

No they don't change the physics of light at all, but the difference between Halogen and HIDs is HOW they emit the light. In a halogen bulb the filament is quite short and the hot-spot defined. As such the halogen lens is designed to ensure that this spot is at the centre of the the lens. With a HID bulb, the light is generated as the result of electrons jumping across the charged gases. Its a longer beam with a no central hot spot. As such putting this in a halogen lens, ensures that the beam is no longer focused.

Here's more:

http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/bulbs/Hid/conversions/conversions.html

The difference is that without a self levelling mechanisim that's in an OEM Xenon Kit, if the driver does not adjust the height of his beam, it risks dazzling oncoming drivers, the same as a H4/H7 headlamp.

No, the driver will still dazzle on-coming drivers as the Halogen lens will not provide the sharp cutoff required by the HID, the will not be self-levelling, the can not be washed. It is not the same as the H4/H7 headlight - at all. Too much misinformation here. Why do you thing the cost of HIDs are so expensive from the manufactures?

I actually have a HID kit installed on one of my cars. The same car also has OEM Xenons for the dipped beam. The difference the HID kit has made to the full beam is exceptional, and worth more than the 400 quid I paid. I do a lot of night time driving due to playing in a band and it's made driving home a real pleasure on the smaller roads with no catseyes/illumination.

So you have installed the HIDs for the full-beam? Then fine, this won't dazzle drivers, as you dip when you see oncoming traffic. Your dips are OEM and already have the correct lenses, etc.

There's nothing wrong whatsoever with either the standard HID kits, or the more expensive Xenon HID kits.

If not correctly specced there is plenty wrong. Also, you still seems to be confused. Standard HID kits? Xenon HID kits? What's the difference? Both use Xenon gas.


<edit> I spent too long typing this out - two people go there before me <edit>

JHMEG

Jayok, Alun & Spit are 100% correct.
Fitting aftermarket HIDs on dip beams (which is what the NCT test) is very hit and miss and more miss than hit. H4 especially, as H4 bulbs have two filaments and a H4 HID will have one hot spot and some mechanical arrangement which will move it in or out. As well as bad focus this, being mechanical and chinese made, will eventually fail.

I would also be concerned about the build quality of the ballasts (the high voltage yokes required by HIDs) and would be concerned about them being fire hazards.

Bosch don't make HIDs at all. Any kits branded Bosch are fakes. I also gather that any brand less than about 800 euro is either fake or chinese muck. eg McCulloch.

The only sure way to retro fit HIDs is to take the lamp assembly from a car that originally had HIDs. I believe the Honda S2000 is an excellent donor in this respect (make sure to ask the permission of the owner first tho;))

I've run with 100w/80w H4 filament lamps for years and have found them to be excellent. The only sure way to get more light on the road.

workaccount

Hi, I'm looking at this bulbs at the moment. How do I know if these will fit my car. It's a 94 sunny.

endplate

Phillips vision plus apparently give better stronger light from 55W. Bought a pair today will install them tomorrow hoping for an improvment