Projector & TV 1080p or not

trabpc · 17-12-2007 1:52pm #1

Need some help here. Hoping to move into my new build in the Spring. I have the Attic Converted and i have one room which measures 34ft long by 10ft wide.(covers nearly full length of house) As it is the Attic, the room height in the middle is 7.5 ft at it highest and at the side about 4 ft. with 3 roof Windows.

I am hoping to by a new pioneer lx508xd later in 2008 for the Sitting Room when prices come down a bit but I also want to buy a PT-AX200 projector for the Attic.

Here is my Dilemma Having looked at this site and various others i have been told that 1080p on anything smaller than 50" is not worthwhile.

So should i upgrade the projecor to a PT-AE2000 1080p like this one

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Panasonic-PT-AE2000-Cinema-Video-Projector/dp/B000YRWZFM/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1197898449&sr=8-8

They deliver this to IRL and works out about €2700
I see Alliance Electrical have the older PT-AE1000 for more than this!!

However looking at reviews on the PT-AX 200 it says he image Quality from that is hard to tell from 1080p, its that good. Pixmania have this for €1195.

also this Sanyo Projector PLV-Z5 form Komplett is only €999

So should I upgade the Projector and Downgrade the tv to 720p like a Panasonic 50px70 or 720p Pioneer, to save money on the TV and Put it towards the Projector (edit I see the 42py70 is now €1799)

By the way im not loaded, that is why im asking the Question. I can Manage about €3000 in the Spring and maybe anothe €3000 in September for the tv.

Has anyone got a Projector and what do they think?

Looking at a 98"x57" 16;9 motorised Screen but only place i know stocks them is Komplett but they are out. Anyone know any shops i can go to look at Screens?

To put things into perspective we were looking a a 3-2-1 setee for the sitting room the other day and that is €2900 ( for a lump of cloth and timber)
That my only Defence with my Wife!!!

Any help appreciated.

Regards,

trabpc · 17-12-2007 8:20pm

Migh have got the TV sorted. Called into Peats today they have the 1080p Panasonic 42py70 . very nice and its reduced to €1799 nice price with 5 yr guarantee. It a much nicer looking telly than the 70pv70. It has a nicer black surround plus side speakers.

brav · 18-12-2007 3:47pm

TBH, if you have a 42" 1080p tv and you only have room for a 50" screen for a projector, I don't think the projector is worth it yet, of course it would still look more like a home cinema with the projector

trabpc · 18-12-2007 4:01pm

The TV is for The Sitting Room. The Projector is for the Attic. As I Said I should be able to fit a 98"x57"inch screen up there But can't decide on a 720p or 1080p Projector.

My local Electrical Store can also get me in the 42py70 and can match the €1799 price with a 5yr Warranty (can never spell this right ! LOL).
My viewing distance for the 42" will be about 4.2m about 13.5 ft. will this be big enough?

big_moe · 18-12-2007 10:58pm

at 13ft+ you'd have no problem going to a panasonic th50py70 (50 inch)

moe

trabpc · 19-12-2007 9:44am

Thanks,
Any chance of geting a picture of the 50". The 42 is a fine looking telly. Need to make my mind up before friday to get the 5yr.
Any reduction in price on the 50"

trabpc · 19-12-2007 9:57am

I see Alliance have the PT-AE2000 for €2999. I might Give them a ring See if they can do a deal on the 2. Does the PT-AE2000 also come with a 5yr Warranty?

trabpc · 24-12-2007 9:16pm

Got Tv Sorted bought the 42py70. Won't have it till early jan but i got 5yr warranty for €1750

Now next ill need to buy projector for the attic . A few models have come to mind

Has anyone here got any of these and any opinions Please

Optima hd70 720p Projector (dlp) €999 local tv shop

panasonic pt-ax 200 (720p) (Lcd) online €1200

Panasonic pa-ae2000 (1080p) €2700.

Can just about afford €3000 incl Screen

I can fit about 120" inch wide, 58"inch high screen so should i only consider 1080p?

Regards,

slave1 · 25-12-2007 4:51pm

at this amount of money you're better off reading through this forum...http://www.avforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=43

trabpc · 27-12-2007 10:10am

cheers

trabpc · 02-01-2008 10:17pm

I think im back to Square 1. ordered the 42py70 on the 20th Dec. I told them I was only buying based on getting the 5yr Guarantee. they agreed but so far the tv has not arrived in store.

I think the promotion was over on the 24th Dec and i was told I had 2 weeks to get serial no's etc in. which means the tv has to arrive tomorrow and get info in post to arrive at Panasonic uk before Monday 7th.

Could Moe or someone tell me am I correct Re above.

Got tv at €1750. I know its now at €1650 but minus the 5yr Warranty.

Regards,

ongarite · 02-01-2008 10:25pm

I think you have till the end of Jan to get it sent in. I bought mine around same time and haven't got around to sending in guarantee card & copy of receipt in yet.

trabpc · 08-01-2008 7:55pm

Got Through to Shop today, yes they Made a bo boo. Never charged my card before the 24th DEC. this was a requirement to get the 5yr guarantee.

What should i do? Got it at €1750 should i leave it with them or insist on the new price €1649 minus the 5yr guarantee.

Was looking at one of their projectors the Optima HD70 720p Projector they will prob do me a deal on both as they F****d order up.

big_moe · 08-01-2008 8:18pm

i'd want the new price minus the 5 year.

jmal · 09-01-2008 7:13pm

Bad form about the 5 yr warranty. They should'nt have let that one slip as they must have known the warranty was only available until 24th Dec. :mad:

What store was it.

As per your projector, if the budget allow's, I'd suggest a 1080p projector.

Resolution is not the only benefit with these PJ's, contrast is usually 10000:1 and other features such as lens shift etc make th 1080p models much more advanced pj;s altogether.

I have seen a Mitsubishi HC5000 in operation before and it an amazing machine.

Here's two:
Mitsubishi HC5000 .
Mitsubishi HC5000
The latest version the HC6000 has just been released, and think it will be similarly priced in the €3000 range. 15,000:1 contrast, 5000 hour lamp life!!:D
etc..HC6000BL

Your screen dimensions as above relate to a 137" Diag screen.
I think at this size you will be looking at an 120" Diag screen (Approx 244 X 149cm).

Anything bigger will be off standard and very €€€, Maybe screen wall paint might be a solution worth looking at. Did a wall a couple of months ago with screen paint and it looked the job. Also available with a magnetic border which offers a removable black border for you screen.

big_moe · 09-01-2008 7:21pm

at the price and specs of those mitsubishis, i'd rather go Panasonic.. the mitsi HC5000 is €2750 on that site, 1,000 lumens, 10,000:1 contrast.. Panasonic PT-AE2000 is €2999 and has 1500 lumens and 16000:1 contrast. well worth the extra few quid. and the Panasonic has more connections as well. http://www.allianceelectric.ie/products/tv/projector/ptae2000.htm

adam

trabpc · 09-01-2008 8:49pm

Might get a photo of room where im planning to put Projector up at weekend how does one attach an image to these forums?

jmal · 09-01-2008 10:47pm

When you post a reply, click the "Insert Image" icon in the utiity bar.

As to the PT-AE2000 this is a highly rated pj and is one of the leading low priced 1080p pj's. Its not excatly correct comparing the AE2000 to the HC5000. The HC5000 is more a competitor to the older AE1000 and the HC6000 is its replacement. I'd still be inclined to wait a couple of weeks to see the price the new HC6000 comes in at as there is very little between these two pj's in terms of performance. In a controller enviroment (dedicated room) where sunlight is not an issue, lumens is not an issue because these thru-HT projectors are designed for operation in a dark room.
Here's the pro's view:AE2000 V's HC6000

If im correct the panni only comes with a 1 year warranty, the mitsubi has a 2year? Might sound strange but a very good feature for ceiling mounted pj's is to have them available in a white casing. Much less visable when mounted. Mitsubishi have thought of this.
You could go back and forward all day between these two projectors where there's very little between them, but it's good to add another option to this panasonic mad envoirement:rolleyes:

trabpc · 12-01-2008 10:25pm

A Mobile phone pic of the Attic It measures 40ft x 16ft. sorry about the Quailty, should be able to fit in a 92" wide Screen. Hope to have sockets plugs and lights in by next sat . The following sat I hope to have carpets in.
What colour paint should I paint walls for use with projector.

By the way The shop rang today they can give me the 42py70 for €1649 but only 1 yrs guarantee.

What should I do? prob won't get to fully move in till March so should i leave tv till then. Decisions decisions.

Bt the way I read this months (feb) What HI FI Sound and Vision. They Reviewd 6 Projectors the Optima HD 80 got a 4 star rating and the Panny PT-AE2000 got a glowing 5 star. so me thinks this is the one.
Now to find a better price than €2999

trabpc · 12-01-2008 10:29pm

Sorry can't seem to put more than 1 pic per post. Am I doing something Wrong.

Any way this is a pic facing back toward the door . Hope to fit a pool tabe in there.(If i win da lotto!)

All donations greatly accepted!

slave1 · 13-01-2008 1:55pm

check out this fourm for members home cinema setups, you may get some ideas

eddiem74 · 14-01-2008 1:12pm

Hi trabpc,

I am not an expert in the slightest, but just wanted to let you know that a few months ago I purchased PT-AX 200 from Komplett. This was my first ever projector, and after reading some reviews of the old AX100, reviewing user feedback on boards.ie and avforums, along with the reviews on projector central I went with it.

For me it was also toss-up between the PT-AX 200 and the PLV-Z5 from Sanyo, however as it was going to be in my living room, with possible use during the daytime without curtains, etc. closed I went with the Panny, otherwise it would have been the Sanyo.

I primarily use it during the weekends, for movies, and regular TV, with SkyHD. When watching a HD program or movie on it, it is just out of this world!

As I said I have no comparisons in real life with other projectors, or any experience in this field but I am quite picky about things, however cannot fault this for picture quality. Everyone who calls to the house when its on, sits back in awe, and just cannot believe how good the picture is, plus I am only projecting it onto a white'ish wall, no screen.

Given the price difference with the AE2000 plus between online and instore, an option to consider could be to buy the AX200, use it for a while, and see if it meets your needs, if you are not happy, sell, and then upgrade to something a little more serious/expensive.

Some food for thought..........from a novice

jmal · 14-01-2008 2:44pm

Hey Trab,

Looks great, I'm impressed & envious:p. Did an installation about 6 months ago in an attic conversion nearly identical to your's.

Here' some pointers you may or may not already have considered.

2. I see your cabling was probably run in the first fix. How did you deciede where to place your projector (HDMI) cables in the ceiling. This is normally done based on the throw distance of the projector you are going to install. Nearly every different projector model carries a different throw distance, and is also relative to the screen size you are going to use. There is usually a common ground to allow you to work with just about any model. But if you were oriigionally concidering a 120" screen then the difference in throw distance is big.

Optoma HD80 Throw Distance from 3.7m to 4.52
Mitsubishi HC6000 Throw Distance From 2.8m to 4.6m

If your HDMI is over 5mtrs I suggest you ask if you can exchange it if its performance is not up to scratch.

2. Where is your seating going to be located. The similar installation we did required two rows of HT Seating. The floor was given a split level to make sure the second row could see the screen. The front row needed to be back enough to ensure shadows were not casted from front row heads.

3. Wall colours should be as dark a colour as you will get away with. Bright colour walls cause the projector light to reflect around the room taking from the experience. See attached image. If this is going to be a dedicated room then go with a dark blue, navy etc.

4. Some screen options.

a. Paint the screen white (Basic Picture).
b. Use a ProAV screen paint. These usually come with seperate ContrastBooster & BrightnessBooster to achieve the perfect screen colour to match the envoirment. Also come with magenitic screen boarders. Can be set up for 16:9 or 2.31:1 depending on the use.
c. Buy a manual or Electronic screen. Always gives an much better picture that a wall painted white. If you are thinking electronic, I'd suggest getting a screen and projector with a 12volt trigger. (Turn on the projector and your screens automatically comes down and visa versa.) VERY NICE FEATURE!
d. Fixed screen. This would be the best solution for your room as you may have problems with getting a pull down screen casing to fit in the eves of the roof, or alternativelly the screen will be too close to the ground. Looks pritty tight. A fixed screen will sit tight in to the space available. But be warned. Can be pricey!
NOTE: Some people splash out on the pj and then slap it up on white wall, which defeats the purpose of high resolution and contrast. Dont make that mistake. Negiotate the screen into the overall projector deal.

4. Projector. If your going for a 92" screen then maybe 1080p is not compulsory. I use my Optoma DV11 on a 84" Screen in my sitting room . Looks fine. The DV11 is only 480p. Using a 720p PJ on a 92" screen will give you a superb picture. (Where as the 120" screen might require 1080p).

My own opinion is always to put DLP over LCD for HT Projectors. LCD has come along way over the last few years and the latest 1080p models are truly amazing but contrast and colour depth are still not quite as good as a Dark Chip3 DLP Engine. A DLP PJ using Dark Chip3+ with a 10,000:1 contrast ratio to me looks must better than an LCD PJ with 15,000:1 contrast. With DLP you get true blacks and strong colours. Read this You need to experience both together to see the difference. The two main disadvantanges of a 1080p DLP PJ are 1. the fact it normally does not have features such as Lens Shift and a wider zoom lens. But the reality is if you intend to ceiling mount a projector and you plan out your installation correctly then this is feature is redundant. The rainbow effect normally associated with DLP PJ's has been eliminated with the recient introduction of a 6 speed colour wheel.

Only read about this the other day.If price is a issue then I would look toward optoma's newest offering the HD800x, a 1080p DLP projector for a little above the €2K mark. WOW.

HTH.
JJ

trabpc · 14-01-2008 6:50pm

Thanks lads for the advice.

Eddiem:

I am very tempted with th PT-AX 200 I Think Pixmania has it for €1050. What size screen are you using?

You make a very good point on the price the Pt-ae 2000 is nearly €3000 and the ax100 is only a 3rd of that!

Jmal:

when you saw 92" Is this referring to the width? so the screen size would be bigger diagonally say 108-113.

I ran all the power cables my self just befor Xmas and it now plastered only 3 weeks ago.

For the position of the projector i got the Panasonic manual online for the pt-ae 1000 and based my figures on that.
I think it said for 120" image projector shoul be roughly between 3.5-6.5 meters back from screen

So I put mine at 5.5m from where i plan on putting screen

At the projector point I ran 2.5sq electrical cable for power socket and also ran flexible hosing about 30mm.dia with a draw string inside so i can pull through HDMI cable after. I also ran a Coax cable but this may have been pointless as projector don't have tv tuners. Dooh!

at the point where i plan the screen I also ran 2.5sq elec cable to power screen.

I have my sparky friend over on sat so he will put on the sockets and tie into power in house.

My local store can get me a wolf screen (I think) 92" wide motorised for about €400.
anyone any reccomendations on screens . Only place i saw was Komplett.
At 92" wide what is the height so I can work out the horiz dimensions.
Thanks again

edit/ forgot to say my local store can get me an Optima HD70 for €1100 incl 2 yr Warranty.
any one got this one? I believe its a DLP Projector. but its placemet is very fussy

But I heard great thinks about the pt ax200

eddiem74 · 15-01-2008 4:26pm

I am projecting on to a slightly off-white wall from a distance of around 12-13feet, with the projector ceiling mounted. You might want to invest some time over on avforums before making a decision on a screen, there seems to be always lots of opinions on a screen versus a wall. Again, its something you can always add later if you feel the wall is not working for you.

I haven't actually measured the size while the picture is running, however just done a quick estimate now, and I would reckon the screen size is around: 55" tall (varies per program/movie), and around 92" diagonal.

At first I played around with the zoom, and various sizes, until I came up with something which was comfortable to watch while sitting down.

jmal · 15-01-2008 9:04pm

Lets put some facts to the Screen V's Wall discussion.

There are 1000's of discussions on the web about weather a projector screen is an improvment over the plain white wall for projection. You will probably find that most of the discussions infavour of the white wall have never actually seen a direct comparison between the wall & the pj screen.

Here's some of the benifits to the pj screen over the painted wall.

Projector screens have been specially designed to control how the light from the projector if reflected back to the viewer. That is why there is different finishes available in projector screens. A matt white screen is suitable for projection in a controlled lighting enviorment where as a High gain Glass Beaded screen is better suited to projection in areas of amient light cannot be controlled as much beacuse the glass beaded surface enhance the amounted of reflected light from the projector to the audience.

Using a wall over a screen will also effect colour rendition and reduce contrast and sharpness depending on how smooth and white your wall is.

Another most important factors in the wall v's Screen discussion sometimes over looked is the use of a black border with a screen. Not only does this make your HT look alot more professional, but it creates the look of a giant plasma screen and not just a projector pointed at a flat surface. The Black border also effects how your eye proceve the contract between the picture and the wall. If you project straight onto a white wall, no matter how smooth the surface or white the colour, you are always contrasting the picture against the white surrounding it. A black border greatly enhances the experience when watching a pj on a wall over a screen.

Remember projector manufactures put alot of work into achieving the ultimate colour, contrast and sharpness in a picture, but alot of this is lost when projected on a wall? Here's what the pro's say.

And a very good point is: "Think about this for a moment...you will probably upgrade projectors every few years, as you will DVD players, audio components, etc. But high quality projection screens will last a lifetime. So we'd suggest you think of it in terms of a lifetime investment."

trabpc:

The screen sizes I was talking about was a diagional measurement. Think most screens are measured in inches diagional.

As I said before I think a fixed screen would fit your wall the best and look fantastic. If your looking more towards a 720p pj then this FIXED SCREEN might fit the budget

trabpc · 29-01-2008 9:51pm

I got the wiring finished last weekend. hope to have painting finished this weekend. the undercoat is white. final colour will be a darker cream colour.
Its either one of the Panasonic Projectors for me the ax200 or ae 2000

kaisersose77 · 29-01-2008 10:20pm

projection.ie are they kidding?

http://www.projection.ie/product_info.php?cPath=24_25_28&products_id=91

The same thing is 115euros on komplett and they wouldnt even be the cheapest

I dont know how they expect to sell anything at those rip off prices

Skatedude · 01-02-2008 8:54am

on the ax200 vrs the 2000. For movies the ax200 is brilliant for the price even though it is not native 1080p.
However, if you want to hook up a pc/ or games console, then the native 1080p on the 2000 is far better for gaming

trabpc · 01-02-2008 10:19am

Thanks Guys for the advise
any idea where i can get one of these?

http://www.optoma.co.uk/screendetails.aspx?ModelType=Motorised&PTypedb=Screens&ShowMenu=SC&PC=DE-GWII9120E

kaisersose77 · 01-02-2008 4:06pm

Optoma supposedly stopped manufacturing screens (or the company who was making them for optoma) and are meant to have new models in testing.

So very hard to find in europe it seems as only US sites seem to have optoma screens in stock.

jmal · 22-02-2008 7:02pm

Hey Trabpc,

Hows the Home Theatre coming. Any pictures yet????? Which PJ do you go for in the end?

trabpc · 23-02-2008 11:39pm

I got the TV Sorted Yesterday eventually!. I bought the Pioneer PDP-4280XD from Alliance Electrical. Thanks to Big Moe for that. Got the deal with the free Pioneer home cinema.(I have that on adverts don't need it) for €1950 not bad with the 5yr Warranty.

I got the 106" Panoview DE-9106EGS for 400GBP from

Quantum Electronics in the uk along with an Onkyo 605 for 360GBP and

Q Acoustics 1010i for 450 GBP all to go with Projector.

On the Projector!
Now here the problem I am dealing with a Guy from AVToad in the Uk he can get me the optoma HD65 for 420GBP I hoped to buy 2 as someone in work will take the other one so he is trying to get me a price on delivery for the last 10 days but still no responce but I may have to cancel one as no matter how hard I try I cant seem to fit it into my room .

Because of the limited zoom lens the image gets quite big at short distances and as I have a 106" screen I would need to place it at 3.7 meters from screen to avoid the image been outside the screen.
But because of lighting ETC the best I can manage distance from screen to PJ is about 4.1m Pity as the quality of the HD65 is amazing for the price

see below

http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=664736&page=42

(You may have to Join to see Pictures!)

some image for 420 pounds!

If anyone is interesed let me kow as I won't cancel the other one if they want it!

So it looks like ill be buying th PT-AE2000.again from the UK
I have got a price so far of 1300GBP so not to bad but still 3 times the price of the optoma.

I got carpets in this Weekend so Ill post pics soon.

Ill keep you updated on PJ when I purchase this week.

Regards,

trabpc · 24-02-2008 4:00pm

I forgot I took A pic on my mobile yesterday!

johnnyflav · 24-02-2008 11:46pm

trabpc wrote: »

I forgot I took A pic on my mobile yesterday!

Looks like a fantastic blank canvas. Can't wait to see the finished product

trabpc · 27-02-2008 8:47pm

Hi guys I ave most things in place now Onkyo 605 1010i speakers and a 106 greywolf screen.

but still no Projector. Still can't decide

options available

Epson tw 700 (not 24fps compatible) but 3yrs warranty 850 GBP

Panasonic PTAX200 from komplett 1100 euro but only 1yrs warranty

or optoma HD80 from uk for 1275 GBP 2ys warranty but very fussy on placement.

Other than that I can get a Optoma HD65 for 440GBP this seems a brilliant projector but I cant fit it in pity!

Help!
Im leaning towards the Panasonic PTAX200 at the mo as most my viewing for the next 18months to 2 yrs will be DVD/Sky.

No plans on buying Blueray yet till profiles sort them selves out and disk prices fall. I was in Virgin(think they call themselves something else now) and the had Bluerays for 40 yoyo's while the regular DVD's were 10-15 euro.

I don't remember in 1999-2000 paying more for DVD over VHS or have I forgotten.

trabpc · 04-03-2008 7:31pm

Just as well i got the Pioneer are these stories true?

http://www.trustedreviews.com/tvs/news/2008/03/04/Pioneer-Dropping-Plasma-Business/p1

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080304/ap_on_hi_te/japan_pioneer

trabpc · 07-03-2008 1:59pm

Just Bought the Panasonic PT-AX200 today. Will post some pic's when I have it set up.

trabpc · 12-03-2008 12:48pm

I probably wont get this set up properly for another month or so at my new Gaff so I set it up in my sitting room for a quick test. Its against a magnolia ish wall. unfortuantly my wall aint big enough. The door gets in the way but so far DVD looks ok please excuse the quality of the pics as they were taken on a 1.3mp phone!

so far my PT-AX200 seems pretty good. cant wait to try hd.

trabpc · 19-03-2008 10:04am

Here is a few more i took in the room I plan to Install it in. I won't have the screen up until the end of the month so these are off a Magnolia wall.

Only Disc I can find again is LOTR. Quality again is from my 1.3mp phone sorry!!

Image is about 5.5 ft high and 14ft across

trabpc · 17-04-2008 9:52am

pwd · 27-04-2008 5:41pm

Those photos look fantastic. Been considering getting the same projector myself.

trabpc · 28-04-2008 12:15pm

yea. I had planned on buying the AE2000 glad I went for the ax200 instead.
3 times cheaper and very happy with the quality. These pictures don't even do it justice. I Don't think illl bother with the screen.

Projector & TV 1080p or not

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