Is this acceptable???

FranchisePlayer

Well anyway went into my school today and just excepted another run of the mill day until we were told we were having a drug awareness talk.
So anyway was pretty decent first half an hour then they actually started to show us dead bodies disfigured with so much drug use bearing in mind the oldest there were 16 and the 1st years had the same talk:eek:
Now I don't know if this is due to the tragedy that occured in waterford recently and they have uped the ante but do you think it is right to show us dead people and use extreme scare tactics???? and Yes I Do know the world is not a nice place and really bad **** can happen but still..

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

nope, it's scare tactics and propoganda. It stops sod all people from taking drugs, and the lack of real useable information does potential harm to those who do.

Gordon

You don't like seeing dead people?

MagicMarker

What school is this? I want to send the person who came up with idea a hamper of muffins.

connundrum

Have you seen the front of your average tabloid over the past few years? Its probably nothing that wasn't already part of the general media.

What do you think would have got the point across more effectively?

andyl222

At 13 years old you would have seen worse on movies and TV shows... Its a scare tactic like the really graphic drink driving ads. You may deem the images unnecessary but to some other kid in your school they may be an effect deterrant.

MagicMarker

Mordeth wrote: »

It stops sod all people from taking drugs

What makes you say this?

Personally, if it stops even ONE person from taking drugs, then it's a good thing.

Deliverance

FranchisePlayer wrote: »

Well anyway went into my school today and just excepted another run of the mill day until we were told we were having a drug awareness talk.
So anyway was pretty decent first half an hour then they actually started to show us dead bodies disfigured with so much drug use bearing in mind the oldest there were 16 and the 1st years had the same talk:eek:
Now I don't know if this is due to the tragedy that occured in waterford recently and they have uped the ante but do you think it is right to show us dead people and use extreme scare tactics???? and Yes I Do know the world is not a nice place and really bad **** can happen but still..

Did it put you off drugs as an individual? Or did you feel patronised as a potential / user?

Oswald Osbourne

You kids need some sense scared into you. I hope you'll have a few sleepless nights ahead to comtemplate the error of your ways!

Trojan911

FranchisePlayer wrote: »

So anyway was pretty decent first half an hour then they actually started to show us dead bodies disfigured with so much drug use bearing in mind the oldest there were 16 and the 1st years had the same talk:eek:

The aim of the talk was to make you aware of what you might look like on a slab dead from a drugs overdose/abuse. You would do well to take heed.

biko

They should have beat you with sticks too. Just to hammer it home like.

foxface

Oswald Osbourne wrote: »

You kids need some sense scared into you. I hope you'll have a few sleepless nights ahead to comtemplate the error of your ways!

sleepless nights getting cans in to sleep!
what irony!

RealJohn

OP, if all they did was show you dead bodies and say "if you do drugs, this is what happens" then it was pretty pointless but you said yourself that the first half hour was decent. How was this so?

People do need to see the consequences of drug use because there's plenty of propaganda going around claiming it's not actually dangerous which is completely untrue but people need usable information as well as pictures of dead bodies.

bug

I don't personally see anything wrond with showing 13+ people pictures of dead bodies.

I don't really see how it's relative though.

Good old school, they always tackle things arseways.

Our sex talk was weird. Even at the time I thought that. Looking back it was still completely off the mark and totally abstract.

The drugs are bad mkay, here's some dead bodies for shock tactic...we'll thats fairly abstract. They never tell people why biologically or socially drug use is crap for you.
Telling 13+ years old's they are going to die because of drugs is weird. 13+ year old's dont really ever think they are going to die no matter what they do.
It's like schools think kids aren't capable of empathy and understanding complex social situations.
Get a real person in to tell them what the score was when they were on drugs, or how use may cause serious depression after etc.. Post pubescent teens know what the fuk these things are.

Burp Bleugh

Drugs are bad, m'kay

l3LoWnA

AS long as they also show you pictures of what happens if you become massively obese from overreating and not excersising, what could happen your body in a crash if you drive after drinking or equally footage of what could happen your children if you become an alcoholic and what a splattered person looks like after walking out on the road on front of a bus without taking proper care and attention....as long as they showed you a picture of a young girl giving birth to a dead child or a child with massive health problems and not long to live (to teach you not to have unprotected sex - in fairness I'd say it happens as regularly as deaths from cocaine in the country if not more regularly) and they then show you what people look like who are dying from lung cancer, having smoked all their lives, withering away in a hospice bed - then it's acceptable. All of the above can be avoided if we all live perfect lives so if they're going to try scare tactics with one, why not with them all?

seamus

bug wrote: »

Our sex talk was weird. Even at the time I thought that. Looking back it was still completely off the mark and totally abstract.

We had an "Introduction to puberty" back in sixth class. It wasn't called that, but that's it's exactly what it was. No mention of sex, just "This is what's going to happen to your bodies".

Then for Junior Cert science, we learned the process of sex in a cold and scientific way. Of course we already knew this, we'd just never seen our bits drawn in profile, chopped down the middle.

In fourth year we got shown a whole pile of slides of diseased penises and vaginas.

I don't recall any actual attempt to tell us about sex.

Oswald Osbourne

seamus wrote: »

In fourth year we got shown a whole pile of diseased penises

Yeah we got shown all that in the first week of first year. One of the benefits of going to a christian brothers school.

humanji

Does the school not have to get parental consent to show dead bodies to kids? What if you get soom fragile freaky kid (every class had one) flips out over seeing them? Is the school not opening it self up for some sort law suit or something?

Cabaal

MagicMarker wrote: »

What makes you say this?

Personally, if it stops even ONE person from taking drugs, then it's a good thing.

Have to agree with this, when I was in 4th year my class went to a drug treatment center where recovering addicts talked to us about how it ****ed up there lives and their familys lives, if it stopped one or two people in my class taking drugs then it was worth it!

casey212

You are all missing the real reason for such activities.

This has been part of a larger campaign to reduce the humanity of the people.
Take newspapers, television, even the film the Wild Bunch by Peckinpah in 1969, images are presented which should cause disgust. However as the process is continually repeated over long periods of time people build up a tolerance. This affects the person on a subconcious level in their daily lives.

These methods are well understood by the people in charge. Coincidences do not occur, never mind what your new age religions may tell you.

xzanti

When I was in 3rd year the parents of Leah Betts came in to give us all a talk on drugs, they brought this really charming PR guy, seemed like a bit of a comedian to start with but by the end of it it got a bit nasty, horror stories etc.. Then they started telling us about how kids our age were taunting their son at school over Leah's death and making jokes, basically calling us nasty little **** etc.. I didn't see how that had anything to do with drug awareness, but I suppose they must have still been quite bitter, she was only a few years dead.. Otherwise it was quite an interesting hour or so, got us out of class for a bit anyway...

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

do youi know who lea betts was?
she was a dumb bint, who (thanks to wonderful government drug education), drowned herself after taking ONE ecstacy tablet.

She is the poster child for proper drug education. ecstasy had about as much to do with her death as an airplane did wth katy french's.

xzanti

Mordeth wrote: »

do youi know who lea betts was?
she was a dumb bint, who (thanks to wonderful government drug education), drowned herself after taking ONE ecstacy tablet.

She is the poster child for proper drug education. ecstasy had about as much to do with her death as an airplane did wth katy french's.

I know who she was yeah, my point was that the talk we were given wasn't much cop in the way of education, more about scaring the sh*t out of us, which is the point of this thread is it not?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

.....


I don't like being corrected.
you have made an enemy this day.

Procasinator

bug wrote: »

Good old school, they always tackle things arseways.

Our sex talk was weird.

The way that unfolded is funnyez!:D

Dragan

MagicMarker wrote: »

What makes you say this?

Personally, if it stops even ONE person from taking drugs, then it's a good thing.

Not really. It's a stupid and pointless way to try and stop people taking drugs. It was the same when i was in school and you would think our methods of drug education would have improved in the last 10 years. Sadly not.

I hate the whole "if it stop even one person" line.....there are far better methods that would help a lot more people actually understand drugs.

xzanti wrote: »

When I was in 3rd year the parents of Leah Betts came in to give us all a talk on drugs

Can't say i see the point in that either. I mean, i understand they suffered a great tragedy and all but what the **** do they know about drugs?

Their daugther had obviously been very poorly educated about them to do what she did.

humanji

Dragan wrote: »

I hate the whole "if it stop even one person" line.....there are far better methods that would help a lot more people actually understand drugs.

You don't have to choose only one method to inform people.

Mr. CooL ICE

I blame anti-drugs campaigns for me take drugs. Once I grew up, I decided to find out about them for myself, and realised these campaigners were talking out of their arses. My first ever spliff was almost like a big "**** YOU" to all those morons who drowned me in their tear-filled sob stories of loved ones whose faces balooned after taking drugs and who blackmailed those former heroin addicts come guest speakers into coming to these schools in exchange for methadone.

To anyone who has never taken a drug and might consider it: The internet is a vast source of unbiased information. Do your research, know your limits, and don't let any conservative moron tell you what you can and cannot do.

laughin'joe

No it's terrible what they done to yous in your school and it's proven that them tatics don't work and have the oppsite effect on some people ie. making them go out and try it to prove the teacher wrong...I said some people. Why don't they bring in real people to talk to yous and I mean real people real junkies who are still on it and some who are trying to get of it. I think it would be a much better to show you first hand what it is really like, not dead bloated bodies. I think if school kids seen how life wrecking it is, I mean if you are able to talk to these people and hear the way they talk back to you and see them in their drugged state it would be better. we had something simular in our school but back then it was all drinking and glue sniffing but they brought in these people that were either still on it or trying to cope without it and it put everything in to a new light. We all said at the end of it, "it wasn't going to stop us from doing it but it lat us know if we abused it this is the outcome....I think it is the best practice to use. It dosen't say don't do it because we all know if someone says don't touch the wall the paint is wet we will touch it just to see it's human nature and showing videos and pictures leaves a lot of unanswered questions like why did they do it and only real people can answer that.

FranchisePlayer wrote: »

Well anyway went into my school today and just excepted another run of the mill day until we were told we were having a drug awareness talk.
So anyway was pretty decent first half an hour then they actually started to show us dead bodies disfigured with so much drug use bearing in mind the oldest there were 16 and the 1st years had the same talk:eek:
Now I don't know if this is due to the tragedy that occured in waterford recently and they have uped the ante but do you think it is right to show us dead people and use extreme scare tactics???? and Yes I Do know the world is not a nice place and really bad **** can happen but still..

laughin'joe

it's not "sense scared into them" they need, it's called education. And that whats wrong here people think by scaring kids it will work...what happens when they grow up or even worse see one of their friends do drugs in front of them and not die, what then. The kid knows the truth, not all people die from drug taking and when he sees this will he do it...with the added peer pressure hmmmm! I think so. See kids rebel and if you say to a kid this is bad and that is bad and he does it and finds out he likes it he wont believe a word from another teacher or parent so...you scare your kids and I'll educate mine....

Oswald Osbourne wrote: »

You kids need some sense scared into you. I hope you'll have a few sleepless nights ahead to comtemplate the error of your ways!

Dun laoire

MagicMarker wrote: »

What school is this? I want to send the person who came up with idea a hamper of muffins.

:D good lad

Hugh_C

Mordeth wrote: »

do you know who lea betts was?
she was a dumb bint ...

I can't believe you're a moderator, speaking ill of the dead like that. You ought to show her some respect regardless of how she died.

laughin'joe

So I take it you knew this person personally you hung around with her and know her family well ???

Mordeth wrote: »

do youi know who lea betts was?
she was a dumb bint, who (thanks to wonderful government drug education), drowned herself after taking ONE ecstacy tablet.

She is the poster child for proper drug education. ecstasy had about as much to do with her death as an airplane did wth katy french's.

DeVore

hughchal wrote: »

I can't believe you're a moderator, speaking ill of the dead like that. You ought to show her some respect regardless of how she died.

He is the moderator of Discworld, not Afterhours. He is just a regular user here and to be fair he has a point. If we genuinely educated our youth about the various dangers of various drugs they might be smarter about the topic.

Does anyone think joints are the same as smack? Why do we continue with the use of the term "drugs" then, like its a catch all term.

Marajuana is a gateway drug only because when you try it as a teenager and it doesnt wreck your life and kill you that night, you understand you have been lied to. Then its open season to see how far the rabbit hole goes.


DeV.

herbieflowers

It's reflective of our dumb society and dumb children that images, as opposed to rational debate and information, are used to 'shock' people...like that Sarah Kane play, Blasted...ugh...

Milktrolley

seamus wrote: »

Then for Junior Cert science, we learned the process of sex in a cold and scientific way.

And it was the only chapter in the whole book that didn't have any experiments. I was so disappointed...

FranchisePlayer

Yeah it did have a profound effect on me so I suppose it was worth it. I also forgot to mention that a former addict talked to us she was 20 started taking when she was 14 because she was raped and did not tell anyone and she got worse..


We also saw a woman who was on sky news a year ago beacuse she was such a servere heroin addict and had to face having her arms amputated and is now is recovered and writing a book now,

This maybe because what happened to me but I feel fierce bitter about this seeing as there are people who have their life choice made for them such as getting an incurable illness and dying and people like this woman get a second chance and they threw their life away:mad::mad:

slipss

The probelm with these kind of tactics is that some of the time they have a negative effect on getting kids to stay away from drugs because of the way the information is presented. They show, for example, a picture of Leah Betts, or whatever her name was, and say "look see!!! this will happen to you if you try ecstacy. If you even take one ecstacy pill YOU WILL DIE!"

And then of course when your 14 or 15 or 16 and you look around and lots of people you know are taking E and they aren't dying, none of them are in hospital beds in comas, infact they seem to be having a pretty good time. And then some kids will say to themselves "I bet that stuff they told us about cocaine and heroin is a load of bollox too". Its treating teenagers like children (which technically they are I suppose), and lying, overexaggerating to them for there own good, and there is nothing in the world teenagers despise more than being patronised and talked down to. The reality is, in your average class of dublin 5fth years, half the class will know more about drugs than the people that are standing infront of them trying tell them about all the negatives. If they just spoke to them like adults , gave them all the information and asked them thier own opinions on it with out trying to scare them, then it would have a far better chance of reducing the harm drugs do. Just my opinion.

slipss

Mordeth wrote: »

ecstasy had about as much to do with her death as an airplane did wth katy french's.

Thats not really true now is it Mordeth, if she hadn't been taking ecstacy she never would have drank all that water, so its not correct to say it had absalutely nothing to do with her death. But I do agree, poor education contributed equally to it as much as the drug did.

monkey tennis

hughchal wrote: »

You ought to show her some respect regardless of how she died.

Please explain why.




I've never understood this business of appropriating 'respect' to someone just because they died...

monkey tennis

slipss wrote: »

Thats not really true now is it Mordeth, if she hadn't been taking ecstacy she never would have drank all that water, so its not correct to say it had absalutely nothing to do with her death. But I do agree, poor education contributed equally to it as much as the drug did.

That's like saying something like 'if she hadn't gone on that long run, she never would have drunk all that water'. The poor education contributed entirely to her death. The water alone killed her (drunk out of ignorance), not the drug. None of the other people with her who took e died.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

monkey tennis wrote: »

Please explain why.




I've never understood this business of appropriating 'respect' to someone just because they died...

this is why

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLVsIpejFgM

yes I know I already pasted it in another thread.. but he asked.. and it fits *so* perfectly.


and to whoever asked if I knew leah betts, no.. but I know enough not to drown myself with a bottle.

slipss

monkey tennis wrote: »

That's like saying something like 'if she hadn't gone on that long run, she never would have drunk all that water'. The poor education contributed entirely to her death. The water alone killed her (drunk out of ignorance), not the drug. None of the other people with her who took e died.

Theres a difference Monkey Tennis (great name by the way, is that tennis where the competitors are monkeys or is it tennis where the monkey takes the place of the ball?) just like one of the reasons people die from dehydration when on ecstacy is that the natural feel good effects mask the pain and discomfort dehydration brings, the same is true with hyperhydration. Drinking large quanties of water can be very uncomfortable giving you bad heart burn for some people and an extreme bloated feeling in the stomach, ecstacy would mask those warnings, long distance running would not. Also there is an argument to be made that when on ecstacy your judgment is compromised, as obviously you aren't thinking normally, which could also have a hand in someone drinking far too much water. Ecstacy also acts as an anti-diuretic for alot of people, this could also increase the chance of water intoxification. It is not like saying "something like 'if she hadn't gone on that long run, she never would have drunk all that water". And just incase you think I'm one of these super anti-drug people, I'm not, check any other posts I've made in relation to drugs on here. I know what I'm talking about most of the time on the subject and the ultra defensive uninformed atitude of pro-drug (not an accurate term, I know) people and comments is just as guilty as the super mega anti-drug attitudes of propergating inaccurate information, its damaging to both sides of the argument and to harm reduction as a whole. Now if I fall off this horse I could really injure myself, so thats all I have to say.

thebman

MagicMarker wrote: »

What makes you say this?

Personally, if it stops even ONE person from taking drugs, then it's a good thing.

Damn straight and we should show teenage girls of pregnancies with complications to scare them out of having sex while still in scool!

:rolleyes:

I think its a little far. Give them the honest facts if people are still stupid enough to take the drugs then there was no reasonable way of stopping them.

No need to scare the crap or traumatise some of the other kids in the class with graphic images.

Naos

10,000 people?

What school was that?

LordChessington

LordChessington wrote: »

I blame anti-drugs campaigns for me take drugs. Once I grew up, I decided to find out about them for myself, and realised these campaigners were talking out of their arses. My first ever spliff was almost like a big "**** YOU" to all those morons who drowned me in their tear-filled sob stories of loved ones whose faces balooned after taking drugs and who blackmailed those former heroin addicts come guest speakers into coming to these schools in exchange for methadone.

To anyone who has never taken a drug and might consider it: The internet is a vast source of unbiased information. Do your research, know your limits, and don't let any conservative moron tell you what you can and cannot do.

DeVore wrote: »

Marajuana is a gateway drug only because when you try it as a teenager and it doesnt wreck your life and kill you that night, you understand you have been lied to. Then its open season to see how far the rabbit hole goes.

2 of the best posts in the entire thread. Makes a refreshing change from some of the BS like....

andyl222 wrote: »

At 13 years old you would have seen worse on movies and TV shows... Its a scare tactic like the really graphic drink driving ads. You may deem the images unnecessary but to some other kid in your school they may be an effect deterrant.

How the fnck can you compare seeing a wax dummy or a CGI version of some dead celebrity with pictures of the bodies of people who have actualy lived?

I'll simplify it for you:

movies = fake
real life = real

OP:

I, for one, would not deem it acceptable. It's the equivalent of showing mangled bodies in car wrecks to prevent speeding, or those pro lifers waving posters of aborted foetuses all over town.

Nobody should be forcefully subjected to anything of that nature.

FranchisePlayer

Mr.S wrote: »

the whole point is to scare you, like thoes smoking adds.

in other news, my old school of 10,000 people had a drug raid today and they closed the schools gates and brought in loads of police with snifer dog and searched everyones locker. lovelly:)

No that I think about it one lad who saw the dead body started to ball because he told me after that it reminded him of his grandad dead and Tbh it reminded me of my brother(he did not die of drugs) also tis not fair to put that **** on us like humanjii said without parent consent:(

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

plenty of women who see the abortion-haters pictures still have abortions...

FranchisePlayer

Mr.S wrote: »

and Franchise, ask yourself this, when that lad who cried is offered drugs, most likley it will bring up thoes images, so chances are he will say no. which is a good thing?

Yeah I suppose but still not right to show it without parents consent..

Hugh_C

monkey tennis wrote: »

Please explain why.

I've never understood this business of appropriating 'respect' to someone just because they died...

I've never understood this business of appropriating disrespect to someone just because they died needlessly.

Neither you, nor more particularly Mordeth knows the circumstances of her taking the drug. She was innocent in the ways of drug taking to be sure, but to class her as a dumb bint to quote Mordeth is inappropriate, insensitive and immature in the extreme.

I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with her use as the poster child for proper drug education again quoting Mordeth - that campaign manifestly didn't work.