Bye Bye driver!

fred funk }{

A few details first. My handicap is 9 and I would consider myself a very inconsistent golfer. I'm capable of shooting close to par on a good day and on a bad day it could be mid 80's. I put a lot of this down to my driving.

My long irons and short game is pretty consistent but its my driving which is the weak link. I'm a big hitter and when I'm driving well I can score very low for a 9 HC but unfortunately that's the exception rather that the norm.

I invested in a Cobra Baffler 18* hybrid about a month ago and all I can say is WOW. I'm consistently 250+ from the tee and nearly every shot is in play.
I've played three rounds with it and the worst round from the three was 78.
The best was 75 today in the wind, par is 72.

I wish I got one of these bad boys along time ago. I'm convinced that if most of us ditched the driver that our scores would dramatically improve but unfortunately we are guilty of the advertising hype of drivers and other such things including putters and balls.

I was one of those people who paid a lot of money for gear when its only now I look back that I realise that it was all a load of Bollix!

Henry Ford III

Fred, that's like playing with 1 arm. An admission of failure. If you can hit it long, and obviously sometimes straight, you can shoot par or better.

Take 15% off your effort with the driver and swing smoother. Don't rush it.

It's not easy to do as we all tend to stand up on the teee with the longest, lightest club in the bag, and simply go at it too hard.

If you can hit a rescue club 250 yards and straight, and also hit long irons, then hitting 280+ yard drives should not be an issue.

Bon chance.

BrianD3

Often thought of doing something similar myself but the "macho" appeal of battering the driver is part of the enjoyment of golf for me. Once or twice I have played in competition after I had forgotten my woods and was forced to use long irons of the tee. In two rounds I don't think I was in trouble once which is unusal for me, I also scored well. But I found it boring.

However unless you are playing a real monster of a course taking a long iron or rescue off the tee is probably a very sensible approach, playing the percentages, risk v reward etc.

I have also heard it said that most golfers use too little loft and too stiff a shaft in their driver. Perhaps if people used a 13 degree driver they'd be in play more often, also I think that too stiff a shaft will tend to exaggerate a slice.

css1

I gotta say I completely agree with Henry here.. I hit the ball a long way myself, 290+ carry usually. I used to be inconsistent as hell, but I swing 80-90% of what i can actually swing with the driver, and things are a hell of a lot more consistent... I also have a 19 degree rescue, which is sweet, but to be honest the heads are so big on modern drivers, that being confident in it, really helps a lot... Try shortening your backswing a bit, and concentrate on a smooth slow take away... worked for me..

WHIP IT!

Personally I think there's a case for both - although, I would suggest that for someone playing as low as 9, like yourself Fred, it would generally be necessary to "go for it" a bit more, as in take the driver and try and hit alot of Greens in Reg? I play of 14 myself, so I'm only guessing...

Although, if you're scoring better this way, then there's your answer...

Bottom Line: This game is not about 'How?', just 'How Many?' and whatever method you use to get the lowest scores may be different for everybody...

PS - I just came back from the range and I hit the ball the best I've hit it in 3months.... Just wanted to tell somebody

stockdam

Good points made on both sides.

Hitting the fairway is very important to scoring well consistantly.

If you do this with a 5 wood or a utility club then that's what you should do.

As was said the heads in modern drivers are so big that it makes hitting the ball straight that much easier.

A lot of it is confidence and what works for one person doesn't for another.

Probably for you it may be better just to use your driver when you have a low risk drive and want the extra distance.

Mister Sifter

BrianD3 wrote: »

Often thought of doing something similar myself but the "macho" appeal of battering the driver is part of the enjoyment of golf for me.

I have also heard it said that most golfers use too little loft and too stiff a shaft in their driver. Perhaps if people used a 13 degree driver they'd be in play more often, also I think that too stiff a shaft will tend to exaggerate a slice.

I'd agree with that brian. Alot of golfers go for a stiff shaft and 8 or 9 degrees of loft because they think it will make them a better player. I had a 9.5 degree stiff Titleist driver for years and i had a tendency to hit a snap hook every now and then. Since switching to a 9.5 degree regular i hit it so much better and the snap hook is gone.

On the driver debate, i've been driver-less for a few weeks and have been hitting the 3-wood all the time. I've probably hit alot more fairways, but i'm left with longer shots in and certain holes play alot different. Still though, it's taught me that i should cut back on my use of the driver and on certain holes just knock the 3-wood.

Aesop

I struggle a lot with the driver. I gave up hitting it for about two years and it's only in the last 12 months I have started hitting it again. I made the mistake Brian mentioned and got a stiff shafted driver, 8.5 degree TM 320 :rolleyes:. Great when I am hitting the ball well but very unforgiving otherwise. I now have a Callaway Big Bertha Ti 10.5 that is much more consistent.

I only take it out when I absolutely have to or there is enough room that I can get away with a badly hit tee-shot. It's amazing how little I do need the driver, usually 5 or 6 holes a round. Problem is if I do start hitting good drives I find it hard to throttle back to a 3 wood.

One Cold Hand

css1 wrote: »

I gotta say I completely agree with Henry here.. I hit the ball a long way myself, 290+ carry usually. I used to be inconsistent as hell, but I swing 80-90% of what i can actually swing with the driver, and things are a hell of a lot more consistent... I also have a 19 degree rescue, which is sweet, but to be honest the heads are so big on modern drivers, that being confident in it, really helps a lot... Try shortening your backswing a bit, and concentrate on a smooth slow take away... worked for me..

What do you play off?

WHIP IT!

I'd like to do an experiment - two rounds of golf, no tee shots... In one round, place the ball 220yds from the tee in the fairway and play your "second" from there...

In the other, place the ball 290yds in the rough - or in various spots; rough, fairway bunkers, the odd fairway ( ) and play your "second" from there...

I wonder where the better score would come from and would it differ greatly from person to person... I suppose some people's strength is their driving, others is something else...

Mister Sifter

WHIP IT! wrote: »

I'd like to do an experiment - two rounds of golf, no tee shots... In one round, place the ball 220yds from the tee in the fairway and play your "second" from there...

In the other, place the ball 290yds in the rough - or in various spots; rough, fairway bunkers, the odd fairway ( ) and play your "second" from there...

I wonder where the better score would come from and would it differ greatly from person to person... I suppose some people's strength is their driving, others is something else...

I've always played along the lines of... i'd rather be 100 yards away and in the rough, than 130 yards away and on the fairway. That's been kind of changing lately though. That experiment would be pretty interesting.

WHIP IT!

I would guess, that if I hit 10 shots from centre-fairway, 130yds out and 10 from the rough, 100yds out I'd have fairly similiar results... Maybe slightly better from the fairway...

I dunno, hard to say really!

Mister Sifter

I might actually give it a go on a quiet day on the course. Even over 9 holes.

css1

One Cold Hand wrote: »

What do you play off?

At the moment, nothing, I manged to injure my hand.. But I was off 12, and breaking 80 nearly every round before I had to stop..

Not really relevant to the post, I went from being an absolutely crap driver of the ball, to having it become the most reliable part of my game, by a simple change in mental approach.. I used to have it in my head that every time I picked up the driver, that the ball was going to be on the green, and swing accordingly.. The results were erratic to say the least as you can imagine..

A good few years ago I was playing in a competition and sliced the crap out of the driver, ball went OB. As I went to the bag for another ball, i changed to the 3 wood. Ended up playing the exact same shot, but the ball was still in play... I think that is what the OP is noticing the most, distance aside....

One Cold Hand

css1 wrote: »

At the moment, nothing, I manged to injure my hand.. But I was off 12, and breaking 80 nearly every round before I had to stop..

Not really relevant to the post,

I realise the question was slightly off topic, but it sometimes makes me laugh when people come on here saying they hit drives of 290yard carry! Is this your average drive, or did you mean that you once hit a drive (maybe downwind) that carried 290 yds?

css1

One Cold Hand wrote: »

I realise the question was slightly off topic, but it sometimes makes me laugh when people come on here saying they hit drives of 290yard carry! Is this your average drive, or did you mean that you once hit a drive (maybe downwind) that carried 290 yds?

Average carry man, distance isn't everything, so hold off the lecture please, and let the fella discuss his driving woes..

Adiaga 2

To the OP I would say don't give up on your driver completely. Work on it til you regain your confidence rather than just discarding it. It will bring more par-5s into range in two and allow you be more attcking with your approaches to par-4s. Try what HF3 suggested above and work on a smoother swing with it and particularly your take-away, as someone else mentioned. I'd say your overall scoring potential would be badly affected by not carrying a driver. That's just my twopence worth.

Henry Ford III

290 yards average carry is enormous pucking out for a scratch golfer or even a pro, never mind a 12 handicapper.

I play off 6 and my average drive, including run wouldn't be that far I reckon.

My new conforming R7 arrived today btw Maybe that will put some extra heat into it?

PhilipMarlowe

290 yards as an average drive (not just carry) would have put you in about 30th place on the european tour (out of maybe 190 people)
300 yard average goes to top 5....

Mister Sifter

Henry Ford III wrote: »

290 yards average carry is enormous pucking out for a scratch golfer or even a pro, never mind a 12 handicapper.

I play off 6 and my average drive, including run wouldn't be that far I reckon.

My new conforming R7 arrived today btw Maybe that will put some extra heat into it?

The lower handicap player doesn't neccesarily hit it further than a higher handicapper though. I'm quite often outhit by mid-teen handicappers and i'm low/mid single figures. I wouldn't consider myself short off the tee either and would average around 250-260.

One Cold Hand

fred funk }{ wrote: »

I wish I got one of these bad boys along time ago. I'm convinced that if most of us ditched the driver that our scores would dramatically improve but unfortunately we are guilty of the advertising hype of drivers and other such things including putters and balls.

I was one of those people who paid a lot of money for gear when its only now I look back that I realise that it was all a load of Bollix!

I'm glad this is working for you OP, but I don't think it would necessarily work for everyone. I tried this for a while and it didn't really improve my accuracy. I find it just as easy (or hard?!) to hit the fairway with my driver as my fairway woods. As I said, each to their own and glad it's working.

css1 wrote: »

Average carry man, distance isn't everything, so hold off the lecture please, and let the fella discuss his driving woes..

As someone just pointed out, an average carry of 290yds (305/310 total?) would have you among the biggest hitters in professional golf!

I'm having a go or saying that I don't believe you, it's just that it's something I see quite often: People over-estimating the distance they hit it.

Just to put it in perspective, the average par 4 is, say, 370 yds (?) This means that you generally hit it to an average of 60 yards on any given par 4.
If this is the case then fair enough and well done, but I really think you need to start working on your short game. From 60 yards, lobbing it on the green and taking 2 putts should pretty straight forward.

f22

Completely agree here. Not wanting to call anyone a liar but I'm a low handicapper myself and don't often get outhit, including in pro-ams. I can tell you honestly that I have never played with anyone with a "consistent" 290 carry or close to it. Yes you can have days with good weather and nice wind assistance, so I suggest you sharpen up that short game and join the PGA tour.

WHIP IT!

WHIP IT! wrote: »

PS - I just came back from the range and I hit the ball the best I've hit it in 3months.... Just wanted to tell somebody

Shocking forum etiquette I know, to not only change the subject but also quote yourself!

But forgive me... went range again tonight... and hit it just as good... maybe even (whisper it!) a little better...

I think I may be finally remembering how to play this game... by God it's been a while! (my last round in the mid-thirties was about four months ago!)

PhilipMarlowe

WHIP IT! wrote: »

But forgive me... went range again tonight... and hit it just as good... maybe even (whisper it!) a little better...

Range Shmange.
Talk to the hand and Put a pencil and scorecard in yer pocket

PhilipMarlowe

f22 wrote: »

...suggest you sharpen up that short game and join the PGA tour.

Maybe he can hit it a mile but not straight?????
How many fairways per round? Top 30 european tour hits average of 9 or so per round (65 or 66% )

I've played with a a few pros (inc. someone who was top 5 at one point on the european tour for 'total driving' combination of distance and accuracy) - the best drivers of the ball hit it high - practically all carry.
I could belt one out there on his coat tails an odd time but it wouldn't be nearly as graceful and would have plenty of run on it to catch up too.
A 290 yard carry would be my best drive in about 4 rounds of golf.... not my damn average.

PhilipMarlowe

Etiquette gone mad I know to be hogging the forum but.....
From this post on another forum that I just came across when looking up averages...

Originally Posted by silliwilli
I carry it about 280 yards, I know this as its been a wet summer and my ball has ended up about 2 yards in front of or behind its pitch mark

My driving accuracy has improved since switching to the Taylor Made Burner driver about a month ago, I probably hit around 60% fairways but I tend to miss real bad once a round, mainly right!

Not to pick on you but just to make a point.

As relayed to me by the Trackman Rep on the PGA Tour. (trackman is a launch monitor that actually measures the flight of the ball by radar, not by an algorithm of the spin within the first few inches of flight.)

A pure 7 iron carry distance of 170 yards equates to a driver carry of approximately 265 yards. A carry of 265 yards puts you squarely in the middle of the PGA Tour driving distance stats (top 60 or so).

For those that are considering their roll out yardage, that number is meaningless. the ONLY thing that matters is carry. Roll is transient based on the course conditions, ball flight, shot shape etc, but carry is something you can rely on.

Oh and as an aside... the carry number of 265 I mentioned, into a 10mph or so head wind, was approx 235 yards of carry with a driver.


To anyone that REALLY wants to know how far they hit it, take a buddy and a laser range finder... put your buddy in the center of a BIG fairway 250 yards out... and see how many balls you carry to him, I would have to guess for nearly every person on this board that number would be very close to zero even for those that think they hit the ball 300 yards.

It may be off topic but it's on a post where someone is considering their driver strategy. Other people going on about massive driver carry only leads to 'driver envy' and may colour their thinking about leaving the driver in the bag.
Personally I too would find it like admitting defeat to some extent and would think that the trick is to know when to leave it in the bag..... there are some holes where driver is a safer play... (especially if you can fly it over all those fairway bunkers out there about 287 from the back stakes) :rolleyes:
Find yourself a reliable driver - I still use a cleveland launcher 400 10.5 degrees which isn't the most modern but the most reliable i've found. I would love to change to a new burner or something of the ilk but only if I would keep the reliability and playability. Any extra length would be the cherry on top.

WHIP IT!

Licksy wrote: »

Range Shmange.
Talk to the hand and Put a pencil and scorecard in yer pocket

Couldn't agree with you more, normally... but I've been working on something recently, and this week is the first time I've been able to say "Oh, hang on - this feels like it's working..."

Just taking baby steps at the minute... so we'll see where it takes me...

Swing well my friends, swing well...

css1

I gotta apologise to the OP for getting people sidetracked on his thread, and guys PGA stats aside, I hit it as far as I hit it. There's a lot more to the game than distance like I tried to say above..

To put your equation into perspective, I hit a 7 iron between 160-170 Metres, depending on the ball I use, and thats using a 3/4 swing. I really don't know why I am even trying to justify myself here. Distance has never been an issue for me golfing, it's always been focusing on getting the accuracy that has. Hence my change to a shorter swing, etc. Getting everything right in the same round has always been my issue to be honest, and getting a dodgey hand hasnt helped things :mad: My handicap is 12 right now, realistically if i can shake this injury I could play off 6-8 easy enough, but every time I start getting into the zone where I am pulling off scores, i've hurt my hand again. And the recovery time is 6-9 months to get back to anywhere near where I left off. All I will say is that I hope none of you guys hit a stone and dislocate your thumb because of it, it's not a nice thing.. I am not going to comment on my game anymore guys, lets get back to the OP.

css1

BrianD3 wrote: »

I have also heard it said that most golfers use too little loft and too stiff a shaft in their driver. Perhaps if people used a 13 degree driver they'd be in play more often, also I think that too stiff a shaft will tend to exaggerate a slice.

I used to use an 8, and an 8.5 degree driver, and to be honest I didn't find that I gained anything when I was swinging well. I did notice that when I was any way off in my swing, I would end up with an abysmal shot.

Also on the degree of stiffness of a shaft, from my own personal experience. I only ever slice a driver that has too flexible a shaft, I've never been fitted or anything, but I do know I need one, otherwise the ball is gone so far right it's not funny!!

Henry Ford III

css1 wrote: »

....I hit a 7 iron between 160-170 Metres, depending on the ball I use, and thats using a 3/4 swing.

187 yards with a 7 iron with a 3/4 swing :eek:

That is tour pro distance, or even beyond it.

f22

Henry Ford III wrote: »

187 yards with a 7 iron with a 3/4 swing :eek:

That is tour pro distance, or even beyond it.

Yep, Bubba Watson is starting to get worried