Do you "impose" your values on meat eaters?

mike65

Or expect them to accommodate you without recipricol behaviour when you cook for others?

Mike.

Ger the man

Im not a vegan but I once knew a girl who was, she played hot and cold with me and on several occasions trying to force her vegan lifestyle on myself. She was the self righteous (I am always right and everyone should be like me)type and preached to everyone about it,but I generally didnt have a problem with her being a vegan. When she started to interrupt me in restaraunts while giving my order that was the end of it. Everyone has a right to eat what they like but being spoken to like a child and being made feel there is something wrong with you because of your food choice is very annoying!

Peanut

I don't try to impose my non-meat eating on anyone, but in reply to your question...

Would you be offended if a conservative Jew wouldn't eat your non-kosher meal? Or Muslim would not eat your non-halal meat?

Would you then expect them to serve food that they don't eat, just for you?

In contrast, most meat-eaters will eat at least some non-meat, so it's not a case that they have to serve food that they won't eat themselves, just for the sake of veg*ans.

I'm sure that was as clear as mud

BurnsCarpenter

mike65 wrote: »

Or expect them to accommodate you without recipricol behaviour when you cook for others?

Mike.

If I'm eating in somebody else's place they're probably a friend. I wouldn't expect them to cook something just for me. They might choose to, but I'd be happy to eat the veg, or bring something along.
I certainly wouldn't cook meat for guests - I can't imagine anybody I even vaguely know being annoyed by this.

rockbeer

mike65 wrote:

Do you "impose" your values on meat eaters?

What, like tying them down and force-feeding them vegetables?

I honestly don't know what you mean.. how could I "enforce" my dislike of farming on anyone?

If you mean do I engage in discussion (and ocassional heated disagreement) with people who think differently to me, then yes... but who doesn't?

mike65 wrote:

Or expect them to accommodate you without recipricol behaviour when you cook for others

I wouldn't expect anyone to cook anything they don't like, for me or anyone else. If you're saying that if a meat-eating friend cooks me an omelette I should be prepared to cook them a steak in return I think you're missing the point... If I'm cooking for other people, I always try to make something that everyone will like - or at least enough choice that everyone will find something they like. What sort of hospitality would it be to do otherwise?

Your question seems to imply a perception of vegtarian cuisine as somehow completely detached from meat-based - as though there were no connection between the two. This is ridiculous: a diet consisting of predominantly meat might suit cats but it isn't healthy for humans. I would imagine the diets of most meat-eating humans consist of predominantly non-meat foods.

Silent Partner

Hello.

I don't generally have too many people to the house to cook for. Both myself and the girlfriend are vegetarians, as are her parents. So it's ok when they come over or vice versa. My own family are meat eaters and that's grand by me. If they come down to the house, we usually end up going out for lunch. That way a) I don't have to cook at all or clean up and b) they can eat what they like.
As for imposing my values, live and let live. My choice to not eat meat is not your choice. Usually when I say I'm a vegetarian, I get more questions than anything else. If someone wants to eat meat, it's their call. I can no more impose vegetarianism on them than imposing my religion/football team/breakfast preferences.

lizzyvera

I never ever ever talk about being vegetarian and even when my boyfriend asks about it I won't talk about it. However, when I go for meals people give out to me and tell me it's unhealthy etc so I don't eat in other people's houses anymore because it stresses me out!

seamus

It's usually the meat eaters who feel the need to question vegetarians and "impose" their opinions IMO.

On the rare occasion I would cook for someone else I would ask them whether the meal was OK. If they said they'd like some meat, I'd cook it for them. It's never occured yet, people are generally more than happy to eat veggie. If I was going to someone's house, I'd let them know I was veggie in advance and offer to bring something.
In the past if I've ended up being served food without advance warning, I'll usually eat around the meat or politely decline and not eat (in the case of something like lasagne).

Peanut

lizzyvera wrote: »

... However, when I go for meals people give out to me and tell me it's unhealthy etc ...

I have given up on people with that ridiculous attitude, but if you could be bothered to argue with them then you can mention that many animals are practically vegetarian with no health problems, so they are talking rubbish, eg chimpanzees, other types of apes, farm animals etc.

If they persist in being dumbasses, you could mention about 400 million Indians are vegetarian (~ 1/3 of the population), but I would probably just give up and ignore them at that stage..

Nature Boy

lizzyvera wrote: »

However, when I go for meals people give out to me and tell me it's unhealthy

Do you have any health problems? If not, maybe you should just mention that

Parnassia

Peanut wrote: »

I have given up on people with that ridiculous attitude, but if you could be bothered to argue with them then you can mention that many animals are practically vegetarian with no health problems, so they are talking rubbish, eg chimpanzees, other types of apes, farm animals etc.

I agree it's annoying, but in all seriousness, telling someone a farm animal doesn't need to eat meat isn't going to make sense, or really help your argument - I don't think eating grass all day would be healthy for a human! Why don't you ask them what they think you are missing in your diet, and then explain where you get it.

Parnassia

Nature Boy wrote: »

Do you have any health problems? If not, maybe you should just mention that

Or this

Peanut

Parnassia wrote: »

I agree it's annoying, but in all seriousness, telling someone a farm animal doesn't need to eat meat isn't going to make sense, or really help your argument - I don't think eating grass all day would be healthy for a human!

Yes true

I only mention it because people seem to forget that many animals are mostly vegetarian and perfectly healthy, and seem to be brainwashed that you can only get protein from eating meat.

ztoical

mike65 wrote: »

Do you "impose" your values on meat eaters

I don't think I do. I certainly don't lecture friends or family when I see them eating meat. I do love to cook and invite friends round for food all the time. they all know I'm veggie and they still come........prob cus their cheap and want a free meal thou

mike65 wrote: »

Or expect them to accommodate you without recipricol behaviour when you cook for others?

within reason. I've some friends who forget or don't think but I don't take offence to it. i've a friend who is kosher and drives people up the wall reminding them ever 5 seconds that he is - I really hope I'm not like that.

For christmas this year we went to my aunts and she cooked a seperate meal for me which I thought was very nice of her.

Bottle_of_Smoke

lizzyvera wrote: »

I never ever ever talk about being vegetarian and even when my boyfriend asks about it I won't talk about it. However, when I go for meals people give out to me and tell me it's unhealthy etc so I don't eat in other people's houses anymore because it stresses me out!

You see it is unhealthy unless you know what you're doing. It's easier to be healthy if you have meat as it contains all the essential proteins. You need different sources of non-meat proteins to cover yourself.

If you do it properly it's healthier than eating meat. Would recommend all vegetarians talk to a nutritionist at some point

A vegetarian girl I work with is literally glowing with health, perfect hair & skin. She smokes too. Basically these idiots who argue with you need to know what I just said.

Tar.Aldarion

Protein is not hard to get for a vegetarian, it is more of an issue of consideration for a vegan.
There are more important things needed that one should think about, like Omega oils etc.

Peanut

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

...
A vegetarian girl I work with is literally glowing with health, perfect hair & skin. She smokes too.

If she smokes at all heavily it will eventually catch up with her.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Peanut wrote: »

If she smokes at all heavily it will eventually catch up with her.

Oh of course, actually gave her alan carr's easyway book which worked for me. Only mentioned it to make the point of how healthy vegetarianism ca be

lolli

I've been a vegetarian for 13 years. I have no problems with cooking meat for other people but wont eat it myself. I wouldnt impose my beliefs on anyone, we all believe different things.

vibrant

What it comes down to with me is that I simply don't really care what other people choose to eat.

Thing is though, I have noticed at times that meat eaters seem to go out of their way to cause offense/try to get a reaction out of me when it comes to what I choose to eat (and what to omit from my diet!). I don't rise to it though.

Also, some older family members just don't get it. I always think of the Nana from the "Royle Family" asking the young lad's new veggie girlfriend if she can eat some wafer thin ham... that's the sort of stuff I hear at every family event, I can laugh about it but I don't understand what's so hard to grasp!

I won't cook meat for someone else, mainly because I wouldn't have a notion how to do it. I've been veggie for 10 years - would you really want me to prepare a steak for you? I'd probably boil it! Seriously though, you'd be much better off eating what I'm cooking for myself I generally hear good things from people about my cooking when they're over for dinner. People are usually very VERY good and will prepare a pasta/veg stir fry for me seprately if I am going visiting - which they know I appreciate.

All that said, if a meat eater starts a discussion/debate about the benefits of vegetarianism with me, I will gladly go along with it. I won't start a debate with them, mainly because these things tend to pop up when people are eating, and I don't think it's very mannerly to go into the nuts and bolts of animal cruelty with people at dinnertime! Generally people are quite interested and polite, but you always get one idiot spouting some claptrap about Hitler being Veg "and look at him!!!!!". What IS a good comeback for that, actually?

Peanut

So was daVinci?

Actually I think Hitler really wasn't all that veggie, but daVinci was definitely vegetarian. Perhaps that's just veg* propaganda though!!

Not that it really makes much difference either way, if people are going to argue veggies are evil because Hitler was one or vice versa then they're just being facetious anyway..

Tar.Aldarion

Tell them Einstein was one.

Also, Hitler was not a vegetarian at all, his favourite food was pidgeon. He did not eat meat during periods of his life due to doctors recommendations for his health. You can tell them that.

Serpentine

Ah the Hitler was a vegetarian line :mad: I usually tell people in as monotone matter of fact way that Hitler was widely reported to enjoy pigeons & other atrocities

Well the topic of this post is one that intrigues yet infuriates me but I know my fellow veggies will understand. While meat eating disgusts me I am an open minded individual & I have more important things on my mind than lecturing ppl about their choices. However, when I'm ASKED what I think of it I'll gladly voice my opinions on the subject, much to the horror of my company. I find it so interesting that the minute I say "I'm a vegetarian because of ethical reasons" no matter how educated my company is, they become completely insulted by my beliefs as though I have engaged in a personal attack. Do meat eaters know deep down it is wrong or can humanity not cope with individualism??

Also, why do meat eaters have to justify their disgusting lifestyle choice with "natures way/natural order" arguments?? I feel like writing a book on this!! Why do people feel the need to impose THEIR views on vegetarianism on me??

seamus

Hitler also had a moustache. Therefore Tom Selleck is a jew-hating genocidal maniac.

Best comeback for the Hitler argument is, "Why am I even debating this with you, you're clearly an idiot." It can't always be used though.

Serpentine

seamus wrote: »

Hitler also had a moustache. Therefore Tom Selleck is a jew-hating genocidal maniac.

Best comeback for the Hitler argument is, "Why am I even debating this with you, you're clearly an idiot." It can't always be used though.

I think I'll be using the "clearly you're an idiot" line for quite some time, I find it such an indication of low intelligence/stupidity/ignorance when ppl try to convert me to meat eating esp since I've been veggie for 13 years how egotistical is that?? :rolleyes: My favourite is WHAT DO YOU EAT AT CHRISTMAS followed closely by WOULD YA NOT LOVE A BURGER??

Peanut

Serpentine wrote: »

..
I find it so interesting that the minute I say "I'm a vegetarian because of ethical reasons" no matter how educated my company is, they become completely insulted by my beliefs as though I have engaged in a personal attack.

Well you can understand, if you say to someone "I don't do x because I believe it's unethical", and they are in the process of doing x...

..Then they can interpret that as you making an unfavourable judgement on their ethical values. So some people could get defensive in that situation.

I think the solution is to try to be a bit tactful, and say something like "I just feel more comfortable not eating meat", which isn't quite as direct an opposition to their views - You are saying, "This is just my preference, and you don't have to feel that I'm trying to impose my values on you"..

Serpentine

I'm not very good on the subject of tact! Another thing that annoys me is when I get asked are you STILL a vegetarian like its some dumbass phase! :rolleyes: To answer the question of the thread, no I do not impose my views (unless asked) leading by example has always proven to be the best persuasion for me!

vibrant

Oh dear, oh dear, all my good work undone...I unwittingly (*drunkenly) uttered the awful phrase "WHAT IS THAT STENCH? Oh... it's your dinner..." to a meat-eater last night

Harrybelafonte

Serpentine wrote: »

Ah the Hitler was a vegetarian line :mad: I usually tell people in as monotone matter of fact way that Hitler was widely reported to enjoy pigeons & other atrocities

Well the topic of this post is one that intrigues yet infuriates me but I know my fellow veggies will understand. While meat eating disgusts me I am an open minded individual & I have more important things on my mind than lecturing ppl about their choices. However, when I'm ASKED what I think of it I'll gladly voice my opinions on the subject, much to the horror of my company. I find it so interesting that the minute I say "I'm a vegetarian because of ethical reasons" no matter how educated my company is, they become completely insulted by my beliefs as though I have engaged in a personal attack. Do meat eaters know deep down it is wrong or can humanity not cope with individualism??

Also, why do meat eaters have to justify their disgusting lifestyle choice with "natures way/natural order" arguments?? I feel like writing a book on this!! Why do people feel the need to impose THEIR views on vegetarianism on me??

Try telling people you don't drink

frecklz

My fiancé is a meat-eater. We've been together for 3 years and I've never forced my beliefs on him or preached about it. However, we both went to see "Fast Food Nation", and after that he gave up burgers and sausages! Nothing to do with me. I'm happy though, because now we live together, and have never had any meat in the house. He usually has a chicken roll for lunch at work, which is cool with me! Look at all these famous veggies;

http://www.happycow.net/famous_vegetarians.html

There are so many more health benefits than risks being veggie. Fact.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Well I've been vegetarian my entire life, so I actually can't cook meat (apart from sausages, whcih I had to do when I worked in a cafe), as I have no concept of what it tastes like, all the safety issues about cooking it etc, so I would sever veggie food at my house if people were coming over, but I'd try and make it something hearty, and not too scarily veggie (ie, pizza, pasta, soup, spuds, not lentils, tofu, quorn, any of that stuff.) when I'm over at someone's house I certainly wouldn't expect them to cater to me, I'd never ask them to, I'm happy out with just a salad or some bread or something. That said, most people who have me over for dinner know I'm a pain in the arse to cook for (read; vegan) and ring me up to say "you're getting pasta, that cool? good"
On imposing my beliefs on people, definitely not. If people ask me questions about it I'll anwer, if people attack me for it (being unhealthy, pointless, dangerously hippy-like), I'll defend myself, but I won't bring it up unprovoked, I'm not a PETA, hemp wearing, militant plonker about it like.

Tar.Aldarion

I'd love if pasta didn't exist.

peaches79

I find when most people hear me mentioning I'm a veggie (work meals, other occasions with strangers) they do tend to start the questioning.
When I explain how I feel, the questioning tends to get more and more intrusive until they're eventually on an anti-hippy, anti communism, higher up the food chain, bodies need meat rant.
I just sit there perplexed wondering why I even bother getting into these conversations when questioned.

Tar.Aldarion

^^^ Received thanks from Moonbaby.


Sweet, I have my thanks abilities back!

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

I'd love if pasta didn't exist.

Frikkin hate the stuff, coz I don't like eating loads of wheat, but if I brought that up people would definitely think I'm a hippy dippy gwyneth paltrow plank-and-a-half. Admittedly my eating habits are rather hippyish, but it's just coz I like the way veganism affects my health and energy levels, in every other aspect of my life I can generally be described as a cynical, materialistic so-and-so.

casper-

Peanut wrote: »

I have given up on people with that ridiculous attitude, but if you could be bothered to argue with them then you can mention that many animals are practically vegetarian with no health problems, so they are talking rubbish, eg chimpanzees, other types of apes, farm animals etc.

If they persist in being dumbasses, you could mention about 400 million Indians are vegetarian (~ 1/3 of the population), but I would probably just give up and ignore them at that stage..

Exactly. I don't know how people in this day and age can say that vegetarians are unhealthy. It's like saying that the Earth revolves around the Sun.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - I think almost anyone could be a vegetarian in India They do some really tasty things with vegetables...

casper-

Serpentine wrote: »

I think I'll be using the "clearly you're an idiot" line for quite some time, I find it such an indication of low intelligence/stupidity/ignorance when ppl try to convert me to meat eating esp since I've been veggie for 13 years how egotistical is that?? :rolleyes: My favourite is WHAT DO YOU EAT AT CHRISTMAS followed closely by WOULD YA NOT LOVE A BURGER??

LOL That's a great line (about the burger)

Gadgie

casper- wrote: »

It's like saying that the Earth revolves around the Sun.

It does...

casper-

Gadgie wrote: »

It does...

Err ... Wait ... That's not what I meant

*goes off to hide in a corner for a while*

sweet-rasmus

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

I'd love if pasta didn't exist.

lol! if only they knew... you'd love it if peas didn't exist. or carrots. or onions. he he he a very picky vegetarian indeed!

Tar.Aldarion

I like some peas! :-(

frecklz

Tar.Aldarion wrote: »

There are more important things needed that one should think about, like Omega oils etc.

You can get Omega oils from vegetarian sources. Flora has them for instance, and that's vegetarian.

Clink

casper- wrote: »

Exactly. I don't know how people in this day and age can say that vegetarians are unhealthy. It's like saying that the Earth revolves around the Sun.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - I think almost anyone could be a vegetarian in India They do some really tasty things with vegetables...

It depends on what you eat as a vegetarian as to whether you're healthy or not though. All of the veggies that I know live on white pasta, lumps of cheese and ready meals. These are the people that are giving ye vegetarians the bad rep!

Nature Boy

Seconded. It's just as easy to be an unhealthy vegetarian as it is an unhealthy meat eater.
But I think casper was trying to say that some people think it's impossible to be healthy if you're a vegetarian, which is untrue.

t-ha

Udo's Oil is vegan friendly AFAIK and has plenty of omega-3's. In general, so long as your vegan diet is more veg, oils, beans etc. orientated than bread, pasta, meat-free pizza etc. orientated then your fatty acid profiles should be fine.

I've only been a vegan for three weeks, so I don't know how much my opinion counts for, but usually when I'm going to people's houses I bring food or eat what I can of whatever I'm offered. I also tell people in advance so there are no surprises and I haven't had any problems in restaurants yet. I've cooked for friends twice now, and both times given them vegan meals. Well, I've been experimenting with different recipes so I may as well show them off!

As for your health, we're not the same creatures as chimpanzees or gorrillas, and we have certain protiens that we need to get from our diet to be in best health. These can be taken in from vegetables though so long as you know what you're doing, but I would take issue with people who become vegetarian/vegan purely for health reasons.

I do think it's funny though, that I could spend a month eating nothing but noodles, pasta, pizza (with roughly 1g of pepperoni on it ) and chips, but yet when I announce that I'm going vegan my nutrition all of a sudden becomes an imminent concern!!

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

The healthy thing is actually so annoying, my best friend actually never eats any fruits or vegetables (they were forced down her as a youngun and she's nearly phobic), snacks on chocolate and KFC constantly, and still bangs on at me about how unhealthy my diet is. I'm actually one of the healthiest people I know, seriously, I have an immune system and a half, and only ever throw up if I'm after a few too many drinks. Whereas she sniffles and moodswings her way through life :mad: