Keep It Simple

Hanley

Ok consider this a plea.

Today, and in the last week there has been a proliferation of posts asking questions with answers that should really be self evident. I don't want to pick specific examples in case I upset anyone, but when we start arguing about whether one set is the optimum way to build muscle, or if drinking a cup of friggin' tea is going to dehydrate you, I think we all need to take a step back from the situtaion and realise how out of hand it is.

In everything I say I try to be as direct and to the point as I can be. It doesn't always come out as nice as it should, but it's always intended to help the person it's said to. It might be in the form of a wake up call, but it's still an attempt to help.

So instead of worrying about all the little details, and whether by not being exactly "optimum" are you wasting your time, please, please just do SOMETHING.

If you're in the gym train harder, if you're trying to gain weight get some food (right now), if you'r trying to lose weight then have some self control. Instead of putting it off by trying to reach some level of perfection that you're probably never gonna achieve, start now.

Just do SOMETHING.

Transform

I'll second that

Shrimp

finally someone says it.

Supercell

Good post Hanley, I'm coming to realise this is THE winning mindset rather than the excuses one I had in the past.

starflake

Here Here

Lockstep

THis should be stickied.

mack1

everybody.... HAN-LEY! HAN-LEY! HAN-LEY!

*raises Hanley aloft*

maradona10

i asked was drinking tea dehydrating.

hanley's reply was "either way drink more water"

he doesnt know whether it is or not.

if someone is drinking copious amounts of tea i think its an important thing to know
as drinking it defeats the purpose of drinking more water

Malteaser!

maradona10 wrote: »

i asked was drinking tea dehydrating.

hanley's reply was "either way drink more water"

he doesnt know whether it is or not.

if someone is drinking copious amounts of tea i think its an important thing to know
as drinking it defeats the purpose of drinking more water

Shouldn't you have posted this in the thread about tea??? It doesn't really have any relevence to this one!

Good post btw Ham

eroo

To be fair,you cannot answer some q's and then say 'I am not answering that because it is a stupid question'.If you do not like the question,then you do not have to answer/post to it!If we use the ''don't ask stupid q's'' mentality,then how will someone find out what they want to know?Knowledge is power.So give them this power rather than letting them go on thinking,for example,that 'weightlifting stunts your growth'!If we did not ask even the most minor of q's then we would know nothing...
Just because you may know something,does not mean everyone does..if we start saying 'oh that is a stupid question' then we are going to scare people away from posting in this forum...simple as.

eroo

maradona10

he dont or wont scare me

Malteaser!

eroo wrote: »

To be fair,you cannot answer some q's and then say 'I am not answering that because it is a stupid question'.If you do not like the question,then you do not have to answer/post to it!If we use the ''don't ask stupid q's'' mentality,then how will someone find out what they want to know?Knowledge is power.So give them this power rather than letting them go on thinking,for example,that 'weightlifting stunts your growth'!If we did not ask even the most minor of q's then we would know nothing...
Just because you may know something,does not mean everyone does..if we start saying 'oh that is a stupid question' then we are going to scare people away from posting in this forum...simple as.

eroo

Tbh I don't think this thread is about those kind of discussion topics, it's more about those silly little questions that could be answered with one simple search in google, you know the type, they're popping up almost every day.

Maradona, what are you on about and why are wrecking a perfectly good thread??

BossArky

maradona10 wrote: »

he dont or wont scare me

How about now?



:cool:

Lockstep

Pwnd

yomchi

Hanley just had a David Banner moment... everyone run:D

maradona10

do u have pics of him up on your wall

Hanley

maradona10 wrote: »

i asked was drinking tea dehydrating.

hanley's reply was "either way drink more water"

he doesnt know whether it is or not.

if someone is drinking copious amounts of tea i think its an important thing to know
as drinking it defeats the purpose of drinking more water

While I would love to say "dude I think you posted this in the wrong thread", I'm afraid you probably did exactly as you intended. I don't know why you feel the need to follow me around and attempt to discredit me, but if you think I' ma big enough deal to do that for, then by all means, please feed my ego.

The truth is, I don't care whether or not it is. It's not something I drink so it doesn't concern me. If it was something I drank I'd be sure to drink enough water with it to ensure it doesn't have a negative effect on my training.

I could quite easily open google and spew out loads of random facts about how it is or isn't, but I don't see the point in faking knowledge.

I would offer 2 pieces of advice tho.

1) Google is a great resource and one you should probably consult before opening a new thread for every single question you have on this forum

2) You have 2 ears, 2 eyes and only one mouth, use them in that order.

eroo wrote: »

To be fair,you cannot answer some q's and then say 'I am not answering that because it is a stupid question'.If you do not like the question,then you do not have to answer/post to it!If we use the ''don't ask stupid q's'' mentality,then how will someone find out what they want to know?Knowledge is power.So give them this power rather than letting them go on thinking,for example,that 'weightlifting stunts your growth'!If we did not ask even the most minor of q's then we would know nothing...
Just because you may know something,does not mean everyone does..if we start saying 'oh that is a stupid question' then we are going to scare people away from posting in this forum...simple as.

eroo

I will happily go on record as saying I'm not trying to discourage questions. Hell I STILL ask them all the time. The difference is, if you have a question then the first place you should check is google. Normally it'll return a whole heap of replies that say wildly different things but if it's a common question and one that we take to be "common knowledge" here, then it'll probably answer it quite well. If you're still not happy then at least you come to the table with a basic knowledge of the different theories around something. It's vastly different than just coming on and saying... "oh so and so said this to me in school yesterday, is it true??????? lolz"

There's quite a distinct difference between asking a question and looking for an answer so that you can better understand something -versus- asking a question that you already decide you know the answer too and that you just want other people to confirm for you. And when they disagree and present arguments, personal exp and research against it you lose the head and decide they're all wrong and still blindly argue your point.

Also, if someone comes on and constantly questions what most would consdier the most basic of things, and then starts to post in other peoples threads trying to give them advice on how they can improve, alarm bell should start ringing.

Earlier on in a thread I said someone didn't know what they were talking about because they said one set was as efficent as multiples for building muscle mass. Well guess what, apparently it was an eminent doctor that said it, so people see it as a chance to go on the attack against me without reading the article and assume since the person has an M.D they know best....It's funny how he also said sets of 12 are the best way to build strength. If someone says something as profoundly incorrect as that then I for one would be a hell of a lot more cautious about the other things that they state as "fact" too.

Be a leader or get the hell out of my way. This sheep mentality where people see or hear something from a "reputable" source and make up their minds that it's the absolute truth only serves to frustrate experienced people who know better and retard the progress of those who believe it. No body wins.

And BossArky, lolz.

Hanley

Jon wrote: »

Hanley just had a David Banner moment... everyone run:D

Jon,




Oh and I hope common sense prevails and maradona10 isn't allowed to derail what could grow into a golden thread and great resource with his sly little digs.

But hey, like I said bro, keep feeding my ego if you want.


EDIT: Also thanks to everyone for the words of support. It's encoouraging to see people like Longfield make a complete turn around reap the positive rewards that come from it. It's because of people and success stories like him that I keep posting here.

Colm_OReilly

Hanley,

I definitely see your point, but I'd disagree on what's common knowledge and whether it's beneficial.

Some "common knowledge"

Eating fat makes you fat.
Wheat and Dairy are good for you.
To lose weight you need long, slow distance work.
Women who lift weights will get huge
Lifting weights is dangerous.

Some of this "common knowledge" varies from unproductive to downright wrong.

I definitely agree that people should take a ready, fire, aim approach and get involved, then start correcting their routine/form/program.

Colm

Cadrach

I'm a huge fan of "keep it simple and start", it is great advice to everyone who wants to find out about heel-toe maneuvres before they learn to drive.

However, I disagree with "keep it simple" as a mantra for this forum.

"Keep it simple" conflicts with "strive for perfection". There is nothing wrong with people striving for perfection, and if they want to tweak some advanced aspect of their diet or exercise, what's wrong with that?

While it can be very good to always keep things simple, this forum should also be a place where we can discuss the more specific aspects of diet and training regardless of whether or not it fits into your "big picture". If we boil down every reply on a weight loss related thread to "just eat less carbs and exercise self control", then what's the point of a discussion forum?

I wouldn't mind knowing whether or not drinking tea dehydrates you.

Odysseus

Cadrach wrote: »

I wouldn't mind knowing whether or not drinking tea dehydrates you.

In my experience it does, though not as bad as coffee. When I'm doing long long distance I replace most of my coffee and tea with herbal ones.

But as this is a keep it simple thread, you urine will tell you whether you are dehydrated, the runners mantra is "if its yellow or brown your water is down, if its clear and bright your waters right";)

Supercell

Hanley wrote: »

EDIT: Also thanks to everyone for the words of support. It's encoouraging to see people like Longfield make a complete turn around reap the positive rewards that come from it. It's because of people and success stories like him that I keep posting here.

Thanks

Its the no bs posts by people like yourself and others here that was the kick up the arse that encouraged me to "do something" as you say.
I'm f'n determined to loose the pudgy blubber, maybe this time next year the six pack I have won't be in the fridge (well maybe there too).

Hanley

Cadrach wrote: »

I'm a huge fan of "keep it simple and start", it is great advice to everyone who wants to find out about heel-toe maneuvres before they learn to drive.

However, I disagree with "keep it simple" as a mantra for this forum.

"Keep it simple" conflicts with "strive for perfection". There is nothing wrong with people striving for perfection, and if they want to tweak some advanced aspect of their diet or exercise, what's wrong with that?

While it can be very good to always keep things simple, this forum should also be a place where we can discuss the more specific aspects of diet and training regardless of whether or not it fits into your "big picture". If we boil down every reply on a weight loss related thread to "just eat less carbs and exercise self control", then what's the point of a discussion forum?

I wouldn't mind knowing whether or not drinking tea dehydrates you.

I fail to see how keeping it simple conflicts with striving for perfection.

In my mind "perfection" is more than just breaking down my diet down and trying to make into some faultless plan of action with precise macro breakdowns and perfect timing. What's the point in doing that if I half ass it in the gym? Or I'm not sleeping at night?

What's the point in writing down this detailed training plan that covers all the bases and should theoretically develop me into superman if I don't bother to actually push myself outside of my comfort zone and just coast?

That's not for me. It's blast or dust.

In this case I would tihnk perfection is achieving my goal and surpassing what I originally set out to do. There really is no secret weapon in this game, a dietary change or some new lift or different rep range honestly isn't going to give everyone the magical results that they think they're missing out on.

Maybe it's the culutre I train in, but in my experience, the best results come from the simplest of things. If a muscle is lagging, train it harder and make it a priority. If you're looking to lose weight, eat less carbs and total kcals.

It can be dressed up anyway you like, but when you lay out all the parts and look at how they contribute to the whole then it's very simple. Good (relative to your goals) eating habits, combined with a good simple but effective weights program, and HARD WORK is all anyone body needs to do to achieve 99% of their physique and sporting goals.

That's ALL it really boils down to. Hell I could go one step further and say all that REALLY matters is hard work. If you offered me 2 people, one who sits and reads online all day and asks loads of questions on minor details in hopes of somehow making up for half-assing the important things, and a second guy who is so bloody pig headed he won't let himself be defeated in the weightroom, then I know who I would choose anyday.

The first guy might have all the best intentions in the world, but if he doesn't act on them and DO SOMETHING then he's not going to get anywhere. And if he does act on it but doesn't truly give himself to it then he's not going to get anywhere either.

The simple things, hitting the big lifts hard, eating enough to recover and grow (and it's at least semi-decent quality) and pushing yourself to a level that you didn't think possible is ALL that anyone needs to grow more muscle and get stronger. A bit more dedication to diet and the same could be said about weight loss.

Guys, it's really really simple. That's all it takes.

Simple, not easy.

Cadrach

Ill keep this short because I'm typing it on my phone.

Good post... It is inspirational and great advice for me and others to keep in mind.

However, out of the two guys you mentioned, why not this guy:

Busts his ass in the gym, eats well AND spends an hour in the evenings finding out more about tweaking the minor details to strive for perfection.

In my last post I wasn't asking whether tea dehydrates you or not, just saying that bits and pieces like this are good to know and should be welcome on the forum. They all add up. What kind of message does it send out if you come down like a ton of bricks on everyone who wants to know something that you deem unimportant because you can get by without knowing it? Should I be afraid to ask about tweaking some minor aspect of my routine lest you all accuse me of procrastinating?

Hanley wrote: »

I fail to see how keeping it simple conflicts with striving for perfection.

In my mind "perfection" is more than just breaking down my diet down and trying to make into some faultless plan of action with precise macro breakdowns and perfect timing. What's the point in doing that if I half ass it in the gym? Or I'm not sleeping at night?

What's the point in writing down this detailed training plan that covers all the bases and should theoretically develop me into superman if I don't bother to actually push myself outside of my comfort zone and just coast?

That's not for me. It's blast or dust.

In this case I would tihnk perfection is achieving my goal and surpassing what I originally set out to do. There really is no secret weapon in this game, a dietary change or some new lift or different rep range honestly isn't going to give everyone the magical results that they think they're missing out on.

Maybe it's the culutre I train in, but in my experience, the best results come from the simplest of things. If a muscle is lagging, train it harder and make it a priority. If you're looking to lose weight, eat less carbs and total kcals.

It can be dressed up anyway you like, but when you lay out all the parts and look at how they contribute to the whole then it's very simple. Good (relative to your goals) eating habits, combined with a good simple but effective weights program, and HARD WORK is all anyone body needs to do to achieve 99% of their physique and sporting goals.

That's ALL it really boils down to. Hell I could go one step further and say all that REALLY matters is hard work. If you offered me 2 people, one who sits and reads online all day and asks loads of questions on minor details in hopes of somehow making up for half-assing the important things, and a second guy who is so bloody pig headed he won't let himself be defeated in the weightroom, then I know who I would choose anyday.

The first guy might have all the best intentions in the world, but if he doesn't act on them and DO SOMETHING then he's not going to get anywhere. And if he does act on it but doesn't truly give himself to it then he's not going to get anywhere either.

The simple things, hitting the big lifts hard, eating enough to recover and grow (and it's at least semi-decent quality) and pushing yourself to a level that you didn't think possible is ALL that anyone needs to grow more muscle and get stronger. A bit more dedication to diet and the same could be said about weight loss.

Guys, it's really really simple. That's all it takes.

Simple, not easy.

Hanley

Cadrach wrote: »

Ill keep this short because I'm typing it on my phone.

Good post... It is inspirational and great advice for me and others to keep in mind.

However, out of the two guys you mentioned, why not this guy:

Busts his ass in the gym, eats well AND spends an hour in the evenings finding out more about tweaking the minor details to strive for perfection.
In my last post I wasn't asking whether tea dehydrates you or not, just saying that bits and pieces like this are good to know and should be welcome on the forum. They all add up. What kind of message does it send out if you come down like a ton of bricks on everyone who wants to know something that you deem unimportant because you can get by without knowing it? Should I be afraid to ask about tweaking some minor aspect of my routine lest you all accuse me of procrastinating?

Dude, I WAS that guy. And guess what, it's not the ideal situation that you might think it is. I spent any time that I wasn't in the gym reading up on training and thinking about how I could do things better/differently. And guess what, there's SO MUCH information out there and every new program or lift is better than the last that you get bogged down constantly trying different exercises and never actually giving anything a real go, and all does is set you back in the long run.

I've had the best results of my life in the gym over the past year and I personally think it's all down to ignoring all the new t-nation articles and "miracle" programs.

The simple fact is, most people are no where even remotely close to a level where picking a good solid training program and just plain working hard won't be enough for them to progress (I include myself in this group). To be hoenst it doesn't even matter what training program they pick. Just pick something and worry about progressing every single week on that.

THe danger of constantly reading is that instead of working hard you hear about a new system or program that's even better than the one you're on, so why bother learning how to struggle with weights when you're not doing the best program out there anyway like. Just switch to the better one and do it there. But then you hear about an even better one. And the vicious circle contiunes.

As far as I can see, no body has come down on anyone like a ton of bricks here. I don't know if you've actually been reading the forum for the past week or not, but if you have then surely you'll have seen how many completely irrelevant (in the grand scheme of things) questions have been asked. Discussion is great, but when people start to treat the findings of the discussion as something they HAVE to do to progress then that is where the porblem arises. Know what I mean??

eroo

I could not agree more Cadrach!

Who is to say that someone who posts loads of q's is half-assing?In my experience,the more knowledge you have,then the better you can train.If you do not know what you are doing then what is the point in continuing training??If someone has a question they genuinely cannot find an answer to,whether it be the best socks to wear when running or whatever,then why not post a question in this forum?
Also I think you will find that it is not that simple if you want to give your body the best challenge all round.I am constantly seeking info from books,online articles etc to better myself and my training rather than continue on with something that is not working.If people did not ask q's then where would the fitness world be?I can tell you where....in the ****....because by not asking q's all of the bull****ters out there would be at the top of the fitness world and we would all believe crap like 'with this,you can gain 6 inches on your biceps in just 10 hours' etc etc.
My point is,asking q's can only better your training..

Hanley

I honestly think that there's a 50/50 spilt of people who get what I'm trying to say in this thread versus those who don't.

What I'm NOT saying:

-Discussion is bad and should be discouraged.

-Questions are bad and people should be mocked for them.

-Tweaking a training program is pointless.

-Tweaking your diet is pointless.

What I AM saying:

-All of the above ARE completely and utterly pointless if you're not actually prepared to work hard enough in the gym to see the changes that you want.

-A good diet and solid training program are important. Chopping and changing every couple of weeks in the hopes of finding some previously untouched miracle lift is not.

-If a good diet (*) and solid training program (**) are already in place then all that really matters is how hard you work.


The reason I cares so passionately about this is because I feel that I've already been thru all of the stages that almost everybody here is posting about, and in hindsight I've come to realise that all I did was waste my time spinning my wheels. Maybe that's a lesson some people here think needs to be learnt first hand, but I don't. If I can save even one person 18 months of wasted traning and get them onto the path to success quicker because of that then I don't care if I offend 5 people because my posting style is too rough and to the point. I think that when most peopel get to a more advanced level then they'd come back and realise that things I were saying was right all along.

So in summary, stop spinning your wheels, put down the books, BLAST for at least 6 months and see where that takes you. If you come back after that time and have made no progress then I will gladly apologise. But if someone works consistently hard for 6 motnhs and is honest with themselves about their effort then there's no way that they won't progress.


(*) - It's not a secret that I feel people are too worried abotu their diet. When it comes to building muscle or getting stronger for those who are truly training hard and pushing their limits it is my belief that most important thing is protein intake and total kcal consumption. That's just me keeping it simple.

(**) - Cover the basics. Squat, bench and deadlift. Do assistance work to make these lits stronger. And do it consistently. You have to have a base of muscle mass before you can attempt to refine, "shape" or "cut" it.

King of Kings

hanley - great post.
100% agree. btw your nicest most polite post yet!

Colm O'Reilly - while I agree with you your post about common sense not always being the correct advice. But I think in 99% of cases people who need to change things know deep down that eating less Chinese and Pizza and training more is the way to go. essentially my point is everybody knows what is good for them- the issue is about breaking the routine and eating the apple/banana instead of the chocolate bar.

When they hit a plateau in training or weight loss / muscle gain then they can investigate if their tea is killing them or that dairy is not as good for you as you thought.

BTW is dairy not that good for you?
I'd eat/drink - full fat milk(daily), cheese (daily), cottage cheese (most evenings)

Hanley

King of Kings wrote: »

hanley - great post.
100% agree. btw your nicest most polite post yet!

Colm O'Reilly - while I agree with you your post about common sense not always being the correct advice. But I think in 99% of cases people who need to change things know deep down that eating less Chinese and Pizza and training more is the way to go. essentially my point is everybody knows what is good for them- the issue is about breaking the routine and eating the apple/banana instead of the chocolate bar.

When they hit a plateau in training or weight loss / muscle gain then they can investigate if their tea is killing them or that dairy is not as good for you as you thought.

BTW is dairy not that good for you?
I'd eat/drink - full fat milk(daily), cheese (daily), cottage cheese (most evenings)

Thanks!! (I can be nice and argue my point when I want, I'd rather just tell it like it is and have people take it or leave tho most of the time because college and training commitments don't leave me much time to spend structuring points and arguments!!)

On dairy, hell I don't know!! But in the spirit of this thread, I don't care either. It's high calorie, easy to consume in large quantities (milk anyway) and it's there to make baby cows grow into large ones!!

I'll gladly take insignificant little trade off that dairy MIGHT have on my overall well being for all the benefits it provides. Obviously some people might be allergic to it, or have differnt goals, but when it comes to gaining weight, I'm all about the milk.

rubadub

Cadrach wrote: »

I wouldn't mind knowing whether or not drinking tea dehydrates you.

I was surprised last week as I saw another thread with studies showing it doesnt dehyrate too much. I thought it would, I find coffee has a strong diuretic effect on me.

Points people may not know is coffee has more caffeine than tea (usually). Also espresso has less caffeine than a standard cup (usually for the pedants). Espresso has more caffeine per ml, that is the confusing point. It is like saying whiskey is stronger than beer, but if getting "portion" in a pub then beer has almost twice the alcohol.

Also certain cups of coffee in say starbucks can have around the same caffeine levels as a full 2litres of coke.

I think Hanley is more pointing out about people worried about their single cup of tea in the morning- if you are drinking 20 cups of strong coffee then it might be a concern.

Dragan

Good post by Hanley, only got round to reading it now.

Maradonna10, see ya around, i'm sick of your **** in my forum so it's time you had a time out.

Jumpy

Odysseus wrote: »

In my experience it does, though not as bad as coffee. When I'm doing long long distance I replace most of my coffee and tea with herbal ones.

But as this is a keep it simple thread, you urine will tell you whether you are dehydrated, the runners mantra is "if its yellow or brown your water is down, if its clear and bright your waters right";)

And if its orange. Lay off the Berocca.

g'em

Jumpy wrote: »

Odysseus wrote: »

But as this is a keep it simple thread, you urine will tell you whether you are dehydrated, the runners mantra is "if its yellow or brown your water is down, if its clear and bright your waters right";)

And if its orange. Lay off the Berocca.

Mine's neon yellow. W00t for Vit B complexes \o/


Can we maintain the keeping it simple AND keeping it polite philosophy?? It hurts my head less on both counts.

Transform

I still go back to the basics i learned from the old Hardgainer magazines and i thing a good picture paints a thousand words to this forum and discussions.

Motivation is what gets you started. Habit is what keeps you going!!

Hanley

BUMP considering th discussion elsewhere in the forum, and also for those who are new or might have missed it.

Leon11

Keep it simple. Never a truer word spoken.

Until people realise the majority of us are just average Joe's only then will they realise how easy it is to work towards a fit and healthy body.

Unless your a top athlete/performer/bodybuilder/gymnast/powerlifter etc I fail to see how over analysing one's training techniques can improve yourself.

Use all that analysing time to train more, rest more and eat more/less. When you reach the upper echelons of your interest, then you can afford to get really specific.

One thing I've learned from here and other forums, those who achieve KEEP IT SIMPLE!!

Jimmy Bottlehead

I knew I had read this before! Might be a bit rough and to the point, but excellent points. I know I'm taking them to heart... Cheers Hanley.

Irjudge1

I spent ages the last three years trying not to eat this or that now I just eat less. I've lost eight pounds in three weeks. Eight pounds in three weeks no big deal, yeah it's early days but jesus I've just had to accept that there is no magic bullet.

The simple reason it's working so far is that I was exercising some self control rather than pissing about putting meal plans together and buying **** that I just don't like to eat. If I gain weight again I already know why it will happen.

I'm guessing that I'm like 90% of people on this forum at this time of year. I'm not trying to qualify for the olympics I just want to maintain a reasonable level of fitness and health. I don't think I need to start measuring % of carbs vs % protein etc. I just need to exercise self control and exercise more than I am.

Racing Flat

maradona10 wrote: »

i asked was drinking tea dehydrating.

Don't know, but it reduces your absorption of iron. Not good for endurance athletes among other populations. If you have to have it, have it weak and milky.

hardtrainer

The problem with keeping things simple is it takes away a little safety net that many people like to cling on to, the excuse. When people want to lose weight, or build muscle or whatever, they want it now. They don't want to have to endure the years it often takes to achieve the look they want. Keeping things simple lays the blame very sqaurely on their shoulders. They're not losing weight because they are still eating too many calories or not doing enough activity to shift the balance. Or, they're not gaining muscle because they just aren't eating enough food, working hard enough in the gym and getting enough sleep.

Not keeping things simple means the reason they haven't lost weight is because they haven't been able to get enough omega 3, or the balance of their carbs, fats and protein isn't precise at every meal, or they don't have time to plan their weeks meals in advance. There are so many places that things can go wrong, sure it's no wonder they haven't been able to lose the weight, but they are trying SO hard.
As for gaining muscle, if only they could still buy NO explode, or if they had special creatine that didn't taste like sand in the bottom of their juice, or if only they had access to the magic secrets that the pros all hide, but give tidbits out on T-nation etc etc etc.

When things are very complicated, there's always an easy way to explain for the lack of results. When things are simple, you have to take personal responsibility for the results you do or do not achieve. This is the biggest reason, I think, that people will always go for the complicated, over tweaked, over analysed approach. If it was so easy, everyone would have a great body, right?

Hanley

hardtrainer wrote: »

The problem with keeping things simple is it takes away a little safety net that many people like to cling on to, the excuse. When people want to lose weight, or build muscle or whatever, they want it now. They don't want to have to endure the years it often takes to achieve the look they want. Keeping things simple lays the blame very sqaurely on their shoulders. They're not losing weight because they are still eating too many calories or not doing enough activity to shift the balance. Or, they're not gaining muscle because they just aren't eating enough food, working hard enough in the gym and getting enough sleep.

Not keeping things simple means the reason they haven't lost weight is because they haven't been able to get enough omega 3, or the balance of their carbs, fats and protein isn't precise at every meal, or they don't have time to plan their weeks meals in advance. There are so many places that things can go wrong, sure it's no wonder they haven't been able to lose the weight, but they are trying SO hard.
As for gaining muscle, if only they could still buy NO explode, or if they had special creatine that didn't taste like sand in the bottom of their juice, or if only they had access to the magic secrets that the pros all hide, but give tidbits out on T-nation etc etc etc.

When things are very complicated, there's always an easy way to explain for the lack of results. When things are simple, you have to take personal responsibility for the results you do or do not achieve. This is the biggest reason, I think, that people will always go for the complicated, over tweaked, over analysed approach. If it was so easy, everyone would have a great body, right?

My point exactly.

t-ha

Nice thread & I agree with the thrust of it. When I first started getting in shape I analysed everything, weighed all my food etc. & it worked great. However, as time went on and I stopped being so meticulous, it still worked? It's come to the point that through constantly living this way that I just know what I'm supposed to be doing to get certain results. That macronutrient post in the stickies is the legacy of my early detailed apprach to diet & sometimes I wish it wasn't there as it probably just confuses people who are new to the place and diverts them away from what's more important.

At the same time, what's common sense to me now wasn't always so - like many other people I tried several times to get started with the weight loss (unsuccessfully) but usually by eating half nothing and running as much as I could on no food. This is about the worst approach possible to fat loss that there is but it's what I tried because it was common knowledge that that is how it's done. I always failed, either by binge eating or by giving up due to frustration with lack of progress. When I finally found online resources correcting my simple mistakes & started getting results, that's what motivated me to keep it up. Also, my training now probably still is influenced by all the things I've read and tried over the last three years, even if I come back to basics at the end of it, and it just seems so much more simple because I've internalised most of the important things and they've become automatic. Maybe it's just part of the journey that everyone goes through?

Like Bruce Lee said, before you learn martial arts a kick is just a kick and a punch is just a punch, then you learn that there's so much more to it than that, and then finally you realise that a kick is just a kick and a punch is just a punch.

g'em

t-ha wrote: »

what's common sense to me now wasn't always so... my training now probably still is influenced by all the things I've read and tried over the last three years, even if I come back to basics at the end of it, and it just seems so much more simple because I've internalised most of the important things and they've become automatic. Maybe it's just part of the journey that everyone goes through?

Well said. Keeping it simple is only possible because I went through the details to figure out what, exactly, simple was.

WHIP IT!

g'em wrote: »

Well said. Keeping it simple is only possible because I went through the details to figure out what, exactly, simple was.

Oh - great quote! Kinda sums up this whole thread... gold star for g'em!