Vatican vaults

Conar

Hey All

I'm sure most of you have heard about the latest thing from the vatican vault....the parchment detailing the trial of the Knights Templar.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7044741.stm

At the end of that article you'll notice that there is an interesting point about other treasures they have stashed away:

BBCNEWS wrote:

Among other treasures from the Archive, sometimes shown to VIP visitors, are letters from King Henry VIII of England to Anne Boleyn, his future wife, stolen from London by a Vatican spy to provide evidence of the King's disloyalty to Rome. There is also correspondence between Lucrezia Borgia and her father Pope Alexander VI.

There are no immediate plans for the publication of any of these unique documents.

Do you think its fair that the Vatican seem to have documents which would be of historical importance and public interest that they seem to have stashed away.

I'm not saying they should hand everything over, but surely they should be making copies available?

karen3212

I have to agree, making copies available to libraries etc. would be a good thing. No harm to have as many sources as possible when looking at history.

JimiTime

^^ I 'd love to see it, I'm sure there'd be some very juicy stuff. However, I think its highly unlikely.

JoeB-

How can the Vatican have 'spies'?

Surely this is dishonest, similar to lying? And what about such 'spies' stealing stuff? Most certainly they (the spies) are in hell now... and the contempory pope if they were spying and stealing with his knowledge and approval.

Or does the Church have an exemption to the rules they tell other people they must observe to make heaven... is it somehow acceptable for the Church to lie and steal?

Dont be at yourself

You'd have to wonder what humanitarian wonders could be done with the proceeds if the Church sold off some of these priceless treasures?

I don't think JC was a big advocate of treasure-hoarding, was he?

Run_to_da_hills

Conar wrote: »

At the end of that article you'll notice that there is an interesting point about other treasures they have stashed away.

Such as the keys for heaven......

Asiaprod

NekkidBibleMan wrote: »

You'd have to wonder what humanitarian wonders could be done with the proceeds if the Church sold off some of these priceless treasures?

That is the one thing I never understood. Why such a wealthy organization continues to draw money from the faithful when it has more than it needs already. As a minimum, open a museum and charge admittance.

JimiTime

Asiaprod wrote: »

That is the one thing I never understood. Why such a wealthy organization continues to draw money from the faithful when it has more than it needs already. As a minimum, open a museum and charge admittance.

The thing is, there is probably alot of evidence of rather dubious goings on. It'd probably see it as putting a nail in its own coffin. Though thats just speculating. As for its wealth and use of it etc, its one of the most obvious evidences to me, that it is far removed from the way of Jesus Christ. Although there are those who cannot see the irony. Nout as queer as folk I suppose.

Carolus Magnus

As a minimum, open a museum and charge admittance.

The Vatican has been operating the world famous Musei Vaticani since the dark days of Pope Julius II. They open it for free to the public on some weekends. It's a hugely popular attraction that includes the Sistine Chapel as well as the vaults of the secret archives.

I would imagine that in due course the entire contents of the Vatican's secret archives would be released. They have had no trouble in opening all the documents they posess from their persecution of the Cathar heresy in Languedoc c.1300 for investigation and that material hardly exculpates the church. As with any organisation that ancient it's going to take time. I don't disagree though, all should be revealed.

That is the one thing I never understood. Why such a wealthy organization continues to draw money from the faithful when it has more than it needs already.

The church is entrusted with a UNESCO world heritage site. That costs money to maintain and preserve. The only source of money for the Vatican from the laity are through Peter's Pence collections in the churches once a year. Outside of that, they count on revenue from tourists to the Vatican City, the sale of stamps and coins, their printing press (that produces theological works), their postal service and the entrance fee from the museums. Tickets to Papal audiences may also incur a charge for pilgrims but I can't be sure. Using that money they not only have to fund their diplomatic embassies but also all Papal visits, their security forces (i.e. the Swiss Guard) and also have to manage the affairs of the Roman diocese and its suburbicarian seats. There are also obligations to the pontifical universities in Rome.

You still have to put money in the plate every Sunday because that's your priest's weekly income. It's not all trickling back to the Vatican.

But then, I would dispute that the Vatican's finances are anyway healthy as such. Off the top of my head, I remember that they were in a bad way and had a big deficit in the mid 90s under JPII at least. If they've got a surplus now, between all their commitments, it's got to be pretty meagre. The outward ostentation is just that.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3819.htm - The US state department report seems to show that for 2003 and 2005 income for the Vatican City was 252 million USD and 247 million USD respectively while outgoings were 264 million USD and 243 million USD respectively. So while a huge amount of money is passing through the Vatican, it is being spent somehow and there doesn't seem to be a huge reserve such that the college of cardinals could be said to be resting on top of a pile of gold.

The Vatican Bank on the other hand is a different kettle of fish for lots of reasons, and that's the only thing decisive I'm willing to venture about it. Someone more knowledgeable could enlighten us :P

Michael G

Conar wrote: »

Do you think its fair that the Vatican seem to have documents which would be of historical importance and public interest that they seem to have stashed away.

The Vatican State is an independent state. It can do what it likes with its archives and records.

Run_to_da_hills

Michael G wrote: »

The Vatican State is an independent state. It can do what it likes with its archives and records.

So that they can hide the truth from the public and get away with it.

Rev Hellfire

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

So that they can hide the truth from the public and get away with it.

You're so right.

I heard that they've a big computer with name of every non-catholic in it !

Here's a picture I found of it on the web, they look like Jesuit trained IT people to me.

Run_to_da_hills

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

You're so right.

I heard that they've a big computer with name of every non-catholic in it !

Here's a picture I found of it on the web, they look like Jesuit trained IT people to me.

That looks more like an oscilloscope!.

Rev Hellfire

Thats what they want you to believe...

robindch

And that's a barcode printer in the background. Spot 'em a mile off, I can.

And isn't that the catholic JFK sitting down twiddling the knobs? Looks like John 23rd was in league with the CIA.