Poker etiquette and talking about a hand after it is played.

sumoward

Having played online and live, I have heard lots of things said on Tables, up to including threats.

twice recently I have been pulled up on things I have said. This has never happen to me before. I just want to get a feel for what is appropriate .


OnLine:

Dont recall the incident very well. Its after a Hand is played and the losing player berates the winning player for his play. I decide to defend the Winning Bad player as:


1. Its Fun to tease people online and is something that is standard in the Online Computer games I play. A bit like sledging in sport.

2. I this like all the times I see player berate other players online.

Therefore I explain to the losing player why his play was wrong. Now as i cant recall my arguments were probable spurious and transparent and inaccurate,They may not have been, Cant recall)

A boardie i respect called me up on it.

In Real Life:

Was sitting in a Buy-in last night in Lukes. Before the break was playing very mad because it was fun, just creating bad beat stories. Cracked another Guys ACES with A!0, that sort of thing.

We come back after the break, I announce I will now play properly. I take a few Pots showing the best hand every time. I fold muck showing it.

There is no reason to believe I am engaged in Loose play.

I then get KQs in early position and make a standard 3 bb raise. It fold around to the cutoff who says raise and puts in a3bb, she hadn't seem my raise. She is told she has made the call and now must stick the chips in. She makes the minimum raise reluctantly. It folds back to me.

I have a think and see I have her covered so I go all in assuming that unless she has a monster she will fold.

She calls. I am thinking bye bye she has AA or KK as this is what she was playing earlier. She turn over AJ and I go nice call and am pretty happy that i am not as far behind as I believed.



I win the raise and she whines. i say something like Thats the nature of raises and and that maybe she could have found a fold( I may have said this t the guys either side of me, i don't recall)

She is obviously pissed off and whines away to players she knows up the table.

Later in the games. Its my BB she goes all in. It fold round to me and i cover her just about. I have J9o I put her on a big hand and because I have a headache i think **** it, double up or go home and lie down in the Dark.

I call and she looses( she was a big favorite).
She then says "how can he call with that when he gave out to me for playing AJ"

Now this is where I should have shut up I think but my head is thumping.

I said "I knew I was making a bad play you and was happy to do it"(roughly)

This really really " thats the best one I have ever heard" annoyed her and she went off complaining.

A dealer I know and respect there said to me I shouldn't have said it as she was a good regular.

Now in the greater stream of Crap that is spewed at poker tables my offenses are in the hind most place but I don't general like to give offense or take it and rarely if ever act out of malice.

In fact I enjoy discussing the hands and because I am not as emotionally involved in them as some players I may be insenstitive.

I was wondering what is the best way to deal with this as I do enjoy all the chatter but don't want to hurt peoples feelings.


Apologies to anyone I offended.:)

Flushdraw

I tilt badly and have bad online etiquette hence why i have requested my chat to be banned on a few of the sites i play on...:(

Edit to say...EP raises, somebody reraises and another guy calls with KJo and wins the hand makes my blood boil more than any other hand possible..p1sses me off no end!

Bandara

can't see what you did wrong, you were bantering at a poker table on poker topics, just cause your opponent who was delighted with your call with a worse hand got beaten she moans about it.

Hell of a lot worse going on out there, very good mate of mine (who is an absolute gentleman) got racially abused at a table in a dublin cardroom at the weekend, eventually he felt he had to leave the table and went to cash out, the abusive person actually left the table and followed him to further spout bile at him in full earshot of the card room manager who was walking past and did nothing at all.

:mad:

cooker3

I hate it when people criticise a clearly bad play whether it live or online. There is just no sense to it. The only time I criticise is if someone is criticising a bad player, I will sometimes try to defend them and their play even if it terrible or I will only try to tilt someone if I want them to call. Although stars threatened to ban from me typing in chatbox last time I did it.
Basically never critcise bad play ever

5starpool

I wouldn't have made the AJ comment, but I don't think you did a lot wrong speechwise on the J9 thing. You knew it was a losing call long most of the time, but it's hardly the first time someone has done that. I'm amazed a dealer made the comment to you.

I have an idea who the woman might have been too at a guess.

bohsman

cooker3 wrote:

Basically never critcise bad play ever

.

bohsman

5starpool wrote:

I have an idea who the woman might have been too at a guess.

Im guessing youre wrong.

Jesus Wept

cooker3 wrote:

I

Basically never critcise bad play ever

QFT.

Drives me nuts when people do this. Idiots.

phantom_lord

The-Rigger wrote:

QFT.

Drives me nuts when people do this. Idiots.

+1. The only people who i berate in the chat are the idiots criticizing bad players, and short stackers. grrr.

sumoward

cooker3 wrote:

Basically never critcise bad play ever

This is the crux of the issue.

I have always thought "the unexamined life was not worth living" so I spend a lot of time being critical in the sense of trying to engage in informed interpretation and judgment.

Now In poker this can be -EV(tapping the Tank). Now as the social aspect of poker is my favorite part of it and the discussion of hands the best parts of this, it leaves me with a a nice catch 22.



Oh and on the Identity of the Lady. I think she inst the curmudgeon you are thinking of. if anything she is a lovely lady, hence me feeling bad about it.

Taxipete29

Although I havent been playing that long I really do think that when it comes to bad play either live or online, if it bothers ya that much or if someone cracks your AAs with 72 then count to five and just vent on boards like so many do. If a player asks for a critique of their play then feel free to say what ya feel but if they dont just let them be. They are never gonna take notice of ya anyway so save your breath

BobSloane

Anytime i've ever commented on a hand i think i've almost instantly regretted it. Now i just sit there and shut the fvck up. You learn a lot more by other peoples comments anyway. e.g. if someone comments on the odds of hitting a flush you learn he is a handicap.

Jesus Wept

sumoward wrote:

This is the crux of the issue.

I have always thought "the unexamined life was not worth living" so I spend a lot of time being critical in the sense of trying to engage in informed interpretation and judgment.

Now In poker this can be -EV(tapping the Tank). Now as the social aspect of poker is my favorite part of it and the discussion of hands the best parts of this, it leaves me with a a nice catch 22.



Oh and on the Identity of the Lady. I think she inst the curmudgeon you are thinking of. if anything she is a lovely lady, hence me feeling bad about it.

There is a world of difference between discussing hands with people who want to learn and progress, and berating some casual player at the table.

Discuss important hands with close friends, or on forums such as boards.

No party learns a thing from someone berating people for poor play.

Also the amount of idiots who berate people (including me :D) for play they consider poor when really they just don't have a clue.

Pure results based type thinking & comments etc.
They see you make a maths type call pf from some short stack that goes allin when it's your BB, and you call with ugly cards such as 94o but automatically all they see is that it's a 94o type hand, they start telling you what a fool you are. :rolleyes: Their ridiculous reactions are even more over the top when the shortstack has a big pair despite the fact that the short stack only had a few BB and their range should be so wide open.

Ah well, a lot of people are stupid, especially when it comes to poker, and would be better to talk less.

Jesus Wept

jazzygeoff wrote:

Hi there

In answer to your query - Etiquette simply means manners and behaviour at the table!

First of all what you did is not breaking any rule - Nor is it bad etiquette?

It is all part of the game - However people don't like to be hit when they are down?

Bad etiquett is when you slow roll or lie about your hand or hide chips or other acts that are considered ungentlemanly?

Hope I have helped you my fellow player.................

Be lucky

G.

You haven't, and you are being a shill, post reported.

And you're talking about etiquette, the ironing.

jazzygeoff wrote:

Bad etiquett is when you slow roll or lie about your hand

Well it's against the rules to tell the truth about your hand. What you said is just really inaccurate.

Mr.Plough

i remember a dublin regular criticising my play before when i flopped two pair with 63o or something. "How can you play thems cards" etc

After I explained to him that i checked my bb pf he replies "Yeah great play we'll see how far you get". lol

I try not to berate an unknowns play, but i've done on occasion in the chatbox when im really frustrated at being put out of a big mtt, i've never done it in cash.

live i dont think ive ever done it sober as i'm fairly quiet at the table anyway but I may have and can't remember. doesn't achieve anything but make you look like an a$$hole imo

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

Jayminator

Hammertime wrote:

can't see what you did wrong, you were bantering at a poker table on poker topics, just cause your opponent who was delighted with your call with a worse hand got beaten she moans about it.

Hell of a lot worse going on out there, very good mate of mine (who is an absolute gentleman) got racially abused at a table in a dublin cardroom at the weekend, eventually he felt he had to leave the table and went to cash out, the abusive person actually left the table and followed him to further spout bile at him in full earshot of the card room manager who was walking past and did nothing at all.

:mad:

Completely unacceptable. If I heard this at a card table I would nt put up with it. I hope your mate aint put off and should make a complaint to the card room manager

David Michael

sumoward wrote:

Having played online and live, I have heard lots of things said on Tables, up to including threats.

twice recently I have been pulled up on things I have said. This has never happen to me before. I just want to get a feel for what is appropriate .


OnLine:

Dont recall the incident very well. Its after a Hand is played and the losing player berates the winning player for his play. I decide to defend the Winning Bad player as:


1. Its Fun to tease people online and is something that is standard in the Online Computer games I play. A bit like sledging in sport.

2. I this like all the times I see player berate other players online.

Therefore I explain to the losing player why his play was wrong. Now as i cant recall my arguments were probable spurious and transparent and inaccurate,They may not have been, Cant recall)

A boardie i respect called me up on it.

In Real Life:

Was sitting in a Buy-in last night in Lukes. Before the break was playing very mad because it was fun, just creating bad beat stories. Cracked another Guys ACES with A!0, that sort of thing.

We come back after the break, I announce I will now play properly. I take a few Pots showing the best hand every time. I fold muck showing it.

There is no reason to believe I am engaged in Loose play.

I then get KQs in early position and make a standard 3 bb raise. It fold around to the cutoff who says raise and puts in a3bb, she hadn't seem my raise. She is told she has made the call and now must stick the chips in. She makes the minimum raise reluctantly. It folds back to me.

I have a think and see I have her covered so I go all in assuming that unless she has a monster she will fold.

She calls. I am thinking bye bye she has AA or KK as this is what she was playing earlier. She turn over AJ and I go nice call and am pretty happy that i am not as far behind as I believed.



I win the raise and she whines. i say something like Thats the nature of raises and and that maybe she could have found a fold( I may have said this t the guys either side of me, i don't recall)

She is obviously pissed off and whines away to players she knows up the table.

Later in the games. Its my BB she goes all in. It fold round to me and i cover her just about. I have J9o I put her on a big hand and because I have a headache i think **** it, double up or go home and lie down in the Dark.

I call and she looses( she was a big favorite).
She then says "how can he call with that when he gave out to me for playing AJ"

Now this is where I should have shut up I think but my head is thumping.

I said "I knew I was making a bad play you and was happy to do it"(roughly)

This really really " thats the best one I have ever heard" annoyed her and she went off complaining.

A dealer I know and respect there said to me I shouldn't have said it as she was a good regular.

Now in the greater stream of Crap that is spewed at poker tables my offenses are in the hind most place but I don't general like to give offense or take it and rarely if ever act out of malice.

In fact I enjoy discussing the hands and because I am not as emotionally involved in them as some players I may be insenstitive.

I was wondering what is the best way to deal with this as I do enjoy all the chatter but don't want to hurt peoples feelings.


Apologies to anyone I offended.:)

Depends how you can carry it off.

By your apology & questions.... it seems you think you did wrong. Did you answer your own thoughts?

*shrugs*

In saying that even on the internet people can discuss hands and come across arrogant etc. Really depends on how you can carry it off.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

LuckyLloyd wrote:

I would personally appreciate if you named the cardclub. I'd be slower to give them my business if that story is true.

me too ...

name and shame pls (even in PM)

White Knight

sumoward wrote:

I have always thought "the unexamined life was not worth living" so I spend a lot of time being critical in the sense of trying to engage in informed interpretation and judgment.

sumoward wrote:

Now as the social aspect of poker is my favorite part of it and the discussion of hands the best parts of this, it leaves me with a a nice catch 22.

Was it you who flat called a 4k bet in position on the river with quad 2's (the absolute nuts) during the IPO

kebabfest

You didnt do anything wrong. Some people just cant take getting dogged by bad play or bad hands.
I find this quite bizarre as the same people are quite happy when all the chips go in the middle and they have the best of it.
What hammertime was talking about is much worse. Racism is something I have seen little of in any card rooms and I am shocked to hear the card manager would allow this going on.
If I heard this type of abuse dished out to anybody at a club and the manager didnt do anything about it I would be getting barred myself for my reaction.

Goodluck2me

LuckyLloyd wrote:

I would personally appreciate if you named the cardclub. I'd be slower to give them my business if that story is true.

It wouldnt be hard to guess imo.

The Al Lad

LuckyLloyd wrote:

I would personally appreciate if you named the cardclub. I'd be slower to give them my business if that story is true.

.

I got slowrolled in the same club by some lanky clown, I'm sure it's the same club which led to murder between other players on the table

won't be going back

Wombatman

sumoward wrote:

Before the break was playing very mad because it was fun, just creating bad beat stories. Cracked another Guys ACES with A!0, that sort of thing.
******************************************
There is no reason to believe I am engaged in Loose play.

????

Let's look at this from another perspective.

I make a good call with AJ (maybe I had a tell-read). You suck out and give me a slap on the wrist for bad play.

Later you suck out again and again twist the knife.

I'd be a more than a little pi%%ed here Sir.

Dealer should have stayed out of it. Rules etc should not be dependant on you being sound or a regular or whatever.

bohsman

Wombatman wrote:

Dealer should have stayed out of it. Rules etc should not be dependant on you being sound or a regular or whatever.

I wear my dickybow so little that I didnt even realise Id been saying it in uniform till I read this thread. By regular I meant player that comes in to play their cards and have a bit of crack with new players and players that theyve been playing with since before I was born whatever casino they may choose to play in. The player wasnt impressed heading out the door so I mentioned it to Sumoward a while later, I should probably have taken the dickybow off first.

I also tell people to stop tapping the aquarium online.

Taxipete29

Taxipete29 wrote:

if someone cracks your AAs with 72 then count to five and just vent on boards like so many do.

Just spent 15 minutes trying to search for this........

The Hammer

Man do I miss Tribeca

TommyGunne

cooker3 wrote:

Basically never critcise bad play ever

+ 3?

Taxipete29

Deleted User wrote:

Just spent 15 minutes trying to search for this........

The Hammer

Man do I miss Tribeca

Definite need for venting after that, ouch

Jippo

White Knight wrote:

Was it you who flat called a 4k bet in position on the river with quad 2's (the absolute nuts) during the IPO

Some people just don't get the river; I saw a guy flat call in with a house; pretty sure it was the absolute nuts. After a while a few people on the table were like; eh?

He then said "sure I wouldn't get any more off him anyway". Total cop-out of an all-told blunder.

sumoward

bohsman wrote:

I wear my dickybow so little that I didnt even realise Id been saying it in uniform till I read this thread. By regular I meant player that comes in to play their cards and have a bit of crack with new players and players that theyve been playing with since before I was born whatever casino they may choose to play in. The player wasnt impressed heading out the door so I mentioned it to Sumoward a while later, I should probably have taken the dickybow off first.

I also tell people to stop tapping the aquarium online.

I dont think Bohsman did anything out of line, he was giving me some friendly advice.

sumoward

Wombatman wrote:

????

Let's look at this from another perspective.

I make a good call with AJ (maybe I had a tell-read). You suck out and give me a slap on the wrist for bad play.

Later you suck out again and again twist the knife.

I'd be a more than a little pi%%ed here Sir.

Good points
I wasnt turning the knife but it certainly could be taken that way. I am pretty OK with Criticism not everyone id, I should be careful of that.