Is Vista a bit Overkill?

cormie

Saw Vista on a laptop for the first time yesterday. I have to say some things are pretty good, previews on windows from the taskbar, the way it will pre-warn you if files are too big that you are about to copy to a destination drive and will give you the option to "try again" and I'm sure there are plenty of other improvements I didn't see but aswell as that, there seems to be a lot of things that are just a bit too fancy like switching between windows, minimising and all that, just seems a tad excessive to animate something so basic.

I'm contemplating getting a new laptop and don't need too high a spec-machine. This is my current laptop and I'm just wondering how much a replacement with equal spec would be running Vista well:

Aspire 5021WLMi AMD Turion ML28 1.6Ghz (35W), Microsoft½ Windows½ XP Home, 15.4" WXGA Acer CrystalBrite, 128MB ATI X700, 512MB (2*256), 100GB, DVD Dual double layer, LiIon, Gigabit Ethernet & wireless 802.11g , 6-in-1 card reader

I wouldn't mind a fingerprint swipe too (or are these just a gimmick and easy to bypass security wise?). The most resource fed thing I'd be doing is probably playing Pro Evo 8, while listening to some music. Here's the recommended system requirements for Pro Evo 8:

Windows XP
Intel Pentium 4 3.0GHz /AMD Athlon 64 or better
1GB RAM
DirectX 9.0c video card
256MB Pixel Shader 3.0 (ATI x1600 / NVidia 6800 GT/GS or better)
DirectX 9.0c Soundcard
DirectX 9.0c or higher
Windows USB Gamepad
1280 x 720 resolution

Supported Chipsets:
NVIDIA - GeForce 6600, 6800, 7300, 7600, 7800, 7900, GeForce FX (5950, 5900, 5800, 5600, 5200), GeForce4 Ti, GeForce3
ATI - Radeon x1600, x1800, x1900, x800, 9800, 9700, 9600, 9500, 9200, 9000, 8500

Also, will everything that is compatible with XP, be ok with Vista too? Or should I scrap the whole lot and just get used to using Linux or Unix or whatever it's called?

Any feedback appreciated!

GerardKeating

cormie wrote:

I'm contemplating getting a new laptop and don't need too high a spec-machine. This is my current laptop and I'm just wondering how much a replacement with equal spec would be running Vista well:

For the next six-months, XP has the lead over Vista with Drivers and Software but you cannot stop the tide so unless there is a specific device or application that you already have that is not support under vista then it make no sense to get XP.

XJR

very confused message from last post .

I wouldn't touch Vista for the next couple of years, I'm going to wait till the rest of the world finds, reports and fixes the bugs before I'll even think about upgrading as if that were an accurate description (Ha!).

Why on earth does any normal home user think he/she needs finger print recognition? Do yourself a favour, if you've got a good stable build of XP and you don't have a new app that demands the new OS stick with what's tried and tested.

BTW our company(1000 users) still runs XP on all it's desktops and it will be a couple of years at leat before we make the move.

Tony H

im running vista business on a inspiron 6400 with intel dual core T2400 @ 1.83GHz with a gig of ram and its flying along , i did however use nLite to reduce the bloat from the orignal Dell Instalation dvd , i have to say installing it was no problem , i did not have to install any drivers as vista installed EVERYTHING ,unlike xp with which i had to install every driver , if you do get a laptop with vista business or ultimate you can also downgrade to XP pro if you are having problems with vista , all in all i am very happy with vista so far
fitz

cormie

XJR wrote:

Why on earth does any normal home user think he/she needs finger print recognition?

Well I wouldn't be a normal home user, I'll be using the fact it's a laptop a lot and taking it out with me all the time. It will also have personal and business information that I'd prefer not to share, nothing valuable to anyone else or anything, but if I can have fingerprint recognition, sure why not:) Just wondering if it increases the security 10 fold or if it's just a gimmick though?

Is Vista known to be buggy? I know all new software generally is, but is there anything major keeping you back or is it just incase?

I like to have things pretty simple. On my XP, I use the windows classic taskbar, I disabled all things like animated minimising and maximising, shadows under options etc in the XP Performance Options. In fact the only two things I have ticked out of all them options is desktop icon shadows and folder common tasks. I also only have one item on the desktop, and it's not the recycle bin either because I disabled that too:p So yeah, I like things pretty simple.

I don't suppose there is updates for XP you can get to add things like pre-warning of the destination drive having not enough free space and all that?

If I do get a laptop that is Vista Compatible and includes Vista, would I not be better off just going with Vista since in a few months/years, it will be the XP of today?

cormie

fitzdragon wrote:

im running vista business on a inspiron 6400 with intel dual core T2400 @ 1.83GHz with a gig of ram and its flying along , i did however use nLite to reduce the bloat from the orignal Dell Instalation dvd , i have to say installing it was no problem , i did not have to install any drivers as vista installed EVERYTHING ,unlike xp with which i had to install every driver , if you do get a laptop with vista business or ultimate you can also downgrade to XP pro if you are having problems with vista , all in all i am very happy with vista so far
fitz

That's something I can't stand. OEM installs of an OS. They just add so much unnecessary shoite. As I said, I like things very simple, clean and minimal. Is it possible to use your OEM license for an install of JUST Vista from a Vista only CD/ISO? How much space would this take up and how much of that space would be for things you just don't need I wonder?

Tony H

well i have gotten my windows folder down to 4.5 gigs on the first try with a dell oem copy of vista business with nLITE , thats with 42 running processes including web browser, antivirus ,firewall and two anti spyware programmes which i think is fairly good

Seth Brundle

My work laptop (Toshiba Satellite pro, 2 gigs, 1.7GHz) has vista on it. Any software I need goes on easily and I have had no driver issues at all (can connect to printers, etc. easily).
If you are getting a laptop with vista then get as much ram as you can but I would suggest getting 2Gigs at a minimum.
I would also recomment that if you are bringing the laptop around with you then move sensitive data to another PC each evening and keep sensitive content on the laptop to a minimum as no matter what security you have in place, it can be bypassed somehow!

melekalikimaka

half a gig of ram with vista... madness, 1 gig will even struggle with anything but basic surfing. 2 is minimum

cormie

A laptop with 2GB of ram will cost a fair whack though, right? XP runs fine on my 512, what exactly is so resource hungry on Vista that requires at least 4x more than that? That's what I mean by Overkill;)

Capt'n Midnight

XJR wrote:

very confused message from last post .

I wouldn't touch Vista for the next couple of years, I'm going to wait till the rest of the world finds, reports and fixes the bugs before I'll even think about upgrading as if that were an accurate description (Ha!).

...

BTW our company(1000 users) still runs XP on all it's desktops and it will be a couple of years at leat before we make the move.

Business users have a choice since business license will allow them to use XP. And most businesses won't touch it with a bargepole until service pack one is shown to be stable. Also lots of VPN software and remote connect stuff like 3G modems don't have vista drivers yet, so can rule it out for many business laptop users.

Home users on the other hand have NO CHOICE.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/lifecycle/default.mspx

Windows XP Professional

Date of General Availability
December 31, 2001

Direct OEM and Retail License Availability (end date)
June 30, 2008 looks like this has been extended from Jan 31st

System Builder License Availability (end date)
January 31, 2009

XJR

cormie wrote:

but if I can have fingerprint recognition, sure why not:) Just wondering if it increases the security 10 fold or if it's just a gimmick though?

I think if you have to ask the question then the answer is probably gimmick - though no doubt someone around here will prove me wrong.

Capt'n Midnight

Fingerprint readers ?
Low tech stuff that has worked on various ones.

Superglue fumes. Clear plastic bag filled with cold water. one USB reader sent an encrypted picture , but when you XOR'd two subsequent pictures the difference was the finger print.

the_syco

cormie wrote:

A laptop with 2GB of ram will cost a fair whack though, right? XP runs fine on my 512, what exactly is so resource hungry on Vista that requires at least 4x more than that? That's what I mean by Overkill;)

Vista on 512MB is like XP with 128MB. As for what it's used for: all the shiney crap, esp the "Aero" interface.

Someone mentioned that they didn't need drivers, etc: you are one of the lucky few who knows how to use a computer. A f**k load of the users I support got printers that don't work with Vista until you download the drivers, won't work with Vista, as the drivers don't exist, or will have weird errors.

XP took about 2 years before it became stable. I'd say Vista will be the same. On it's initial release date, Vista was not compatible with any USB modem iven to users by their ISPs in the UK. Nine months on, and people are still finding out that X, Y and Z programs are not compatible with Vista.

Finally, and I say this from the bottom of my heart DON'T GET A F**KING ONBOARD GRAPHICS CARD, ESP NO INTEL ****E, AND IF YOU GET ONE WITH SHARED MEMORY, BE PREPARED TO BE F**KING ASS RAPED BY SOME SH|TE SPEC GAME LIKE PACMAN COS THE ONBOARD PIECE OF SH|TE CAN'T HANDLE IT...!

cormie

the_syco wrote:

Finally, and I say this from the bottom of my heart DON'T GET A F**KING ONBOARD GRAPHICS CARD, ESP NO INTEL ****E, AND IF YOU GET ONE WITH SHARED MEMORY, BE PREPARED TO BE F**KING ASS RAPED BY SOME SH|TE SPEC GAME LIKE PACMAN COS THE ONBOARD PIECE OF SH|TE CAN'T HANDLE IT...!

lol, calm down there:D

What do you mean an onboard graphics card? If I was getting a laptop, would it not be onboard? I don't even know what you mean by onboard so explain that first please:)

GhostInTheRuins

I have to throw in my 2c about those fingerprint readers. Don't waste your money. My brother had one for his pc a while ago. Unless he scrubed his fingerprint of the pad after each time he touched it, all you had to do was put some cloth on your finger and gently place it where he had his finger last time he logged in and it would read it. It was a joke really, you're more secure without one.

cormie

cormie wrote:

lol, calm down there:D

What do you mean an onboard graphics card? If I was getting a laptop, would it not be onboard? I don't even know what you mean by onboard so explain that first please:)

I'm sure he's referring to shared memory graphics chips such as UMA (the typical ones seen on a cheapo Micro-ATX board), or to a lesser extent TurboCache or HyperMemory.

28064212

melekalikimaka wrote:

half a gig of ram with vista... madness, 1 gig will even struggle with anything but basic surfing. 2 is minimum

Not true, 1GB of memory is easily sufficient, even with Aero switched on. At 512MB you might want to switch Aero off, but it will still be sufficient to run Vista pretty well

dulpit

Just to throw in my opinion, I think any normal home user should get Vista when buying a new system, be it laptop or desktop... So far my Dell laptop has handled Vista great, no troubles as of yet...

I would say that 2gb of RAM is a clever thing to get, although i have used laptops with 1gb and it handles it ok (just don't be doing too much)

Also, to echo above, get a decent graphics card if you wanna play games, our old desktop had an integrated card, couldn't play anything on it, my laptop has a nice nVidia card, runs games great!


Oh and finally, if it's a laptop you're looking for, check out the Dell Vostro line, very reasonable with decent graphics thrown in too...

cormie

Seems for my heads sake I should probably just stick with XP at the moment? I'm not into all the fancy schmancy stuff Vista does, only the more intelligent things like warning if a destination drive is too small before a transfer. I wonder are these things possible with an XP upgrade at all?

Ghost Train

cormie wrote:

Seems for my heads sake I should probably just stick with XP at the moment? I'm not into all the fancy schmancy stuff Vista does, only the more intelligent things like warning if a destination drive is too small before a transfer. I wonder are these things possible with an XP upgrade at all?

you can always turn off the fancy features in vista. would agree with what dulpit said that for a normal user vista should be fine, but if you're more a power user maybe you should stick with xp. Vista security can be annoying if you're installing stuff regularly or want to do more advanced stuff.

XP probably the safe option since its still the most popular os and everything should work with it

cormie

But what has Vista got over XP for a home user? Just fancyness?

Slaanesh

I have found wireless to not work very well with Vista. There is a bug which causes the connection to lag out every minute or so. This means low latency online gaming can be a nightmare.

It used to be in XP too but there was a fix. There is no fix for vista as far as I know.

Ghost Train

cormie wrote:

But what has Vista got over XP for a home user? Just fancyness?

a bit more user friendly* for the average user and some security improvments*. Should be supported further into the future than xp... unless Microsoft decide to drop vista and go in a different direction

*just my personal opinion (:

I actually think it's less user friendly, at least for someone who knows Windows 95 and its successors. I find myself taking more time to do familiar things.

Also, while you can disable the Aero interface and revert the colour scheme to Windows 2000's, the Vista UI layout looks awful with the older schemes.

Just my opinions...

TerrorFirmer

If you're a gamer just leave it. Not because there's any performance hit, that seems to be fixed. But half my games don't work - keep giving me error messages, crash, even in XP compatibility mode. And the strangest thing is that I can't boot from an XP disc to install it. It boots fine on my desktop but when I try to boot from my laptop it just says no boot device. its set to cd-rom priority boot. Vista....just pisses me off. It's also always doing something - processor/hard drive are always doing/accessing something constantly.

Seth Brundle

eolhc wrote:

a bit more user friendly* for the average user

Are you including the start menu in that? :eek:

PogMoThoin

I have had nothin but troubles since i installed vista, conflicts, crashes etc. Gotta re-instal my soundcard & gpu driver every-so-often, not to mention half my programs & games don't work. Vista is $hite, re-installin Xp when i get time.

Stick with XP until the bugs are sorted out. Theres a service pack out early next yr 4 vista which is 4.5Gb. :eek:

PogMoThoin

PogMoThoin wrote:

Stick with XP until the bugs are sorted out. Theres a service pack out early next yr 4 vista which is 4.5Gb. :eek:

4.5 gigs for a service pack?! You must be joking!

That's the thing I don't understand with Vista, what the hell's taking up so much space?

Seth Brundle

Maybe it comes with spyware already built in?

sebastianlieken

ah i wouldnt agree with the spyware built in thing...you see, vista is the safest os so far, because even viruses have compatabilty issues.