Alternatives/How you spend your "wrestling time"?

Vince135792003

Interesting column by Bryan Alvarez which really sums up where I am right now.

ALTERNATIVES

By: Bryan Alvarez
The Fight Network
bryanalvarez@f4wonline.com

Ever since WCW died, I've gotten e-mails from people who say they still read my newsletter and visit my website, but they don't actually watch wrestling anymore. Other people lost interest when people like Eddy Guerrero or Chris Benoit died, and, more recently, I've heard from people who have given up on Raw after Hornswoggle was revealed as Vince McMahon's illegitimate child.

I love wrestling, but the reality is that if I didn't do this for a living I probably would never watch TNA, and rarely watch Smackdown or ECW unless I heard there was something great on. I guarantee I wouldn't buy every single PPV as I do now. I can understand why people have grown disillusioned with these shows over the last few years, but I cannot understand people saying that there isn't anything interesting for them to watch.

There are a ton of alternatives in the world of wrestling and mixed martial arts, and I'm going to touch on a few of them in this column. Now, granted, some you have to go out of your way to find, and maybe you'll have to spend a bit more money on your cable package. But if you love wrestling and used to spend $29.95 to $39.95 per month on PPVs, I guarantee you can get far better action for an equal or lesser price if you look around.

* Ring of Honor. ROH isn't for everyone. If you're one of those fans who thinks the only good wrestling came before 1989, well, skip forward to the next selection. But if you love fast-paced athletic pro-wrestling and love what the X-Division used to be before it became a clown show, you really should give it a try. ROH is now running on PPV, so if you're in America and have anything other than the DirecTV you can sample a two-hour show for about $10. Both PPVs have gotten largely rave reviews from fans, and while I haven't seen Driven yet (I will this weekend), we're told the Bryan Danielson vs. Nigel McGuinness match is between ****1/2 and ***** depending upon the report. I saw their first big match in England and it was out of this world. There are some flaws with the product, but overall everyone works hard, there are a lot of great matches, you rarely if ever feel insulted by the storylines, and even if you don't love everything about it it's hard to argue you didn't get your money's worth. DVDs are also available rather inexpensively at ROHwrestling.com, and free videos are up at ROHvideos.com.

* Derby City Wrestling. It's hard for me to review this one right now because I'm currently involved in a storyline there. But I loved it before I was ever involved and I can pretty much guarantee I'll love it when my involvement is over. Derby City is a TV show run by Rip Rogers and Danny Davis featuring students from OVW's intermediate class. It's unaffiliated with WWE, meaning unlike OVW they aren't forced to use guys they don't want to use in stupid gimmicks created by the office. Every wrestler is allowed to be whatever character they want, is in charge of putting together their own matches, does their own promos without being overly scripted, and often call their matches in the ring. It's as old-school as old-school gets, and if something gets ****ed up, there's no editing. Unlike TNA, every storyline makes perfect sense and you never find yourself asking why something happened. It's not great wrestling because they're all students paying to train, but some of them are remarkably good given their level of experience, and it's so wacky and fun that it's usually my first or second favorite show to watch all week. More info is up at derbycitywrestling.com.

* Human Weapon. This usually vies for the top spot with Derby City. Former football player Bill Duff and MMA fighter Jason Chambers travel around the world and study different forms of hand-to-hand combat. After training in a discipline, each show ends with one or both of them engaging in a fight with a legitimate practitioner of the art. It's a great way to learn about different fighting styles and different countries and cultures around the world. Shows have covered such arts as karate, krav maga, muay thai, original Greek Pankration, and judo. Bill and Jason are a very likable buddy duo, leading to fights where sometimes there's more drama than anything you'd see in wrestling or even on Ultimate Fighter. The show airs on the History Channel, so check your listings for time and date.

* The Ultimate Fighter. I've only seen one episode so far, but based on that and feedback I've gotten from others about episode two, this may very well bump Derby City and Human Weapon to third place. It was by far the best TV program last week and when it gets into a groove I look forward to it more than anything else. It's a bunch of wacky fighters training and battling to win a contract with UFC, and it usually features two coaches -- Matt Hughes and Matt Serra this season -- who not only hate each other but are going to fight when the season is over. TUF has built more bona-fide money-drawing superstars than any pro-wrestling or MMA program in the last three years or so, and there is much to learn from it. Too bad nobody in WWE or particularly TNA has. Plus, besides the learning experience aspect of it, you also get nutty personalities, compelling TV and an ass-kicking at the end of each show. When this show is great, nothing tops it. It airs on Spike TV Wednesday nights.

* International wrestling and the indies. I don't get a chance to see much Japan at all these days, but I'm constantly being told that while there isn't a lot of major news going on from any of the major promotions, there is a lot of great wrestling, particularly in Dragon Gate. I saw several of the Dragon Gate stars live at the Battle of Los Angeles the past two years, and they were a step above everybody else, and it's not like everybody else wasn't any good. In fact, if you can get your hands on this year's BOLA (prowrestlingguerilla.com), night three in particular was the single best independent show I've ever been to. If you have lots of channels on your TV, do a search for Guerreros del Ring on Canal 52 or Lucha Libre on Fox Sports Espanol for CMLL matches from Arena Coliseo and Arena Mexico. It's hit and miss sometimes, but if you can comprehend lucha, the great stuff is awesome. AAA is also available on Galavision, and while the company sucked in the ring for many years, it's had a real renaissance of late. Other major indies include CHIKARA, which featured one of the greatest matches I ever saw involving a tree and a mummy, and FIP in Florida, which is booked by Gabe Sapolsky of ROH.

In conclusion, yes, WWE programming has largely sucked lately and TNA -- well, I don't need to get into that. But there ARE alternatives, and anyone who says there is nothing good to watch anymore is merely lazy or not looking hard enough.

*****

For more pro-wrestling and MMA news and analysis with Bryan Alvarez, please visit www.figurefouronline.com.

How much WWE/TNA do you watch? Do you sit through whole shows? And basically if you don't, what are your alternatives?

For me, this is probably a time where I'm watching the least amount of current wrestling ever. The Raw's from earlier this year seem a long time a go and now I basically follow whats going on, catch bits and pieces but don't generally sit down and watch shows right through each week. It's just not offering anything I want to see right now. The whole Benoit situation probably has something to do with it but I think my lack of interest has slowly been growing for a long time.

I've nothing to say about TNA.

My alternatives would be dvds of old stuff or wrestling documentaries which I love, MMA and newsletters/websites. I could go on and on about UFC or old Pride shows forever but basically the excitement I once got from wrestling I get now from MMA.

When I was 5, I used to love every good guy wrestler. It didn't matter who. I was interested in all of them and its kinda the same with MMA now. There are literally 20-30 guys who I can't wait to see fight and am interested in how their careers develop and progress because they have personalities that appeal to me and well don't make me feel stupid when I watch.

In wrestling, besides a notable few, I'm pretty apathetic about the whole thing. Like if Khali had been given the belt a couple of years ago I'd have been pissed off. But when it happened this year, I pretty much shrugged my shoulders.

Mossy Monk

I find I am gone off WWE programming. It is very dull and boring. I am watching a lot of UFC though.

ShawnRaven

Mossy Monk wrote:

I find I am gone off WWE programming. It is very dull and boring. I am watching a lot of UFC though.

Yep, same here. I got my mits on 1-67 the other week and am sifting through them all. UFC this year is kicking seven shades of sh*te out of WWE in my honest opinion.

VR!

Vince135792003

validreasoning! wrote:

Yep, same here. I got my mits on 1-67 the other week and am sifting through them all.

1-67 as in UFC's?! Just my 2 cents but I'd look at some of the Pride Grand Priz's (especially 2004) too. Especially when you look at it from a pro-wrestling perspective. Awesome awesome shows.

ShawnRaven

Vince135792003 wrote:

1-67 as in UFC's?! Just my 2 cents but I'd look at some of the Pride Grand Priz's (especially 2004) too. Especially when you look at it from a pro-wrestling perspective. Awesome awesome shows.

Yep, and i've got some Pride stuff coming to me as well. I've heard it's f*cking awesome.

VR!

Fozzy

I watched pretty much every Raw this year since the Rumble, haven't seen the last two though, mainly because of college but it doesn't sound like I missed much. Haven't seen SD in months. I'll check out ECW when I hear of a good match on the show

I just can't bring myself to watch Impact anymore, unless I hear of a very good match on it. I'll usually read two or three reports on it from people I've agreed with in the past. It's been pretty much the same with their last few ppvs, I can't imagine having to sit through a full three hours in case I get as angry as I did once

I haven't seen as much ROH as I'd like to this year, but what I have seen has been just great. They're really getting everything right this year I think, especially with their character development

I'll always watch UFC's ppvs and I just caught the first episode of the new TUF series today. I'm sure I'll be watching the rest of it now

I've seen some really good stuff from New Japan and NOAH earlier in the year, and a couple of shows from Dragon Gate, it didn't disappoint me at all although I haven't had the time to keep up with it recently. My match of the year so far has been from NOAH

I'd love to check out some Derby City Wrestling stuff, it just sounds like a real fun show. I did watch a few episodes of some American indy tv wrestling show, it was some NWA affiliate...possibly NWA Anarchy. It was a pretty fun show, the wrestling wasn't great but there was an old-school feel that made it interesting. DCW sounds stronger though

I don't think I'll ever run out of stuff to watch, I've also seen some bits from CMLL, CHIKARA and PWG that have made me want to check out more of their stuff, but there's other things ahead of them on the list at the moment

WWE is slipping down the pecking order now though, but it's hard not to keep up with it anyway

Good column, I think that a lot of the people who complain a little too much about WWE just haven't got an alternative, and there are plenty out there

krudler

ufc is great but you can be really let down by the hyped up matches, how many times has a fight ended in one round with a few punches thrown? at least with WWE you're guaranteed to get some longevitiy to the main events (aside from cena/orton at unforgiven,grrrr)
i do try to watch raw every week but theres some night i just flick around when theres a match on i have no interest in,nothing unexpected happens on it anymore

ShawnRaven

krudler wrote:

ufc is great but you can be really let down by the hyped up matches, how many times has a fight ended in one round with a few punches thrown? at least with WWE you're guaranteed to get some longevitiy to the main events (aside from cena/orton at unforgiven,grrrr)
i do try to watch raw every week but theres some night i just flick around when theres a match on i have no interest in,nothing unexpected happens on it anymore

I dunno, Rey Mysterios hyped comeback was somewhat of a let down. I'm still convinced that's Konnan under a mask! I tend to think WWE main events to be milked down to the last drop. A lot of WWE feuds are milked to death. Honestly, i really don't want to see Londrick v Hillbillies anymore. I don't wanna see Cena v Orton, I CERTAINLY don't wanna see Undertaker v Kane anymore as it's been done to death, and then some more. Trust me, WWE are also responsible for letting fans down with hyped up matches.

VR!

Vince135792003

validreasoning! wrote:

I've heard it's f*cking awesome.

VR!

Leaving all fighting aside, the production (the set, lighting, video packages and a whole load of other weird stuff) is unbelievable. Don't fast forward through the opening ceremonies would be my advice.

Some of the setups WWE have had have been great. But Prides is just another level. The amount of money the must have spent on production alone would have been staggering.

In many ways (besides the actual fighting!), Pride is closer to great WWE than UFC.


Sorry for throwing the topic off. As I said at the start how much WWE/TNA do people watch? Do you sit through whole shows? And basically if you don't, what are your alternatives?

Vince135792003

krudler wrote:

ufc is great but you can be really let down by the hyped up matches, how many times has a fight ended in one round with a few punches thrown?

Not a good week to use that argument! Every fight on the main card of UFC 76 (except Shogun/Forrest which ended with 15 seconds to go) went the full distance. And it was all awesome. UFC 75 was similar too with the top 3 fights going the distance.

It would vary from month to month but judging on the last year, if I was over in the US, the UFC for me have given people their moneys worth (and then some) on ppv more times than the WWE have

ShawnRaven

Vince135792003 wrote:

Sorry for throwing the topic off. As I said at the start how much WWE/TNA do people watch? Do you sit through whole shows? And basically if you don't, what are your alternatives?

WWE:
All the PPV's, as much 80s/90s TV stuff as i can get my hands on, anything from 86-2005 really.

TNA: Only started watching this year, caught up with a load of PPV's but I don't have Bravo 2, so i get a friend of mine to record it, but i usually get em in batches once a month or so, so i'm often behind.

I usually sit through the entire shows to be honest. Definitely if they are live. Same when watching DVDs. I never take one out for one match and then put it back on the shelf, except one time on the night i found out Benoit died. I put on his and Angle's match from Rumble 03.

VR!

Mr.Nice Guy

I've gone off wrestling considerably over the last year. It started with the Benoit incident as watching the shows left a pretty bitter taste in my mouth. It was like wrestling had become tainted to me. I no longer feel that strongly about it but I've still found myself missing a lot of wrestling shows.

Right now Smackdown is on but I've decided not to watch. I'll give The Undertaker/Henry match a look but that's it. I haven't watched ECW in a good while.

As for TNA, well I gave up on that monstrosity a few months back. It's a shame because there was a point when I looked forward to the show more than I did the WWE shows but that time has long since past. If I want to see cheap effects and dodgy camera angles I'll go watch some old Doctor Who episodes.

Alternatives? Well I'm open to any. MMA never really caught my interest before but I enjoyed their recent PPV and took the time to look at Ultimate Fighter and I liked it and intend to watch the second episode. Maybe that will fill a void for me. What I like about it is you can root for the underdog (as I did for Jardine against Liddell) and he can pull off the upset.

I've caught a few Derby City Wrestling clips on Youtube but there's not much around.

ROH doesn't interest me in the slightest as I think they try too hard and ROH comes off as pompous and elitist to me. I also find the matches and wrestlers ridiculously overrated.

To be honest though I'm probably watching too much stuff. Heroes is back, Family Guy is back (loved the Star Wars episode) and South Park is back soon and Lost returns in a few months so I really should be studying more but it's so damn hard!

Vince135792003

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

ROH doesn't interest me in the slightest as I think they try too hard and ROH comes off as pompous and elitist to me. I also find the matches and wrestlers ridiculously overrated.

I get what your saying about ROH in that their fans can be sooo enthusiastic, it borders on annoying sometimes.

But have you actually watched a show from beginning to end and not just random matches? ROH's calling card is good wrestling. Its the kinda promotion I think that you need to watch 1 or 2 full shows to appreciate whats going on, the wrestlers, the storylines etc..

Thats why i find it hard to get into it sometimes because I find it hard to follow as its really a DVD promotion.

Mr.Nice Guy

Vince135792003 wrote:

I get what your saying about ROH in that their fans can be sooo enthusiastic, it borders on annoying sometimes.

But have you actually watched a show from beginning to end and not just random matches? ROH's calling card is good wrestling. Its the kinda promotion I think that you need to watch 1 or 2 full shows to appreciate whats going on, the wrestlers, the storylines etc..

Thats why i find it hard to get into it sometimes because I find it hard to follow as its really a DVD promotion.

Yeah you make fair points there. I've not watched an entire card from start to finish so I can't really judge their shows.

I just find the whole scene ROH kind of exclusive and narrow. I know it's not bad wrestling on offer but it's just not the kind of wrestling that I can sink my teeth into.

ShawnRaven

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Yeah you make fair points there. I've not watched an entire card from start to finish so I can't really judge their shows.

I just find the whole scene ROH kind of exclusive and narrow. I know it's not bad wrestling on offer but it's just not the kind of wrestling that I can sink my teeth into.

I'm kinda the same. Some people (Fozzy, for example) can overlook production values in Wrestling, I can't. Which is one of the big reasons i couldn't watch ECW. Additional lighting and cameras DO make a difference. Maybe not much when attending a live show, but if your promotion's international fanbase is won over by DVD's, you need to do the best for production.

ROH have to be doing something right though. 5 years on and they're still going. That's about three years more than I gave them originally!

VR!

Vince135792003

validreasoning! wrote:

Maybe not much when attending a live show, but if your promotion's international fanbase is won over by DVD's, you need to do the best for production.

I'm sure they are doing their best. You can only go so far with a limited budget. I think their production is pretty good all things considering though.

The bits I saw of their last ppv looked good production wise.

Spiron

I watch Raw in it's entirety, every week. It's the main WWE show, with the best storylines. If something major is going to happen, it will take place on Raw. Plus, I love the "live" aspect of it, where anything can go wrong.

I record SmackDown every Friday (Sky+), but latley I've found myself fast forwarding through most of the segments. For example, I woke up this morning, watched MVP's Lounge, his match with Kane, Hornswaggle striping of the CW title, and the end of the main event. That's not alot for a two hour show.

I watch ECW, maybe once every three months, and it's the same as SmackDown. Fast forward through most of it. I think last time, I only watched CM Punk's match and that was it.

I watch nearly every WWE Pay-Per-View. Or, at least have done in the past. See, right up untill the Great American Bash, I ordered every single WWE PPV available for more than 3 years. Then, I just said, **** it, I'm not watching it. I didn't watch SummerSlam either, and when finally watched Unforgiven was dissapointed aswell. I only watched it becasue it was free, has it been PPV I wouldn't have.

I watched TNA up untill about 3 months ago, and then stopped. The product doesn't apeall to me anymore.

Independent Wrestling. That's where I'm at. And ****ing DVD I can lay my hands on, I'll watch it, and devour it. I watch ROH, RQW and all the other shows on TWCFight!, I buy ROH DVD's in WrestlingMania, I have all of the 1PW DVD's I could lay my hands on. Heck, I just recently bought IwW Global Impact and had a better time watching it tha any WWE/TNA pay-per-view! Why? Because, it's what wrestling should be about.

Bubs101

I go through spells where I'd watch all 4 shows for a week and then leave it for ages. I tend to watch every Impact before their PPV to catch up, Smackdown was regular viewing for me with EDge and I still like to go check on the MVP storyline but as I watch everything online I skip large bits. Since HBK got injured and Edge left I've barely touched Raw as I don't like watching Cena talk about respect or drinking milk or some crap.

Ironically after Benoit died, I've watched much more wrestling because of Morrisson being the (ex) champ. I think ECW is getting very good, it has people I wanna see like Morrisson, Punk,Thorn, Burke and The MIZ and I've found the commentary pretty class of late.

P.S. Does anyone wanna post a full ROH Event in the videos section so people like me and Mr. Nice Guy could give it a crack of the whip?

Double C

Full ROH shows are around 3 hours long so it would take about a week to put one up, and tbh if I did it would just be taken down straight away. If you really want to check out the product get yourself up to WrestlingMania, they have DVD's for sale for around €20 each. Or if your looking for value go to rohwrestling.com. Get back to me if you want a list of their better shows.

Bubs101

I meant link one. I know some of them are on the net but I don't know where?

Vince135792003

Bubs101 wrote:

I meant link one. I know some of them are on the net but I don't know where?

dailymotion.com usually have some stuff.

Double C

I meant go and buy one.

Fozzy

Bubs101 wrote:

P.S. Does anyone wanna post a full ROH Event in the videos section so people like me and Mr. Nice Guy could give it a crack of the whip?

I just put up a link to their second ppv in the video thread. It's two hours long. I'd like Mr.Nice Guy to check it out, because if he still doesn't like ROH after it then I'll give up on any of my future arguments with him about it! I thought it was really good, some very strong wrestling, every match had a purpose and advanced something, some surprises, good promos, but make up your own mind if you haven't seen it. Best wrestling ppv of the year in my humble opinion

RebelRockChick

Over the summer I stayed up for live Raw most of the time but now I'm back at college so I have to do with the replay Thursday night. I haven't missed many Raw shows this year.

Smackdown, I think I have watched it once since Edge got injured.

Have watched most ppv's live or else watch the repeat....can't remember missing one this year anyway

TNA I only watch if I'm checking through channels when there is nothing else on.

Wish they showed more ROH on TWC cos I'd probably watch it more then.

Mr.Nice Guy

Fozzy wrote:

It's two hours long. I'd like Mr.Nice Guy to check it out, because if he still doesn't like ROH after it then I'll give up on any of my future arguments with him about it!

Well I've time to kill so I will check it out. Will post up my thoughts.

pingu_girl

Dont have the channels now that im back at college but watch the ppvs online live and read the boards and web sites to keep updated on what happening not that there is much. Got the wrestlecrap dvds and not even through a 5th of them yet so them and my old 90's wwf dvds and ,wcw and ecw videos give me a fix when needed

Vince135792003

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

I've caught a few Derby City Wrestling clips on Youtube but there's not much around.

If you've been following it on the free figure four show, Bryan Alvarez's granny has in fact responded to Ted "the traylor" McNailor with her own promo. She has challenged him to an arm wrestling contest!

TheNumpty

I just stick to watching raw live now and the odd ppv, the last few ppv's have been dire to be honest, injuries and suspensions and the head scratching booking in some cases e.g HHH destroying Cade & Murdoch, Carlito and then London and Kendrick a few weeks ago, like seriously, what was the point in that?

Smackdown has been terrible lately and i dread to think what Vickie Guerrero's role as GM will bring in the next few months. Edge can't come back quick enough, he was one of the only reasons i watched it when he was champ.

No Mercy is on soon and (Super) Cena is on his way to retain again in shoddy circumstaces again. I'm holding out for Survivor Series to gain back my interest, hopefully HBK and Edge will return again and rumours of Jericho returning as well can only mean goodness in the lead up to WM 24

gimmick

I haven't watched a full episode of Raw or SD in a long time, and pretty much dont bother with ECW. Ill flick onto the other two every week alright, but find Raw entirely insufferable at the moment. Kind of turned off SD because of the Teddy Long wessing storyline as well.

What I am watching now is UFC a bit more. I have got a tad tired of ROH, but that is down to my watching far too much of it in since last christmas. Also looking at some Japanese stuff from 1994 1995. Got the 1994 Super J Cup today in the post and am told it is an amazing tourney.

TheNumpty

gimmick wrote:

I Also looking at some Japanese stuff from 1994 1995. Got the 1994 Super J Cup today in the post and am told it is an amazing tourney.

That is a quality tournament, it has Eddie Guerrero, Jyushin Liger, Great Sasake, Chris Benoit and a few others. Might watch it again now

Goebels

I have 0 interest in wrestling right now. Haven't watched Smackdown in a long time, never watched ECW and havent watched Raw in a couple of weeks either, nor do I plan on it. I record TNA for a friend but I don't watch it. The last New Japan stuff I saw was the G1 Climax, semi finals and finals, which were great. My current MOTY is still the first Nagata/Tanahashi match from April. Dragon Gate isn't my kettle of fish at all. All Japan has had some good stuff this year like Suzuki/Kojima, but now that Suzuki lost the triple crown I have absolutely no interest. NOAH, I can't stand anymore. I used to be such a huge mark for it too. ROH for what they are doing, are successful. I'm a jaded 2005 fan. I still adore Danielson, and like a couple of others, but there isn't enough for me to be interested in now.

I'm pretty much all into MMA now. The Ultimate Fighter is the best show on TV. Even if you don't like MMA you would enjoy this show. It's also probably the best way to get into MMA. All year there's one been one UFC show that wasn't great, but it was still pretty good (73). The last two pay per views were awesome with great matches up and down the card, and the Ultimate Fight Night which didn't look spectacular on paper, was absolutely awesome.

I've spend most of my time watching PRIDE however. Some of these shows are just some of the best sporting events there ever was. It was a more entertainment based product, and some of the skits were great, like Stephen Quadros playing video games with Renzo Gracie. You have some of the greatest fights, like Fedor/Nogeuira at 25, the entire tournament for Bushido 9, amazing shows top to bottom like 33 (still the best show of the year IMO).

EXC has also been good this year. The show in conjunction with Strikeforce in June, with Shamrock vs Baroni headlining was one of the best shows of the year. The recent one had a lot of good fights, tho is more infamous for Mauro Ranallo's pole comment than anything (which I laughed histerically at).

Vince135792003

Goebels wrote:

I've spend most of my time watching PRIDE however. Some of these shows are just some of the best sporting events there ever was. .

I'm so with you there. Until I started watching Pride I never really appreciated what a big deal it was when it basically went under. It's sad that they didn't tap into the US marker a bit more until it was too late.

Have you seen the Pride Heavy weight grandpriz for 2004? It's 47 euro at silvervsion for the 3 shows and I was just wondering if it was worth it.

Fozzy

Goebels wrote:

My current MOTY is still the first Nagata/Tanahashi match from April.

And what a match that was. I pretty much stopped watching the heavyweights in New Japan after that, I didn't think it could get any better. There's a rematch in a week's time, also featuring what I think is the first time team of Tomko, Giant Bernard (A-Train) and Fergal Devitt

Goebels

Vince135792003 wrote:

I'm so with you there. Until I started watching Pride I never really appreciated what a big deal it was when it basically went under. It's sad that they didn't tap into the US marker a bit more until it was too late.

Have you seen the Pride Heavy weight grandpriz for 2004? It's 47 euro at silvervsion for the 3 shows and I was just wondering if it was worth it.

I haven't, though I will be getting it soon. From the lineup, I don't see how you could go wrong, and pretty much all those tournaments are awesome. You could get it for a LOT cheaper though...

And what a match that was. I pretty much stopped watching the heavyweights in New Japan after that, I didn't think it could get any better. There's a rematch in a week's time, also featuring what I think is the first time team of Tomko, Giant Bernard (A-Train) and Fergal Devitt

Well the first re match was really good, check that out. Also, Nagata/Makabe was just so much fun. Makabe has been so great this year. Did you see Nagata/Suzuki from the dome show? that was one of my favourite matches all year too.

Fozzy

Goebels wrote:

Well the first re match was really good, check that out. Also, Nagata/Makabe was just so much fun. Makabe has been so great this year. Did you see Nagata/Suzuki from the dome show? that was one of my favourite matches all year too.

I watched a good bit of New Japan right after they did the Dome show, but I'll go back and check that match out. Didn't see any of the G-1 Climax, so I'll have a look at some of that. Bit of build-up to the show next week sure

Goebels

Fozzy wrote:

I watched a good bit of New Japan right after they did the Dome show, but I'll go back and check that match out. Didn't see any of the G-1 Climax, so I'll have a look at some of that. Bit of build-up to the show next week sure

If you need links, shoot me a PM.

Fozzy

Goebels wrote:

If you need links, shoot me a PM.

No need, I watched Makabe vs Nagata earlier. Cool match, Makabe was very good. I'm afraid to watch the whole tournament though because of Akebono's presence...

New Japan's a great alternative, I'll have to watch more of it again

Goebels

Makabe/Nagata was so great... just such a fun match. Watch the other semi and then the final. Nothing else is really worth watching, and that way you skip Akebono too.

I'd suggest you picking the dome show though, it was a great show. Tanahashi/Kea, Suzuki/Nagata and Nakamura/Kawada. 3 great matches there, and there wasn't a 'bad' match on the show. Probably the best wrestling show all year.