taylor/pavlik

dlofnep

Any interest in this? I hope Pavlik squashes Jermain..

cowzerp

Pavlik has the power and aggression to beat taylor but this could be like the mayweather v hatton fight, will pavlik or hatton get to land any clean shots?

dlofnep

For the sake of boxing, I hope so!

nacho libre

Jermain Taylor is by far the better boxer. I expect him to win on points.

theone

I'm gonna go for a pavlik ko,taylor is making noises about calzaghe so hopefully pavlik will catch him,joe's got too much for taylor.

cowzerp

My heart say's Pavlik but my head say's Taylor but Pavlik will make Taylor put in a performance, thats for sure-im not betting against my heart though!!

dlofnep

By the end of all this, Poor Cowzer's heart will be in tatters. Someone have a bottle on the ready!

henbane

It's an interesting fight.Taylor looked awful in his easy fight and against Spinks but everyone looks awful against Spinks. Pavlik looked like the man against Miranda. But is that all there is to it?

Taylor's opposition is streets ahead of Pavlik's but Pavlik has knocked plenty out. Has Pavlik learned enough since their amateur bout to prevail? I doubt Pavlik has the class to beat someone who beat B-Hop twice and drew with Winky. The Miranda bout is the only close-to-top-level opposition Pavlik has on his record, but Taylor has done the business against the best there is, Taylor has to get the vote in this one.

I look forward to yet another quality bout in 07

nacho libre

wow what a finish!!! what a fight!!!

cowzerp

Pavlik was brilliant-this was a great fight, both lads put on a show-i was on the edge of my seat the whole time,what a heart from pavlik- boxing at its best..:cool:

Big Ears

Great fight , I thought that Taylor would be able to hurt him......I was right , I thought that Taylor would be able to outbox him.........I was right

What I didn't account for was Pavlik's stamina , workrate and in the end huge punch power , being able to cancel out the rest . I could see it happening during the fight from about the 5th on but not before hand .

We've got a new , exciting , determined Middleweight champion who wants to fight , really wants to fight .

jayroyal

savage fight well done to taylor he came to fight and gave and took some shot but kelly must just have some savage power. He took some shots himself but he never thought about losing. i had taylor up by two at the time of the stoppage now we have the most exciting fighter out there being a world champion some great nites ahead for us too enjoy.:D

dlofnep

Great fight, toe to toe action for the 7 rounds.

walshb

That's one-one now.
Taylor beat Pavlik in the US trials
for the Sydney games.
Taylor was 22 and Pavlik 17..
Not really a fair comparison is it???

walshb

Big Ears wrote:

Great fight , I thought that Taylor would be able to hurt him......I was right , I thought that Taylor would be able to outbox him.........I was right

What I didn't account for was Pavlik's stamina , workrate and in the end huge punch power , being able to cancel out the rest . I could see it happening during the fight from about the 5th on but not before hand .

We've got a new , exciting , determined Middleweight champion who wants to fight , really wants to fight .

The documentary below is one of the better ones I have seen to promote a fight and it really explains Pavlik's workrate and stamina. His camp were relying on both these traits for victory...If you have a spare half hour, this is well worth a watch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU60TcT9lrs&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKoNg8UKGuo&mode=related&search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeeTfAnwKMg

nacho libre

I knew Pavlik with his power would win after he survived the second round. It looked obvious that Taylor had expended too much energy trying to finish him and that it would catch up to him later on.
You have to give Pavlik his due, he's got great stamina, determination and punching power.

I would love to see him face the winner of the Kessler v Calzaghe fight.
Though, i guess there will be a mandatory rematch to look forward to first.

theone

great fight how pavlik got through the second I'll never know,taylor has to be given some credit aswell it takes two to make a great fight.

walshb

I just got to see the fight. Great fight. Two very good fighters.
Two things;
Taylor IMO was 4-2 rds ahead with a big 2nd round.
I had it 58-55 after 6 rds.

The ref had asbsolute no option but to intervene.
Taylor was not just hurt, but dangerously so..

Pavlik is a great talent, but I felt that he is a little easy hit
by big shots and if Taylor was a heavier banger and a little more precise
in his finishing, he would have taken Pavlik out. All credit to
Pavlik for getting up.

The judges had it as I saw it, 58-55 on two cards and a little closer on the third card

nacho libre

walshb wrote:

I just got to see the fight. Great fight. Two very good fighters.
Two things;
Taylor IMO was 4-2 rds ahead with a big 2nd round.
I had it 58-55 after 6 rds.

The ref had asbsolute no option but to intervene.
Taylor was not just hurt, but dangerously so..

Pavlik is a great talent, but I felt that he is a little easy hit
by big shots and if Taylor was a heavier banger and a little more precise
in his finishing, he would have taken Pavlik out. All credit to
Pavlik for getting up.

The judges had it as I saw it, 58-55 on two cards and a little closer on the third card

Do you think Kessler would beat him?

walshb

As much as I was impressed with Pavlik, his defence needs serious improvement, because a man weighing 168lbs and who hits hard could KO Pavlik. Is Pavlik's CHIN top notch?

I think NOT, because he was badly hurt by Taylor the very first time Taylor
really connected. He barely recovered, but did, and that was more from Taylor's
lack of real killer finishing.

Right now I'd pick Kessler, but lets see how Pavlik really matures over the next couple of years....

I would at this stage pick Pavlik over Calzaghe. Joe doesn't hit near hard enough I think to really deter Pavlik. Pavlik has all the physical advantages (at 168) to beat Joe and the power punching will really TEST to see if Calzaghe can take a big punch...

theone

have to disagree with you there even though joe is past his best i think he'd be more than a match for pavlik.

You have to take into account that pavlik would have to move up in weight would his power move with him? joes super middle he's mooting over moving to light heavy.

I don't think pavlik's right hand would get to joe as much as you think he doesn't have concussive power in his shots but his chin is rock solid although his opponents have been questionable his chin was never in question.

Taylor would have a better chance of beating calzaghe i don't think he would do it but he's a much better technical boxer than pavlik,Taylor doesn't really have much power and he nearly got rid of pavlik in the second round.

Big Ears

I'd fancy both Calzaghe and Kessler to stop Pavlik , both are just on another level imo and the only thing Pavlik could match/beat them on is power .

Really looking forward to Calzaghe v Kessler , for me neither would be beaten by any other fighter from 160-175(bar Hopkins maybe being able to 'old man' Kessler) .

Calzaghe is a crude slapper with feather fists. I think he could bore Pavlik to submission, but STOP him I don't think.

cowzerp

I think Pavlik would push either man and would yet again give us 1 hell of a fight-he's a warrior and has power stamina and heart..

walshb

Calzaghe is a crude sloppy slapper with very average power at 168lbs. He may well
outpoint Pavlik in a horribly sloppy fight,. but STOP him I don't think.
I think Pavlik will certainly retain that power. It's not like he's moving to heavyweight.
It's 8lbs and he is already a massive Middle. Can Calzaghe shake off Pavlik's power. Pavlik is bound to nail him flush at least a few times. If so, I think then we will find out if Joe's CHIN is solid, or has he simply been the most protected champion ever???

theone

walshb wrote:

Calzaghe is a crude sloppy slapper with very average power at 168lbs. He may well
outpoint Pavlik in a horribly sloppy fight,. but STOP him I don't think.
I think Pavlik will certainly retain that power. It's not like he's moving to heavyweight.
It's 8lbs and he is already a massive Middle. Can Calzaghe shake off Pavlik's power. Pavlik is bound to nail him flush at least a few times. If so, I think then we will find out if Joe's CHIN is solid, or has he simply been the most protected champion ever???

you don't like joe very much your not american by any chance ?:)
I liked his fight against lacy have watched it a couple of times.

I think joe was unfortunate to only come on the scene when benn,eubank and collins were too old.

imo he was more than a match for all three,don't think hypnotism would have worked on joe sorry steve:D .

I would have liked him to travel a bit more but he didn't so theres no use in crying about it now.

I'm not an expert but 8lbs does make a difference to power,rafael marquez moved up a weight in his last fight and he's a devastating puncher at bantam but not as powerful at super bantam he didnt get rid of vasquez easily.If his power came with him vasquez wouldn't have set up a trilogy.

walshb

Without doubt 8lbs make a difference to power. But I think in Pavlik's case we
are dealing with a huge middle and therefore I think the transition to 168lbs will see him not only retain his power, but the extra weight on his big frame will make for a formidable hitting machine. If Jermaine Taylor were to move up, I could see him having a problem, as he is a lighter hitting and naturally smaller man IMO than Pavlik....

As for Calzaghe: He is a fighter who I can't watch. He is a slapper, has no punch and is quite sloppy. He has fought very average opponents. Lacy was nothing but a weightlifter IMO who the British hyped up. He couldn't throw a punch. His record looked impressive, but whom did Lacy beat?

I think Calzaghe needs or needed a superfight to really enhance his reputation. Now I think the time has passed and his career will disappear without anyone batting an eyelid...

theone

walshb wrote:

Without doubt 8lbs make a difference to power. But I think in Pavlik's case we
are dealing with a huge middle and therefore I think the transition to 168lbs will see him not only retain his power, but the extra weight on his big frame will make for a formidable hitting machine. If Jermaine Taylor were to move up, I could see him having a problem, as he is a lighter hitting and naturally smaller man IMO than Pavlik....

As for Calzaghe: He is a fighter who I can't watch. He is a slapper, has no punch and is quite sloppy. He has fought very average opponents. Lacy was nothing but a weightlifter IMO who the British hyped up. He couldn't throw a punch. His record looked impressive, but whom did Lacy beat?

I think Calzaghe needs or needed a superfight to really enhance his reputation. Now I think the time has passed and his career will disappear without anyone batting an eyelid...

are you sure your not American the British hyped lacy??????

I remember a British commentator saying to two American boxing journalists that joe was going to give lacy a boxing lesson and they looked at him like he was going mad,so i'd say the hype was on the American side.

I agree he needs a super fight but no American was willing to travel and he wasn't going to America so that was never going to happen His fight against kessler is going to be pretty significant no ?.

nacho libre

walshb wrote:

Without doubt 8lbs make a difference to power. But I think in Pavlik's case we
are dealing with a huge middle and therefore I think the transition to 168lbs will see him not only retain his power, but the extra weight on his big frame will make for a formidable hitting machine. If Jermaine Taylor were to move up, I could see him having a problem, as he is a lighter hitting and naturally smaller man IMO than Pavlik....

As for Calzaghe: He is a fighter who I can't watch. He is a slapper, has no punch and is quite sloppy. He has fought very average opponents. Lacy was nothing but a weightlifter IMO who the British hyped up. He couldn't throw a punch. His record looked impressive, but whom did Lacy beat?

I think Calzaghe needs or needed a superfight to really enhance his reputation. Now I think the time has passed and his career will disappear without anyone batting an eyelid...

i'll be interested to see what you say if Calzaghe beats Kessler.:)

jayroyal

walshb wrote:

Without doubt 8lbs make a difference to power. But I think in Pavlik's case we
are dealing with a huge middle and therefore I think the transition to 168lbs will see him not only retain his power, but the extra weight on his big frame will make for a formidable hitting machine. If Jermaine Taylor were to move up, I could see him having a problem, as he is a lighter hitting and naturally smaller man IMO than Pavlik....

As for Calzaghe: He is a fighter who I can't watch. He is a slapper, has no punch and is quite sloppy. He has fought very average opponents. Lacy was nothing but a weightlifter IMO who the British hyped up. He couldn't throw a punch. His record looked impressive, but whom did Lacy beat?

I think Calzaghe needs or needed a superfight to really enhance his reputation. Now I think the time has passed and his career will disappear without anyone batting an eyelid...

i think your been a bit harsh on joe he's the perfect boxer for any young kid to watch. Can you remember many boxers who can win a world title fight with a jab and as for lacy he boxed on the olypmic team for usa, so you know enough about boxing to know a weightlifter wouldn't have a chance in making them. Also he stopped robin reid something joe and ottke couldn't do.
I think he has alot more power than people think and i hate people who slag off joe and then they reckon hatton is better why it ain't because of his skill. He's just a throw and hold fighter with no power at world level a wrestler if you ask me. Come on joe A TRUE BOXING LEGEND

Big Ears

It's funny you call him a weightlifter Walshb , that's one thing Lacy claims he doesn't do and that his physique is achieved through old fashioned methods(sit-ups , press-ups etc) .

Lacy is a very good fighter and once his shoulder heals okay he will prove it , I'd fancy him to dominate at Super Middleweight once Calzaghe and Kessler aren't around and I think he's better than Mundine , Froch , Inkin etc........the only question I'd have would be against Bute who is a carbon copy of Calzaghe .

walshb

The weightlifter jibe was a joke. He performed like one. He was slow and barely could throw a decent bloody punch. The Brits made an awful lot more out of that win than was
plausible. Joe simply does not really impress me. Maybe I am a bit harsh. He's a good fighter and deserves credit for being champ for so long, but I don't think he has fought real genuine talent and NOR do the Americans. He's a slapper and gets away with it. He has nothing approaching a punch and I believe the Toney's and Nunn's and Jones and Hopkins would really have exposed Joe as a good, but far from great fighter.
He never met one fighter close to their level....

cowzerp

walshb wrote:

Joe simply does not really impress me. Maybe I am a bit harsh. He's a good fighter and deserves credit for being champ for so long, but I don't think he has fought real genuine talent and NOR do the Americans. He's a slapper and gets away with it.

I agree with Bren, why do you think he keeps damaging his hands-His punching technique is awful-he is a tough guy though and can fight, i still love fighters that can pull a crowd though.

walshb

jayroyal wrote:

. Also he stopped robin reid something joe and ottke couldn't do.
BOXING LEGEND

Part of my criticism of Joe is his inability to punch properly or with power. No wonder he could NOT stop Reid....Ottke is not really known as a big puncher..he's a boxer/spoiler.
Lacy has one thing and that's a punch. Well that's what we are led to believe. It was a TKO he scored on Reid wasn't it? Reid was 34/35 and he was hardly world class....

Big Ears

walshb wrote:

Part of my criticism of Joe is his inability to punch properly or with power. No wonder he could NOT stop Reid....Ottke is not really known as a big puncher..he's a boxer/spoiler.
Lacy has one thing and that's a punch. Well that's what we are led to believe. It was a TKO he scored on Reid wasn't it? Reid was 34/35 and he was hardly world class....

Reid was shot by that stage and had nothing left , I can't think of any fighter in history that I would give a more than 50% chance of ko'ing a prime Reid . Not only was he very skilled but he had an iron jaw too .

Reid was robbed against Ottke by both the referee and the judges . The ref warned Reid for hitting Ottke ! .

I've been impressed by Lacy on a few occasions , but that's when he's boxing and not trying to bang someone out like he successfully did against Reid .

Joe used be a big hitter , but his hand problems(probably caused by his slapping) have caused him to not really put everything into his shots anymore . Young Calzaghe could hit like a mule .

nacho libre

Big Ears wrote:

Reid was shot by that stage and had nothing left , I can't think of any fighter in history that I would give a more than 50% chance of ko'ing a prime Reid . Not only was he very skilled but he had an iron jaw too .

Reid was robbed against Ottke by both the referee and the judges . The ref warned Reid for hitting Ottke ! .

I've been impressed by Lacy on a few occasions , but that's when he's boxing and not trying to bang someone out like he successfully did against Reid .

Joe used be a big hitter , but his hand problems(probably caused by his slapping) have caused him to not really put everything into his shots anymore . Young Calzaghe could hit like a mule .

yeah, just ask Chris Eubank.