Irish Team V Arg announced

Aldini98

Ireland: Murphy; Horgan, O'Driscoll, D'Arcy, Hickie; O'Gara, Reddan; Horan, A N Other, Hayes, O'Callaghan, O'Connell, Easterby, D. Wallace, Leamy.
Replacements: A N Other, S Best, O'Kelly, N Best, Boss, P Wallace, A Trimble

bugler

With a fresh pack like that we're really equipped to deal with the Argies.

buck65

A bit disappointed no Carney or Quinlan on the bench. O Kelly should start and fix the lineout which has collapsed. No ulsterman yet?
Good to see Murphy playing if only to end an argument or 2

MikeHoncho

ARGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sack that gob****e now. I wont rest until he gets the boot. Not picking Mal is a disgrace. Both O'Connell and O'Callaghan have been pure ****e all tournament. At least he has picked our most attacking backline but they wont be getting any platform to work off as he has failed to shake up a pack which has not performed in a single match all tournament.

bugler

Dempsey is actually injured, so it's debateable if G Murphy would have featured otherwise.

This is amusing, in a tragic sort of way.

zAbbo

AN. Other ?

Surely he'll pick Flannery.

Eddie likes to hedge his bets on versatility on the bench rather than those who might make an impact, he's covering possible injuries, as this XV will be given 70+ minutes again.

Boss - SH/FB
P Wallace - FH/IC
A Trimble - OC / Wing

It's an absolute shame, players like Carney, Ferris & Quinlan won't even get the chance to do anything at this World Cup

jameshayes

Hickie will hopefully play well after missing the last game.. please god he'll be all fired up..

Or am i kidding myself?

LuckyLloyd

Well, I would have kept Dempsey and brought Murphy in on the wing for Horgan.

Apart from that, I am glad to see that he has retained some sense - and not pressed the panic button for the sake of it. Bringing in the likes of Quinlan or O' Kelly wouldn't be very clever given their lack of game time and the fact that they have been in general decline the past few years.

And Buck, why would we play any Ulstermen?

Punchbowl

Hickie is due a good game, considering it'll be his last.

Selection nowhere near as radical as I expected and not enough, I'd expect, to please the media. EOS is in for a rough one now.. Carney must be livid that he never got a look in, and really deserved his chance in the 22, rather than Trimble..

Still, they'll probably put in a perfromance, esp with Murphy out to prove a point

bugler

AN. Other ?

Surely he'll pick Flannery.

Flannery is injured. Seems to be a chance R Best will be fit. The alternative is Frankie, so I'd imagine they'll have the painkillers out for either Flannery or Best whatever happens.

monaghanbiffo

it really just makes him look clueless! Alan Quinlan especially must be gutted he really has a lot to bring to this team in terms of raw agression, and i suspect neil best wont be too happy with another 3-4mins.

But i really wanna make a point for Carney. We need four tries, the man is a natural try scorer and finisher, he has done it all over the world in league and has proved himself time and time again. Shaggy is also a super finisher but he ain't at the races. i'd at least have him in instead of trimble, thats a joke selection, the lad is not up to speed and it is actually annoying now that eddies keeping him in the 22

patmac

zabbo wrote:

AN. Other ?


It's an absolute shame, players like Carney, Ferris & Quinlan won't even get the chance to do anything at this World Cup

What about the QF's , SF's and Final;) Although if we did make it that far he probaly wouldn't change things.
No Ulstermen does that mean can we play our national anthem (that old chestnut I know) BTW did anyone hear us singing it at the beginning of the match in Paris, was there but not too sure if it came across well on the tv (apologies for going off topic)

Nukem

Well thats all folks. How can he expect that same pack to keep goin like this? Com'on what was the point in bringing that amount of players? What a waste of money the Argentina tour was!

Six nations 2007 - one step forward for EOS
RWC 2007 - two steps back for Irish Rugby

Tis a sad day:(

thebaz

Good solid Eddie selection --
Leamy, O'Callaghan, O'Gara , Darcy , Wallace should have been dropped

If i was Carney , Neil Best or Alan Quinlan i'd be pissed , and rightly so .

Why Humphry's isn't in France is a disgrace, any other coach would have stood up to O'Gara's demands about selection , look whats happened now that hes misfiring , we've no proper out half to replace him with -- Wallace ain't up to it and O'Sullivan knows that now --- disgracefull

monaghanbiffo

wont someone think of Gavan Duffy, where did he disappear off too, makes that selection now look even more stupid for the french game, eddie is such a gimp

Attractive Nun

It's the best we could have hoped for tbh. Probably actually makes sense, if we're to have any chance of hockeying the Argies (which we don't) it would have to be as a result of a miraculous return to form from O'Gara, D'arcy, Horgan, O'Connell and a few others. Bringing in the likes of Carney, Ferris, Wallace at centre/flyhalf, Trimble at centre and even Quinlan might be a good idea if we just needed a win, but they don't have the quality needed to put four tries up. Would still have put O'Kelly in for O'Callaghan, since the lineout needs to be solid, but aside from that it might well be too late to experiment anywhere else.

Ah well, I at least hope we go out with a win.

pd101

Should have filled the team with players hungry to play, Quinlan, Best etc. The rest have had there chance.

raven136

was ferris not brought because of his physicality and pure size?if he hasnt got a game could someone please explain why Gleeson is not there.

Quinlan/best would bring more aggresion to this match.Pity Carney isnt in the squad,what was the point of bringing him so?

bugler

You'd have to question not only why was Carney brought to the WC, but why the IRFU backed his move to Union at all. The Irish coach had never had any intention of using him in meaningful internationals.

tHE vAGGABOND

*sigh*

What does Trimble have to do to be dropped? Miss a few more crucial tackles and a few more aimless kicks?
How many stupid penalties and crap line outs do the members of second rows and the back row have to do to be dropped? Im *stunned* the back 5 of the scrum was not freshened up with a bit of new blood.

Mupping Fu<kets..

Attractive Nun

thebaz wrote:

Good solid Eddie selection --
Leamy, O'Callaghan, O'Gara , Darcy , Wallace should have been dropped

We simply don't have the strength in the squad to drop all these players. That is, of course, partly the fault of EOS for doing little to nothing to blood any other players, but looking at the situation right now I don't see how dropping O'Gara or D'Arcy makes any sense (I initially thought it might be an idea to drop D'arcy for Trimble in the centre, but I can't see that working). Any who are you going to bring in for Leamy or Wallace really? Ferris? If we somehow manage to scramble out of this pool, we'll be rightly fooked because our pack will be knackered, but since that's probably not going to happen, I'm not overly unhappy with this selection.

If i was Carney , Neil Best or Alan Quinlan i'd be pissed , and rightly so .

Carney? Not really, he can't have expected much gametime in this WC - probably should have been on the bench against Georgia or Namibia. Suppose you could question why he was brought at all. Best? Probably should have been used earlier off the bench, but Easterby was pretty good against France and deserves his place IMO. Quinlan? Fair enough, he's been neglected.

Why Humphry's isn't in France is a disgrace, any other coach would have stood up to O'Gara's demands about selection , look whats happened now that hes misfiring , we've no proper out half to replace him with -- Wallace ain't up to it and O'Sullivan knows that now --- disgracefull

Humphreys is injured.

is_that_so

Was hopeful of more changes on the basis that the fringe players might have had a bit more enthusiasm and maybe even a bit more form about them. Still good to see Murphy, pity about Dempsey and hope EOS remembers that a bench can be used. I am also hoping there's a decent performance in them, whatever the result.
The lack of game time for fringe players is certainly one of those things for the post-mortem and needs addressing.

monaghanbiffo

we're at better odds to win the world cup than wales, scotland and italy, i'll be havin some of that!!!!

raven136

monaghanbiffo wrote:

we're at better odds to win the world cup than wales, scotland and italy, i'll be havin some of that!!!!

Paddy Power loves people like you;)

monaghanbiffo

is_that_so wrote:

Was hopeful of more changes on the basis that the fringe players might have had a bit more enthusiasm and maybe even a bit more form about them. Still good to see Murphy, pity about Dempsey and hope EOS remembers that a bench can be used. I am also hoping there's a decent performance in them, whatever the result.
The lack of game time for fringe players is certainly one of those things for the post-mortem and needs addressing.

Forget the bench, he's not a real coach he doesn't understand how it actually works.

monaghanbiffo

raven136 wrote:

Paddy Power loves people like you;)

and i love him too:)

Gatsby

This game is all about scoring tries and nothing else. Carney is able to manufacture tries out of nothing and we need that to beat the argentina defence. His all round game might not be up to scratch but defence is only secondary to attack in this match.
Trimble will offer nothing extra if he comes off the bench.

Dont know what can be done with the pack at this stage. The whole unit is poor so changing one or two players might not make the impact needed. Although if O'Kelly started we might get 40 minutes of a solid line out.

raven136

the backline is fine(if rog turns his head around) but where is the decent quick ball for them going to come from?Maybe this team have one big performance in them,even then it will only be a win and not the 4 tries.

Anyone hear Keith Wood last week on newstalk basically agreeing with EOS tactics regarding subs.He says he doesnt believe in the whole sub idea.Weird that the rest of the world does

Poncherello

Woody said he would prefer if teams didnt change half their team in every game.ie that 2 teams of 15 went at it for 80 mins and guys only came off if injured. Would defo suit Ireland
But Not gonna happen so not worth talking about IMO.

4 more years

LuckyLloyd

Gatsby wrote:

This game is all about scoring tries and nothing else. Carney is able to manufacture tries out of nothing and we need that to beat the argentina defence. His all round game might not be up to scratch but defence is only secondary to attack in this match.
Trimble will offer nothing extra if he comes off the bench.

All this stuff about Carney.

HE HAS LITTLE OR NO TEST MATCH EXPERIENCE. WHY WOULD YOU ASSUME HE WILL AUTOMATICALLY JUST ROLL INTO THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF UNION AND SUDDENLY TERRORISE ALL COMERS????? STFU!!

raven136

LuckyLloyd wrote:

All this stuff about Carney.

HE HAS LITTLE OR NO TEST MATCH EXPERIENCE. WHY WOULD YOU ASSUME HE WILL AUTOMATICALLY JUST ROLL INTO THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF UNION AND SUDDENLY TERRORISE ALL COMERS????? STFU!!

Because in league he was an amazing finisher and the wing position in union is the one where he can do most damage,he was looking always for intercepts in his last outing.Oh and on past experience Robinson fittted in fairly well didnt he and Carney was as highly regarded as him

monaghanbiffo

LuckyLloyd wrote:

All this stuff about Carney.

HE HAS LITTLE OR NO TEST MATCH EXPERIENCE. WHY WOULD YOU ASSUME HE WILL AUTOMATICALLY JUST ROLL INTO THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF UNION AND SUDDENLY TERRORISE ALL COMERS????? STFU!!

you stfu, he's not some lad who's been messing round for years working as a builder and won a trip with the irish squad to the rwc. he's shown that he can play at the highest level in league and he's shown that he's a natural try scorer, which is the important part for us, and the way shaggy's playing we need someone like that. if shaggy misfires again we have trimble on the bench, useless!!!

you gimp

Poncherello

Highest level of Union ??????!!!!!

We are the team playing in Green not black yeah

foz_e_bear

The Man is a fool, a foll I tell you!

D Hickie - Ah there's an idea, where did you leave him last week...muppet!
R O'Gara (Munster) - have you been watching hime Eddie...guys been zoned
out, not that Walace is much good but I'd play better than ROG at the
mo...should be on the bench
E Reddan (Wasps) - Don't let it go to your head Ed, but that's a good
decision
A N Other - Hopefully Jerry will be okay
D O'Callaghan (Munster) - Ah God almighty Eddie, sure why not watch him
drown for 75 minutes then bring on Mal
S Easterby (Llanelli) - What is with you and this guy Eddie...why not bring in Best..needed in this game
D Leamy - Again poor showing over there...Quinlan! Have you heard of him Eddie?

And why trimble is there (even on the bench) is beyond me...they guy is not up to it..Eddie did you see the last game at all? Maybe Carney, even though he's not tested, at least he hasn't been tested and failed miserably!
Grrrr!

RuggieBear

LuckyLloyd wrote:

All this stuff about Carney.

HE HAS LITTLE OR NO TEST MATCH EXPERIENCE. WHY WOULD YOU ASSUME HE WILL AUTOMATICALLY JUST ROLL INTO THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF UNION AND SUDDENLY TERRORISE ALL COMERS????? STFU!!

Keep it civil.

RuggieBear

monaghan biffo banned for personal abuse

subfreq

Very good to see Reddan has kept his place.

Hickie should have played against France if nothing else but for his defensive experience.

It's a solid looking team but I think EOS has missed a trick again by not refreshing the forwards. They have not been delivering as a unit and Argentina are in better form than France up front.

Snickers Man

patmac wrote:

No Ulstermen does that mean can we play our national anthem (that old chestnut I know)

We NEVER did before during away games. Why is it such a big deal now?

The mods closed down a thread on this very topic claiming it had nothing to do with rugby, which is bizarre. It ONLY applies to rugby.

Linford

foz_e_bear wrote:

The Man is a fool, a foll I tell you!

D Hickie - Ah there's an idea, where did you leave him last week...muppet!
R O'Gara (Munster) - have you been watching hime Eddie...guys been zoned
out, not that Walace is much good but I'd play better than ROG at the
mo...should be on the bench
E Reddan (Wasps) - Don't let it go to your head Ed, but that's a good
decision
A N Other - Hopefully Jerry will be okay
D O'Callaghan (Munster) - Ah God almighty Eddie, sure why not watch him
drown for 75 minutes then bring on Mal
S Easterby (Llanelli) - What is with you and this guy Eddie...why not bring in Best..needed in this game
D Leamy - Again poor showing over there...Quinlan! Have you heard of him Eddie?

And why trimble is there (even on the bench) is beyond me...they guy is not up to it..Eddie did you see the last game at all? Maybe Carney, even though he's not tested, at least he hasn't been tested and failed miserably!
Grrrr!

With you most of the way, but why would you want Ireland's best forward last Friday to be dropped. I think Best or Quinlan should be in for Wallace, they can't play any worse than he has...

gosplan

Larf!!

Murphy to do enough to win the match and force EOS to stand down but ultimatly not enough for us to go through.

GreeBo

Gatsby wrote:

Trimble will offer nothing extra if he comes off the bench.

Rubbish!
Trimble can create tries from anywhere...for the other team. :eek:

ivuernis

I would have thought Carney would be at least deserving of a place on the bench. Granted he's a recent convert to Union BUT he has played it before, he IS a winger which is the easiest position to covert to and he WAS up until a year ago and had been for 5 years one of the best in League in the UK. Surely, in a game where we are chasing 4 tries he would be the ideal man to come on with 20-30mins to go if we still needed a couple of tries. I don't blame Trimble as he is a centre and not a winger. I'm firmly of the belief that you play players in the position they are best suited too. Looking forward to seeing Howlett and Carney on the wing for Munster this coming season and I hope Carney is given a chance in the 2008 Six Nations.

bugler

Trimble will offer nothing extra if he comes off the bench.

Yes but you're thinking differently to EOS. When EOS names his bench, he's really thinking "What if O'Driscoll gets injured, what if XXX gets injured". This is how a limited player like Duffy makes a WC squad, when he had been struggling to make the Harlequins squad.

He doesn't think in terms of subs changing games, he has shown that by how late he leaves substitutions in games. Subs, in EOS's mind, are for emergencies primarily.

zuutroy

The term 'arguing over the wood for our coffin' springs to mind.

thebaz

Attractive Nun wrote:

We simply don't have the strength in the squad to drop all these players. That is, of course, partly the fault of EOS for doing little to nothing to blood any other players, but looking at the situation right now I don't see how dropping O'Gara or D'Arcy makes any sense (I initially thought it might be an idea to drop D'arcy for Trimble in the centre, but I can't see that working). Any who are you going to bring in for Leamy or Wallace really? Ferris? If we somehow manage to scramble out of this pool, we'll be rightly fooked because our pack will be knackered, but since that's probably not going to happen, I'm not overly unhappy with this selection.



Carney? Not really, he can't have expected much gametime in this WC - probably should have been on the bench against Georgia or Namibia. Suppose you could question why he was brought at all. Best? Probably should have been used earlier off the bench, but Easterby was pretty good against France and deserves his place IMO. Quinlan? Fair enough, he's been neglected.



Humphreys is injured.

D'arcy is off form , drop him , stick Horgan in the centre , and Carney on the wing .
I agree we have no suitable replacement for o'gara , but he should have pulled out all the stops to get Humphrys to go in his retirement year.

Easterby was good , agree, drop Wallace for Quinlan , and shift Best for Leamy, with Easterby at no 8.

O'Kelly for O'Callaghan -- the team is stale , and needs re-structuring , anyway i hope this is the end of the O'Sullivan era , he's spoiled the world cup for many

hallelujajordan

I like this selection . . I presume Girv the Swerve is injured ? Otherwise another bizarre decision to be dropped out of the 22 altogether. .

I disagree with those who argue that the pack should be shaken up . . the time to introduce new heads was at the Georgia game imo . . I don't think introducing lads with very little game time for this crunch game will serve us any good.

Otherwise, Geordan has a point to prove, Hickey is playing in potentially his last international, Reddan is definitely the best of 3 available SH's and ROG might be all better now that all the crap has been thoroughly thrown about in the Sunday papers and he has had his chance to fight back . .

The argies are not all that and I expect us to win . . 4 tries might be a lot to expect but this side were always destined to play their best rugby under these kind of circumstances . .

hj

Gatsby

LuckyLloyd wrote:

All this stuff about Carney.

HE HAS LITTLE OR NO TEST MATCH EXPERIENCE. WHY WOULD YOU ASSUME HE WILL AUTOMATICALLY JUST ROLL INTO THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF UNION AND SUDDENLY TERRORISE ALL COMERS????? STFU!!

I agree with you. I said his all round game isnt up to scratch but we need someone who "might" generate a bit of magic. In my opinion, Trimble can not do this. Carney did it regularly in League and I think it is worth the risk given the circumstances. Playing conservative and winning the game 10-9 is no good for Ireland.

If Eddie was ever going to go for broke on something, this is the game to do it. Most people here have already written an obituary to his managerial career. (Personnaly I can't see him resigning). The only way to salvage his public reputation is to get a bonus point win and i can't see that happening on the basis of recent meetings between these two sides.

jmayo

Is it April 1st or something.

He can't seriously have Horgan still on, he is not at the races?
He hasn't even Carney or Quinlan on the bench ?
They might as well go on the tear and actually enjoy their visit to France.

He hadn't Murphy on the bench for the last game, but he is now good enough to go straight into the team?
Duffy was good enough for the bench against France but not Argentina?

Eddie is on something, not sure what but he is definetly on a different plane of reality.
The time for persevering with old tried and tested, even though completely off form, has gone.

It will be interesting to see how long Hayes manages to keep the wheels on the wagon on sunday.

People are grasbing at straws saying players have points to prove, so do the Argies just like the French had.
Argentina are out to screw as many 6 nation/tri nation teams as possible, in the hope they finally get adopted.

sioda

The whole thing just mistifies me Horgan has being appalling on the wing Carney is a competent winger.

Quinny must feels awful watching from the wings when a bench seat is the minimum he deserves.

I think either way whether we some how win and get through or not EOS has to get the door

Poncherello

zuutroy wrote:

The term 'arguing over the wood for our coffin' springs to mind.

Well said..

davmi

If I could pick the team for Sunday, from all Irish players, going on form, current form for those in the squad and last season's for those not, heres what it would be:

murphy
Horgan
o'driscoll
darcy
hickie
humphreys
reddan
horan
flannery
hayes
cullen
o connell
quinlan
gleeson
heaslip

subs:
best
best
o kelly
wallave
boss
o gara
carney

how many of these not in squad or not getting a look in