Relationship Brickwall!

LegacyUser

posting unreg for this sorry...(oh and it's a long one)

firstly, me and my girlfriend have not been going out for very long at all (about 6 months), but it's been very intense and we both have had previous relationships, and neither of us have felt this way before. We both love each other very much and can't bear being apart. I know 99% of new relationships are akin to this, but seriously, neither of us have had anything like this before and both believe that we've found "the one".

anyway, she's very independent, very busy and also very insecure. She's lived on her own for the past 9 years, and has funded herself through uni twice for 2 separate degrees by basically working her ass off. She's got so used to it that she's become a bit of a workaholic and through the nature of her business now finds it hard to let go of one of her 3 jobs as she's worried about losing the extra money "in case she ever needs it" etc. This basically means she's incredibly busy and her evenings are either occupied by overtime on her business or shifts for her 3rd job, making finding quality time for us very difficult. She has however made the effort and has made time for us as best she can.

She tells me that i'm good for her as i'm making her realise how ridiculously hard she was pushing herself and is glad i'm there to almost make her stop working and find some relaxing time in the evenings. She still finds it hard to let go however. This has led to a good few arguments. All over silly little things, but from the nature of them, it's blatant how they all stem back to her tiredness, fear of losing her independence or her insecurity (she's been cheated on in the past). It's tough because i feel i'm bearing the brunt of her past and i feel like it's a struggle i can't cope with at times. i even feel like i'm being the bad guy at times, when all i'm doing is trying to solve problems. then, at other times, i remember how much i love her and know that it's worth the effort.

My life has completely changed since we've been together and very rarely now do i manage to do things i want to do when i want to (all part and parcel of being in a relationship i hear you cry) and it's fair enough. I spend 100% of my free time with her, or at her place, because neither of us wants to be apart. We've talked about me moving in, but then it comes back to her insecurity of "if i ever left her, etc". So for the last 3 months i've basically been living out of a bag at hers. I have none of my possessions, nothing that makes it feel like home. Yet she constantly tells me she wants me to move in. The trouble is, when we try to arrange it, she freaks out again and gets paranoid i'm going to leave her and take my possessions away leaving her with nothing. I've tried to explain to her that she can't think like this otherwise we'll never get anywhere, but then in the next breath (once she's calmed down) she acknowledges this and says she wants me to move in again. I don't know if i'm coming or going.

Sometimes, I don't feel she appreciates the effort i'm going to with the relationship, and everything always comes back to how hard she's working, how tired she is, how insecure she is etc etc. when, hey guess what, we're both tired, we both work hard, and through the way she is with me sometimes (as detailed above), i too feel insecure on occasion. however i guess some of us deal with it better than others.

i just don't know where we're going to go from here as it's turning into a bit of a vicious circle and i'm the one stuck in the middle. I can't spend any time at my own home (which from time to time i'd like to, even if just to have some of my own possessions around me to make use of and enjoy) because she then asks "don't you want to be here with me? don't you love me?" etc. (This logic also applies to me seeing my friends. She takes it as a rejection if i go out with my friends - despite the fact that i always try to organise nights out on evenings she's working). But then, she won't let go of her past and let me move in (i'm not pushing the issue of me moving in, it's her) because of her fear of me leaving her. All this in itself causes arguments, and most of the time i feel like i'm walking on egg-shells to keep the peace.

I do love her, and if you read the above it probably paints a very poor picture of her. But i must stress that she is a lovely person and it's only briefly that she freaks out and all of this comes to ahead via arguments etc. But it never solves anything and once the argument has subsided, we're back to the same problems being un-resolved.

It's very frustrating - as while 10% of me says "walk away", the other 90% of me knows i can't, and i don't want to.

Any one got any advice at all? Again, sorry for the length of this.

Talliesin

Go out with your friends. Spend time alone.

Don't move in with her until she's able to deal with that. But do help her deal with it.

MarinoMark

Step back a little. Sometimes its better to be on your own, than in an intense relationship. Jesus been there and its hard work. Even when ur not with them you deal with txt msgs which, in themself, wreck ur head.Give yourself a week, on your own, say ur mobile is gone, lost or whatever. or just switch it off. Time out for you. Be selfish, just for a week...Take walks, spoil yourself. you know what I mean. If , deep down...be honest, you dont think its right/,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,go ! Sometimes we all think that any relationship is better than none..........wrong !! I walked away from 2. no 3 was ms right !! Take time out....for you.

How Strange

My life has completely changed since we've been together and very rarely now do i manage to do things i want to do when i want to (all part and parcel of being in a relationship i hear you cry) and it's fair enough. I spend 100% of my free time with her, or at her place, because neither of us wants to be apart. We've talked about me moving in, but then it comes back to her insecurity of "if i ever left her, etc". So for the last 3 months i've basically been living out of a bag at hers.

Gibson222, IMO this is not a good situation to be in during the first six months of your relationship.

she's very independent, very busy and also very insecure

I would have thought that this is a contradiction in terms. Can you be very independent and very insecure?

IMO, spending all your free time together in the first 6 months is not normal. You have given up your own independence and your own life to be with this girl and I honestly wouldn't find that attractive in a man.

I hear what you are saying about living out of a bag, I did that myself for a year and a half but only for a three nights a week and every so often I would get so p*ssed off with it that I would head off home for a week and just relax, meet friends, do what I wanted to do in my own space.

Why are you so keen to move in together? She is clearly not ready for it otherwise you would be there right now with your toothbrush permanently beside hers.

Take a step back and reclaim your own life. You say she is always busy with her other jobs so what do you do? Do you sit around her place waiting for her? I think you are moving too fast and you could ruin the whole thing.

My advice, slow down and become more independent yourself.

NextSteps

And couldn't she come over to your place sometimes?

Beruthiel

gibson222 wrote:

So for the last 3 months i've basically been living out of a bag at hers. I have none of my possessions, nothing that makes it feel like home. Yet she constantly tells me she wants me to move in. The trouble is, when we try to arrange it, she freaks out again and gets paranoid i'm going to leave her and take my possessions away leaving her with nothing. I've tried to explain to her that she can't think like this otherwise we'll never get anywhere, but then in the next breath (once she's calmed down) she acknowledges this and says she wants me to move in again. I don't know if i'm coming or going.

Personally, that would drive me crackers.
I'd probably do the following, tell her exactly how you feel, the above is good.
Then do as Tallie suggested, go out with your mates now and again, don't move in and basically tell her that when she's ready for that move, to let you know.
At the moment you are doing all the running around and bending over backwards, you won't and can't keep that up, already you are starting to resent it.
Either she wishes to have a relationship and all that entails, or she doesn't. You are doing so much for her right now that she doesn't even have to think about adjusting to that. Leave her the time to do so.

Personally, I think you are moving too fast, 6 months into a relationship and you are living out of a bag at her place, that's too much imo. Two to three times a week is more than enough for that - the rest of the time you should be spending on you and your mates. Put on the breaks a bit, it's not a race.

LegacyUser

thanks for all of your advice. on the subject of stepping back and taking time for myself, i have tried this but as i said in my op, she then gives me the "don't you love me, don't you want to be here with me?" lines. I mean, i can see how she could take that as a rejection, because, what excuse can you give?

"sorry love, i'd rather go and sit at home watching tv than spend it with you"?

Black Swan

Cut her some slack. Be a bit more patient. 6 months is not a long time to get to know someone. It's also not very long to build trust in a relationship. She will have to learn to lighten up too, and let you have time with your friends. All these things take time, but are worth it if it lasts.

Beruthiel

gibson222 wrote:

"sorry love, i'd rather go and sit at home watching tv than spend it with you"?

No
Sorry love, but living out of a bag constantly is really difficult. I miss playing my xbox 360 and think I'll be doing that on tuesday nights from now on. On friday I'll be going out with the lads and it's easier to go home to my place afterwards as it takes less organising of clothes etc... I love you loads and will see you on x, y and z days. Anyone who cannot accept that needs to get a grip and learn how.
You need to keep your own life too, no relationship should take that from you, otherwise in time, you'll regret it.

strawberrybox

totally agree with Beruthiel you just cant win with this girl i understand she was hurt in the past but she has to realise that either she takes the plunge and puts all of her into your relationship instead of keep pulling back and changing her mind you will soon become very resentfull of her and her worst fears will come true and it will be all of her own doing because she drove you away- she wants to have her cake and eat it to have to there at her beck and call in whatever mood she is in and you just have to take it- you should defo start seeing your mates and having a life of your own i never agree with couples spending 100% of their free time together - it is healty for each of you to have your own persuits and helps the relationship not to become stale cos you will both have your own new experiences and things to talk about when you see each other

LegacyUser

Beruthiel wrote:

No
Sorry love, but living out of a bag constantly is really difficult. I miss playing my xbox 360 and think I'll be doing that on tuesday nights from now on. On friday I'll be going out with the lads and it's easier to go home to my place afterwards as it takes less organising of clothes etc... I love you loads and will see you on x, y and z days. Anyone who cannot accept that needs to get a grip and learn how.
You need to keep your own life too, no relationship should take that from you, otherwise in time, you'll regret it.

We kinda had this chat last week. she went away on hol for a few days, so i organised a night out with my mates on the friday. she cam back on the friday, but didn't get home till 2am (sat morning). she then had a strop at me for not arranging to stay at hers after i'd been out that night. she wanted me to be there when she got in. i told her it wouldn't be a good idea as she'd be tired and sober and i'd be tired and pretty hammered. plus it was a lot of trouble for me to go over to hers after work to leave my car there and my stuff for the weekend etc etc. but she took it like "i wanted to see you as soon as i got back, you obviously didn't want to see me". etc etc.

she's just throws emotional stuff at me all the time to make me feel like the bad guy. i really don't think she does it maliciously, i genuinely think she means what she says, but it's just unreasonable in my opinion.

Mr. Incognito

whoa, crazy lady after 6 months? She sounds needy, clingy and totally unreasonable. A healthy realationship isn't this intense. Unhealthy relationships are. I know that sounds like a contradiction but people need a balance otherwise they become obsessive which is what is happening here. She needs to learn to respect your boundaries and you my friend need to establish some.

LegacyUser

SetantaL wrote:

whoa, crazy lady after 6 months? She sounds needy, clingy and totally unreasonable. A healthy realationship isn't this intense. Unhealthy relationships are. I know that sounds like a contradiction but people need a balance otherwise they become obsessive which is what is happening here. She needs to learn to respect your boundaries and you my friend need to establish some.

i've tried. i really have, but it always comes back to her then saying "don't you love me?" etc. how do you set up boundaries and reason with someone who gets so emotional whenever you try and do it? Someone who thinks you've stopped loving them just because you're saying you need some space? How can i recover some control without destroying what we have?

How Strange

on the subject of stepping back and taking time for myself, i have tried this but as i said in my op, she then gives me the "don't you love me, don't you want to be here with me?" lines. I mean, i can see how she could take that as a rejection, because, what excuse can you give?

I don't see how she could take this as rejection. Not if she is a well grounded, very independent (your description) person. She should expect you to say this, respect you for it and welcome a bit of time on her own.

she's just throws emotional stuff at me all the time to make me feel like the bad guy. i really don't think she does it maliciously, i genuinely think she means what she says, but it's just unreasonable in my opinion.

You're right it is unreasonable. OP, you have to establish some ground rules here or you're life will be ruled by your gf. I am saying this as a girl & gf. I would never say any of this to my bf and if I did the door would probably hit him on the way out cos he wouldn't stand for it.

Your gf has issues with trust etc but they are HER issues, not yours. It seems to be that you are at the stage where you have to have a serious, honest discussion which could result in the end of the relationship. If you don't then you will become more and more miserable and no doubt we will be reading more posts from you in 6months or a year's time.

Moving in should be off the cards until all this is resolved. You should stay at your own place at least two nights a week and try to make them consecutive nights so you can do your own thing. And tell your gf when she tries the emotional blackmail stuff that these are her issues, you love her but you can't be held to emotional ransom for wanting to have your own independence. Then have the discussion. If she listens to you, accepts what you say and you stay together then you could have a great relationship ahead of you.

Good luck.

Beruthiel

gibson222 wrote:

i've tried. i really have, but it always comes back to her then saying "don't you love me?"

By pointing out that you are there x, y and z times on a regular basis - by pointing out all the things that you do for her already, by pointing out that you can love someone without being joined at the hip. She is needy and clingy, she needs to understand that she is so she can work on it. She needs to learn to trust herself and you.

Someone who thinks you've stopped loving them just because you're saying you need some space? How can i recover some control without destroying what we have?

She's an adult, not a 14 year old.
Time and regular effort on your part will make her see that, she will also respect you more if you continue to do your own thing and show her you care at the same time. Doormats become very boring after a while, expecting you to turn up half cut in the middle of the night just cos she's back from hols is totally unreasonable.

Talliesin

gibson222 wrote:

she then gives me the "don't you love me, don't you want to be here with me?" lines. I mean, i can see how she could take that as a rejection, because, what excuse can you give?

That she presumably wants a partner and not a lapdog.

If she wants a lapdog then she can get one easily enough and carry it around in her handbag, and then she'll be sorted.

If she wants a partner then you'll have to be a person in your own right rather than defined simply in terms of her.

You aren't doing her any favours in limiting yourself to be with her. A good relationship makes both people more than they are outside of it. A relationship that makes anyone less than they are outside of it is bad to the point of being pathological.

If she really can't handle such a small degree of independence on your part, and you can't help her to handle it, and she isn't going to do anything to get her head sorted, then just leave. Such a relationship is a sinking ship and it's not a matter of whether you leave as when and how and how much damage you suffer in the purpose.

Hopefully it won't come to that, but keep your eyes open.

LegacyUser

thanks everyone for all your input. you've all confirmed what i have thought for a while which is i need to recover some control. it's just easier said than done as i have tried quite a few of the things you've suggested. it just never seems to make any difference.

i clearly need to sit down with her and have ANOTHER chat. it's just frustrating because we're just going to go over old ground. I just have to hope this time we get a different outcome. although, depressingly, i can't see it.

thanks again for the advice though. it is appreciated.

strawberrybox

sorry but she sounds like a bit of a control freak and a nut job- either you grow a set and tell her yes i love you but i need my own space or you will be one of them men who carry their wifes handbags and wait in the hairdressers/shops/ outside the pub for her in the clothes that she has picked out for you to wear and your hair in the style that she wants and not aloud to speak to strangers! - at the end of the day women like to be with strong men who have a mind of their own that challenge them not some lapdog that does exactly what she says this gets old very fast belive me

GoalsGoneWild

It all sounds a bit ominous. I believe you when you say that she's a great girl - but I know a lot of great girls that for various reasons i wouldn't want to be in a relationship with. There are red flags all over these posts and unless you sort them out ahead of time, you'll be stuck in what sounds an unworkable relationship.

Ask yourself this - you currently don't live with the girl and have little or no freedom. How bad do you think that'll get if you move in with her? Will you only be allowed to do your own thing when she's off doing her 2nd/3rd jobs? Will you always have to be there when she gets back from these jobs?

Be careful on this one...

BronX-Bunny

I have to agree with Beruthiel.
It just seems to me your being guilt tripped into making all the sacrifices.
This happened to me a number of years ago... Ah being hit with the "Dont you love" me stick which eventually led to me finishing it, hard as it was.

By no means am I telling you to do this its entirely your choice, just dont get walked on because of her "insecurities"

LegacyUser

gibson222 wrote:

thanks everyone for all your input. you've all confirmed what i have thought for a while which is i need to recover some control. it's just easier said than done as i have tried quite a few of the things you've suggested. it just never seems to make any difference.

i clearly need to sit down with her and have ANOTHER chat. it's just frustrating because we're just going to go over old ground. I just have to hope this time we get a different outcome. although, depressingly, i can't see it.

thanks again for the advice though. it is appreciated.

Hi there

Sounds like time for chatting is over, actions speak louder than words. We all have insecurities but she is going to just get worse if this is how it is six months down the road. You've talked, now just "do"....look after yourself, get your friendships back in order and behave ina healthy way towards yourself before thinking of anyone else. Give her some tough love, and just do what's best for you. You can stil love her, in fact it's the most loving thing you can do. Ask her to get some counselling for her issues which seem to be many because you're both in vulnerable positions but you've put hers first for too long. Not trying to make her out to be the bad guy, that is not the issue, there's no black and white or right and wrong in relationships, but there must be equal investment in each other's lives to promote a healthy one, and you, my friend, are not in a healthy relationship right now. I wish you luck and hope you manage to assert your needs without having to compromise your love for her, but if you have to give up that much of yourself, you may as well cut your nads off now.... Hope it goes well for you. Best regards, from a concerned woman who wants all of mankind to have healthy happy relationships.

Pigletlover

Does your girlfriend have many friends? Could you encourage her to meet up with them from time to time? Maybe then she won't feel like you're out having a good time without her while she's either working or waiting at home for you. Have you introduced her to your friends yet? She may have a picture in her head of a bunch of lads who are going to lead her boyfriend astray. It sounds a bit mad but if she hasn't met them it might just be that she's thinking the worst, especially if she's been cheated on in the past.

You need to explain to her that while you love her and want to be with her, only six months ago you had your own life that was completely separate to hers. Tell her that you're happy to stay at her house x number of nights each week but you also need to make time for the things you used to do before you started going out. Gently point out to her that she doesn't seem to be prepared to give up her third job so it's not fair of her to expect you to live your life around her working week.

You need to be firm with her. You say you love her but unless she's willing to back down a bit, you can't make it work. It takes two to work at a relationship and it's time she started making the effort.

K-9

Another issue here is she has 3 jobs, but expects you to be at her beck and call. Her lack of free time may be an issue here too.

The yes/no over moving in is verry worrying to.

LegacyUser

'

Pigletlover wrote:

Does your girlfriend have many friends? Could you encourage her to meet up with them from time to time? Maybe then she won't feel like you're out having a good time without her while she's either working or waiting at home for you. Have you introduced her to your friends yet? She may have a picture in her head of a bunch of lads who are going to lead her boyfriend astray. It sounds a bit mad but if she hasn't met them it might just be that she's thinking the worst, especially if she's been cheated on in the past.

See this is another problem. She does have friends, but a lot of them are settled down themselves or have moved away, and that's kind of why she does the 3rd job of an evening because as she sees it, she'd rather be out earning, than sat at home doing nothing. Obviously now she has me, but she doesn't want to quit her 3rd job as on the odd saturday for example i might go out with my mates and she feels she'll just be stuck at home twiddling her thumbs, and then she's made a sacrifice, but i'm not willing to do the same (in her eyes). I can see her point on that, but i've also tried to get her to mix with my group of friends to try and show her that there is an alternative in that, she can either come out with us all, or if i'm just having a lads night, she can go out with the other girls in the group. but then there's more excuses, like she's made a snap judgement and she doesn't like "so-n-so" etc. plus she still won't quit the job, so what she's done a couple of times is come out with us, but not drink and then toddle off to work later on in the evening. which kind of breaks the night up and she's not really getting into the group.

Pigletlover wrote:

You need to explain to her that while you love her and want to be with her, only six months ago you had your own life that was completely separate to hers. Tell her that you're happy to stay at her house x number of nights each week but you also need to make time for the things you used to do before you started going out. Gently point out to her that she doesn't seem to be prepared to give up her third job so it's not fair of her to expect you to live your life around her working week.

Yup, had that conversation too. :-('