DTT forget it?No more free pictures

musa

Is it just me or did the FTA Rte pictures disappear over a week ago from the boxless northern folk? leaving only radio.
Should we hang on for the hell of it,having bought wideband amps and CD aerials?I did warn ,if we told them too much,they would switch us off.
Is the future LNB,CRT,and a tweek at the cat's whisker?

SRB

musa wrote:

Is it just me or did the FTA Rte pictures disappear over a week ago from the boxless northern folk? leaving only radio.
Should we hang on for the hell of it,having bought wideband amps and CD aerials?I did warn ,if we told them too much,they would switch us off.
Is the future LNB,CRT,and a tweek at the cat's whisker?

Eh, which transmitter are you talking about here ?

musa

SRB wrote:

Eh, which transmitter are you talking about here ?

Good question,reading the boards we have been lead to believe the tests are coming from the Cairn,at Carlingford,but some installers have been convinced they came from Carrickdale,when I posted this idea,I was shouted down,(politely).

Ulsterman 1690

Claremont Carn is not the same TX as Carlingford

And the only transmitters that have ever been situated at "Carrickdale" have been for pirate radio

lucernarian

Mux 1 on Ch 53 is still FTA.

As for the location of the transmitter, I suggest looking at the pictures of Clermont Carn posted here recently. It seems to be just below the main analogue antenna.

musa

How is it that installers can't see the DTT tests in Warrenpoint ,put full strength to the north and east?They are looking straight across at the Cairn but still can't see the signal ,you say is being sent from there?
Sunday last the test encrypted channels could be received in the clear for some time.Maybe it is time to let them get on with testing and stop watching partial programmes which we wouldn't watch normally anyway.
There is enough bad television out there without beating ourselves up ,trying to see tests?:

lawhec

musa wrote:

How is it that installers can't see the DTT tests in Warrenpoint ,put full strength to the north and east?They are looking straight across at the Cairn but still can't see the signal ,you say is being sent from there?
Sunday last the test encrypted channels could be received in the clear for some time.Maybe it is time to let them get on with testing and stop watching partial programmes which we wouldn't watch normally anyway.
There is enough bad television out there without beating ourselves up ,trying to see tests?:

To the best of this board's collective knowledge the current terrestial channels (RTÉ 1, 2, TV3 & TG4) are broadcast from a set of aerials further down the mast directed to the South-West with nulls of up to -30db northwards (or one thousandth of the maximum ERP). Its perfectly possible to have line of sight to a transmitter yet the signal from it not strong enough to be usable. It is commonly reported in Britain regarding local DAB multiplexes which come from transmitting aerials that are highly directional.

musa

I drove passed a lot of transmitter stuff to the left on the new Newry bypass yesterday,could DTT be coming from there?and would this explain why installers much further away from the Carn are receiving full signal strength on the trials,or are different tests coming from two transmitters close to the border?

L1011

Its coming from Clermont Carn, simple as. The reason you can't get it easily in some locations is due to a heavy, heavy null to the north; as has been said before.

lucernarian

Well there's definetely no DTT broadcasts from the Warrenpoint area. Analogue from Rostrevor Forest or Kilkeel is the order of the day there. It's in Clermont Carn and if you don't believe us, try asking the Dept. of Communications and see what they say.

musa

To_be_confirmed wrote:

Well there's definetely no DTT broadcasts from the Warrenpoint area. Analogue from Rostrevor Forest or Kilkeel is the order of the day there. It's in Clermont Carn and if you don't believe us, try asking the Dept. of Communications and see what they say.

What can I say? I give up ,and thanks to all for their patience on this matter.I will onpass the information to the disbelieving men up ladders.

musa

Have been told by RTE engineer that Warrenpoint receives RTE annalogue pictures not from Clermont Cairn directly,but from a small transponder.

Mayo Exile

Originally posted by musa: Have been told by RTE engineer that Warrenpoint receives RTE annalogue pictures not from Clermont Cairn directly,but from a small transponder.

Sure about this? Possibly from the Carlingford/Greenore relay then. RTE1/2, TG4 are on chs. 61, 67, 51 V. Group C/D. No TV3 from here. Can one pick up TV3 in Warrenpoint?

Where does that Clermont Carn fill in on Group A cover? RTE 1/2 on Chs. 29/33.

musa

I can see the tests on a Sony trinitron CRT with digital tuner.
When the signal is being received (on a groupC/D with wide band amp),the picture quality would blow your socks off,superior to Sky RGB pictures.
About two weeks ago the RTE and TV3 pictures disappeared,never to return,leaving only radio.Last Sunday a few channels appeared in the clear ,briefly,they had removed the encryption.Most of the time the signal is not apparent ie, its off more than on.I would say its not worth investing in aerial stuff for the short time transmissions are coming our way,and is always being pointed out,they are tests which could disappear at any time.

SRB

I can't comment on the CC tests as I'm receiving from Three Rock, but AFAIK there has been no mention of RTE1 and 2, TV3 and TG4 testing any encryption from Clermont. It's possible the TV locked on during "lift" conditions and you were able to view, once things returned to normal the TV possibly flags the lower signal as encrypted.

musa

I see what you are saying and agree,just pointing out that the four FTA channels have been received at this location for months ,with few interuptions,and at full signal strength on the tele.Now suddenly everything
changed,the four channels no lower there but radio left untouched.
I assume the folk with the boxes are seeing uninterupted transmissions,and is it possible that the CC tests are different in some respects?

SRB

It is possible they've received complaints from the UK and thus had to null the signal in that direction further, I know that reception of the CC trial isn't possible in many areas where the analogue signal is blasting in, some parts of Co.Down have a stronger signal from it than Divis, but still can't "see" the DTT service trial.

mrdtv

I think that's very likely as these are engineering tests and undoubtedly would cause interference with existing UK services. Similarly its known that the Three Rock DVB-H trial is interfering with Divis DTT on the Isle of Man outside the protected service area. If Ireland ever gets its act together for a commercial DTT service the Claremont Carn analogue assignments would be replaced by DVB-T (or maybe T2 by then) pairs and the existing NI coverage would be replicated. Interestingly the areas where CC is strongly ghosted eg round Strangford and in the lee of the Mournes would then have a highly usable DVB-T signal compared to today where Kippure VHF or Three Rock have to be used (modulo Divis DTT interference which will disappear when Divis is switched to DVB-T only in 2012..) Ofcom will probably insist on further nulls northward in the meantime and the recent reception pattern is probably a tropospheric lift common in the autumn... May well return when its foggy: just wait and see.)
Of course with Freesat coming next year RTE are in a real bind now: scrappy analogue pictures for those dependent on terrestrial and pay for those via satellite, MMDS and cable. The ongoing shambles continues..
mrdtv

lawhec

Scratching my head here, I remember that at last year's ITU Region 1 conference regarding the path to eventual migration to DVB-T, analogue TV services are still regarded as "protected" and hence the primary user of the VHF and UHF broadcast bands until some point in 2012. After that digital TV allocations then become the primary user and any analogue transmissions still going at that point will not be protected.

I'll need to pull out the list of frequencies cleared for the respecitve sites north and south. IIRC Clermont Carin is cleared on UHF for channels 52, 53, 56, 57, 60, 63, 66 and 68.

musa

All services came back to us in the North last weekend.Four TV in the clear and a lot of radio.
Mind you there is not a lot to look at,and I think that would also be the case even if the powers that be gave us a free box
Freesat seems to be the way forward,more expense,and still paying the TV license,and again for the same channels on Sky and on line.
Pay per view?never happen.
Shame we lost CRT,do we need LCD,how big is the average living room?
I was always told the optimum viewing distance was 8 times the diagonal of the screen,a mans head in my room should not be bigger than a mans head!

watty

MINIMUM viewing distances so as to not see the lines:
8 times for 405 line TV
5 times for 625 (576 visible)
3 times for 1080 visible (based on Analogue 1125 line)

JHMEG

Owing to the different aspect ratios of widescreen TVs those figures need to be adjusted? The lines on a 28" widescreen the lines are going to be thinner than on a 28" 4:3 TV.

musa

musa wrote:

All services came back to us in the North last weekend.Four TV in the clear and a lot of radio.
Mind you there is not a lot to look at,and I think that would also be the case even if the powers that be gave us a free box
Freesat seems to be the way forward,more expense,and still paying the TV license,and again for the same channels on Sky and on line.
Pay per view?never happen.
Shame we lost CRT,do we need LCD,how big is the average living room?
I was always told the optimum viewing distance was 8 times the diagonal of the screen,a mans head in my room should not be bigger than a mans head!

It all went away again in the Mournes,back to Country Music 106.8FM

L1011

This would probably be due to the fact that your reception is based entirely on tropospheric conditions, and nothing else...

musa

I agree propogation conditions would seem to apply in this situation and the fact the signal is bouncing over a big stretch of sea.It is still a shock to realise that full signal strength on 38 services can go overnight hero to zero.The signal was rock solid for over six months it seems.
I just have a feeling something changed at the send end?Will continue to monitor as I'm sure they would like me to keep in touch for free.