Factory Records on BBC4

mike65

Clicky

Mike.

Dudess

Oh fabulous. Can't wait. Cheers Mikey!

JLemmon

Good doc, great stories.

MoominPapa

Good show, reaffirms what a pr!(k Hooky is
Thought it was very poignant where Jeremy Kerr from a Certain Ratio was saying Wilson would have long conversations about situationism with him but he never really got it and would have to ask him about it again. Too late now mate

Dudess

I watched it for the second time last night, then headed into Thomas Read's to meet a couple of mates who had been at a gig by a "Madchester" band which can't be discussed here. From 11 til 3am, the DJ played nothing but "Madchester"/Hacienda tunes - it was ****ing amazing! There were people of all ages - from 18 or 19 (who were barely born for "Madchester") to guys in their 40s who were "there" for it (and in fairness, ONLY guys. It was such a laddish scene) The place was jammers and the crowd went ballistic - Voodoo Ray, Pacific 707 by 808 State, Chime by Orbital, KLF, lots of New Order, Roses, Mondays, Smiths, Fall, as well as Primal Scream, The La's - bliss! Ok, there were a few Oasis numbers but nothing's gonna be perfect! Ah, to be fair, very early Oasis is good.
Brilliant night.
MoominPapa, why do you think Hooky's a prick? I think he seems like a fairly amiable chap.

MoominPapa

Dudess wrote:

MoominPapa, why do you think Hooky's a prick? I think he seems like a fairly amiable chap.

He basically pinned the blame for Curtis(', 's?) suicide on his wife (Ian's not Hooky's). After everything that has been said about the poor epilepsy treatments available at the time and the other members youthful indifference it seemed very low. But then he's throws his hands up and says "but I don't know", keep your mouth shut then. The programmers should not have included it imho

dereko1969

in fairness, curtis and the wife had just had a huge argument before he topped himself which is all that hook said. i though hook was hilarious, loved the way he told the story about curtis having been told what not to do by the doctor (no late nights, drink, drugs) and then replying to the question what he worked at with 'librarian'! they were all fairly forgiving of tony wilson even though new order lost loads of money through funding the hacienda. was surprised at the lack of an explanation of why the other directors/founders of factory weren't interviewed. was a great documentary though.

Dudess

MoominPapa wrote:

He basically pinned the blame for Curtis(', 's?) suicide on his wife (Ian's not Hooky's). After everything that has been said about the poor epilepsy treatments available at the time and the other members youthful indifference it seemed very low. But then he's throws his hands up and says "but I don't know", keep your mouth shut then. The programmers should not have included it imho

God yes! I forgot about that bit - I found it shocking!

dereko1969 wrote:

in fairness, curtis and the wife had just had a huge argument before he topped himself which is all that hook said.

No he said a lot more than that, Derek. He actually said (I'm paraphrasing obviously) "Whatever happened between Ian and Debbie beforehand - that must have been what caused him to top himself!" I definitely remember him saying that and thinking it was too harsh. An awful thing to say, and no doubt very difficult for Ian and Debbie's daughter Natalie to hear. She wrote a feature in Saturday's Guardian on Control, where she described how the band members told her how guilty they felt. And she had reassured them that there is nothing to feel guilty about - that they were very young musicians who couldn't have known what to do.
She said if anyone had failed her dad, it was the NHS.

Marty DiBergi

dereko1969 wrote:

in fairness, curtis and the wife had just had a huge argument before he topped himself which is all that hook said. i though hook was hilarious, loved the way he told the story about curtis having been told what not to do by the doctor (no late nights, drink, drugs) and then replying to the question what he worked at with 'librarian'! they were all fairly forgiving of tony wilson even though new order lost loads of money through funding the hacienda. was surprised at the lack of an explanation of why the other directors/founders of factory weren't interviewed. was a great documentary though.

Alan Erasmus is/was notoriously camera/interview shy. The guy who played him in 24 Hour Party People had to use 2nd hand information to try to get some handle on his mannerisms and accent. Hannet is dead. Rob Gretton also gone. Wilson now gone. Saville was always somewhat detached. Maybe Hook was out of order with the reference to the domestic row. Debbie Curtis details the events of the Friday and Saturday of Ian's death in her book. If there was a flaming row I don't believe that this single event was that important in the scheme of things. Ian was unwell with multiple problems. He was also very young.
Any body read the new book yet? Don't think I can wait until my Christmas present

Dudess

Marty DiBergi wrote:

If there was a flaming row I don't believe that this single event was that important in the scheme of things. Ian was unwell with multiple problems. He was also very young.
Any body read the new book yet? Don't think I can wait until my Christmas present

Exactly. The row might have pushed him over the edge, but if that hadn't, something else would have. He wasn't even 24 when he took his life, yet he seemed so much older.
Which new book, Marty? A follow-up to the Mick Middles one?

Marty DiBergi

Dudess wrote:

Exactly. The row might have pushed him over the edge, but if that hadn't, something else would have. He wasn't even 24 when he took his life, yet he seemed so much older.
Which new book, Marty? A follow-up to the Mick Middles one?

Yeah that's the one Dudess. It's new to me. Saw it in hardback in Waterstones-thought it was recent-maybe not? Also saw LWTUA (CD single?-if this term is correct) in HMV yesterday. Wonder about the point of releasing it again.

JLemmon

Marty DiBergi wrote:

Alan Erasmus is/was notoriously camera/interview shy. The guy who played him in 24 Hour Party People had to use 2nd hand information to try to get some handle on his mannerisms and accent. Hannet is dead. Rob Gretton also gone. Wilson now gone. Saville was always somewhat detached. Maybe Hook was out of order with the reference to the domestic row. Debbie Curtis details the events of the Friday and Saturday of Ian's death in her book. If there was a flaming row I don't believe that this single event was that important in the scheme of things. Ian was unwell with multiple problems. He was also very young.
Any body read the new book yet? Don't think I can wait until my Christmas present

But Alan Erasmus is an actor, being camera shy doesn't help with his choosen career. Maybe he's just not into reliving the past.

John

Marty DiBergi wrote:

Wonder about the point of releasing it again.

Cash in for the movie. Much like the album reissues.

funktastic

'Torn Apart' by Mick Middles is from 2006. Bigger than any book on Joy Division (I've seen) so far. It goes into the Annik Honore story with interviews from her. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Torn-Apart-Life-Ian-Curtis/dp/1844498263/ref=pd_bbs_7/203-1830597-8541544?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1190815744&sr=8-7

Does anyone know if the BBC4 documentary is available on youtube/google video or elsewhere?

Dudess

I personally don't. But I'd say BBC4 will repeat it. It does tend to repeat things. It's been on four times already but that doesn't mean it won't be on again, given the channel's record. It's not the same as RTE, which repeats any old **** just to fill a gap. BBC repeats stuff that it KNOWS viewers will actually want repeated.

Marty DiBergi

Some of the programmes on BBC4 get an airing on BBC2 at some point. It wouldn't surprise me if it gets an outing there. Maybe with some John Peel anniversary type angle.

funktastic

Hope so. I don't have BBC4.

On another note the Joy Division film 'Control' is out in Britain on 5 October. From interviews it seems pretty good. Trailer is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrFKu3xwTlQ

John

I've heard mixed reviews about Control so far but **** it, another movie about Joy Division can only be good news.

Dudess

The band were absolutely blown away by Sean Harris, the guy who played Ian Curtis in 24 Hour Party People. I think they'd have liked him to have reprised the role in Control.

Marty DiBergi

Dudess wrote:

The band were absolutely blown away by Sean Harris, the guy who played Ian Curtis in 24 Hour Party People. I think they'd have liked him to have reprised the role in Control.

A number of people I know didn't like 24 Hour party People at all. I thought it was great, capturing the oddball business outlook and telling this version of the story in a funny way. It was more subtle than people realise. The glimpse of the baby feeding bottle while the chicken danced on the TV screen was a clever touch. I can't remember any reference in the movie that Curtis had a baby girl. Hopefully Control will delve a little deeper. Uncut magazine had some stills/photos from the movie set. Sam Riley looks the part.Corbijn should have some affinity for the band's story. At least it's not Ron Howard!

Lunar Junkie

I've seen a lot of extremely positive press for 'Control' based on its festival showings, but it's been frequently noted that the film is specifically about Ian Curtis and focuses on his personal life as opposed to the wider Joy Division story- so if you go in expecting 'The Joy Division Film' you might be a little disappointed. I've read the Torn Apart book, some bits of interesting info in it although the writing style is fairly mundane and unengaging.. I'd only bother with it if you're a big fan of the band.

stovelid

John wrote:

Cash in for the movie.

even more bizarre artifact....

John

stovelid wrote:

even more bizarre artifact....

That's mad!

funktastic

Anyone know if 'Control' will be a general release or just specific cinemas like d'olier st/IFC?

John

I've only seen it listed in the IFI so far.

jmc

It's opening in Cineworld this Friday as well
http://www.cineworld.ie/cinematheque/Prochainement.jgi

Dudess

Cineworld - bizarre considering there's no Bruce Willis or explosions. Oh wait... Control does sound like the title of an action movie.

funktastic

The Factory documentary has been posted here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=784671196311645201&q=Factory+Records+-+Joy+Division+to+the+Happy+Mondays&total=12&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

Stumbled across this Smiths South Bank Show documentary from after the split in '87 - which is quite righteous: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6287819103590496366&q=the+smiths+south+bank&total=1&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

Dudess

Yep, we still have that Smiths documentary on VHS. It's worth watching for the ads alone. Wow, beer ads have come a long way since the day when all they featured were rain-soaked streets, lots of neon, a bunch of lads wearing leather jackets, a saxophonist giving it loads and some blurry camera-work!

stovelid

funktastic wrote:

Stumbled across this Smiths South Bank Show documentary from after the split in '87 - which is quite righteous:

Magic. Haven't seen that for ages.

My mate has a fabled VHS copy that he won't even let us watch.