Speed kills! Who cares?

Archeron

Just an observation here.
My journey to work takes in app 30km of bendy back roads, and then app 25km of motorway. I do my utmost to obey all the laws, and I make a point of not speeding anymore.

However, every single day, I see things, as we all do, that almost defy belief. People on the wrong side of the road, overtaking on bends, speeding outside schools, you name it, its bound to have been spotted by someone. Or, my personal favourite, overtaking in the hard shoulder on the OTHER side of the road!

Its obvious that speed is far from the only factor in deaths on our roads, what with potholes you could hide a truck in, bad surfaces and road conditions, idiotic drivers, people drunk or asleep and so on, but what exactly goes through the heads of the thousands of idiots every day who risk their lives and the lives of others with ultimately pointless bad driving?

We've all seen the ads, the news reports, and many of us have been personally touched by road tragedies, so we know the pain and misery that this behaviour causes. My question is, does anybody really give a damn about the potential outcome of their own dangerous driving?

There is no set group of people that this comment is aimed at either, as it varies from boy racers through truck drivers, yummy mummies, blue haired wrinklies and everything else in between. Today I had the privelege of almost being clipped as a muck truck overtook me outside a school in a 50kmph zone when he pulled back in too soon to avoid a head on collision.

What does it take to make people see sense about their driving? Ads dont seem to do it, nor does the horrifying images on news reports, and penalty points system is, in my own humble opinion, a joke.

Any ideas? Perhaps a Clockwork orange-type training regime?

peasant

I think there needs to be a differentiation between "speeding" and bad driving.

Speeding, IMO, is the conscious decision to go fast / faster than the limit allows ..i.e. you are fully aware that you are going too fast, but you keep on doing so.

Judging by the behaviour of most drivers around me, I would have to say that most of them seem to be neither aware nor conscious of what they are doing.

I think the problem goes far deeper than "speeding" in that an awful lot of people seem to have no idea whatsoever as to how bad their driving actually is. Going too fast is just one of many symptoms that they display.

Simple example of what I mean:

The typical dawdler that chuggs along on a perfectly good N road at 65 - 70 km/h usually doesn't slow down when they hit a village ...so one minute they're dawdling, the next they're "speeding"

In fact, they're just displaying that they have no clue what they are doing.

There are many more examples like this and in my opinion they all fall under the heading of bad driving, no skills and no awareness.

By targeting "speeding" only, one is only scraping at the tip of the iceberg

Archeron

peasant wrote:

I think there needs to be a differentiation between "speeding" and bad driving.


By targeting "speeding" only, one is only scraping at the tip of the iceberg

I agree 100%, I dont mean my thread title to be misleading.
As I mention, bad overtaking, dawdling like you say, and all the other things we see make for such a dangerous combination. I chose the headline "Speed Kills" because its such an obvious tagline that we are all familiar with.
The question (phrased better now that your point is on board) what needs to be done to make people aware of the dangers of being so oblivious, and/or just downright dangerous driving?

CarLover

We have a very simplistic view to road safety in this country - speed kills.

So we plaster unrealistic and stupid speed limits everywhere and do nothing to fix our extremely bad roads.

Bad driving is the cause of most near accidents that I see on the roads. That in combination perhaps with speed.
Speed is all down to circumstances. What we need are more police cars on our roads...both marked and unmarked to cut down dangerous driving.

We've all seen mad things...whether its cyclists, dodgy overtaking or people texting on the motorway. Stop people doing this...catch them red handed and we might stop this behaviour. Until that happens in earnest we're just flicking water at a roaring fire.

peasant

It is also a question of attitude and perception.

People are great at pointing out the faults of others while being perfectly oblivious to their own ...it's always the other driver that's the "idiot" never oneself.

Being cocooned in ones car seems to amplify that behaviour.

The only things that will make you realise your own mistake is either getting cought or have a near miss ...and even then a lot of people are very learning-resistent.

What to do to change that?

I don't know ...but I don't need to, you see ...I'm a perfect driver anyway

CarLover

It's a good point. It all boils down to human behaviour. Some people never learn anything in life.

I used to be a fairly dangerous individual on the roads - when I ran cars that couldn't even handle the kind of punishment I put them through.

I'm a lot more careful now...funny that. Now I can afford to run a powerful car and I drive more carefully than I used to....this is part down to age/maturity and partly down to not wanting to ding my nice bus

pow wow

Try driving in Donegal near the border. Cars (not just yellow reg ones to be fair) slingshotting past 4 and 5 cars in one go near bends, undertaking, entering roundabouts in the wrong lane and cutting you off, overtaking a queue of cars on a blind bend.....by far the worst driving I've ever witnessed, anywhere. In that case I think the lack of policing has a LOT to do with it.

Archeron

peasant wrote:

It is also a question of attitude and perception.

People are great at pointing out the faults of others while being perfectly oblivious to their own ...it's always the other driver that's the "idiot" never oneself.


I don't know ...but I don't need to, you see ...I'm a perfect driver anyway

I honestly hope that I didnt come across like that in my original post, because that is far from the point I'm aiming for, or the question I'm trying to ask. Nobody can honestly claim to be a perfect driver, and I know that I have my own foibles, as does everybody. The purpose of the thread is to ask what needs to be done to change the attitudes of drivers on the roads to make driving safer for everybody and avoid pointless accidents that shouldnt happen in the first place.
In fairness, most people will know the type of driving behaviour and un-nesssecary danger that I'm talking about and its not a matter of blaming anyone in particular. I was hoping for a discussion on what can change peoples attitudes, if I came across as being holier than thou in the OP, I apologize.
In saying that, being driven off the road by an over zealous dude in a 10 tonne truck does tend to p*ss you off a tad.

MrPudding

ellscurr wrote:

Try driving in Donegal near the border. Cars (not just yellow reg ones to be fair) slingshotting past 4 and 5 cars in one go near bends, undertaking, entering roundabouts in the wrong lane and cutting you off, overtaking a queue of cars on a blind bend.....by far the worst driving I've ever witnessed, anywhere. In that case I think the lack of policing has a LOT to do with it.

Bah, it is speed that kills. Everyone knows that. A few more speed checks on the N11 will sort out those dangerous drivers in Donegal. Won't it?

MrP

Pep

The typical dawdler that chuggs along on a perfectly good N road at 65 - 70 km/h usually doesn't slow down when they hit a village ...so one minute they're dawdling, the next they're "speeding"

In fact, they're just displaying that they have no clue what they are doing.

I see this type almost every time I go on a journey. I really believe those people don't realise what they are up to. They seem to think I'm comfortable at this speed and thats what Im going to!

cornbb

Agree with everyone's sentiments re. speed not being as big a culprit as its made out to be. As much as I disagree with speeding, there are times when driving over the speed limit is not necessarily dangerous driving. Stupidity must be the main factor in the vast majority of road deaths IMO - a couple of weeks ago I was driving behind a man who was reading the newspaper behind the wheel! :eek: We all have stories like this, there are muppets everywhere.

Enforcement is a major problem. The Gardai like easy pickings, eg speed traps and random breath tests. There need to be more of them on the roads and they need to be handing out penalty points/fines/bans for everyday stupid things like tailgating, blind overtaking, dozy slow drivers, tools without their lights on after dark, etc etc.

mike65

I have a minor but good example of unthinking behavior from this morning.

A van was parked on the far side of a road facing in the same direction I was going, he was indicating to be let out. Being a van parked on the 'wrong' side of the raod pointing in the 'wrong' direction, his vision was very restricted. I slowed to a stop to let him edge he way out but typically some knob-end in a hurry behind me assumed I was parked or something and shot around me as the van was starting to take up road space.

It was'nt a drama no-one was close to getting thier car mashed on this occassion but had the van driver been less circumspect there would have been a collision.

Btw if you drive a van NEVER park on the opposite side of the road when its busy and the road is anything other than dead straight. Its flipping hard to see much of whats going on as you pull out. I speak as a van driver

Mike

peasant

Archeron wrote:

I honestly hope that I didnt come across like that in my original post....

My "musings" weren't directed at you at all ...more to myself and everybody/anybody in general.

Ger the man

The best one I ever encountered was an impatient twat in a celica who passed me going through Blanchardstown village in the dark - with no lights on and wearing shades!! What a moron!

CarLover

See the problem with giving the guards more opportunities for fining people for minor infractions is the guards in this country have very little cop (excuse the pun).

It'd turn into a police state very quickly.

Is it fair for someone to be put off the road for minor infractions...maybe a few of them? I don't think it is.

Give the police different powers and clear guidelines. Warnings...especially severe ones do work...contrary to popular belief. I got pulled by an unmarked car on the M50 a couple of years back for undertaking him on the inside
He pulled up to me at lights later on and asked me to pull down my window. Gave out hell...then calmed down...told me to drive carefully in future. That stuck with me. I paid heed. Obviously not everyone will but if you pull most people for minor infractions and explain why (lights not on etc) they'll probably pay more attention in future. They shouldn't be automatically getting 2 points.
It should also be based on history. Guards should be able to pull up your points record quickly in order to guage whether you deserve points, both or neither.
But all of this of course assumes that we don't have a police force who are fair to the general public.

Cionád

Was on the Galway to Cliften road a while back this crazy driver was overtaking on the hard shoulder of the other side of the road as a car was overtaking another one and another car was coming the opposite way, four cars almost touching each other!! Incidentally she was pulled for speeding (i think) about 20km up the road

^Above is a little vague, here what it looked like (arrows are cars

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That dawdling too is very common, its my main hatred, that and not knowing how to indicate or not indicating at all on roundabouts.

I think dangerous driving should be the main focus rather than speed checks on motorways, last night there was some guy driving on the M4 with his 'candlelights' on, he was almost invisible!!!

wet-paint

We need more of these around the place...
http://www.speedbandits.dk/

MrPudding

wet-paint wrote:

We need more of these around the place...
http://www.speedbandits.dk/

A "not work safe" notice would have been nice there. Tosser.

MrP

Dades

MrPudding wrote:

A "not work safe" notice would have been nice there. Tosser.

Seriously, that was tame.
Unless your boss had his chin on your shoulder nobody would notice that.

MrPudding

The Atheist wrote:

Seriously, that was tame.
Unless your boss had his chin on your shoulder nobody would notice that.

It doesn't need to be the boss that sees it. In fact, my boss would be the least of my worries. Bare breasts, whilst very nice, are not work safe anywhere I have worked and in my current place would result in instant dismissal for a permie, let alone a contractor like myself.

MrP

Cion&#225

Cion&#225 wrote: »

I think dangerous driving should be the main focus rather than speed checks on motorways, last night there was some guy driving on the M4 with his 'candlelights' on, he was almost invisible!!!

I think I met him a few months ago! in total darkness.
I was about to overtake a lorry, road looked clear except for a couple of dim lights "in the distance", I pulled out to start overtaking when I realized that this car was MUCH closer,:eek: aborted rapidly!!!

How the hell could he see where he was going? Night vision goggles??:rolleyes:

Seth Brundle

The reason why bad driving is so common is because with our lax enforcement and our absence of a proper driver education system, people don't realise what they are doing is wrong/dangerous/etc. and continue to do it.

ninty9er

There's this thing called common sense that a lot of Irish drivers seem to forget about when they get into the driver's seat.

It's common sense that if the speed limit is 80 km/h and there's a sharp bend ahead that you slow to 40 or 50 km/h.

It's also common sense that if it's dark you should have your lights on.

This is lost on people, however the one common sense issue that people do remember is that although the speed limit on Motorways is 120 km/h that 160, 180 or even 200 km/h are not dangerous speeds on these roads.

conclusion: Irish people are always in a hurry. Refer findings to the Department of Psychology at Yale for determination on why this is the case.

afatbollix

speed doesent kill stupid driving does...

ive been in a car that crashed 60mph into a tree and i walked away... ( legal car raceing)

its stupid driving kills... and excessive speed is stupid if the road or car cant handle the speed

Seth Brundle

I agree ninty9er but in all fairness, the party you publicly are supporting are the ones we can blame. To have useless idiots such as Cullen and Roche in charge of this important part of society was extremely irresponsible of the taoiseach.
Basically, nothing much has been done to tackle poor driving on our roads.
We do have the NCT (for what its worth!), penalty points (albiet limited), random breath testing (occasionally), more driving testers (who apparently are easier to pass with), safer driving adverts (again occasionally), new ROTR (eventually), etc. but the average level of driving skill in this country is going downhill fast.