Prosperity

Fr Dougal

Did anyone see the new Irish drama series Prosperity, 9.30 Monday night. I wanted to watch but missed it.

Seems each episode follows one character.

If you watched it, was it any good?

hot fuss

It's not starting until next Monday, so you're in luck!

Also Starring LeVar Burton

The ads look good. How many episodes is there?
Yeah, definitely didn't start last monday because the finale of Prison Break was on at that time.

Dave!

Just a heads up, the new RTÉ show is starting now!

Looks alright

Dave!

Pretty dire so far...

Conor108

These skangars have wonderful conversational skills

Man: Ya drinkin' your cans?
woman: yeah
Man:Thats nice
woman: yeah

Dave!

lol

Whoever wrote the script should be shot...

fricatus

Bleedin' despreh!

I'm going to watch "Bwitten's ne'xt to'p moddouwl" now, just to get the smell of chips, cigarettes and baby sick out of my mind.

lukin

I think the stilted conversations in it were the point of the series, i.e. this is ordinary life, nothing much happens, life is dull, hum-drum stuff.
It was fairly depressing alright but I suppose that's what most days are like for some single mothers in Dublin.

Basq

Missed it... simply due to it being an RTE production.

Ah well.. doesn't sound like i missed much!

mike65

Is this one of those hand-wringing lefty dramas that protray the oppressed masses as hardy folk doing thier best in difficult cirumstances, loike? "teh hell of soink estate etc"?

Mike.

philstar

DaveMcG wrote:

lol

Whoever wrote the script should be shot...

kill a ten year old child:eek:

lukegriffen

Brutal stuff. Nothing dramatic about it.
How could anyone write such terrible dialogue ? Mike Leigh can get away with monosyllabic dialogue, but you know there's a story & a plot & a tension building
This story had nothing going for it. I switched over, then switched back & thought it had improved - there was 2 characters chatting and smiling, but it turned out to be a Coke ad.

Tipsy Mac

Wasn't great.

Interesting to see how RTE still are not aware of the smoking ban in the workplace and get away with it for their dramas :rolleyes:

masseyno9

Didn't catch it myself, but sounds a bit like Adam & Paul the film that was out a while ago.

kinkstr

mike65 wrote:

Is this one of those hand-wringing lefty dramas that protray the oppressed masses as hardy folk doing thier best in difficult cirumstances, loike? "teh hell of soink estate etc"?

Mike.

That exactly what it was.

slipss

Maybe I'm reading a bit too much into it, but I think the dullness of the dialogue and the story in general was supposed to reflect the situation of young single mothers in Dublin, nothing much to do, no money to do it with, everyone else is working or in school during the day so you end up trapped in an extremely monotonous lifestyle. Like it was a literary device or whatever the television equivalent is.

But yeah it was terrible television, next episode seems like it could be better though.

Dave!

lukegriffen wrote:

Brutal stuff. Nothing dramatic about it.
How could anyone write such terrible dialogue ? Mike Leigh can get away with monosyllabic dialogue, but you know there's a story & a plot & a tension building
This story had nothing going for it. I switched over, then switched back & thought it had improved - there was 2 characters chatting and smiling, but it turned out to be a Coke ad.

hahaha, I fell for that too!

Retr0gamer

I think we already saw the best part of the next episode:

'How did you break your arm? Did your girlfriend cross her legs?'

'No, I fell off YORE MA!'

I think the dull conversations were part of the point of the episode. Stacy seemed to be having the same conversation with everyone. Still it didn't make great TV.

CiaranC

slipss wrote:

Maybe I'm reading a bit too much into it, but I think the dullness of the dialogue and the story in general was supposed to reflect the situation of young single mothers in Dublin, nothing much to do, no money to do it with, everyone else is working or in school during the day so you end up trapped in an extremely monotonous lifestyle. Like it was a literary device or whatever the television equivalent is.

I'll reply to your post because its the only one of any intelligence in the thread.

I thought it was very well done. First time Ive seen anything like it on Irish television. It illustrated the reality of the lives of the underclass in Dublin; Child from a broken home falls pregnant by a violent thug due to lack of moral guidance or any type of protection from a parent in her life, gets sucked into the same situation herself perpetrating the cycle. The creeping lonliness, isolation, the onset of depression and the inevitable turning to drink. Nods to the inarticulate, confused nature of a working class youth bereft of any real education and to the prevalence of mental health issues among Dublins poorest.

Depressing stuff, and all too close to the bone for some of us. Unfortunatley, I dont imagine there will be many other Boards users along to agree with me, as most (all?) here are products of the 'prosperity' alluded to in the title.

You may now return to your regularly scheduled 'skanger' jokes. Even better, pop over to AH and join the thread there. Dont forget your copy of the Daily Mail. If you do, sure no harm you can have one of your daddies drop it over in his 07 Primera

Dave!

Ah yes, you're the only one who 'gets' it and everyone else is just missing the point.......

It couldn't just be a good idea but sh*tty implementation.

CiaranC

DaveMcG wrote:

Ah yes, you're the only one who 'gets' it and everyone else is just missing the point.......

It couldn't just be a good idea but sh*tty implementation.

lol, why didnt you say that then?

I thought the production values were decent, the acting was good with a few exceptions and the accents were spot on.

Maybe Im just a cantankerous old skanger bastard.

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

bobbyjoe

Thought it was brutal.
Yeah
Yeah
Yeah
Yeah
Yeah
Looked good well filmed etc but the dialogue was terrible and not much of a story. Her talking to the security guard was painful yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah.

johnnyrotten

Probably a realistic conversation though

telecaster

I think you're all being very hard on it; for me it was an excellent production.

These characters are never going to deliver snappy Tarantino-esque dialogue. Their lives are dull, bleak, hopeless and violent. This is inner city Dublin, this is the people who have bigger problems than what to do with their SSIA.

Have you ever tried talking to a 17 year old girl from that kind of background? "Yeah" and "It's alright" are most likely the only two phrases you'll manage to draw out of them. Admittedly that's a generalisation but it's a realistic one.

To paraphrase previous poster, maybe the programme is a bit too real to be appreciated.

um7y1h83ge06nx

What a load of rubbish.

I think that the main problem is the characters being Dublin skangers, who seem to have poor conversational skills at best.

They should have picked different characters for the show. Just because they're skangers doesn't mean the dialogue has to be so bland, full of "yeaaah".

There was pretty interesting dialogue in the likes of the Welsh Twin Town and of course Trainspotting.

RTÉ seem to think that drama = boring.

Miguel_Sanchez

I thought it would divide people alright. Personally I enjoyed it - thought it was very understated and well written. Abrahamson and O'Halloran work well together and I will definitely be tuning in to see how the other 3 episodes play out.

The whole point of the series I think will be that there's not much of a story - it's a slice of life set over the course of one day. I think these kind of stories can be much mroe interesting in ways.

That could be just me though.

CiaranC

Joy Incalculable Bead wrote:

What a load of rubbish.

I think that the main problem is the characters being Dublin skangers, who seem to have poor conversational skills at best.

They should have picked different characters for the show. Just because they're skangers doesn't mean the dialogue has to be so bland, full of "yeaaah".

Firstly, this was the first episode of the series, other episodes will feature other characters.

The whole point of the show is that it features Dublin 'skangers', those left behind by the 'Celtic tiger' due to factors like alcoholism, drug abuse, physical & sexual abuse, lack of education and poverty in our inner cities. The dialogue was spot-on in the most part.

Suggesting that they shouldnt have used these characters is like suggesting that DaVinci should have painted a bowl of petunias for the Mona Lisa. He could have, but then it wouldnt be a picture of a bird smiling, would it?

There was pretty interesting dialogue in the likes of the Welsh Twin Town and of course Trainspotting.

RTÉ seem to think that drama = boring.

The episode was supposed to reflect the drudgery, isolation, boredom, depression and lonliness of the main characters life, and to explain why people become like they do in Dublins underclass, which it did well. If you want comedy, go watch a comedy. Its simple really.

um7y1h83ge06nx

Alright, I was probably overly harsh.

But it did seem quite a slow moving episode. It could have possibly done with a bit more drama that would still remain true to what the creators want to portray.

Some of the stuff I have witnessed and/or have been told about would make far more interesting/depressing than a single mother drinking cans and talking to a fella with replies of "yeah". That's just so stereotypical it doesn't make interesting viewing, we unfortunately see it so much.

Some of the real stuff that happens you couldn't make it up. The cops battering a load of skangers on a garage forecourt cos the were always nicking stuff from it, lads nicking a small dumper at nightime from a construction site and ended up driving it through a large roundabout, making sh*t of the place. A builder getting dodgy characters to track down some windows that were robbed off a site, the characters finding out who stole them and threatened them with violence to return all the windows. Which they did!

If they really want to send a message out about Irish society they may be better off with a hard-hitting dcoumentary.

blackhead

To me it was a typical RTE piece about lower class life. Condesending in the extreme. I wonder who researched this. You could do the same piece about half of the stay at home mothers on lower incomes whose lives I'm sure are equally bleak.

Most people who end up in those circumstances have grown up like that and don't know anything different. They are not unhappy that is their life and they have nothing else to compare it to. It is condesending in the extreme to look down in that way on them.

It's like upperclass rich kids looking down on everyone else saying, oh imagine having to have a job etc, they probably think my life is awful, it's not, it's all I know!!

To me this was more of Adam & Paul, without the humour or the character development.

I find the whole thing quite smug to be honest. I have lived in Dubin inner city, and alot of these 'poor single mothers' are having a ball. They get loads from the state, their partners are working and they get free housing, medical, etc etc. I used to see them hanging out in the park, not a care in the World on them. And it's not just in Dublin, they are in everytown in the country, same story! Of course that woudlnt be as controversial.

Look, loads of people have boring lives, doesn't make it good TV!!

ianrush

CiaranC wrote:

I'll reply to your post because its the only one of any intelligence in the thread.

I thought it was very well done. First time Ive seen anything like it on Irish television. It illustrated the reality of the lives of the underclass in Dublin; Child from a broken home falls pregnant by a violent thug due to lack of moral guidance or any type of protection from a parent in her life, gets sucked into the same situation herself perpetrating the cycle. The creeping lonliness, isolation, the onset of depression and the inevitable turning to drink. Nods to the inarticulate, confused nature of a working class youth bereft of any real education and to the prevalence of mental health issues among Dublins poorest.

Depressing stuff, and all too close to the bone for some of us. Unfortunatley, I dont imagine there will be many other Boards users along to agree with me, as most (all?) here are products of the 'prosperity' alluded to in the title.

You may now return to your regularly scheduled 'skanger' jokes. Even better, pop over to AH and join the thread there. Dont forget your copy of the Daily Mail. If you do, sure no harm you can have one of your daddies drop it over in his 07 Primera

As someone who is not quite enjoying the "prosperity" of the celtic tiger myself, is it still okay if I disagree with you CiaranC about this show?
I appreciate this is a first episode, setting up characters and situations, perhaps for reasons that are not immediately obvious, but which will hopefully have a payoff in the next three episodes. And certainly I would not disagree about the importance of the subject matter and the issues raised. Yet the execution in my view was disappointing. After Adam and Paul, O'Halloran was rightly feted as a writing talent to watch, but his script for this first episode felt underdeveloped. Ultimately I just couldn't engage with the central character of the girl. Your description of "the inarticulate, confused nature of a working class youth" is interesting. As a former working class youth myself, I can tell you that the majority have no problem speaking their minds to whoever wants to listen. Maybe the vocabulary they use isn't extensive but they make up for it in volume and relentless energy. O'Halloran chose to present the opposite and okay, there is always the quiet kid in a group who tends to stand back from the ringleaders. It's a brave choice to try and make this a central character but bravery does not always equal successful drama and certainly not in this case. The reduced dialogue style which O'Halloran specialises in just didn't have the sharpness to it that it had in Adam and Paul and in some scenes actually sounded like a really bad parody of working class accents (the shopping center security guard was particularly cringeworthy). Again, maybe this will pick up in the second episode, but this episode did not succeed, for me anyway, to tell a compelling story. Just presenting life as is, which seems to be what you find worthy about this production, is not necessarily drama.

davej

Overall fairly terrible, I have to say. The acting was a slight cut above fair city but that's about it.

Who scripted the dialogue? The security guard's lines were particularly atrocious. I don't know anybody in Dublin who speaks like that.

The actual plot wasn't the worst and the actress playing 'Stacy' was ok, it was just executed particularly badly. Adam and Paul would be spinning in their graves

Get Ken Loach on the job!

davej

eth0_

davej wrote:

Adam and Paul would be spinning in their graves

OMG SPOILER PLAZ!!!

Ok, "Trainspotting" this was most definitely not! It seems like a waste of time and taxpayers money thus far. Nothing really happened for greasy, domestos bleached hairdo Stacy buying three cans and going for a drink by the canal on her own. What next, a crack pipe?

I admit I have almost zero sympathy for the scum in Dublin, but I can separate that from the fact this show was utter cr*p.

Big Tone

"Nil By Mouth" meets "Soupy Norman"!

CiaranC

Finally some decent counterpoints, particularly from ianrush.

blackhead wrote:

To me it was a typical RTE piece about lower class life. Condesending in the extreme....Most people who end up in those circumstances have grown up like that and don't know anything different. They are not unhappy that is their life and they have nothing else to compare it to.

And you say this TV show is condescending... wow.

blackhead wrote:

I find the whole thing quite smug to be honest. I have lived in Dubin inner city, and alot of these 'poor single mothers' are having a ball.

Thats nice for them. I would point you to the suicide rates, heroin addiction and violent crime levels among the poorest in Dublin as a counterpoint.

ianrush wrote:

As a former working class youth myself, I can tell you that the majority have no problem speaking their minds to whoever wants to listen. Maybe the vocabulary they use isn't extensive but they make up for it in volume and relentless energy. O'Halloran chose to present the opposite and okay, there is always the quiet kid in a group who tends to stand back from the ringleaders.

Point taken, but this episode was about the people who fall by the wayside, not about those who overcome the challenges presented. Thats its central point.

Certainly I know loads of kids who came good, the large majority Id say, some even in spite of having atrocious family lives and little chance. Of the rest, most are dead or in the joy zombified by smack.

ianrush wrote:

Just presenting life as is, which seems to be what you find worthy about this production, is not necessarily drama.

Given this and the other thread, I think its a worthy goal just to inform people that these people actually exist and to try to explain why; people seem either ignorant, in denial or openly hostile about the even the idea of it.

davej wrote:

The security guard's lines were particularly atrocious. I don't know anybody in Dublin who speaks like that.

Are you serious? The man is a supposed to be a simpleton. Minimum wage jobs in this country, particularly security, are littered with people like him. My last job had a chap from St Josephs on security.

Turbulent Bill

I think the biggest problem was the lack of nuance, especially considering that it was billed as a drama. There didn't seem to be any change in tone from the first moment, so once it's established that Stacy has a horrendous life, there's nowhere to go. Clearly, having her skipping down the street with her buggy wasn't an option, but a little bit of levity (or something) would have emphasised her terrible situation rather than detracted from it. As it was, the programme lost its punch after a few minutes, and never really recovered.

It might be better next week, but I think this fell between the drama and documentary stools.

humanji

CiaranC wrote:

The episode was supposed to reflect the drudgery, isolation, boredom, depression and lonliness of the main characters life, and to explain why people become like they do in Dublins underclass, which it did well. If you want comedy, go watch a comedy. Its simple really.

But it's not going to achieve anything by boring the audience to tears. The show tried to make you feel for the main character and failed miserably, in my opinion. As was mentioned above, it should have had breaks in the depression which would serve to emphasis the depression even more. As it was, it was more an ordeal to get through before Law & Order came on, on TV3.

I might give next weeks episode a gander to see if they do a better job, but I won't get my hopes up.

um7y1h83ge06nx

humanji wrote:

But it's not going to achieve anything by boring the audience to tears. The show tried to make you feel for the main character and failed miserably, in my opinion. As was mentioned above, it should have had breaks in the depression which would serve to emphasis the depression even more. As it was, it was more an ordeal to get through before Law & Order came on, on TV3.

I might give next weeks episode a gander to see if they do a better job, but I won't get my hopes up.

Exactly. Trainspotting for example had a few funny/light parts but also a few deeply saddening parts such as when the baby is found dead. It also I think portrayed the horrors of heroin pretty well.

CiaranC

humanji wrote:

But it's not going to achieve anything by boring the audience to tears. The show tried to make you feel for the main character and failed miserably, in my opinion. As was mentioned above, it should have had breaks in the depression which would serve to emphasis the depression even more.

I see your point, but I think what the writers were trying to get at is that for some, there is no break from the depression. Also, the episode took place over a single day.

Anyway, Id like to debate this further, but I have to emigrate to canada in about 12 hours! Maybe I should get off Boards.

um7y1h83ge06nx

CiaranC wrote:

I see your point, but I think what the writers were trying to get at is that for some, there is no break from the depression. Also, the episode took place over a single day.

Anyway, Id like to debate this further, but I have to emigrate to canada in about 12 hours! Maybe I should get off Boards.

Good luck with that.

Boards is far too addictive, I've been trying to pull myself away from it for the last hour!

rs

Personally, I have to say I didn't enjoy it at all. The whole thing just seemed so very heavy-handed. It just seemed like it was trying way too hard to be depressing, trying too hard to push home the social message and make a point of it.

To me it had the feel of watching a terrible communist or facist government propaganda film. It was trying so desperately hard to stuff a message down my throat that I simply turned off and lost interest. I suspect I was not the only one.

Remember those terrible labour ads leading up to the election. That's what this reminded me of.

eirebhoy

The Scientist wrote:

Wow, did'nt expect these reviews this morning.

A review of an RTE production on boards... What else do you expect?

I thought the first 3 quarters were alright. It got too boring for the drinking cans at the canal bit.

The acting was very good imo. Makes you wonder what they're paying those in Fair City.

mike65

CiaranC wrote:

I thought it was very well done. First time Ive seen anything like it on Irish television. It illustrated the reality of the lives of the underclass in Dublin; Child from a broken home falls pregnant by a violent thug due to lack of moral guidance or any type of protection from a parent in her life, gets sucked into the same situation herself perpetrating the cycle. The creeping lonliness, isolation, the onset of depression and the inevitable turning to drink. Nods to the inarticulate, confused nature of a working class youth bereft of any real education and to the prevalence of mental health issues among Dublins poorest.

Sounds like Roddy Doyles Family reheated to me.

Mike.

mickd

Exactly, Scaldy skangers doth not make good TV. Should be renamed Posterior because thats what it is, Arse in skanger speak.

CiaranC

mike65 wrote:

Sounds like Roddy Doyles Family reheated to me.

Mike.

Thanks for letting us know what it 'sounds like' to you. :rolleyes:

Do you read the back cover of books and pop into the literature forum to let them know what they 'sound like' to you too?

anotherlostie

I'm amazed at how negative the reaction to this has been here (in the main).

Posters bemoaned the monosyllabic dialogue, but when she was with her friend it disappeared, just like it would in reality - but maybe people would prefer to have Stacy discussing her lack of knowledge of Shakespeare a la Brian from Big Brother when she was in the social welfare office or talking to the other fella on the canal? I laughed out loud at the name of the friend - Leanne Grimes:D. Having worked in a business 10yrs ago dealing with loads of Kylies and Jasons (and even Alexis and Blakes), this name was spot on. And the chav boyfriend was shown to be a manipulating pr*ck (but funny too!) trying to get his hole on the foam on the back of the van.

I didn't like the security guy - I don't know if you're supposed to, but again loads of them exist like this - the type that would come into your shop and you could never get them to shut up and leave when you were up to your eyes and that had absolutely no self-awareness to realise the body language of those talking to them. And I thought the best performance was by Stacy's sister, not wanting to get involved with 'two more kids' as she referred to her sister and the baby, but at the same time unable to help herself.

The trailer for the next one looked much more 'lively' and obviously as the four characters start to collide more, the story should pick up. I will definitely be sticking with it.

mike65

CiaranC go to Canada please.

Mike.

lukegriffen

You can't excuse the script on the fact that it was about a scanger.
Probably the best TV character of the last 10 years was a scanger - Rats from Paths to Freedom.

I will be watching the next show to see if it gets better, and RTE should be commended for producing / commissioning it. The more Irish drama the better.

~Marky~

Just saw this thread now..I thought it was absolute rubbish being honest.
The acting was terrible except the girls sister thought she was ok at least she had a bit of life in her..the rest of the people in it where zombies..
It would have been better if they had fitted it all in for half an hour because an hour was just way to long and the whole thing just moved to slowly..
I was looking forward to this but was a very big let down

fricatus

CiaranC wrote:

I'll reply to your post because its the only one of any intelligence in the thread.

(...)

You may now return to your regularly scheduled 'skanger' jokes. Even better, pop over to AH and join the thread there. Dont forget your copy of the Daily Mail. If you do, sure no harm you can have one of your daddies drop it over in his 07 Primera

CiaranC wrote:

Thanks for letting us know what it 'sounds like' to you. :rolleyes:

Do you read the back cover of books and pop into the literature forum to let them know what they 'sound like' to you too?

This is a discussion forum CiaranC. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. Stop being so bloody superior.