most fun car under 1.0L

davidclayton

i got some great views from other members in my other post about fiat cinquecentos. rather than walk off topic and start talking about other cars, i thought i'd start a new thread. i'm thinking of buying a new car very soon.

budget: max €5k
stipulations: must be under 1L [can be turbo]
i'd be interested in what people suggest. i'll get the ball rolling:

1. fiat cinquicento sporting
2. daihatsu mira trxx [660cc turbo four wheel drive]
3. suzuki cappuccino

Cyrus

itd have to be one of those mad jap 600cc turbo jobs i reckon!

isnt the smart roadster 900cc, lovely looking car, rwd, very light so quick enough

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smart_Roadster

that said you wont get one for 5k!

davidclayton

i used to own 2 smarts, and have driven several roadsters. i love them, but even bringing a second hand one in from the UK will set you back over €12k!

Cappo

It would have to be the Suzuki Cappuccino!!

The Cappuccino is a superb little car to drive.

The handling is unbelievable! Had it on a track day in Mondello and it was a blast – keeping up with much faster traffic on the twisty bits and in the rain!

The best bit though is the roof. 5 arrangements are possible. Very ingenious and you will get attention. Do not buy if you are a shrinking violet. I have already had people shouting and staring!

Practicality is not a strong point. 4 Bags of shopping, but if you can keep the passenger seat free, the foot-well can take quite a large bag. You will learn to pack with bags, forget suitcases.

Safety is an issue as well. You need to be extra careful in the wet!!

Watch insurance. Although it has a 660cc engine, it can be very expensive for anyone under 21

Parts are expensive. Turbo = 2500, headlight unit = 500. You get the idea.


It looks are cute, the performance is spectacular, considering the fuel consumption (45MPG+) and it's a real hoot to drive - even at 'sensible' speeds.

For those who appreciate automotive design, check out some of the features:

4 roof configurations, light-weight aluminium panels, double wishbone suspension, rear wheel drive and an 8500rpm red line on its 3-cylinder engine.

I wouldn't recommend a Cappuccino though to the following groups of people:
1) Large ones
2) Shy ones
3) Those who need boot space
4) Those who think of car as phalic symbols
To everyone else, you (probably) don't know what you're missing.

lightening

Great post OP, good question! The Cappicino is an incredible car, great fun, rear wheel drive, quick, light and mad looking. I have driven one and they are no slouches. (weirdly, they manages to stuff air conditioning in as well!)

Anyone know anything about the Honda Beat? I think its a mid engine car, not as good looking as the suzuki though.

lightening

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carid=655577


:eek:

Stephen

Never heard of these cappucinos before - are they JDM imports or something?

lightening

Stephen wrote:

Never heard of these cappucinos before

They are a bit of a cult car, I'm not certain, but I think they were a cheeky "up yours" to the K class car regime in Japan. The Japanese basically made a box and said if your car fits in this and is under a certain cc you can avoid heavy taxes and drive rather cheaply. Manufacturers build a range of horrible bad performing cars but Suzuki came up with this!

Henry Ford III

Diahatsu Charade Gtti? A bit old by now but they absolutely flew.

bazz26

Stephen wrote:

Never heard of these cappucinos before - are they JDM imports or something?

Not exclusively, they were sold here alright but in very small numbers. More plentiful in the UK however.

BTW this could be considered fun :
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=Car&carID=717649&message=You%20searched%20for%3A%20BMW%20C1%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%2E%20Your%20search%20returned%20one%20vehicle%2C%20which%20is%20shown%20below%2E&CFID=53960763&CFTOKEN=52357146

davidclayton

eh. no. 4 wheels please

the_syco

A Toyota MR2?

tuxy

the_syco wrote:

A Toyota MR2?

With a 1 litre engine swaped into it? :eek:
That's going now where fast

smash

I'd say you can get this for 5k
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carid=685650

BrianD3

Nobody mentioned the Mini?

If older cars are being considered then there's also the Hillman Imp and Citroen 2CV!

cormac_byrne

Nissan Figaro just squeezes in under 1L
Smart ForTwo Brabus

Though both may be over budget
(a regular smart car might be possible, if you would go for a LHD one they can be very cheap)

or a classic mini
http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=727132

or Citroen 2CV (though I suspect that's not your cup of tea)

I really like the Suzuki Cappuccino, I can't understand why there are so many MX5s out there. I vaguely considered both, before buying a 1968 Triumph Spitfire.

Also I think you need to be an enthusiast to buy any niche car.
Servicing and getting parts will always be more complicated.

Checkout the online forums / owners clubs to see what kind of help is out there for problems, parts etc...

That Cappuccino on Carzone has been there for months (bad weather probably no help for trying to sell a roadster) so price should be negotiable.

Common wisdom on roadsters is buy is Winter, sell in Summer.

Also roadsters are best garaged for both security and roof leaks.
I suspect the Cappuccino's solid roof panels are better than most in both regards, but will your insurance company think so?

rowanh

Id say a Cappuccino is the worst car to have a bad crash in.

Cappo

Bit of background on the Cappuccino


"The public first saw the project car in 1989 at the Tokyo Motor show. Built in Japan from 1991-1997, this car was a successful entrant in the Kei-class sector of the Japanese market. Body length less than 3.3m, body width not exceeding 1.4m, engine under 660cc. This means that it’s diminutive dimensions and engine size fall into a category created by the Japanese government called the K-Class or Kei-class. This class carried car tax incentives, to encourage car owners to buy smaller machines, leaner city vehicles for the congested and polluted streets of Japan. Benefits include access to certain small roads, on-street parking free of charge, and other things which are normally forbidden to the motorist in Japan.

Various other car models flourished in this sector of the market, all invariably boring, square-shaped shopping carts.

However, Suzuki, Mazda and Honda came up with a few variations on the theme when they created their sports models. Honda came up with the mid-engined Honda Beat, an attractive little soft-top roadster. Mazda sold a rare model named the Mazda A-I, a gull-wing coupe using the Suzuki engine. But Suzuki came up with the much celebrated class-beater - The Suzuki Cappuccino. Technically the car won huge critical acclaim, deservedly heaped upon the car’s designers.

Compliant with the K-class specification requirements, the engine was kept under 660cc. Suzuki produced the 657cc unit, and added a turbo. It’s a three-cylinder engine with four valves per cylinder, producing 63.1 bhp at around 6,500rpm. Turbo interjection is at 2,000rpm. but all the action is
carried out far above that figure. The tachometer shows 12,000rpm (!), red-lining at 8,500. It takes the 700kg machine there courtesy of a rear-drive chassis that is beautifully balanced, allowing the tail to ease smoothly out to the side on it’s double-wishbone suspension setup, only to be easily gathered up both cleanly and accurately with a flick of the wrist. The car’s low centre of gravity, combined with absolute minimal overhang at each end, provide for kart-like handling through the precise, non-powered rack and pinion steering. Disk brakes are provided on all four wheels.

Such was the acclaim and demand for the car, Suzuki (GB) imported as many units as they could get their hands on for the European market (about 1,200) including very small numbers for Belgium, Holland, Germany and Sweden. In Ireland, I estimate there is about 20-25 cars – all personally imported from the UK or Japan.

The brilliant hard top is removable in 3 segments, leaving the driver with 3 choices: Coupe, Targa, or full open-top motoring. These tuck away ingeniously into the boot, each roof piece into it’s own cover. Once the roof is safely stowed away, the heated rear windscreen slides back in to the car body.

Performance
Owners have debated long and hard over the stats! The truth is, a standard un-modified Cappo takes from 8 to 10 seconds approx to reach 60 mph, it needs third gear to do this, so physically changing up through the gears adds
dramatically to the time.

Top speed is electronically restricted to 87mph, but de-restricted it will reach 110mph, and highly modified cars can apparently hit 130mph and a 0-60 in 4.5 seconds!

Fuel consumption.
Cappuccino achieves 40mpg easily around town, about 58mpg at a constant 56mph. Again this is a key element of what the K-class car was intended to be, fun, highly economical and environment friendly."


Be careful buying UK versions as they tend to be very prone to the dreaded rust due to the salt used in winter in the UK

Suzuki Cappuccino Owners Register for Enthusiasts (a UK based club).
www.score.org.uk
www.cappuccinosport.com

Henry Ford III

rowanh wrote:

Id say a Cappuccino is the worst car to have a bad crash in.

Worse than what? and based on what? Just wondering.

lightening

rowanh wrote:

Id say a Cappuccino is the worst car to have a bad crash in.

As bad as any small car, maybe better even! you never know though.

tuxy

I'm still intrigued by the idea of a mr2 that's under 1 litre.
The mr2 is a fairly heavy car, how would it work?

blastman

The Honda Beat is a great little car, too, but it suffers compared to the Cappo because of a lack of oomph as it has no turbo. Although I'm a Honda fan, I've always fancied the CAppo and that would be the one I'd go for.

Duiske

Suzuki Cultus (Swift). I dove my sisters awhile back and could not believe it was only a 1ltr. A little rocket !

Edit. Small cars might be quick....but

smash

shame there's no Honda beat's around.....

Idleater

tuxy wrote:

I'm still intrigued by the idea of a mr2 that's under 1 litre.
The mr2 is a fairly heavy car, how would it work?

Speaking of bodging engines into different cars, and since bikes are out :rolleyes: - there was a video on YouTube from a guy who bodged a hayabusa engine (1300 cc) into a smart car.

If that can be done, I would suggest bodging a Suzuki GSXR 1000 into a smart car. 175bhp+ not bad.

L.

davidclayton

not do-able with my budget, and not exactly a daily driver with the thrum of an engine whining @ 12k revs

Mr. Presentable

I suppose it depends on what you mean by fun

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=733300

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=687134

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=415454

Orlee

steve06 wrote:

shame there's no Honda beat's around.....

There's one going around Dundrum. I think it's the some one that was for sale on boards around this same time last year.

I don't think it looks as nice in "person" as it does on paper

rowanh

There are a good few Honda beats about. Id say i have seen more than most kei cars. I pass one on the way to work most days. I think they are

Henry Ford III wrote:

Worse than what? and based on what? Just wondering.

Worse than almost every modern car available in Ireland. Just based on my opinion and some friends opinions some of who have owned one.

You are very low to the ground in a very small car without a solid roof. The car is very light and feels a bit flimsy.

I have been in two serious crashes in a Polo, i wouldnt like to have seen what would of happened if i was driving a cappaccino.

rowanh

nipplenuts wrote:

I suppose it depends on what you mean by fun

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=733300

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=687134

http://carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=415454

Nice finds! Love hte daihatsu.

cormac_byrne

steve06 "shame there's no Honda beat's around....."

Honda beats

http://www.usedcarmart.co.uk/honda_beat_convertiable-o27909-en.html
http://www.u-ukhbc.co.uk/vbb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=4

but I still think the Suzuki is a better bet

lightening

rowanh wrote:

Worse than almost every modern car available in Ireland. Just based on my opinion and some friends opinions some of who have owned one.

Ah... I see. The good old "friends" that have all owned one. I have driven one. I felt a little bit "small" in it, particularly when jeeps or trucks were behind me, but I never felt in danger or unsafe.

blastman

Suzuki is rarer, I'd say. Two mates of mine have Beats, there are a few about.

watchinpaintdry

I'd have to say the Daihatsu Hijet 660cc turbo

rowanh

lightening wrote:

Ah... I see. The good old "friends" that have all owned one. I have driven one. I felt a little bit "small" in it, particularly when jeeps or trucks were behind me, but I never felt in danger or unsafe.

Sorry i didnt relise you had driven one, you obviously know better..

What do you think the chances of living would be if you crash into a stationary object at 100kms? Or what do you think the chances of living are in a head on crash with a jeep if you are both going 30 - 50 kms? Or if a normal sized car hit the side of you going 60 kms?

lightening

rowanh wrote:

Sorry i didnt relise you had driven one, you obviously know better..

No problem, apology accepted;)

lightening

rowanh wrote:

Sorry i didnt relise you had driven one, you obviously know better..

No problem, apology accepted

colm_mcm

NIssan March Superturbo, no contest.


1.0 Supercharger and Turbo, just like Lancia Delta S4 or Golf TSI.

THis one's on Carzone for 4750

Cappo

For a car designed in the late 80s - the Cappuccino is about a safe as most - has side impact bars and with the roll bar up it should survive a roll - but haveing said that i would not like to test it!


In traffic i tend to drive it like a motorcycle - extra extra alert!!! :eek:

Owen

colm_mcm wrote:

1.0 Supercharger and Turbo, just like Lancia Delta S4 or Golf TSI. THis one's on Carzone for 4750

There were only a handful of those made! They're an incredibly quick machine.

unkel

Has to be the Cappuccino

I'm surprised you can actually get one for less than €5k here. If you buy one now, it surely must keep its value.

Thanks for the info, Cappo. Let me guess, you like them?

Cappo wrote:

The tachometer shows 12,000rpm (!), red-lining at 8,500

We were discussing that recently and several people claimed it redlined at 12k or 13k, which didn't make sense to me given the max power at about half that. The meter actually displaying those revs must have confused those people!

A bit like the speedo of a 70s Ascona 1.2 showing 120MPH when it would struggle to do much more than about 80

colm_mcm

ned78 wrote:

There were only a handful of those made! They're an incredibly quick machine.

I know, I saw one smoke a Celica GT4 a few years ago. incredible power to weight ratio. definately one for the collection!

legs11

first car that came to my mind was the suzuki, i saw a girl in cork with one recently.

i'd say 97% of the population have no idea what kind of a car that is....but it sure beats a fiat chiquiqnutea.a........:p

davidclayton

that seems like a decent price as they are so rare, but i've heard they are hard to work on and get parts for - anyone know any info on the superturbo?

0-60 in 7.7sec and 770kg!

Cappo

Most parts are OK to get as the car was officially imported to the UK – but some would have to be imported from Japan. Tuning is very expensive and not to be undertaken lightly – have a look at Dany’s CappuccinoSport website and drool!

The rev counter reading might be a tad optimistic!

wogger

best under 1 ltre car, 660cc turbo , Fun, buy my one

http://www.driver.ie/classified/showproduct.php/product/2187/cat/44

fletch

davidclayton wrote:

stipulations: must be under 1L [can be turbo]

Surely doesn't that rule out the Cinquecento Sporting as it's 1.1?? (1108cc)

davidclayton wrote:

1. fiat cinquicento sporting

davidclayton

wogger wrote:

best under 1 ltre car, 660cc turbo , Fun, buy my one

http://www.driver.ie/classified/showproduct.php/product/2187/cat/44

i'm going to look at that one today!

colm_mcm

Daihatsu Cuore TR-XX? same idea as the Alto.

davidclayton

i've heard the trxx has softer suspension and is not as good around corners.
drove the alto works today. wow. crazy punch from the small engine. i used to own a smart, but this was in another league! the works is a bit out of my budget, so i'm not looking into importing one.

davidclayton

i'm going to try test drive a cappuccino aswell if i can...