Good grip puncture proof tyres

Tweeter

I'm currently using kevlar puncture proof tyres which are excellent for avoiding puntures however they perform particularly poor in wet conditions. The bike has come from under me on 2 occasions now in the wet, even taking great care as I know they're rubbish in the wet.
Is there a puncture proof tyre available on the market that is also capable of providing decent grip in the wet?

E@gle.

what size tyres do you need? if you are looking at 700c tyres the specialzed armildo's are a great tyre they havent let me down yet anyway

Tweeter

Thanks E@gle, don't know what 700c means but the tyres currently on the bike are 700x28mm, is that the same as 700c?

Who makes these tyres you're suggesting and where can I get them easily?

thanks again,
Tweeter.

daymobrew

The Specialized Armadillo 700x28 tyres are available at CycleWays on Parnell Street, Dublin 1. They cost 30 euro each. Highly recommended by forum members.

Tweeter

Excellent, thanks a mil guys. I'll pop over at lunch time and pick up a pair

Tweeter

Went into cycleways to purchase a pair of the mentioned armadillos. Told the guy of my experience with kevlar tyres in the wet, only to be told that armadillos are even slippier in the wet than kevlar.
A guy in work phoned his local repair shop and the guy confirmed that because armadillo tyres are the most puncture proof tyres you can get they are also the hardest tyres that you can get hence they will give the worst performance in wet conditions.
Armadillos are definitely out considering what I have on already is better.
Now then anyone got any suggestions?

illumin

Well ive had continental gator skin ultras 700x28 and they were fine handling in the wet but i did get punctures after 500 miles so i scrapped em and got some armadillos and they are working great. I dont understand how you are getting such bad handling in the wet. Ive gone on slippery grass (taking short cuts ) on both tyres and havent had the bike come out from under me.

Membrane

Tweeter wrote:

Went into cycleways to purchase a pair of the mentioned armadillos. Told the guy of my experience with kevlar tyres in the wet, only to be told that armadillos are even slippier in the wet than kevlar.

You use "kevlar" as if it's a brand name. Kevlar is a material used to make tyres more resitant to punctures, it is used in most (all?) tyres with puncture protection, afaik including the Armadillos.

Armadillos are definitely out considering what I have on already is better.
Now then anyone got any suggestions?

Could it be that the problem isn't caused by the tyres? Are you reading the road and the conditions well enough? Especially in the wet certain road patches simply are slippery where no tyre will maintain grip.

Civilian_Target

Correct me if I'm wrong, my understanding was that tyre hardness was proportional to grip, but puncture proof tyres aren't by necessity hard tyres, just tyres with an extra layer that prevent things like glass from getting in.

Membrane

Civilian_Target wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, my understanding was that tyre hardness was proportional to grip, but puncture proof tyres aren't by necessity hard tyres, just tyres with an extra layer that prevent things like glass from getting in.

Agreed on the second part.

To the OP: tyres with sillica in them are often rated as performing less well in the wet. For optimum performance in the wet you could opt for a tyre that doesn't use sillica, for example the Continental Ultra Gatorskin: http://www.conti-tyres.co.uk/conticycle/ti%20ultra%20gatorskin.shtml

ruprect

Civilian_Target wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, .

Problem is a salesman will never say this, so instead of admitting ignorance they spout bull**** in the hope the customer is even more ignorant

the Continental Ultra Gatorskin

I have these on since last week and they seem fine in the wet, though I do not usually have much problems since I cycle safer in the rain. I do not usually have such thin slicks at the back though.

Tweeter

Membrane wrote:

You use "kevlar" as if it's a brand name. Kevlar is a material used to make tyres more resitant to punctures, it is used in most (all?) tyres with puncture protection, afaik including the Armadillos.



Could it be that the problem isn't caused by the tyres? Are you reading the road and the conditions well enough? Especially in the wet certain road patches simply are slippery where no tyre will maintain grip.

I understand what kevlar is, similarly I thought you'd understand what I meant. Kevlar is used in all tyre brands that claim to be puncture proof with the exception of armadillo tyres. Armadillo is a patented formula based on layers of nylon to form the puncture proof layer.

I am reading the road conditions correctly and am perfectly aware when I cross over a surface that will be slippy irrespective of the tyres used.
I figure it must be the brand that I have, which came with the bike a Giant FCR2 with Kenda kevlar tyres. It could be the case that I need to select a brand that has a better thread structure for enhanced grip.

I'm really not sure what to do, I don't want to throw away money by replacing what I have on for no improvement.

Anyone use Kenda kevlar tyres? and have an opinion on them?

Membrane

Tweeter wrote:

It could be the case that I need to select a brand that has a better thread structure for enhanced grip.

Manufacturers put thread on bicycle road tyres because many prospective buyers don't trust tyres without thread, but it serves no other purpose.

Thread is needed on wide flat tyres where water can get trapped causing a film to form which can cause aqua planing. No such thing for bicycle road tyres.

Ghost Rider

My FCR3 came with Kenda tyres. I don't know whether they have Kevlar in them or not. Last weekend I did about 320 km on them and got four punctures! One of these was caused by a faulty tube, granted, but the others weren't. (And, before anyone asks, no, there was nothing stuck in the tyres.) I've since replaced the Kendas with Armadilloes.

Tweeter wrote:

I understand what kevlar is, similarly I thought you'd understand what I meant. Kevlar is used in all tyre brands that claim to be puncture proof with the exception of armadillo tyres. Armadillo is a patented formula based on layers of nylon to form the puncture proof layer.

I am reading the road conditions correctly and am perfectly aware when I cross over a surface that will be slippy irrespective of the tyres used.
I figure it must be the brand that I have, which came with the bike a Giant FCR2 with Kenda kevlar tyres. It could be the case that I need to select a brand that has a better thread structure for enhanced grip.

I'm really not sure what to do, I don't want to throw away money by replacing what I have on for no improvement.

Anyone use Kenda kevlar tyres? and have an opinion on them?

ruprect

Tweeter wrote:

I understand what kevlar is, similarly I thought you'd understand what I meant.

Think he was making sure you did, and pointing it out to people who didnt. From reading your first posts it could have been taken up wrong, it was as though the kevlar lining inside the tyre was somehow directly related to how well the outside grips the road.

Tweeter wrote:

Kevlar is used in all tyre brands that claim to be puncture proof with the exception of armadillo tyres.

I have seen some claiming protection without kevlar, and I have seen armadillos described as kevlar too.
http://www.google.com/search?complete=1&hl=en&q=%2Barmadillo+%2Bkevlar

The only real complaint I hear about armadillos is a weak side wall, I have had probs in the past with this, the gatorskins claim

The Duraskin® sidewall reinforcement forms an external protective sheild over the entire casing to prevent cuts, puntures and abrasions. The slick natural rubber tread is designed to perform well in wet/wintery conditions.

After reading reviews I was 50/50 between the gators and armadillos, went with gators in the end since CRC had them.

YOu can also get liners that are reusable

Tweeter

Membrane wrote:

Manufacturers put thread on bicycle road tyres because many prospective buyers don't trust tyres without thread, but it serves no other purpose.

Is this really the case?
I would of course be one of the guilty ones for not trusting a bicycle tyre that didn't have some thread on it. My brain is obviously conditioned this way as I can offer no logic as to why I think this.

Bearing this in mind Membrane, can you recommend a tyre?

Turbulent Bill

Tweeter wrote:

Is this really the case?
I would of course be one of the guilty ones for not trusting a bicycle tyre that didn't have some thread on it. My brain is obviously conditioned this way as I can offer no logic as to why I think this.

See http://sheldonbrown.com/tyres.html.

Tweeter

Turbulent Bill wrote:

See http://sheldonbrown.com/tyres.html.

Good article Turbulent Bill, thanks for that.

Now I'm at a complete loss as to what tyres I should put on, although obviously ones with no thread on them after reading the article.

Anyone with a specific recommendation please share with the rest of us, thanks.

Membrane

Tweeter wrote:

Anyone with a specific recommendation please share with the rest of us, thanks.

The Conti's that I linked to earlier seem to suit your requirements. The puncture protection they offer is probably not quite as good as the Armadillos, but as I mentioned before they are sillica free tyres which should give you the best attainable grip in the wet.

Before considering buying these you should check if your current Kenda tyres have sillica in them, if they don't then the cause of the slippery behaviour you experience lies somewhere else.

Tweeter

Membrane wrote:

The Conti's that I linked to earlier seem to suit your requirements. The puncture protection they offer is probably not quite as good as the Armadillos, but as I mentioned before they are sillica free tyres which should give you the best attainable grip in the wet.

Before considering buying these you should check if your current Kenda tyres have sillica in them, if they don't then the cause of the slippery behaviour you experience lies somewhere else.

Thanks Membrane. I'm taking the bike back to the shop on my way home tonight. Spoke to the guy on the phone and he was able to give me the pros and cons of certain tyres. Judging from what I was telling him on the phone he seemed to be recommending Vettoria tyres. I'll get a full run down on the different types when I get there. I'll let you know what I went for in the morning.

He did say that the Kenda tyres are an ok make, which I was hoping he wouldn't by the way.

blorg

Personal experience, with Armadillos, is that they are indeed fantastic at preventing punctures but I have indeed slipped sideways on a turn in the wet more than once, ending up sliding along the ground on my side.

Most recently was Monday.

Tweeter

blorg wrote:

Personal experience, with Armadillos, is that they are indeed fantastic at preventing punctures but I have indeed slipped sideways on a turn in the wet more than once, ending up sliding along the ground on my side.

Most recently was Monday.

Which comfirms what the guy in Cycleways told me about them.

Went to my local shop last night and after a fair bit of discussion I ended up going for a pair of Vittoria Rubino tyres which would seem to satisfy my needs and they won't break the bank either at 20 euro a tyre. He didn't have my size in stock there and then but they'll be in today so I'll collect them on my way home this evening.

I'll post back here after I've put them through their paces in the wet a few times.

pete4130

I ran an Armadillo on the back of one of my road bike (700x23 or 700x25) for a year over 2 years cycling around the city centre and never got a puncture with the armadillo. I will agree they aren't as grippy as regular tyres due to the harder, thicker compound of rubber involved. I did have one incident where I had to jink or weave slighjtly aggressively and suddenly when a car pulled out and the back end slipped out (not under braking either) but this was on a slightly wet road (wet to the point that all the crud and grease sits on the surface of the water but not wet enough to wash the crid and grease away) and was on the centre white line of the road.
I never found the Armadillo to be substantially less grippy but i did pay more attention to road conditions if it was wet, making sure I didn't go too fast or lean at too steep an agle into corners etc if it was wet or greasey road conditions (as you would with any tire).
another thing to make sure of is that you are running the tire in the right directions, so that the threads are dispersing water away from the tyre. Having the tire the wrong way around could provide less grip in the wet.

I've run those vittoria Rubino tyres as well, and although not as puncture resistant as the armadillo's they are quite grippy. also remember, that when cycling in the rain, your tyres are more prone to being punctures as rubber becomes softer afaik (correct me if I'm wrong please).

blorg

I have a Vittoria Rubino on the front (700x28) which has done over 9,000km without problems.

However I used to have the same tyre on the back and got suffered around three/four punctures over the first 750km which led me to swap it back for a Specialized Armadillo. The last puncture was a blowout that destroyed the tyre, so maybe I was just unlucky with this particular tyre or doing something wrong.

Civilian_Target

Tweeter wrote:

Which comfirms what the guy in Cycleways told me about them.

No, answering my question would be confirming what the guy in Cycleways told you :rolleyes:

Tweeter

Civilian_Target wrote:

No, answering my question would be confirming what the guy in Cycleways told you :rolleyes:

????

Put the Rubinos on the bike last night. Obviously got to try them in the pissing rain this morning and they were certainly noticably better than the Kendas that were previously on there. Very early days of course, but very encouraging start none the less

Civilian_Target

Well, we know hard tyres underperform in the rain, but there's no necessity for puncture-proof tyres to be hard (although they may be!) so why should they have **** performance in the rain?

Tweeter

Resurrecting this thread to give an update on the Rubinos.

I've now put 500km up on them and so far no punctures and no slipping in the wet, I'd definitely recommend them if any of you are having problems with grip in wet conditions.

ruprect

Membrane wrote:

The Conti's that I linked to earlier seem to suit your requirements. The puncture protection they offer is probably not quite as good as the Armadillos, but as I mentioned before they are sillica free tyres which should give you the best attainable grip in the wet.

I have had a conti gatorskin on the back for a month now, had 1 puncture, but it was a savage razor sharp bit of glass that went directly into it, dont think metal would have stopped it!

They are fine in the wet though I am fairly careful, on take off I do use a lot of power and they have never slipped once. I want an armadillo when my front wears out, just to compare them, but I was not put off by that puncture, on the contrary I am very impresses with the lack of glass sticking in them, and lack of cuts. I have a standard conti on the front, and it is cut to ribbons, it is fairly old, but I notice lots of new cuts recently.

kenmc

Tweeter wrote:

I figure it must be the brand that I have, which came with the bike a Giant FCR2 with Kenda kevlar tyres. It could be the case that I need to select a brand that has a better thread structure for enhanced grip.

Well I have an FCR2 also, and I don't think they have kevlar tyres. If they do I wasn't aware of it. I have never come off yet though, even in the rain.
I know this doesn't help much, but I just felt like adding something tbh
I'll look and see if they're kevlar when i'm heading home from work.

Titiritero

ruprect wrote:

The only real complaint I hear about armadillos is a weak side wall, I have had probs in the past with this

Totally agree with that comment. I´m on my second set of tyres, and although quite happy with the anti-puncture performance (except when my girlfriend takes the bike, she´s a real destroyer! ), I´m quite dissapointed with the side walls. They always end up cracking too early, even taking good care about tyre pressure.

I´ve bought recently in CRC a Michelin Transworld City which claims to be puncture-proof. Too early yet to get conclusions, so far it´s looking good, and I paid only 12 EUR instead of the usual 24 for the Armadillo...

Civilian_Target

I'd rather spend that extra 12 to not get a puncture on the road Because when it happens its sooo tedious!

philstar

its the tubes that are puncture proof......not the tyres yes??

kenmc

philstar wrote:

its the tubes that are puncture proof......not the tyres yes??

Nope its the tyres.
you can get solid rubber bands to use as tubes, but doesn't sound very useable to me.

rubadub

philstar wrote:

its the tubes that are puncture proof......not the tyres yes??

People are discussing tyres here, so the tyre has a layer inside that stops the glass etc being able to break through so it never touches the tube at all.

You can also get a tyre liner, goes between the tyre and tube, these are strong, and reusable, so you can get cheaper tyres and use it over and over, some get brittle over time, and are hard to fit.

There are puncture proof tube too though slime ones, that heal themselves, I think it is only for MTBs though, as they cannot go to high pressures.

I'd rather spend that extra 12 to not get a puncture on the road Because when it happens its sooo tedious!

Yeah if you got a puncture and some lad stopped beside you and said "I can fix that in 5 seconds pumped and all, for €12" I would pay him...

Civilian_Target

rubadub wrote:

Yeah if you got a puncture and some lad stopped beside you and said "I can fix that in 5 seconds pumped and all, for €12" I would pay him...

I mean, ****it, if the AA offered a cyclists membership for €12 a year, I'd probably take it too!

philstar

how about innova??......are they a good tyre??

Civilian_Target

Who? They could be, try them out and let us know

dohouch

Don't know nothing, but it's different--- http://www.greentyre.co.uk/

philstar

have any of you tried those puncture-proof sprays, for spraying on your tyres to make them puncture proof.

are they a gimmick??

ruprect

ruprect wrote:

I have had a conti gatorskin on the back for a month now, had 1 puncture, but it was a savage razor sharp bit of glass that went directly into it, dont think metal would have stopped it!

They are fine in the wet though I am fairly careful, on take off I do use a lot of power and they have never slipped once. I want an armadillo when my front wears out, just to compare them, but I was not put off by that puncture, on the contrary I am very impresses with the lack of glass sticking in them, and lack of cuts. I have a standard conti on the front, and it is cut to ribbons, it is fairly old, but I notice lots of new cuts recently.

AHHH second puncture on the gatorskins today, havent seen what got through yet, didnt go through any obvious bad patches of glass.

have any of you tried those puncture-proof sprays, for spraying on your tyres to make them puncture proof.

Is that a spray on the tube or inside? I think some have that slime on the inside of the tube, but again it is only suited to low pressure AFAIK