Depression theme c & c

thebaz

As i posted in another forum , i use photography as a tool when fealing down/low.
The weather's been getting a lot of people down lately, and i'm going through some relationship difficulties , so
these photographs follow a theme of depression/ low / the blues







Cheers to a better day tomorrow

Oriel

I'm trying to learn the lesson that if you have nothing good to say, then say then nothing.
But I'm not learning it well.
Give a thousand monkeys thousand cameras....

RCNPhotos

Second is best to me but overall not really getting any kind of "dression" off of them, not really feeling it to be honest

soccerc

RCNPhotos wrote:

Second is best to me but overall not really getting any kind of "dression" off of them, not really feeling it to be honest

I can see the "depression" but I suspect its oly visible to those who may have been through it.

None of them "do it" for me personally.

minikin

hi thebaz,

I can see where you're going with these, but you need to think about communicating what you're feeling in a more obvious manner... the images obviously are heavily coded with significance for you - the first one being the most obvious. But if these are for public consumption then you have to help people visually understand the message. You need to play more with colour and contrast to depict possibly extreme emotions, you need to show possible actions by depicting movement.

Having said all that be careful not to reinforce the depression with images that remind you of it! b.t.d.t.

Cabaal

I don't get a feeling of depression, more a sense of being far awar or lonely perhaps, thats just barely to be honest

They need to be stronger

Benster

Oriel wrote:

I'm trying to learn the lesson that if you have nothing good to say, then say then nothing.

Is that an evolution of the old Norn Iron phrase "Whatever ye say, say nathin' "?

@ baz - have to agree with other posters, although the subject matter is depressingly mundane, I don't think it comes across as expressing a feeling of depression, not to me anyway. Maybe what you're looking for is a photographic version of "The Scream"?

B.

Rojo

If you hadn't said these were taken under the theme of depression, I don't think any of us would've guessed..

thebaz

Oriel wrote:

I'm trying to learn the lesson that if you have nothing good to say, then say then nothing.
But I'm not learning it well.
Give a thousand monkeys thousand cameras....

are you insinuating a monkey could take them ?

Oriel

thebaz wrote:

are you insinuating a monkey could take them ?

Well, no - I was just trying to say that they're a little...bland.

thebaz

Oriel wrote:

Well, no - I was just trying to say that they're a little...bland.

Fair eneogh , maybe you should have said that first of, sometimes i find some of the unoriginal glossed up band shots , bland and uninspiring , but i'm carefull how i word it , without monkey referneces .
FYI i don't really like no. 3 now, but i still like 1 and 2 .

Morlar

I am almost never fully negative about shots posted for c & c but even after looking hard I cant find a single good thing to say about any of them other than they are in focus. Not trying to sound like a smartarse but Looking at those pictures for long enough is mildly depressing. Perhaps due to the inaccessibility of the pictures you could expand on what you are trying to convey with a few words on each one - what they mean to you and why and what you expect the viewer to take from them ?

minikin

Not all photographs have to be bright, colourful and in your face!
The subject matter calls for a muted, bland, emotionally disconnected image. There's room for improvement in the images but that doesn't make them crap.

Eirebear

Arent we all in Fine fettle today!

Ok no1 and 3 dont actually do anything for me, but the middle one certainly does give off a sense of lonliness and distance.
And if your trying to portray depression then surely lonliness is one aspect of that?

Morlar

minikin wrote:

The subject matter calls for a muted, bland, emotionally disconnected image.

This will sound pedantic but no it doesnt. The subject matter calls for the photographer to make choices on how to approach it. One approach/set of choices would be aim for a (as you said ) 'muted, bland, emotionally disconnected image.' Thats just one (fairly predictable) approach to a subject matter we are told is 'depression'.

If you had been told the subject matter for the first 2 was 21st century rail infrastructure could you tell the difference ? You shouldnt have to be told what a photograph is about - it should stand reasonably well on its own, perhaps a description/theme can put the viewer on the right track (pardon the pun) but it shouldnt be so obscure as to be a requirement.

I never thought that all pictures have to be bright colourful and in your face (most of mine arent). Ironically in this case however that might have been a more interesting /engaging way to convey the subject matter.

What I find depressing about those is the lack of effort that went into them, if you told me that each picture took one single second to take from the point of the photographer opening his bag taking out his camera pressing the button and putting the camera back in his bag I would not be surprised. To me there was no forethought in those pictures in terms of composition, selecting aperture or shutter speed or anything also in terms of processing.

minikin

Can't agree with you on this morlar, in order to communicate an emotion effectively a photograph should evoke the same feelings in the viewer.
You say you felt depressed about the photographs... looks like he achieved his aim

Morlar

minikin wrote:

You say you felt depressed about the photographs... looks like he achieved his aim

No I didnt. I said that they were so badly taken as to be depressing - thats not the same thing as saying that the photographer successfully conveyed the subject matter of depression. If the subject matter was 'maltesers' I would still find them so badly taken as to be mildly depressing. There is a difference there.

minikin

how do you know that you didn't feel depressed because of the intended mood of the images and then, because you were in a negative frame of mind, started bashing the less than perfect technique...

perhaps bad technique was his chosen technique...

I have to say the first 2 definitely fit into the theme of depression.The colours are very bland and monotonous and the subjects represent being lost and lonely in a lively city full of people.Sorry but I don't think the 3rd one fits this theme as well as the other 2 though.Even though there is a lack of life in the photo I still don't get a feeling of loneliness and depression.

Morlar

minikin wrote:

how do you know that you didn't feel depressed because of the intended mood of the images and then, because you were in a negative frame of mind, started bashing the less than perfect technique...

Because I am not that stupid or easily swayed thank you very much! Actually I never said I felt depressed.

I said looking at those pictures long enough was mildly depressing. I was not in a negative frame of mind either. Also I dont bash peoples less than perfect technique - my own is very very very far from perfect.

minikin wrote:

perhaps bad technique was his chosen technique...

Who is slagging less than perfect technique now ? That would be hella convenient I think but still a possibility.

minikin

do you want to leave it there morlar, no point in turning this into a juvenile "you think / I think argument", I'm just trying to be constructive and supportive... given the nature of the thread... is all.

My view on them...
1st pic: composition is a bit unresolved, overexposed.
2nd pic: interesting because of the lone figure in red, sense of isolation.
3rd pic: i see this as being a long lonely journey ahead (what path to take?)

maybe they can only be appreciated by people who've been in a similar situation.

City-Exile

I'm not someone, thankfully, who suffers from depression.
I would, however, describe defeat in an important football game as depressing.
I remember growing up in the 80's, when everyone was talking about the country being in depression. High rates of unemployment, civil unrest the rise in heroin abuse.
My point is, depression means a lot of different things to a lot of people. It's very difficult to capture it in such a way that it will be recognised by everyone.

thebaz

Morlar wrote:

I am almost never fully negative about shots posted for c & c but even after looking hard I cant find a single good thing to say about any of them other than they are in focus. Not trying to sound like a smartarse but Looking at those pictures for long enough is mildly depressing. Perhaps due to the inaccessibility of the pictures you could expand on what you are trying to convey with a few words on each one - what they mean to you and why and what you expect the viewer to take from them ?

sorry that these images made you depressed .For what its worth the 3rd is a path leading up to a pyschiatric hospital in Dublin, but i don't feal i need to spell out what the images mean.
they are personal, and my outlook on the world , which thankfully not everyone sees.

Oriel

thebaz wrote:

Fair eneogh , maybe you should have said that first of, sometimes i find some of the unoriginal glossed up band shots , bland and uninspiring , but i'm carefull how i word it , without monkey referneces .

Sorry, what band shots now?

thebaz

Oriel wrote:

Sorry, what band shots now?

you and Morlar don't like them fair eneough ---
and i don't like everthing thats posted up here --

Keane and Coldplay are fine competent musicians , but there music has no soul , to me .
I like punk and simple old style rock, but because its easy to play does that make it bad music ?

i expect and want criticism on a public forum, not nastiness

Oriel

thebaz wrote:

you and Morlar don't like them fair eneough ---
and i don't like everthing thats posted up here --

Keane and Coldplay are fine competent musicians , but there music has no soul , to me .
I like punk and simple old style rock, but because its easy to play does that make it bad music ?

i expect and want criticism on a public forum, not nastiness

What are you talking about?
You posted looking C&C, I happened to say, upon pressing, that I thought they were bland.
I'm sorry if you feel that is "nasty".

Oriel

I mean - photo three - what exactly is supposed to be depressing about it?
Do you have an emotional attachment to the place?

Oriel

Oriel wrote:

I'm trying to learn the lesson that if you have nothing good to say, then say then nothing.
But I'm not learning it well.
Give a thousand monkeys thousand cameras....

That's hardly constructive,it's just criticism but none the less ye should just drop this petty argument,it's helping no one....

Sebzy

There is a fifth dimension beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call the Boards Zone.

Oh like the shots Baz but could be stronger.

thebaz

Oriel wrote:

What are you talking about?
You posted looking C&C, I happened to say, upon pressing, that I thought they were bland.
I'm sorry if you feel that is "nasty".

your never wrong are you ?

and i do want criticism positive and negative , but there always seams to be something biting and nasty about your criticism , and i feal people are scared to give you give you proper feedback , for fear of reprisal.
As i've said in the past you are a decent photographer , but your not as perfect as your ego tells you.

Oriel

Barry, I'm not looking for a fight. This is the last I'm going to say in this thread.

digitalbeginner

Oriel wrote:

You posted looking C&C, I happened to say, upon pressing, that I thought they were bland.
I'm sorry if you feel that is "nasty".

thebaz wrote:

your never wrong are you ?
and i do want criticism positive and negative , but there always seams to be something biting and nasty about your criticism , and i feal people are scared to give you give you proper feedback , for fear of reprisal.
As i've said in the past you are a decent photographer , but your not as perfect as your ego tells you.

Does "C&C" mean "Comment and Criticise" or "Comment and Critique"? Perhaps that's where the confusion lies,

Dave

sineadw

Hey Baz, I like the second shot. I would maybe have cropped some of the left of the shot out to make the lone figure less central. To me anyway this might have make him/her seem more isolated? And the 'grift' graffiti and light (??) below are a little distracting. I'd also see what its like with a little more contrast.

I think the cars in the last one are taking away from the atmosphere. I didn't know the place, it makes sense to you knowing what the building is but to a casual viewer its not doing much. Maybe it'd be worth while going back and framing it more closely, and maybe from a lower angle.

Hope you're feeling better soon.

digitalbeginner

sineadw wrote:

Hey Baz, I like the second shot. I would maybe have cropped some of the left of the shot out to make the lone figure less central. To me anyway this might have make him/her seem more isolated? And the 'grift' graffiti and light (??) below are a little distracting. I'd also see what its like with a little more contrast.

I think the cars in the last one are taking away from the atmosphere. I didn't know the place, it makes sense to you knowing what the building is but to a casual viewer its not doing much. Maybe it'd be worth while going back and framing it more closely, and maybe from a lower angle.

Hope you're feeling better soon.

Ditto

Valentia

sineadw wrote:

Hey Baz, I like the second shot. I would maybe have cropped some of the left of the shot out to make the lone figure less central. To me anyway this might have make him/her seem more isolated? And the 'grift' graffiti and light (??) below are a little distracting. I'd also see what its like with a little more contrast.

I think the cars in the last one are taking away from the atmosphere. I didn't know the place, it makes sense to you knowing what the building is but to a casual viewer its not doing much. Maybe it'd be worth while going back and framing it more closely, and maybe from a lower angle.

Hope you're feeling better soon.

Ditto too.

Valentia

Oriel wrote:

What are you talking about?
You posted looking C&C, I happened to say, upon pressing, that I thought they were bland.
I'm sorry if you feel that is "nasty".

But you didn't say that, did you? You mentioned monkeys FFS. Social interaction classes? Hmm. Not sure that they would work TBH. The sad thing is you haven't bothered your arse to look at the rest of Barry's photos, have you? They really capture Dublin as it is, which, I think, is a very worthwhile achievement!

City-Exile

Valentia wrote:

They really capture Dublin as it is, which, I think, is a very worthwhile achievement!

Yeah, when our cities change so much, so quickly, it's important to capture their essence. His pictures will have a greater artistic value & relevance, with the passing of time.

Fajitas!

Well, it's great that you can use your photography to keep away the blues.

I like the first one myself. It'd work out really great with some work to bring out the blown out highlights.

I feel the last has a lot of potential, but a different viewpoint (I would have gotten down on the grass) would have really brought into play the lines in the picture.

I'm not gone on the second one. It looks like a beach scene that's been captured wrong...or something. I really want to see what the slope on the right hand side leads down to, as opposed to the ugly DART station, which could be exactly what you were going for, I don't know?

Hope you're feeling better soon too

440Hz

I think it's great, like everyone else has said that you can use photography like this. I do the same with my music, and I get some of my best results when I'm very sad or very happy because so much of myself and how I'm feeling goes into it. Having said that, and I think the same probably applies to photography for you, if I'm feeling down for example, and I try to translate that into something musical, a good result instantly lifts me, as I imagine a good photo will do for you. The thing I really admire here is that it is more difficult for you to "inject" emotion into a photography, because you have the intermediate factor of mastering the camera. Perhaps that is just a personal thing however, maybe its just because I find music more emotive than imagery. Maybe if I was as passionate about my photography as I am about my music it might come easier to me to try and achieve some emotional content. I think that is something that is very very difficult to do, well it is certainly difficult to create an image which evokes the desired feelings in others. But you are at the first, and most important step, where the photos and the process of taking them influences your own feelings, and personally I think that is the most important part.

ramble over!

Zillah

I don't know what you're all whining about, I really got it. I think they're excellently chosen, the three carry a different sense of depression, each a little different than the last. The first one I think is the weakest but the other two are pretty cool.

440Hz

Hey we're not ALL whining!! Some of us really enjoyed em

thebaz

thanks again for feedback, i feal a bit better today, altough my relationship situation problem/ situation hasn't changed -- thats lifes ups and downs , and some of us hit those highs and lows more than others . if everything was always good, we wouldn't appreciate good.
On thursday i was fealing pretty down , and didn't want to shoot anything , and had to push myself to take what i did , whilst i've gone off number 3 , that lonely path to St. John of Gods , still looks harrowing to me , or anyone else or family members who have walked it.
No 1 kind of harrows me , as a freind of mine died by a train years ago.
No2 , has that sleepy dull feal to me , like the current weather.
Like music i don't expect everyone to like them or get them, but i guess better to get some reaction than no reaction, and sometimes for personal stuff , no one sees it but the person.
I used to hate bob dylan, now that i'm older i get what he was rambling on about, years ago i liked early U2 , nowadys they do nothing for me -- tastes change.
again thanks for your support.

p.s. i'm working on completing my smugmug website , which will mainly be Dublin stuff , feedback welcome, as i want to chill out on the volume of stuff i have being putting up here for c &c
http://thebaz.smugmug.com/

i'll still be putting most of my stuff on
http://www.flickr.com/photos/thebaz/

Thanks,
B.

Shiny

Baz could you make the high res versions of these photos available?
(or if anyone knows that way of getting the hidden link to highres versions)

Then,

Why doesn't everybody have a go at post processing the photos
to introduce more atmosphere and then quickly explain their
technique....then everyone learns something ?

thebaz

Shane -- i'd prefer leave those photos rest , bad memories , if you get me .

Anyway just to proove my mood has changed , like the summer weather out in Bray today, whilst these are not masterpieces , they hopefully highlight that moods swing like the weather , taken with my new panasonic , which i'm using less and less, but is so handy size wise

leinsterman

Hi Baz ...

I think you are a brave man to take on a subject of this nature ... it is not all that easy to do ...

For the first one I think it could have been improved by slowing the shutter right down to make the train appear to be moving much faster ... it looks a little static, not enough motion blur ... this can be a challenge in daylight so shooting a twilight would be better or use an ND filter ...

The Second is good composition though as someone else points out if you maybe crop to just before the end of the steps to bring the figure less central while at the same time going less square ... it is a little bit on the flat side colours wise ... which maybe something you are doing deliberately ... but not flat enough to look expressive ... a couple of things to try - maybe a bleach bypass (you can tell I've been experimenting with this a lot lately) or perhaps isolate the figure a lot more by going B&W and leaving the figure in red ...

The last one I have to admit does not really do much for me ... maybe as Al said you could opt for a lower angle ... at the same time try a wider lens ... to exhaggerate the length of the path ... Id also maybe consider making the path a little less central ...

I hope this is helpful ... I'm no photo genius myself ... but that's my two cents ...

Looks like you are going through some bad times ... Hang in there mate ... we all go through 'em ... I think it is a good idea to use the camera to bring these feelings out ... making a project of it at the same time

Maybe look for inspiration and ideas from other works ... I can recommend works like "The cry" by Munch ... or Dorethea Langes Migrant Mother (and some of the other FSA photographers) ... or closer to home maybe Paul Seawright.


Some Links for you -
http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/munch/munch.scream.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorothea_Lange
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farm_Security_Administration
http://www.paulseawright.com/archive.html

thebaz

thanks Simon --

saw this pretty sad image today , which makes me gratefull for what i have

440Hz

thebaz wrote:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/thebaz/821569657/

very sad

That is sad, and lonely. Life can be very tough indeed. Hope you are feeling better, I know how draining times like this can be. Thing is to try and remember, things could always be worse, and I know thats very cliche but its true really - put it this way, im on my way to my second funeral in 7 days on Tues

Life is rarely easy, we just gotta keeping on trucking and make the most of it. Chin up!

Hugh_C

thebaz wrote:

saw this pretty sad image today

He looks pretty content to me, happy even.

I would suggest a little more anonymity in your photos of junkies and drunks though, somebody somewhere might be pissed off to see their loved ones portrayed in such a way.

thebaz

hughchal wrote:

He looks pretty content to me, happy even.

I would suggest a little more anonymity in your photos of junkies and drunks though, somebody somewhere might be pissed off to see their loved ones portrayed in such a way.

point taken , removed link , not meant to offend , just capturing what i see -- but i see where your coming from -- apologies .

MooseJam

excuse the ignorance but what does c & c stand for

Oriel

MooseJam wrote:

excuse the ignorance but what does c & c stand for

Comment and critique