Reliability.

layke

Read em and weep boys

http://home.eircom.net/content/unison/national/10691758?view=Eircomnet&cat=National

Saw this in the indo yesterday and finally found the story on Eircom's webby.

Looks like although Hondas are No 1 in reliability, yet Irish people don't buy them.

However Irish drivers purchased over 1,100 of these worst-performing makes, compared with just 70 new Daihatsu cars in May, CSO figures show.

Why? Why do people go for cheapness over quality? It always costs more in the long run.

maidhc

layke wrote:

Why? Why do people go for cheapness over quality? It always costs more in the long run.

Because you can buy a Ford or Toyota which for all intents and purposes are just as reliable, but cheaper to buy, cheaper to repair, and cheaper to run (2.2 Diesel Civic v. 1.4 Diesel Auris...anyone).

And there is also the small factor that reliability is just one element of choosing a car.

layke

Toyota's are up there in reliability too so it's not a great comparison.
Also comparing the higher end 2.2L model to a 1.4L is just silly. Sure some people like to drive cars that are painfully slow. Perhaps we can compare a 2.2L Petrol Civic to a 1L micra next? What i'm saying is these two cars are not in the same market. Personally speaking I wouldn't drive a non-turbo diesel below a 1.9L. Also i'd like to point out that although diesel engine sales are on the way up they are still no where near as popular as the petrol engine. In fairness, Honda do not make a small engine diesel cars (and rightly so imo) but that pales in comparison to overall car sales for the entire market anyway.

Now I can see the point your trying to bring across but surely if the car is more prone to break down then it's going to cost more. Also if your driving within the speed limit your going to use less fuel with a Honda then say a Ford as it's all high end power, so that adds to the cheaper cost of running over time. Finally, out of the majority of cars which holds it's value better? Ford, Dhiatsu, Suzuki? I think you'll find honda is the winner once again.

bazz26

Some of the reasons behind are that Honda have very little interest in the small Irish market. Take the Civic for example, only available in either 1.4, 1.3 (hybrid) or 1.8 petrol. Nothing in between or no diesel option. Other brands generally appreciate that they have to adapt to the market conditions they are competing in and generally offer what buyers want.

Maybe this is a deliberate market strategy by Honda to sustain resale values but I'm sure if Honda offered the same flexible range of cars as other main stream makers here they would probably sell as many.

BrianD3

The current Civic was rated joint worst in class in that survey.

bazz26

layke wrote:

Toyota's are up there in reliability too so it's not a great comparison.
Also comparing the higher end 2.2L model to a 1.4L is just silly. Sure some people like to drive cars that are painfully slow. Perhaps we can compare a 2.2L Petrol Civic to a 1L micra next? What i'm saying is these two cars are not in the same market. Personally speaking I wouldn't drive a non-turbo diesel below a 1.9L. Also i'd like to point out that although diesel engine sales are on the way up they are still no where near as popular as the petrol engine. In fairness, Honda do not make a small engine diesel cars (and rightly so imo) but that pales in comparison to overall car sales for the entire market anyway.

The 1.4 D4-D Auris has 90bhp compared to the 1.9 TDi VAG with 100bhp, while the Auris will not set the world on fire, it is quite capable of cruising at motorway speed while still giving around 950/1000km to a tank of diesel. Ford, PSA, Fiat, Opel, Renault all offer smaller capacity diesel engines these days along with their standard higher capacity diesels. The point is though that they offer you a choice, Honda don't seem to be bothered.

prospect

The survey was more of an ownership survey.

Also, not everyone, me included, has reliability top of their list of requirements.

Also, the new Civic (probably Hondas best seller) actually performed quite poorly on that survey.


Always take those surveys with a large helping of salt.

Stephen

Honda don't sell the 2.2 diesel Civic here at all, unfortunately -- probably due to our good old friends VRT and cc-based motor tax that make big engines in relatively small cars very hard to sell here.
Mine is a 1.8 vtec petrol. The only other engine they offer in Ireland (on a non-type-r) is a weak-but-economical 1.4 DSI petrol. The fuel cap/rear suspension problems were wideley reported when the first of the new Civics came out but its over a year later now and all those issues have been sorted with recalls for the cars already out there and in the factory for new ones.

/lusts after a type-r

edit: I just remembered that they offer the saloon model with a hybrid powertrain too.

Henry Ford III

Is it just me or do Honda Civic hatchbacks have a bad rep. for having racer/skanger owners? May explain a few things if so.

JHMEG

Honda have no particular interest in the Irish market. They didn't even sell here before 1985.

As with any completely new car, not a facelift or a revision, teething problems are to be expected. Honda are usually fairly good tho at dealing with issues (work done for free thru recalls and TSBs).

Owen

Henry Ford III wrote:

Is it just me or do Honda Civic hatchbacks have a bad rep. for having racer/skanger owners? May explain a few things if so.

I'd link the new Civic with the OAP market. Having said that, I've driven the Type R, and had to change underpants afterwards. Great car.

RobAMerc

layke wrote:

Why? Why do people go for cheapness over quality? It always costs more in the long run.

Why do people buy cars because they are reliable rather than they like them ?
It gets me every time !

Henry Ford III

ned78 wrote:

I'd link the new Civic with the OAP market. Having said that, I've driven the Type R, and had to change underpants afterwards. Great car.

The Accord is strongly perceived to be a favourite of the blue rinse brigade in the UK.

p.s. Stronger sphincter control req'd for you ned!

Captain Slow IRL

People go for cheapness over quality because they want the 07 reg parked on the driveway.

I've only seen one new civic in for warranty work on the suspension; the only other recalls have been related to the fuel cap sticking. IMO, the 1.3 (it's not a 1.4!) is a nippy little car - how fast can you go on Irish roads these days anyway?!

Edit - the civic is marketed as a 1.4 - 1343cc is a 1.3, before anyone starts disagreeing!