Possible new site's, be careful what you ask for

nonex

as a business, you need to make money to pay the rent and staff.
and to make it pay for it's self you need 30+ players every weekend.
now let's say more site's open, at the momont the numbers are not there, so the site's will close.
so we need a lot more airsoft numbers to get better site's to open and more of them, if not the site's will close because of the numer of palyers at the momunt, so it's numbers we need to get for site's,
because if site's close from lack of business, it will be harder to get new site's to do business with airsofters, for they will have looked at the markit and say no.
just something to think about, i think.

and yes i now i cant spell to good

ED E

AS i said on the "Regulation" thread, before we go any further we need to recruit more to sport.

Puding

catch 22, need sites to get more people

ED E

Well, first more people, then barrage, thenlike 50 more people, then a site in the west/south...and so on and so forth.

CrazyRabbit

If other sites do open, don't be expecting the same great prices that you get at HRTA. And no, Nonex didn't pay/ask me to say that...it's just the truth

EDIT: What the hell us up with boards.ie? I keep getting 'Page cannot be displayed'. Took 4 attempts to make this post.

gandalf

As said above its catch 22, if there aren't enough sites then people won't get involved or lose interest quite rapidally due to lack of facilities and then sites may hit the wall as nonex said.

The prices at HRTA are good but if lets say the guys in Barrage carry their plans out I would be willing to pay more to use their facilities as well.

To be honest I would be spreading my love so to speak if there were a few sites out there.

HawkerHunter

Nonex is dead right in what he said in relation to the economics of the sites for airsoft. Unfortunatly what airsofters will be stuck with are the days or times when paintball sessions are not being played as there is no way that you could use a mesh mask if paintballs where firing around. Also the reason why the paintball sites have said NO is because of the price of the the ammo as it is cheap and there would not be much of a mark up on this. Some paintball sites have collosal overheads, rent, lease, startup capital repayments, insurance,investments, upkeeps, staff and of course 41% goes to the tax man at the end of the day. No insurance company wil insure airsoft in Ireland at the moment but I am working on it and I will keep you all posted.

Thanks guys

hawkerhunter
ruairi@barrage.ie

HawkerHunter

Thanks to all you guys that came up to Barrage on the weekend. I will be posting an email from my Insurer to let you guys know what is required from you all to push a policy through. Again thanks for coming up and we will endevour to get this up and running ASAP. My personnal email is ruairi@barrage.ie if any wish to contact me.

Thanks again

Hawkerhunter

nonex

it's to easy to say catch 22, try saying that to a bank when you are looking for the loan to fund it, and saying on your business plan, it's catch 22 if i build it they will come in geat numbers, i dont think it would win any business man to invest, or bank in your airsoft site.
and not evey body has lot's of money to pay more, for some site's
and site's dont make airsoft good, it's the airsoft player's that make an airsoft site good, and alway's rember that.
it's the player's that make the game and not the site's.

nonex

Hawkerhunter bet me to that.

ambro25

hawkerhunter - thx for the feedback and all.

Now, I don't how often you've posted on interweb forums, but a quick word of friendly advice: I'd remove that email from your earlier post super-presto, or at least change the '@' in there with '.at.', if you don't want to be inundated with spam (web "bots" will locate and copy it from the page, then you'll get thousands of offers daily for company shares, appendage enlargement and drugs, and many other fanciful items, from complete computer-generated strangers )

To remove the email/edit your post, just log in then press 'Edit' at the bottom of the message in question

nonex - only my €0,02 and don't mind me for it, but if you want to up the turnover, might be an idea to float the idea of Friday night 'nightlies' (6-9 pm -ish). Don't know about others here, but I'd be able to attend them a lot more often (meaning: on much more regular basis) than Sats or Suns - and I can't imagine that I'd be alone with this.

Fallschirmjager

well i truly understand what the sites are saying but there is one small issue i could raise. but first a right good ole rant...

firstly i dont think choice is a bad thing. it might be for the owners but its not for a consumer. i say good luck to ye in earning a buck, i dont begrudge it to you, but hawkerhunter you are not the only one risking money. we all are here. it hopefully wont last long, but for the moment we are all in this together. yourself and nonex are risking large amounts of money on a venture, we are risking considerable amounts (well its considerable to me) on kit to play a game that might be a niche sport with no sites. now i know you are risking more, and i truly wish you the best on your venture, personally i think its a sure fire bet-- the big question we all want to answer is -- when? i think the one thing this shows is the need for a standard. i have not been to hrta or barrage but judging by the response here, ye are both on a winner as ye are committed to this professionally. what i would be concerned with is the quick buck sites that no doubt will appear, no rules, no safety, no clue. it is not in your interest as a supplier or our interest as a consumer to want to see this. it will, if you excuse the metaphor, blow up in our collective faces. i dont know if ye are involved with the IAA (and i am not currently so i am not speaking for them) but perhaps it might be an idea to be part of that as a supplier side to ensure that the same quality can be expected everywhere, a kinda airsoft 9001 site quality mark, if you will. ye have a huge opportunity here to set a standard for airsoft in ireland. jeeze we could lead europe on this if the will is there. personally i think we are on the edge of something that can be run in a crappy old style irish fashion, or we can all run it like a 21 century ireland. personally im for the latter. you have a huge opportunity here to focus a part of the IAA on site side development (assuming they agree of course). i cannot speak for the group, but i am sure o1s1n can pitch in here. perhaps ye should look at a quality issue to ensure a level playing field, hell even get to the critical mass for importing and selling aegs. maybe ye could recommend people join the IAA and explain to new joiners what it is doing, what ye as part of it are doing. the world of airsoft in ireland is your oyster....also as i have moaned again and again, the jobs front (aka ye) is the one tool we have to ensure some minister doesnt kick airsoft to touch for a few votes...the more sites, the more power we wield as a group and indeed the more powerful the suppliers are to dictate for grants, support etc...

so the big rant is nearly over...

also, here is my real point, not everyone lives in dublin..hard to believe i know, but some of us live out in the wilder parts of ireland and eat our young... so therefore i think more is more...and therefore not a bad thing....assuming i can be assured its up to scratch for safety, legality etc. i would like nothing more then a sign to ensure that it meets your specs...good for me , good for you, good for airsoft...how can we loose?

Jelly 292

nonex - only my €0,02 and don't mind me for it, but if you want to up the turnover, might be an idea to float the idea of Friday night 'nightlies' (6-9 pm -ish). Don't know about others here, but I'd be able to attend them a lot more often (meaning: on much more regular basis) than Sats or Suns - and I can't imagine that I'd be alone with this.

I'd go with that to, it is a heck of a lot easier for me to jump up for a few hours on a Friday evening than full Sat/Sun.
Always seem to have something I cant get out of at weekends latley
Where as Friday nights are usually spent drinking beer and looking at my navel.
But I understand that Nonex cant spend his entire weekend at HRTA on the odd chance a few of us would turn up.

Hivemind187

IMO getting the paintball sites to start letting Airsofters run around their land until more and more preople take up the sport is the way to go.

While its true that our numbers are growing we have no where near enough people right now to support more than a couple of sites.

For operators to make money (or break even) they will need more customers and right now the paintball folks have that. Airsoft needs to grow like a parasitic funghus on the back of paintball because as a group there arent enoughof us to keep things running as it is.

That said, fair play to nonex for having the stones to open up here while things are still so flakey.

Fallschirmjager

Jelly 292 wrote:

I'd go with that to, it is a heck of a lot easier for me to jump up for a few hours on a Friday evening than full Sat/Sun.
Always seem to have something I cant get out of at weekends latley
Where as Friday nights are usually spent drinking beer and looking at my navel.
But I understand that Nonex cant spend his entire weekend at HRTA on the odd chance a few of us would turn up.

hahaha..

nonex...maybe on a night like this is a prepay booking so if someone does wind up doing navel gazing..you still are up on the cash......

Irish Trinity

HawkerHunter: is there any word on an age limit if it goes ahead?

ambro25

I'm thinking more like periodical subscription, gym-style. E.g. € x per month / per number of sessions with/without rentals etc. for the 'regulars'.

The onus would be on nonex whichever way: either go to the trouble of sorting out advance bookings to make sure you don't open up for nought, or just have to be there and open up if the 'subscription' model is used.

The formation of 'teams' (not quite 'pro-sports' but... you get what I mean) would go some way to establish regular attendance as well, for regular training sessions.

But of course, to make this team-building thing worthwhile, there would have to be some form of competition/ladder/whatnot... so IAA involvement. Etc.

It *should* all come together nicely - the question is, can the business startups survive the distance 'til we get there?

Fallschirmjager

ambro25 wrote:

I'm thinking more like periodical subscription, gym-style. E.g. € x per month / per number of sessions with/without rentals etc. for the 'regulars'.

The onus would be on nonex whichever way: either go to the trouble of sorting out advance bookings to make sure you don't open up for nought, or just have to be there and open up if the 'subscription' model is used.

The formation of 'teams' (not quite 'pro-sports' but... you get what I mean) would go some way to establish regular attendance as well, for regular training sessions.

But of course, to make this team-building thing worthwhile, there would have to be some form of competition/ladder/whatnot... so IAA involvement. Etc.

very good idea...the league idea might be a bit early but rather early then late...

Jelly 292

Could have mini tourney's 3v3 at HRTA, that would be something anyway!

I like the idea of pre pay and pre booking also, means I have a leg to stand on with the missus, 'but luv, Ive paid for it already and everything' :rolleyes:

ED E

I was thinking. You know how barrage has the netted speedball area. Could have a singles tournament, say 20 players, winners progress, losers KOed. Would be quick and fun.

ATM wwe only have one team so a tournament isnt possible.

kdouglas

Lethal_Bullet wrote:

ATM wwe only have one team so a tournament isnt possible.

nataibhse, stray dogs, wolf (from drogheda), balbriggan team....

that's 4 teams so far...

N.O.I.P.

Don't forget the teams from NI

The Ghosts (original flavour)
Panzer 13
ExtremeTaz and the funky bunch (They probably do have a team name but until I remember what it is Taz is the new Marky Mark )

I had already given some thought to an IAA run league, multiple teams facing each other across a variety of venues (woodland, indoor, underwater ) Each team faces the others at least twice with points awarded for game wins. After all the teams have played each other. The highest scoring teams enter a knock-out phase with opponents and venues drawn at random. Think of it like Airsoft TopGun and I am definitely gonna be Viper

Hivemind187

N.O.I.P. wrote:

Don't forget the teams from NI

The Ghosts (original flavour)
Panzer 13
ExtremeTaz and the funky bunch (They probably do have a team name but until I remember what it is Taz is the new Marky Mark )

I had already given some thought to an IAA run league, multiple teams facing each other across a variety of venues (woodland, indoor, underwater ) Each team faces the others at least twice with points awarded for game wins. After all the teams have played each other. The highest scoring teams enter a knock-out phase with opponents and venues drawn at random. Think of it like Airsoft TopGun and I am definitely gonna be Viper

I think "washout" is more appropriate :P

N.O.I.P.

Hivemind187 wrote:

I think "washout" is more appropriate :P

I'll remember that goose

tonyj_mc

Speaking of cheesy 80's movies, would Navy Seals not be more appropriate

Hivemind187

N.O.I.P. wrote:

I'll remember that goose

Mental note: Steer Clear of F15 canopy's

tonyj_mc

F-15. ah man its a F-14 Tomcat, sorry loved that film

Hivemind187

tonyj_mc wrote:

F-15. ah man its a F-14 Tomcat, sorry loved that film

I always thought is was an F15 Eagle but then I havent seen the film in years. Thanks for the correction.

N.O.I.P.

tonyj_mc wrote:

Speaking of cheesy 80's movies, would Navy Seals not be more appropriate

Ah cool, get me a fifty and call me God

tonyj_mc

sorry couldn't resist

Hivemind187

tonyj_mc wrote:

Speaking of cheesy 80's movies, would Navy Seals not be more appropriate

With the most suspect line ever uttered in a film?

"If I were any closer I would be inside him"

No way. Never. Uh-uh. Not with NOIP any way.

Irish Trinity

i got Ice Man!

tonyj_mc

forgot about how "close" navy seals where

gandalf

/me dons best Welsh accent

"Broadsword calling Danny Boy, Broadsword calling Danny Boy"

N.O.I.P.

Hmm don't remember that line now I guess I gotta go dig out my copy of Navy Seals

Shiva

That was from Where Eagles Dare....best of all the Alastair MacLean adaptations.

gandalf

Navy Seals pah, Shiva knows his class war films

N.O.I.P.

What? they made a movie out of that kick ass Iron Maiden song?















I'd pay good money to see the look on Gandalfs face right about now

gandalf

LOL!

Well its good to see you got over the trauma of sharing a car with me and Lemming

N.O.I.P.

Oh please!! I've been to the dark side, I used to work for IBM so its gonna take a lot more than you two to traumatise me

CrazyRabbit

N.O.I.P. wrote:

Oh please!! I've been to the dark side, I used to work for IBM so its gonna take a lot more than you two to traumatise me

The only trauma you've seen in IBM was trauma you inflicted on your customers.