Steroids - FM104 now

Kinetic^

Adrian Kennedy phone show is talking about them now.

tribulus

I sense a very intelligent debate coming....

J.S. Pill

Speaking of Steroids, There's a lot of media speculation at the moment that the Chris Benoit murder/suicide may have been linked to Roid Rage. Expect sober and incisive coverage...

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/06/27/wrestler/

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,286834,00.html

t-ha

LOL @ ^^^



It's ridiculous the way 'roid rage' is being mentioned over and over - despite the fact that these deaths & murders seem to have happened over a 2-3 day period. Benoit was pretty fit, but I don't think anyone could sustain 'roid rage' for that long! Added to that is the apparent massive lack of reporting that all of the drugs found in the house were legally owned prescription medicines. Then to top it off, virtually no-one is mentioning that Nancy and Chris were nearly divorced several years back, with Nancy putting a restraining order on him due to repeated aggression & physical intimidation, so he has a suspected history of abuse.

So you've got a guy who passed a drug-test two months ago, has only prescription meds (some of which are AFAIK testosterone based) in his house, and has a suspected history of being abusive towards his wife - commits a horrendous double murder that appears to be a deliberate and possibly pre-meditated move, and then hangs himself. And the steroid rage did it all?!! Come on - the guy was clearly a little unhinged!



Of course there is a flip-side that is definitely worth discussing, that most of the guys on 'steroid-friendly' boards tend to be skipping over in their rush to dismiss everyone as totally ignorant of steroids. There's no doubt that Chris Benoit was using performance enhancing drugs (PEDs) over the course of his career & as many of you know, steroid use isn't just a simple matter of having loads of testosterone for a while. There's all kinds of other things going on once you've disturbed your HPTA, and although most aspects of what goes on can be managed to a great extent AFAIK, it's certaintly not unheard of for a user to experience mood changes, such as some depression after a cycle.

Like I say, AFAIK this can be managed if you know what to do - but can you garauntee that Chris Benoit always cycled perfectly? And given that he seems to have been a slightly unhinged guy anyway (injecting a child with GH? I hope that turns out to be a rumour! ) can you be 100% sure that him messing around with hormones would not contribute to his mental problems deepening?



In any event it doesn't matter - no matter what they determine as the contributing factors in this incident Chris' name will be added to the list of 'deaths due to steroids' that gets brought up every time someone wants to show how lethal they are. Only by then any discussion as to whether or not they were a factor will have been dropped in favour of an easier-to-remember 'steroids did it!'.

Dragan

t-ha wrote:

(injecting a child with GH? I hope that turns out to be a rumour! )

The kid had Fragile X syndrome, and at the moment it is thought that the script drugs were split between the kid and Chris.

t-ha

Dragan wrote:

The kid had Fragile X syndrome, and at the moment it is thought that the script drugs were split between the kid and Chris.

And none of the reporters for the articles I've read bother to find this out!! GODDAMN the media!!! Idiots probably just copy stories off of each other and don't do the reporting themselves anyway...

Dragan

t-ha wrote:

And none of the reporters for the articles I've read bother to find this out!! GODDAMN the media!!! Idiots probably just copy stories off of each other and don't do the reporting themselves anyway...

Yeah i know, it's pathetic. I can find this **** out but they can't?

Maybe i should be a journo..... all i need is to get lazy and eat a few lard sandwiches.

J.S. Pill

t-ha wrote:

In any event it doesn't matter - no matter what they determine as the contributing factors in this incident Chris' name will be added to the list of 'deaths due to steroids' that gets brought up every time someone wants to show how lethal they are.

Ah yes, the good old list! For anyone who hasn't read it here's a short piece on Andreas Munzer

BaZmO*

J.S. Pill wrote:

Ah yes, the good old list! For anyone who hasn't read it here's a short piece on Andreas Munzer

That's a good read. Although it's certainly not "short".

Money Shot

J.S. Pill wrote:

Ah yes, the good old list! For anyone who hasn't read it here's a short piece on Andreas Munzer

I think bodybuilding at that level is incredibly sad. I find giving up your life, and the living of your life, to such fruitless endeavour incredibly sad. They look as bizarre and freakish to me as girls who almost kill themselves in search for a size zero pyhsique. It's the same thing - have to get smaller, have to get bigger. They will never be happy with what they see in the mirror.

I'm pretty sure the 4.7% body fat brigade will be on giving it loads, but I think 'Fitness' is becoming as much of a problem for young people today as eating disorders. I base this on the majority of posts here - almost all the newbies, some very young teenagers, are only interested in what they can do/take to get big, get body fat down to the magical 'single digits, and as quick as possible. "I'm down to 8% - I'd bet I'd look so much better if I was at 5%." "what level to get visible abs?". It's vanity gone mad and it's incredibly dangerous.

I'm all for people improving themselves, getting fit, looking good and being more healthy, but I find the lenghts people go to for pure vanity's sake quite disturbing. Seeing skinny 18 year olds in the gym talking about taking creatine and fat burners like it's a basic building block of looking like that other guy over there benching their combined body weight.

Whatever about the facts of the Benoit tragedy - any story which might prevent one person taking steroids is doing some good. I've seen people who've taken steroids and it does definitely effect their moods and aggression levels significantly. I've witnessed said aggression.

As a parting shot across the boughs, and not without wanting to stir it, - I don't consider bodybuilding a sport, any more than you could consider judging fashion models on how they look on the catwalk, and calling that a sport.
- just my opinion...

Sangre

Money Shot wrote:

I base this on the majority of posts here - almost all the newbies, some very young teenagers, are only interested in what they can do/take to get big, get body fat down to the magical 'single digits, and as quick as possible. "I'm down to 8% - I'd bet I'd look so much better if I was at 5%." "what level to get visible abs?". It's vanity gone mad and it's incredibly dangerous.

Hmm, what board have I been reading? I rarely see posts on single digit bf% and if they are its by those who are already established lifters or athletes not your average teenager.
Anyway, unhealthy advice is usually shot down here pretty quickly.

J.S. Pill

Money Shot wrote:

I think bodybuilding at that level is incredibly sad. I find giving up your life, and the living of your life, to such fruitless endeavour incredibly sad.

The article I posted there was an extract from This Book. If you want to know more about the higher echelons of competitive body building I strongly recommend it. . I was searching through the fitness books in waterstones one day and picked this book up, I read the first few pages and didn't want to put it down so I bought it on the spot. My only criticism is that he didn't really delve that deeply into the whole steroid question, probably for fear of offending some of the people who he interviewed or got information from. Its a fantastic read though even if you've never seen the inside of a gym.

And some of those guys do have lives outside Bodybuilding. Kevin Levrone for instance only really got seriously into his training for 6 months of the year back in the day. The rest of the time was spent touring with his band Fulblown.

Rock on!!:D

ali.c

Money Shot wrote:

I think bodybuilding at that level is incredibly sad. I find giving up your life, and the living of your life, to such fruitless endeavour incredibly sad.

First i am not a body builder in any way shape or form. but i think you are being overly harsh, For example i personally dont see the point of golf, really just dont get, yet i dont judge those who chose it as their sport and i dont downgrade it to not being a sport simply because i dont approve of it. On the note of it being a fruitless endeavour well tbh you could say that at about a lot of sports IMO, just of the top of my head you could agrue that it doesnt really matter if you can run 100m in 9.8 or 9.85 secs its still bloody fast.
I am not in any way saying that bodybuilding is good or bad. I dont think highly of anyone who uses steroids etc, yet i dont judge anyone who considers it a sport.

I am not overly sure why i am replying, but people who body build stick to incredibly strict training and diet plans and IMHO deserve respect for that