Now he's won ... can they stop talking about him ?

v10

Fair play to Lewis Hamilton. I'd be the first to say that but jaysus Itv are really going overboard with the Lewis Hamiltion is the Best in the World Hype and I for one am getting really tired of it. I'd almost consider listening to the terrible commentary on setanta sports now if only it was free.

Look at this :


21 Links .. 13 of which have Lewis/Hamilton in the title.

Are there any free alternatives to ITV for F1 in Ireland ?

How many other countries have a Pay Channel as their main source of F1 viewing I wonder ?

Dcully

Setanta is free with chorus digital.

Hamilton is outstanding already,hes a nice guys but **** them pricks on ITV are headwrecking.

v10

Dcully wrote:

Setanta is free with chorus digital.

I don't have that ... only Sky.

mike65

Whats the problem you're watching a BRITISH tv channel covering a BRITISH winner. Imagine RTE's hyperbole if Hamilton were Irish (I'm sure someone very sad is already looking the lads "Irish connection").

Mike.

v10

mike65 wrote:

Whats the problem you're watching a BRITISH tv channel covering a BRITISH winner.

Yeah I realise that and well thats my problem really .. the only alternative is to pay for 'Irish' coverage. I have nothing against Hamilton, but the coverage is becoming annoying to say the least .. I'm simply looking for an alternative.

Robbo

I think the hubris is warranted so far, the boy's been amazing. Compare what he's achieved so far to the sum total of Plucky Little Jenson's drives. Of course the long term prognosis is a little less rosy because I think that the English media really can't handle a consistent winner of their own, the plucky underdog is the most common archtype of British sportsman.

v10

Robbo wrote:

Compare what he's achieved so far to the sum total of Plucky Little Jenson's drives.

True but Hamilton hasn't had to drive anything but the best car on the grid. Give him a Eco Green Honda Puke Machine and see how well he does.

Again I'm not trying to lessen Hamilton acheivments, simply find an alternative to British coverage (for free like in most countries)

heyjude

v10 wrote:

Fair play to Lewis Hamilton. I'd be the first to say that but jaysus Itv are really going overboard with the Lewis Hamiltion is the Best in the World Hype and I for one am getting really tired of it. I'd almost consider listening to the terrible commentary on setanta sports now if only it was free.

They are a bit OTT at the moment and I'm just waiting for them to make a total mockery of their F1 coverage by comparing him with Ayrton Senna and Michael Schumacher, after just a handful of races.

Its clear that Hamilton is a hugely talented driver, but he is also blessed by being in what is clearly at present, by far the best car and in that respect F1 is unlike most other sports. Tiger Woods even with a $300 bag of golf clubs would still be a great player, would Hamilton be so impressive driving a Spycher ?

Senna spent some time in his first year in F1 with the small Toleman team, while M. Schu spent most of his early career with the Bennetton team which he helped transform into contenders(and then he joined a Ferrari team that hadn't won the championship for years and helped transform them), Hamilton landed in what has now turned out to be the best car on the grid. Both these greats spent seasons in cars that they couldn't win a chmapionship in, but I doubt that ITV will dwell on this. They just can't believe their luck, they have a new young very marketable British driver with a great chance to win races and maybe the championship and they are going to hype him to heaven.

And if you follow F1 and like me don't have Setanta, then we are just gonna have to get used to it. It hasn't been this bad since they finished hyping Damon Hill as a great driver!:rolleyes:

Running Bing

I can understand non brits getting a bit p1ssed off with ITV but I dont think it is anything over the top. He is young, very talented, personable and has now won a race, no matter where F1 is being shown he is the hot topic.


Now add in the fact ITV is a british station, with a british presenters, broadcasting for a predominantly british audience.


If Hamilton was Irish and RTE didnt make as much fuss as ITV are now I would be up in arms tbh.

Frank Bullitt

I got setanta fixed this morning and was able to watch the race with an unbiased view, which was nice for a change. I can see why ITV are getting their knickers in a twist but for god's sake they are really blowing it up now, I would be all for the hype with Lewis if he were in a Red Bull or a Honda but, as its been pointed out, the lad is in the best of the best at the moment, if you put any other driver in it then they would be doing quite well also, he has also been groomed in the McLaren team for quite some time now and I would put this down as a big factor as well.

ITV will make a show of themselves if they compare him to Michael or Aryton, what they did was not just race well but transform teams to be great and get wins and titles, if Lewis did that then I could understand ITV's raving about him, but the fact remains he is in a very very fast car and it would be fast with or without him in the team.

For the next while anyway ill be watching setanta and the American equivalent...and hoping that Michael decides to come out of retirement and show them who's boss.

steviec

The 'fast car' argument doesn't really apply though - his car isn't any faster than Alonso's, and he's completely outperformed him. That's the same Alonso who is the only World Champion on the grid and before Hamilton arrived along believed to be the best driver in F1 this year.

So, no, I don't think 'anybody' would have beaten Alonso in the same car or done as well as Lewis Hamilton has so far. Sure, he's in the best car, but he's proven that he belongs there. He's completely outclassed Alonso, Raikkonen and Massa and they're supposedly the best drivers on the grid.

If Heidfeld or Webber had a car as good as his, maybe they'd have a chance, who knows, but I don't think there's anyone else on the grid who could claim to be performing as well as Hamilton. And this is in his rookie year.

mike65

Hamilton landed in what has now turned out to be the best car on the grid.

Hamilton has been with McLaren since he was 11 years of age, so its pure chance the car was bang-on when he got the gig to race in the top formula. He must be glad he's not 3-4 years older - he'd have been piloting a dog.

Mike.

thegoth

I agree with steviec.

He may have been pioliting a dog, but he would still be beating Alonso.

At least this is much better than ITV treating Jensen Button like he was some sort of F1 driving god. Jensen is no better than an average driver. Fact. At least Lewis looks like he could well be the next big thing. Time will tell.

The difference between Jensen and Lews is is that Jensen talks a good race, while Lewis drives a good race. What team mate of note has Jensen beaten ?????? An well past his best JV ? Lewis came straight from GP2 and is beating a double world champ.

ITV will always promote British/English drivers. At least when they promte a driver that seems to have real talent, its much easier to swallow than hearing about the legends that are Jensen Button, Damon Hill, and David Coulthard

Edwardius

I do like lewis, he seems like a smart kid, appears reasonably human and throws that car around like nothing else, but the commentary is ridiculous. Thankfully, I had an inkling he'd do well in the canadian race and decided to watch it on setanta. I'm not sure about the "british commentators for british audience" thing. ITV coverage, as far as I know is broadcast in many countries, I do wish someone would shoot that james allen character though.

Ay Cee

As far as I know ITV F1 broadcast to Australia and a few other places. Malaysia or Singapore and other such destinations.

It really is WAY over the top and ITV have already started with the Senna comparisons, "yellow helmets" any one?

The YEARS of OTT coverage given to Button and for what? Take that and multiply by ten for Hamilton.

I'd probably like Hamilton a lot more than I do now if it wasn't for ITV. Not his fault of course. Well ITV and the fact he drives for Ron.

Hamilton is in the best car on the grid. He's been around the team for what? 10 years? He's in a position no other driver in F1 has ever been.

Alonso's been griping about it being an English team. Ron always has his favourites and it's always fairly blatant. Mika - Kimi - Lewis. I'd imagine Alonso won't hang around too long. One or two seasons then jump ship to Ferrari, hopefully. Might give Kimi a kick in the orse, make him get his act together.

heyjude

Ay Cee wrote:

Alonso's been griping about it being an English team. Ron always has his favourites and it's always fairly blatant. Mika - Kimi - Lewis. I'd imagine Alonso won't hang around too long. One or two seasons then jump ship to Ferrari, hopefully. Might give Kimi a kick in the orse, make him get his act together.

Alonso now seems to be playing a very canny game, (after Hamilton's revelation after Monaco that he was ordered not to race Alonso), as you say he started griping about McLaren being an English team and now I hear that rumors have started that Alonso might be interested in moving to Ferrari next season.

I don't believe that Alonso is going anywhere, but some nicely timed stories :rolleyes: about a move to Ferrari, are just what the doctor ordered, to help Alonso get what he wants at McLaren

Ay Cee

I have to say I'd love to see Fernando in the red car

steviec

heyjude wrote:

Alonso now seems to be playing a very canny game, (after Hamilton's revelation after Monaco that he was ordered not to race Alonso), as you say he started griping about McLaren being an English team and now I hear that rumors have started that Alonso might be interested in moving to Ferrari next season.

I don't believe that Alonso is going anywhere, but some nicely timed stories :rolleyes: about a move to Ferrari, are just what the doctor ordered, to help Alonso get what he wants at McLaren

Alonso's just doing what he always does and whining when he has to actually work. He did it when Renault had the cheek of letting Fisichella pass him after about five laps of sitting behind him and destroying his own race when Alonso was multiple seconds off the pace in China last year in the wet. Remember when he went crying to the media that "Renault don't want me to win the title"?

Alonso's been spoiled at Renault, he was Flavio's golden boy, when Trulli started beating him he was ousted from the team, and Fisi was always treated poorly as his number two. The team continued to support him and give him the best car on the grid even as he went and signed a big money deal with McLaren behind their back over a year in advance, and he went on to win two really easy titles by having his title rival blow up in front of him time and again for two years running, never really fighting for anything on track. Any time things got remotely difficult, he moaned to the press or took his frustrations out on backmarkers either with a shake of the fist or his much more worrying fondness for brake testing and intimidation.

Now he's under Ron Dennis, a man who doesn't take crap from his drivers, he's finding himself being beaten by his rookie team mate in equal equipment even though he's the one getting the higher pay and the first choice of strategy, the outbursts were always going to come. And add to that the number of times he drove off the road in Canada, and he even did it at one point at Indy too at a time when he was in striking distance of Hamilton, and you have to wonder how long before he burns his bridges with another top team.

Hamilton, meanwhile, is just getting better and better and he's turning into a genuine favourite for the championship. It's funny that Alonso claims McLaren are favouring him when the evidence shows the complete opposite - when Alonso beat Hamilton at Australia it was thanks to Alonso being given first choice of pit strategy(he was running behind him up till then) and Ron Dennis said as much afterwards. When he beat him at Malaysia Hamilton spent the first stint going slower than he was capable of to let Alonso build a gap from the Ferraris - Lewis set the fastest lap once he was let go. Then in Monaco Lewis qualified with a lot more fuel than Alonso, then never got to take advantage of that as the team played it safe and brought him in 5 laps early in case a safety car was called - a reasonable risk reduction move but one they knew they'd likely end up taking when they originally fuelled him up that much on Saturday.

On the other hand look at the times Lewis has beaten Fernando - at Bahrain he was chasing Massa for the lead while Alonso couldn't even stay ahead of the BMWs, at Spain he was once again racing Massa for the win while Alonso was running down in fourth thanks to his own mistake, luckily for him he profited from Kimi blowing up, just like old times. And then at Canada, well, where do you start with Canada. Hamilton was flawless all weekend and won the race three times over with the safety cars constantly eating up his lead, while Alonso drove off the road four or five times and couldn't even outrace a Super Aguri. Indy is the first time he was close to Hamilton, and Lewis defended his position beautifully and needless to say Alonso pushed too hard, lost a couple of seconds at a critical phase, and the race was over from that point.

So McLaren are favouring Lewis? I don't think so.

thegoth

Agreed, but he fair, Alonso did frive very well in the 2005 at Imola to keep Schmui behind him.

Alonso cannot leave McLaren for Ferrari, as if he does, it will look like he is running away from a younger faster teammate. This would stop him being considered one of the all time greats.

triple h

mike65 wrote:

Whats the problem you're watching a BRITISH tv channel covering a BRITISH winner. Imagine RTE's hyperbole if Hamilton were Irish (I'm sure someone very sad is already looking the lads "Irish connection").

Mike.

TRUE

---

If you lived in spain you would be sick of hearing about Alonso
I have Setanta, so i have no worries, but i watched a bit of itv yesterday, just to hear the hype.

THE BIGGEST PROBLEM WITH ITV is the fact that they are trying to make this into gossip and a bitch fight ( just like a soap or a womans magazine). ITV would nearly have you believe that Hamilton needs a body guard in case Alonso stabs him or injures him in some way while walking around the motor home or garage.

another few example of what i am talking about ---sky news = gossip news and tv three news heading down that road too. And sky the magazine = a womans magazine ( one just can't read it anymore it's so bad and full of gossip)

Woden

I have to agree steviec on the fast car arguement not applying. He's beating/holding his own against his team mate who is massively more experienced in F1 which is of course in the same car.

I do have to agree I think it gets a bit ridiculous on ITV yet I continue to watch it for Martin Brundle, James Allen I've never been particuarly fond of. Stuff yesterday like well 2 British drivers who won there first grand prix went on to win their second one in succession. Thats great an all but not really what i'm after. I used to enjoy the abundant ITV pre race / post race coverage which might have a 5 minute snippet etc on the British drivers that fine. Unfortunately now i've taken to giving most of it a miss and watching some on setanta.

With reference to setanta I get it via the ntl basic package. Think the commentary from david kennedy is it? is ntb along with the info from Gary Anderson. The James Allen type figure though on Setanta again not a fan.

With reference to if it was an Irish driver on an Irish tv station I really don't think it would be the same. Feel we are typically more partial but hey maybe not

Robbo

On a complete aside about yesterday's race, anyone else notice that 7 out of the first 17 laps were missed due to ads. ITV have really started to take the piss with them recently.

Ay Cee

Dataisgod wrote:

Stuff yesterday like well 2 British drivers who won there first grand prix went on to win their second one in succession.

I believe it was GREAT British drivers. I don't think Damon Hill, Nigel Mansell and the word great go together.

triple h

Robbo wrote:

On a complete aside about yesterday's race, anyone else notice that 7 out of the first 17 laps were missed due to ads. ITV have really started to take the piss with them recently.

That's why i bought Setanta. Even though i have itv.
I have sky ( in a few early post in this thread someone was asking who has sky) and i have itv through other channels, but i watch NASN a lot. I would watch a baseball game quicker than a soccer or GAA game, so i do not mind pay €180 a year. It is a bit steep i reckon, but thats life, i don't go out as much as i use to.

Andrewf20

Considering its his first season, I cant help but compare his stats to the first year of Senna, Mansell, Stewart etc in F1. Hes so far ahead of them in term of progress to the top, although Id like to see how he manages in the wet. I wonder if he could match Senna's Monaco 1984, Estoril 1985 rainy performances.

I rate this season as the best in many years.

triple h

I have noticed (and i am sure ye all have noticed it too) a lot of people that don't really like F1 ( in fact these people hate it) all know about Lewis Hamilton. He is good for the sport and it is a great season. I would love to see him win the championship and i reckon ye all would love to see it too.

PeadarofAodh

I'll be honest, I've always found F1 mind-numbingly boring - as I'm sure others might well say of my preferred sport. However I'm now genuinely interested in how this season pans out - I think Alonso's constant whinging is hilarious, adds that extra bit of spice to the contest! I would definitely tune in if I saw F1 was on now, rather than flick to something else as I used to.
I don't really blame ITV for hyping it up, I'd say anyone would be pretty excited at the prospect of a talented driver of same origin after so many years of nothingness!

thegoth

Just remember, everyone is judging Lewis compared to his performances to Alonso, and Alonso himself is a bit of an unknown still. Remember he was outperformed by Trulli at Renault for half a season, and has beaten a past his best Fisi, so the jury should still be out on how great Alonso is ( He is undoubtly very fast).

Lets all wait and judge Lewis over a 5 or 6 year peroid with different teammates in different cars.

The question should be, is Lewis is mega superstar, or is Alonso not as good as we all thought ? I dont know the answer, and I dont think anyone in the world really does yet either

Beekay

Andrewf20 wrote:

Considering its his first season, I cant help but compare his stats to the first year of Senna, Mansell, Stewart etc in F1. Hes so far ahead of them in term of progress to the top, although Id like to see how he manages in the wet. I wonder if he could match Senna's Monaco 1984, Estoril 1985 rainy performances.

I rate this season as the best in many years.

Well thats not exactly fair to compare those kind of stats, Hamilton has started his career in probably the fastest and most reliable team on the grid this year.
Senna started his F1 career in a Toleman which wasn't one of the top three teams and was pretty small.

Mansell started his career in a Lotus which was very unreliable.

Stewart was a bit better seeing as he started his career alongside Graham hill in a BRM.

Beekay

thegoth wrote:

Just remember, everyone is judging Lewis compared to his performances to Alonso, and Alonso himself is a bit of an unknown still. Remember he was outperformed by Trulli at Renault for half a season, and has beaten a past his best Fisi, so the jury should still be out on how great Alonso is ( He is undoubtly very fast).

Ah but he beat the almighty Schumacher:D

thegoth

But not in the same car !!!!, therefore not relevant

Running Bing

thegoth wrote:

But not in the same car !!!!, therefore not relevant

So it's irrelavant that Schumi beat all those drivers down the years? the only ones he really beat were the likes of Massa, Barrichello and Eddie Jordan? WOW talking out of your Ar5e fella.

thegoth

I was not offensive to you.

Eddie Jordan was a team owner. Eddie Irvine was the formula 1 driver. Emm, talking out my arse indeed !!

You can only compare drivers using one of two things. Number 1, compare them to their teammate, which is accurate. Or number two, which is less accurate, but none the less a good pointer, compare them to other drivers via their teammate, i.e compare Trulli to Montoya via Ralf.

Using your logic, if Sato was in this years Mclaren and he beat Alonso who was in this years Ferrari, Sato is a better driver.

Sorry, that does not work, and I think most people agree.

You can compare Michael to most drivers on the grid by gauging how his team mates did against other drivers, same as Fisi, Trulli, DC, ..........

thegoth

And when you say "The likes of Massa", is this the Massa that is kicking the great Kimi's ass this year you are talking about ? Massa has developed into a very good driver.

Name drivers that were faster than Irvine and Rubens when they were Schmuis team mates. I tell you. Mika H, thats it

Running Bing

thegoth wrote:

I was not offensive to you.

Eddie Jordan was a team owner. Eddie Irvine was the formula 1 driver. Emm, talking out my arse indeed !!

You can only compare drivers using one of two things. Number 1, compare them to their teammate, which is accurate. Or number two, which is less accurate, but none the less a good pointer, compare them to other drivers via their teammate, i.e compare Trulli to Montoya via Ralf.

Using your logic, if Sato was in this years Mclaren and he beat Alonso who was in this years Ferrari, Sato is a better driver.

Sorry, that does not work, and I think most people agree.

You can compare Michael to most drivers on the grid by gauging how his team mates did against other drivers, same as Fisi, Trulli, DC, ..........

OK the last comment may have been a bit out of order, apologies if I offended you and yes I put down Eddie Jordan by accident:o ...a stupid mistake, but I stand by my sentiments. It is foolish to say Scumacher can only be judged against the likes of Massa, Irvine , and Barrichelo. He was consistently the best driver on the grid, yes he may have had the best car but he still beat the other drivers plain and simple.



And I was not belittling Massa as a driver, I think he is class.



The point is wheter he has the best car or not Hamilton has come in as a rookie and performed nothing short of phenomenal. He has shown composure and a will to win far beyond his years and where many would have settled to being Alonso's wingman, Hamilton was not content with that. A lot of schumacher fans I have talked to seem somewhat threatened my Hamilton for some reason but I think he is the closest thing to Schumacher we have seen in some time. NOW BEFORE YOU ALL LOSE YOUR HEAD...I am not saying he is as good as Schumacher I am just saying he seems to share some common traits/Characteristics and some day could well be as successful as Schumacher.



EDIT: I put in Jordan instead of Irvine again by mistake:o Dont know where my head is

jmayo

Babybing wrote:

...It is foolish to say Scumacher can only be judged against the likes of Massa, Irvine , and Barrichelo. He was consistently the best driver on the grid, yes he may have had the best car but he still beat the other drivers plain and simple.

And I was not belittling Massa as a driver, I think he is class.

The point is wheter he has the best car or not Hamilton has come in as a rookie and performed nothing short of phenomenal. He has shown composure and a will to win far beyond his years and where many would have settled to being Alonso's wingman, Hamilton was not content with that. A lot of schumacher fans I have talked to seem somewhat threatened my Hamilton for some reason but I think he is the closest thing to Schumacher we have seen in some time. NOW BEFORE YOU ALL LOSE YOUR HEAD...I am not saying he is as good as Schumacher I am just saying he seems to share some common traits/Characteristics and some day could well be as successful as Schumacher.
...
:

Hamiliton has been lucky he has arrived at just the right time, the McLaren now appears superior to the rest and he is in with a shout of winning GPs because of this.
That's why it is unfair to compare his first reason top anyone else.

Nevertheless he is a very good driver, more talented than either Hill or Mansell but another Schumacker, never mind Senna?
Time will tell.

BTW for number of wins the yardstick is Schumaker but for sheer driving talent it has to be someone like Senna, Villeneuve, Clark or Fangio.

heyjude

triple h wrote:

I have noticed (and i am sure ye all have noticed it too) a lot of people that don't really like F1 ( in fact these people hate it) all know about Lewis Hamilton. He is good for the sport and it is a great season. I would love to see him win the championship and i reckon ye all would love to see it too.

I wouldn't mind seeing Hamilton winning the championship, just not this year. The hype if he manages to win the championship in his first season would be too much.

I'm just not sure if anyone can deny him, the Ferrari's seem off the pace(What has happened to Raikkonen ?) and Alonso seems to be psyched out at the moment.

thegoth

BabyFace - I agree with you. I am a massive MS fan and do feel threatened by Lewis, but I do not let that cloud my judgement.

The facts are that he has had a brillant debut, no doubt. But his teammate still seems to be strugleing with this years tyres and new team, and like I said we still dont know exactly how fast Alonso is. He has really only had one really fast teammate in Fisi.

Time will tell how good Lewis is. As I write this, I am just wondering are modern F1 cars becoming so easy ( relative to say 15-20 years ago ) to drive that any young driver with a years experience in a decent single seater can sit into an F1 car and be on the pace straight away ? I say this because years ago, when Senna first drove an F1 car which was a Williams, he was immeditely faster than Williams regular drivers, same with MS. Nowadays, this sort of thing is not too uncommon. So we either have a bunch of Sennas and MS's all coming along on a converer belf, or the cars are getting much easier to driver.

Bring back 1000-1200bhp engines, big black slick tyres, no TC or launch control and see who are the best drivers then. Would a guy like Lewis, Vettel, Kubica immeditely be on the pace then ? I dont know. Maybe another explaination might be that the feeder series like GP2 and formula Renault World Series, are more similar to F1 cars than in the past

dazman2250

OMFG, ITV is providing without a doubt the worst television coverage ever seen in the history of the sport this season. Aside from the ludicrous levels of Hamilton mania being propogated by the channel, has anyone noticed that all Martin Brundle seems to spend his time doing is interviewing celebrities and insulting politicians on the grid. Add to that the unbelievable amount of ad breaks (you'll spend more time listening to that little sound byte as they begin and end than you will the commentator) and the channel is truly disgracing itself. Watch Setanta, it may be low budget, but it's Irish, impartial (except toward Ralf Schumacher who David Kennedy loathes), and they actually know whats going on the race and provide some insightful comments about the sport.

Edwardius

yeah. ITV has lost the run of themselves this year. The gridwalk can be an amusing aside and I like Martin Brundle's insight but James Allen needs to be taken out and shot. With an axe. Why don't they fire him?

Ay Cee

You just know they had a big Hamilton Special thing organised post race for when he won the British GP.

It's baffling why ITV don't get Ben Edwards!

I'd say Brundle is being forced into interviewing mostly celebrities because of how interest has grown in the sport because of Hamilton. For example did he not say that they were more spectators for the qualifying this year than there was for the race last year.

Says it all really.

Ay Cee

PS, Setanta are Scottish!

Edwardius

Ay Cee wrote:

You just know they had a big Hamilton Special thing organised post race for when he won the British GP.

I'd say there'll be some cheap t-shirts out there alright.

aidan_dunne

Ay Cee wrote:

It's baffling why ITV don't get Ben Edwards!

I agree, I said right from the beginning that he should have gotten the gig when Murray retired. Him and Martin Brundle together would be an awesome line-up, I think. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like it's ever going to happen because he has said in the past that he's not interested in doing the F1 commentary gig for ITV. All the travelling he did back in the days of Eurosport's F1 coverage with him and John Watson, and then travelling back and forth between the UK and America for the Champ Car races after that, really got to him and that's why he ended up quitting the Champ Car gig and taking on the BTCC gig instead. His wife runs a company that organises some of the BTCC support races, I believe, and he helps her out with this as well so I guess that was another factor in his decision in taking on the BTCC gig instead of the F1 one. Which is such a shame as he was great with John Watson on Eurosport's F1 coverage years ago and they also showed how good they were together when they did the commentary for Sky when they ran the F1 Digital+ service back in 2002.

The past couple of years I've gotten the impression that Martin Brundle is being "dragged down" by James Allen or something as well. Anyone else get that feeling too? And there's times where he sounds distinctly un-interested and just fed up with it all these days. Which is a shame, really, because back when he was working alongside Murray he always sounded really excited and interested in what was happening and was always on the ball as well and came out with some great insights and one-liners ("Well, if your name's "Shu-maker" I guess you can talk cobblers!" ). It was as if the whole Murray-effect rubbed off on him in the commentary box and he was brilliant to listen to. Now, it seems, the James Allen effect has started to rub off on him and he sounds as if he just couldn't be bothered anymore!