Could you vote for a candidate that supported abortion?

The_Minister

I saw a poster for this at the bus stop today. Anyone know anything abiout it?

billy the squid

Any idea who the poster was put up by? was there an organisations name on it?

joolsveer

The_Minister wrote:

I saw a poster for this at the bus stop today. Anyone know anything abiout it?

Have you a photo of the poster?

Dirk Gently

smells like csp.

brianthebard

Yeah I could

Zaph

I don't see how this is even an issue.

Saruman

I would be more of the opinion " Could you vote for a candidate that did NOT support abortion?"

_Kaiser_

Saruman wrote:

I would be more of the opinion " Could you vote for a candidate that did NOT support abortion?"

Exactly

ateam

Yes.

brianthebard

zaph wrote:

I don't see how this is even an issue.

Its not unless your a CSP member.

Seth Brundle

Given that abortion (under certain circumstances) is legal in Ireland and our politicians support the law, you could make the claim that they all support abortion.

Owen

Most definitely yes.

Gobán Saor

AFAIK, it's illegal to erect an election poster that does not identify (albeit in very small print:D ) who is responsible for it.

The_Minister

It was at the bus-stop outside UCD. It had a small print name on it, of an individual, not an organisation. It was D

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O'D

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I can't remember. It was yellow. I remember that.....

Gobán Saor

The_Minister wrote:

It was at the bus-stop outside UCD. It had a small print name on it, of an individual, not an organisation. It was D

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O'D

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I can't remember. It was yellow. I remember that.....

Ok, it's legal then. Unhelpful to women with crisis pregnancies, perhaps, and unlikely to help society in general come to any kind of consensus on the abortion issue, but definitely legal.

fobster

So that's what Daniel O'Donnell is doing these days.

Dave!

yes i could.

RalphCifaretto

Supporting abortion would be fairly bizarre

LuckyLloyd

I would strongly oppose any candidate that had an anti - abortion // pro - life // whatever stance.

mike65

Yes.

Mike.

Senator

A candidate who supported abortion would not be able to do much about it as it is illegal in BOTH Irish jurisdictions. Far better to concentrate on issues we do have control over.

athtrasna

it drives me mad when people try to play politics with abortion. Best advice I ever saw on abortion was on a bumper sticker in the US -

"Against abortion? Don't have one!"

Boston

athtrasna wrote:

it drives me mad when people try to play politics with abortion. Best advice I ever saw on abortion was on a bumper sticker in the US -

"Against abortion? Don't have one!"

"Against murder, dont murder"
"Against domestic abuse, don't beat your spouse"
"Against drug use, don't do drugs"
and so on so forth. Your logic is flawed deeply.

athtrasna

eh...no!

The best place to start is with yourself, we are a nation of hypocrites. Take Bishop Casey and all the priests with kids...don't have sex outside marriage...do as I say and not as I do.

Take any anti-abortion protest and over 50% of the participants will be of non child bearing potential (ie men or over 60s). It makes me mad. And when people make it a political issue its worse, abortion is a deeply personal issue and one which should not be a political football.

leeroybrown

I would be unwilling to vote for any candidate that felt the need to base their campaign on a topic that is irrelevant to this general election. Abortion is definitely an irrelevant topic.

Boston

athtrasna wrote:

eh...no!

The best place to start is with yourself, we are a nation of hypocrites. Take Bishop Casey and all the priests with kids...don't have sex outside marriage...do as I say and not as I do.

Take any anti-abortion protest and over 50% of the participants will be of non child bearing potential (ie men or over 60s). It makes me mad. And when people make it a political issue its worse, abortion is a deeply personal issue and one which should not be a political football.

You did a survey and those where the results?

athtrasna

Yes, me and my eyes! I used to work across the road from a place that had weekly protests and on that one at least 75% were men/old. The protests outside the four courts recently and the ones at the Bank of Ireland on College Green at weekends are similarly populated. I was being conservative on the 50%

Cnoc16

Getting back to the original question..

No I couldn't vote for someone who supported abortion. I do think it is an issue, like any other issue. I don't agree with it, and don't want it in Ireland, so why would I vote for someone who is going to push for it?

Just like I don't agree with socialist financial policies, or any other topic for that matter - it's an issue for me - so no I couldn't vote for someone who does not share fundamental principles and ideas that I have.

Tricity Bendix

athtrasna wrote:

eh...no!

The best place to start is with yourself, we are a nation of hypocrites. Take Bishop Casey and all the priests with kids...don't have sex outside marriage...do as I say and not as I do.

Take any anti-abortion protest and over 50% of the participants will be of non child bearing potential (ie men or over 60s). It makes me mad. And when people make it a political issue its worse, abortion is a deeply personal issue and one which should not be a political football.

Eh... yeah!

Your logic is flawed. And nothing in your post above detracts from that point.

athtrasna

My point is that if people are against abortion - don't shout about it,just don't do it.

It really turns me off a politician if they think that parading their own values on such a sensitive subject is going to win them votes, regardless of whether I agree with them or not.

The_Minister

fobster wrote:

So that's what Daniel O'Donnell is doing these days.

Thats the name.

Time Magazine

athtrasna wrote:

My point is that if people are against abortion - don't shout about it,just don't do it.

I'm against rape. I've nothing against rapists, but I'd never do it.

Boston

athtrasna wrote:

My point is that if people are against abortion - don't shout about it,just don't do it.

By your logic, if you've no problem with something, then it should be ok for you to do it?

What about receiving stolen goods? It's illegal but quiet a few people have your attitude on it, "If you think it's wrong don't do it, but don't force your morality on me".

athtrasna

For God's sake, you know that's not what I mean. It just sickens me when people jump on the abortion bandwagon. Abortion is a deeply personal issue and not one that needs to be politicised.

It's not about the morals, it's about the CSP and plenty of others making a virtue out of being "pro-life". If you're anti abortion, just keep it to yourself, don't lecture me or anyone else about it, especially not on my doorstep.

Boston

athtrasna wrote:

For God's sake, you know that's not what I mean. It just sickens me when people jump on the abortion bandwagon. Abortion is a deeply personal issue and not one that needs to be politicised.

It's not about the morals, it's about the CSP and plenty of others making a virtue out of being "pro-life". If you're anti abortion, just keep it to yourself, don't lecture me or anyone else about it, especially not on my doorstep.

You support criminal activities.

athtrasna

Boston wrote:

You support criminal activities.

WTF?? I don't support any criminal activities????? I just wish people would stop politicising such a personal issue.

rainbow kirby

Saruman wrote:

I would be more of the opinion " Could you vote for a candidate that did NOT support abortion?"

I'd be in this camp, I could not vote for a candidate who does not support a woman's right to choose.

Agent J

Boston wrote:

You support criminal activities.

Do not attempt to go down that road. We have constitutional protections for information and the right to travel that a few idiots in the HSE seemed to forget with the D case.

Abortion is legal in this country as far the protection of the mothers life is concerned. Its more conveient to push the problem to the UK.

Anyone who does not support abortion in that case should quite simply take a serious look at themselves. Same goes for any candidate who will not support abortion those cases.

Nevyn

There is the point of view that it is illegal in this state as is smoking canibis as is having sex with a 14 year old, but there are countries with in the EU where you can have an abortion, smoke canibis and have sex with a 14teen year old.
This is the type of world we live in and if you traveled to those countries and enguaged in those acts you would not be prosecuted here for them.

Contraception used to be illegal here and that changed because 'The people' became in favour of it and fought and lobbied to make it so.

Voting for a candiate or a politcal party an factoring in what thier stance on abortion is is a personal choice, but if the candiate or a party is infavour of abortion then catholics can risk falling under latae sententiae excommunication so I certainlycan understand them and those who feel strongly for non religious reasons vetting along those lines.

Grudaire

It's a very personnal question for a thread...

If you agree with the right of an unborn child to live you won't vote a pro-chice candidate in

If you agree with the womans choice side of things you will.

I personnally believe there are more relevant issues to discuss, and any playing the victim by a female canditate deserves a slap not a number 1 choice.

E92

I could vote for a candidate that supported abortion yes no problem. I support it being legalised, under certain circumstances. Of course I realise that Enda has said that no way will he allow it, and to be honest one way or the other it wont affect my choice on the ballot paper.

Tricity Bendix

athtrasna wrote:

For God's sake, you know that's not what I mean. It just sickens me when people jump on the abortion bandwagon. Abortion is a deeply personal issue and not one that needs to be politicised.

It's not about the morals, it's about the CSP and plenty of others making a virtue out of being "pro-life". If you're anti abortion, just keep it to yourself, don't lecture me or anyone else about it, especially not on my doorstep.

I think being pro-life is a virtue.

is_that_so

b.ie polar wrote:

I think being pro-life is a virtue.

That may be the case but bringing a single issue into an election that will decide on the next government and all it is required to do, is questionable, imo. It also makes those doing so a "vested interest".

As for the question itself it would not even occur to me to ask. The issue tends to be addressed on a regular basis in public referenda.

Nevyn

Which is a shocking way to do things.
Currently it is permissible under certain circumstances for a woman to legally have an abortion under our consititution and law and there should be legislation to back this up and health policy and proceedures so that a woman who is legally entitled to end a pregancy for health issues does not have to travel outside of the country.

gandalf

Boston wrote:

You support criminal activities.

Boston, you're trolling. Don't do it again.

Boston

gandalf wrote:

Boston, you're trolling. Don't do it again.

I'm not trolling, I'm pointing out blatant flaws in an arguement that everyone should be free to do what they want and not do what they don't want. This is me trolling.

karen3212

Boston wrote:

"Against murder, dont murder"
"Against domestic abuse, don't beat your spouse"
"Against drug use, don't do drugs"
and so on so forth. Your logic is flawed deeply.

I think the logic here is also flawed.

the original poster said; against abortion, don't have one

against murder, don't murder yourself
against domestic abuse, don't abuse yourself
against durg use, don't use drugs yourself

again the question is, do i have a right to do what i want to myself, and is the foetus part of the woman, or another person?

oscarBravo

karen3212 wrote:

...is the foetus part of the woman, or another person?

To pursue that question is to discuss the issue of abortion itself on this thread. Don't do that.

Boston

karen3212 wrote:

again the question is, do i have a right to do what i want to myself,

No you don't. Society dictates what people can do, regardless of who it affects.

The crux of her argument is that if you are ok with doing something then you should be able to do it. You've extended that to provision thats it's ok once it doesn't affect anyone else. By your premise it's ok for someone to kill themselves or to self harm in some other way, it's ok for someone to drive without a seat belt, or drink themselves to death.

The only rights you have are the ones society deems you to have, that's the reality. People talk about the right to choice but fail to realise we live in a country where people don't have the right to speak their minds on topics that may be considered blasphemy.

Lemming

The entire *ahem* "logic" of the poster the OP saw is flawed. I doubt you will find many people in favour of trotting every pregnant woman off to a clinic to have an abortion because they think it's great.

I think you'll find instead that the reality is "pro-choice" as in the right to choose, not "pro-abortion".

A not so subtle distinction that is often lost on the more zealously dogma-minded of our citizenry unfortunately.

Boston

Lemming wrote:

The entire *ahem* "logic" of the poster the OP saw is flawed. I doubt you will find many people in favour of trotting every pregnant woman off to a clinic to have an abortion because they think it's great.

True, one wonders what the aim of it is. However that doesn't make the arguements put forward here valid.