American Horse Racing

liamdubh

Anybody here a fan?

I've gotten involved recently and I'm having a great time with it. There are plenty of free stats and form cards available. The horses generally are triers (and even at that, braindead jockeys can account for odd runs) and it seems to be on the level. The liquidity on Betfair is terrible but I find exotics to be much better for gambling anyway.

I've never bet on UK & Irish horse racing, just never got into it, not sure what it's about really....2 pounds here...4 pounds there.....he had a cold 2 months ago and doesn't like to run on soft-ground on the 2nd wet Tuesday of the month, the jockey doesn't win on horses with 'O' in the name....seems a lot like guessing. I'm probably wrong but I read peoples reasons for backing/laying on the Betfair forums and they're sometimes like that. Some jockeys who have broken ranks alledge widespread and systematic corruption, as far as running horses who are non-triers goes anyway. Stuff like betting ante-post and being burned or backing national-hunt and the horse clattering into the first hurdle....not for me.

(Sorry, horse racing forum is the place for this, but I can't delete it)

county

liamdubh wrote:

Anybody here a fan?

I've gotten involved recently and I'm having a great time with it. There are plenty of free stats and form cards available. The horses generally are triers (and even at that, braindead jockeys can account for odd runs) and it seems to be on the level. The liquidity on Betfair is terrible but I find exotics to be much better for gambling anyway.

I've never bet on UK & Irish horse racing, just never got into it, not sure what it's about really....2 pounds here...4 pounds there.....he had a cold 2 months ago and doesn't like to run on soft-ground on the 2nd wet Tuesday of the month, the jockey doesn't win on horses with 'O' in the name....seems a lot like guessing. I'm probably wrong but I read peoples reasons for backing/laying on the Betfair forums and they're sometimes like that. Some jockeys who have broken ranks alledge widespread and systematic corruption, as far as running horses who are non-triers goes anyway. Stuff like betting ante-post and being burned or backing national-hunt and the horse clattering into the first hurdle....not for me.

(Sorry, horse racing forum is the place for this, but I can't delete it)

just PM the mod in this forum to move it

Robin1982

I like US horseracing, partly because of its structure and moreso because the nature of the racing and information over there lends itself to more interesting form analysis.

As regards to non-triers, the absence of a central handicapping system and implementation of a claiming/allowance race system means they don't seem to have these problems.

However, the big problems in US racing are:

1. the widespread belief of the utilisation of performance-enhancing drugs by many trainers, often masked by the "legal" drugs: bute and salix

2. the monopolised Tote system (plus small pools at the non-major meets)

3. the game is nowhere near as popular over there as it would be over here as regards to the public domain - many racetracks have installed 'casinos' (often just slot machines) and without them would not be able to survive.

4. it has its benefits, but the banality of the racetracks there (pretty much all flat, small and left-handed) versus the variety we have over here sometimes means less interesting viewing.

liamdubh

As regards to non-triers, the absence of a central handicapping system and implementation of a claiming/allowance race system means they don't seem to have these problems.

Could you expand on this? How does this impact on non-triers? They have claiming/allowance races? What is a central handicapping system? Do you mean a course-handicapper Vs a central system?

4. it has its benefits, but the banality of the racetracks there (pretty much all flat, small and left-handed) versus the variety we have over here sometimes means less interesting viewing.

Yeah they are all very similar, but I don't find this boring. What I find interesting is sizing up the races and how each horse will perform. Even if I wasn't betting on it I'd still be interested in trying to figure out a race. As you said the form analysis is interesting.

BangBeater

Yeah, it's true about the courses over there... so boring & bland! And the names are priceless in fairness... you'd know it's an american track - 'Turf Paradise'... FFS!

Robin1982

liamdubh wrote:

Could you expand on this? How does this impact on non-triers? They have claiming/allowance races? What is a central handicapping system? Do you mean a course-handicapper Vs a central system?

The vast majority of races in the US are claiming races. There are a myriad of varying rules and conditions but on the whole, every horse in the race is potentially up-for-sale to be claimed by anyone else. Sometimes all horses will be available for the same price, sometimes trainers will accept a lower claim price for carrying less weight, but all in all the general theme is the same.

The next level of races would be Allowance level - this is basically where the horses just run for the prizemoney.

Handicap races are rare, and conversely they tend to focus on the major races (i.e. Santa Anita Handicap). There is no central handicapping system like we have here (an official who assigns a rating to every horse) - the track handicapper will determine the weights as he sees fit. Also note that carrying 130lbs (9st 4lbs) would be considered a very heavy weight.

As for non-triers, there is not the same opportunity to profit as there would be here. By sandbagging a horse, the is no lower handicap mark to exploit. You could run a good horse in a bad claimer, but you run the risk of losing him for less than he's worth. You could set your horse up for a touch, but the Tote system means the more you back him, the lower the payoff - so you are going to have to make sure he's going to win. Hence, the idea of a non-trier among US handicappers is less of a concern.

liamdubh wrote:

Yeah they are all very similar, but I don't find this boring. What I find interesting is sizing up the races and how each horse will perform. Even if I wasn't betting on it I'd still be interested in trying to figure out a race. As you said the form analysis is interesting.

Their similar nature leads to easier comparisons. Another big concern is US racing are the small fields.

liamdubh

Handicap races are rare, and conversely they tend to focus on the major races (i.e. Santa Anita Handicap). There is no central handicapping system like we have here (an official who assigns a rating to every horse) - the track handicapper will determine the weights as he sees fit. Also note that carrying 130lbs (9st 4lbs) would be considered a very heavy weight.

I don't think the weights vary that much...few pounds. Doesn't seem to be much.

Their similar nature leads to easier comparisons. Another big concern is US racing are the small fields.

Aye. I like the bigger fields. Most of my success is down to picking long-odds winners in big fields.

Robin1982

A terrific race at the weekend where Curlin defeated Kentucky Derby winner and BC Juvenile champ Street Sense in the Preakness: Video

The winning time equaled Secretariat's* record