Dobies and rots and other breeds

Lou.m

Hi

I just wanted to share a story from my childhood.

Now dont get me wrong i love dobies and rotweilers but i just had to share this. When i was young our neighbours had a rotweiler and another mixed heavy breed. They were quite vicious to the point that as a child i could not go near the part of our garden that was near theirs as the dogs would go insane and the fence was not that stable. We noticed that the dogs were quite good with the owner but had some problems they were never exercised and never seemed to be taken out i assume this is becasue they were not socialised or something.

Obviously people would complain to the owners not just about the dogs behaviour but that this was not the way to treat such dogs and that they needed some help especially in a neighbourhood with so many children. But the response was very antisocial.

Then the owner became pregnant and the first thing she did was get rid of the dogs they realized that they could not have their children around them as it would be too dangerous but for some reason it was fine to have other peoples children upset by them. SO they knew there was a problem but did not care about their dogs or other people i cannot think who would have takemn those dogs and i would not be surprised if they just gave them to the pound.

Now to contrast i want to tell another story. My aunt had a huge german shepard (another breed sometimes considered dangerous) but he was socialised and trained and well used to all types of people. And as i little girl i felt so comfortable with him i used to try to ride him like a pony.(now dont accuse me of cruelty i was tiny and he loved it!). He was my favourite dog and you never met a happier Doggie. I never really even knew that other people considered german sheps to be a potentially difficult breed at all until recently.Actually i kind of thought that they were known for being really good with kids. I just see them as cuddly as i am some people see dobies and rots.

But i just wanted to show the two stories and to tell people what can happen to dogs. It wasnt even that my aunt trained him very much it was more being in a sensible happy home and being socialized and a little training.

I was wondering what other people thought.

Nala

I think in most cases, dangerous dogs are made not born.

shinners007

its never a dogs fault its the owners, how they train them, handle them are for them etc. i agree with nala.

cowzerp

rottys and dobey are natural guards and wont tolerate strangers on there patch, my rotty is great with everyone once he does not see you as an intruder-thats why i love my rotty-great guard and pet..my dogs socialised though..

Alfasudcrazy

My bobies and sheepdog are doing a great job keeping election cavnassers away. There was a posse of them outside the gate this evening but they decided to beat a hasty retreat when the female dobie let it be known she is not interested in this election.

Lou.m

Alfasudcrazy wrote:

My bobies and sheepdog are doing a great job keeping election cavnassers away. There was a posse of them outside the gate this evening but they decided to beat a hasty retreat when the female dobie let it be known she is not interested in this election.

Ok thats it i want a dobie NOW!

cold_filter

Its all in how they are raised, my german shepherd is a big mean looking dog, but he's a teddy bear, he loves children and he loves my gf now if we are out walking she goes to the shop or disapears from view he will wait for her to re-appear before walking forward. Kids are amazed at how friendly he is.

There is a rotty up the road a huge monster and vicious his owner is an ex-junkie so i dread to think what he's like i'm fortunate enough never to have bumped into him while walking my dog as he always has it off the lead and unmuzzled

biko

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

Nala

biko wrote:

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

The reason you only hear about dog attacks from Dobermanns, pitbulls etc is because The Sun, The Star etc aren't able to generate as much hysteria with "Golden Retriever mauls girl" as a headline. The only breeds I have ever been snapped at by were a Lhasa Apso, a Cocker Spaniel and a Jack Russell. Unfortunately I do not write for a tabloid newspaper.


The dogs themselves are not dangerous, but a lot of the people that buy them are 16 year old hard men who have no idea how to train them.

I mean a lot of the lads in my class had mopeds as status symbols but at least they come with instruction manuals...

michelleans

biko wrote:

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

No dog breeds should be banned. Only the irresponsible dog owners that do not train or socialise them and make them dangerous should be banned from owning dogs.

I have a german shepherd also considered a "dangerous" breed :rolleyes: My dog loves all people, especially children and other dogs, he plays so gently with my budgie even. It's all about how you raise them. I've handled many many dogs - rottweilers german shepherds and dobermen included and never gotten bitten by one. However I have been bitten by terriers :cool:

Here's my baby

golden

biko wrote:

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

You cant generalise like that when I was a kid my friends parents had a rotty and they were not "skangers" by the way we used to get up on its back and and ride it like a horse.

Looking back at it as an adult the rotty was extremely tolerant all the rotty wanted to do is to please.

Bex01

biko thats the most stupid thing I've ever heard. I know loads of people with rottweilers and they are the most friendly dogs ever and the owners are not 'skangers'.

Michelleans your dog is gorgeous. I also own a German Shepherd.

fatmammycat

biko wrote:

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

Skanger dogs? God, knee jerk reaction much? I"ve been chased by Jack Russells in the park near my house on more than one occasion and -hum let's see- NEVER by a doberman. In fact I can't even tell you the last time I heard or read anything about a doberman attacking a person in this country.

michelleans

Bex01 wrote:

Michelleans your dog is gorgeous. I also own a German Shepherd.

Thank you

They are a wonderful breed

Nala

Any German Shepherd I've ever met was lovely. I think they're gorgeous. My dad thinks otherwise, says "they're vicious, they turn on their owners" cos apparently the GSD he had as a child was. However my dad's idea of dog keeping is to chain the dog up in the garden.

Our man in Havana

biko wrote:

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

Please do your homework! Bull breeds were not bred to killers - they were used to protect families whilst the men were away at war! They often have the nick name of nursery dogs!

People make bad dogs! Tis very rare to have a nasty dog - if they are they have been trained that way or are so badly abused that they have a nervous breakdown & SNAP! Just like humans can!

My rottie is nicer than my terriers! Like Nala said the news plays up stories of KILLER DOGS! It happens very rarely! More people are bitten by little dogs! but the news are only interested in sensational headlines!

CrowdedHouse

Nala wrote:

T The only breeds I have ever been snapped at by were a Lhasa Apso,

I don't believe it,what did you do to the poor dog

Our adorable Lhasa Apsos - Hayley & Lucy

Lou.m

Well while i dont know about 'bad breeds' i do think there is such a thing as bad breeding that has made a lot of certain breeds unsafe.

I think breeding practises have a lot to answer for aswell as bad owners.

Nala

CrowdedHouse wrote:

I don't believe it,what did you do to the poor dog

I was only a kid, he belonged to a girl in my class, there were loads of kids around him and next thing he turned around and snapped! He was probabl a bit stressed.

corkimp

There are only bad dogs because of owners who haven't a clue about trainging their dogs or socialising them correctly and think it is "cool" to have an aggressive dog - makes them look macho withthick check chains on them. I admit when I was younger I was afraid of what was to become our GSD Amy's dad - Kesh (huge stocky fella!) and another male who were tidied up. I was only 8 or 9 and these dogs were nearly as tall as me. They'd run towards me and I was afraid because of their size. It took me a while (the owner grabbed one of them and told me to say hi) and I realised they were just delighted to see me - big babies! Just a bit hyper! I'm more afraid of terriers to be honest. I've never been bitten but wouldn't put myself in that situation either.
Don't judge the rotti's, dobbies and other dogs for fools mistakes - they are beautiful dogs ( I prefer dobbie though) as the majority bar maybe 0.5%, are brilliant pets and great with kids. Just have bad names - just like the GSD - what a bad education and knowledge of dogs does is leads to brilliant dogs being prejuiced against.

deaddonkey

biko wrote:

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

you're so wrong it isn't even funny

oh, let's ban a breed a dog because they look mean
i've met a lot of dogs, and i mean a lot of dogs, and i've not yet met a bad tempered 'dangerous dog'

but yeah, their sole function is to intimidate
you must be right

grantona

Pay no attention to that nasty person, obviously this guy is a fool who knows nothing about animals or dogs. I have dobes a long time and train my dogs with rotts and gsds for police protection, obedience and tracking. I have yet to see a dangerous one they are protective dogs with intelligence that's it, you get one person like you who confuses (with teasing and incorrect training) the dog and you have a dangerous one.

Gsd is the most popular dog in Ireland registered with the ikc over 60,000 pups registered last year.
I am told how many bites? And remember how many of these dogs a trained guards by the army, Gardaí and security companies. One attack last year in Offaly by a rott because of an unstable owner mistreating the dogs she owned and not keeping dangerous animals under proper control, name one dob attack ever in Ireland?

There is no such thing as a bad dog, just bad owners. Get your facts straight before you publish such rubbish not backed up by facts.
The breed is not responsible for who's on the other end of the lead.

Our man in Havana

Grantona, I have edited your post to remove insults which will not be tolerated on this board. This is your only warning. Next time infractions and bannings will follow.

Also in future please use proper punctuation and paragraphs. Otherwise you post is painful to read.

Glowing

I think westies should be banned. Aggressive little sh1ts.

Our man in Havana

Agreed!

Toulouse

I interact with lots of different types of dogs, mostly ones who are in the pound or ones who have just come out. I can honestly say that in the 18 months since I started I've only been snapped at once and that was by a shih tzu x. Not one staffie, rotti, GSD, pitbull, doberman or any crosses of those breeds has even growled at me and god knows there's many many more of those in the pounds than the smaller dogs.

I think it's really sad when people, who in many cases have never even met one of the breed they are prejudiced against, label all dogs of a particular breed 'Killers' due to sensationalist newspaper reporting, fear and ignorance and call for them to be banned.

Why not call for stricter dog ownership and breeding laws to really get to the centre of this problem which is imo the people who abuse these breeds.

andreac

I own a rottie and he is the biggest softie ever!!!!
AND THEY WERE NOT BRED TO KILL!!!!!!!
They were actually bred as a working dog, herding cattle
but if people did their research they would not post such stupid comments.

It maddens me when people havent a clue about these breed and generalise all those dogs as dangerous and viscous. My fella has the best temperament ever, and loves kids and all dogs, he is an absolute ambassador for the breed.

So please people get your facts straight before posting such comments.

There are actually nmore attacks by other breeds but they are never highlighted as it wouldnt make good press!!

The Artist

biko wrote: »

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

those breeds or any other breed of dog can be dangerous only the owners are to the blame imo.Care,trained,looked after,walks,food and water,play with them,disapline of your dogs will make them excellent dogs.If not cared,not trained,left in the back garden all day with out water and food,no walks,no time for ye dog and no love for dog will make them dangerous imo.

lakes

Biko!!! YOU ARE CRAZY MAN!!!, NO dog should be banned!! just thier should be some sort of law of wat age a person can be to own one,to keep these dogs away from young wannabe thugs! I own a staffy & she is the biggest softie iv ever known!

Ruby Soho

Like what Toulouse said, I also work with dogs, lots of different breeds, on a daily basis. The only breed that I have seen to be consistently unmanageable are Westies (sorry to any westie owners out there, I have also seen some lovely ones!). Cocker spaniels, and JRT's are also up there, but like I said there are far more nice ones than nasty ones. I have never felt threatened by Staffies, Pit Bulls, Rotties or GSD's. They do take careful handling, I'll give you that, and respect, but once they get proper socialisation + management, they are fine. Personally I think the Staffie to be the friendliest and most trustworthy breed out there. Its a shame that the breed can't shake the association it has with some of the thuggish owners. I will say now that if I have kids, I would love to get them a Staffie as a playmate!!

cobweb

as stated dogs arent the problem its their owners, bad training care and lack of attention socialisation affects the dog. I ve got or should that read my folks ave 2 westies who are so obedient and loopy that the same time.

I think rotties and dobies have got bad press due to movies like The Omen etc and I also think that their tails shouldn't be docked as this is how they communicate and people misunderstand them without their tails. I saw a donnie recently with a full tail and he looked gorgeous!

michellans have i seen your lovely dog elsewhere he is gorgeous

Ruby Soho

Its the same with westies, some people get them thinking they are cutesy chocolate box dogs that love to get their hair cut, when in reality they are tenacious, head-strong little gurriers! They're just not disciplined enough as pups and let away with murder. When you do see them with owners that have a bit of cop on, they're grand little things.

Lauragoesmad

I don't believe any dog should be banned but I do think that you should have to have a proper cert like a qualification to have big powerful dogs. This in my opinion would be for the dogs wellbeing. I know most dedicated dog owners would take a week out of their lives to have the breed that they love. This could even be a cert in dog handling. I don't think the types that just want a "hardshaw" dog would go to the trouble. I know this would be very hard to enforce but if I was running the country........:p
I have seen young guys aged about 14/15 out with all different types of dogs in Dublin and Liverpool who just have no control over them.

fatmammycat

biko wrote: »

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

Really? Biggest offenders you say. How many Doberman attacks can you quote within the last five years? I'm genuinely curious. I had a doberman for years, well socialised, trained, exercised, and I never EVER had a problem with him. He was naturally aloof and an exceptional watch dog, but never aggressive. Like wise the groomer my sister goes to own a female doberman, an absolute charming dote of a dog. So I'd like to understand where your poor opinion of them stems from.

EGAR

Very funny, Biko . I am a middle aged woman with a University degree and I keep/rescue/work with Bull Breeds, mostly APBT (American Pit Bull Terriers - in case you don't know what APBT stands for ). I rehome APBT, Rottis and the occasional Doberman into families. I am sure they would be less than pleased to hear you call them Skangers.

I do not own a track suit, nor do I have bleached hair and loop ear rings.

I am very sorry to have burst your little bubble of ingorance after all it is said to be bliss :pac:

The Artist

EGAR wrote: »

Very funny, Biko . I am a middle aged woman with a University degree and I keep/rescue/work with Bull Breeds, mostly APBT (American Pit Bull Terriers - in case you don't know what APBT stands for ). I rehome APBT, Rottis and the occasional Doberman into families. I am sure they would be less than pleased to hear you call them Skangers.

I do not own a track suit, nor do I have bleached hair and loop ear rings.

I am very sorry to have burst your little bubble of ingorance after all it is said to be bliss :pac:

+1!

~Thalia~

I agree with most of the above posts in that it is owners that make bad dogs.

Nor do I sport gold hoops, a kappa tracksuit and bleached blond hair and I have a GSD who is the most loyal affectionate dog. She is well trained and not a 'killer' as someone mentioned above. Picture of her below.

As always it is people who destroy animals and it's people's treatment of dogs that shapes the type of dog they are.

Love dogs like dobies and rotties and bull breeds.

The Artist

Skangers is not a nice word to be saying for these posts.imo look at the wellknown people like pop stars ,rappers,film stars etc own these type of dogs too!And oh! even the royal family has the bull terriers! would any one call them skangers!:cool:

bilbo79

davey180 wrote: »

would any one call them skangers!:cool:

Yes i'd say so..

kerrysgold

biko wrote: »

Rotweiler
Doberman
Pitbull
all should be illegal in Ireland in my opinion. Sure I know other dogs can be dangerous too but these seems to be the biggest offenders and are bred to kill. They are skanger dogs used to intimidate other people.

Are you serious?! :mad:
Do you know anything about dogs?!
All the dobies & german shepherds that have been in my family & that I've met have been adorable, sweet tempered dogs who wouldn't hurt anybody! And from what I've seen of them, pit bulls look like they make wonderful pets when they have a good owner!

and as for being "bred to kill" rotties & german shepherds are actually like the german version of our border collies etc, they are herding breeds. well actually rotties (and dobies as well) are a "working" breed and german shepherds are a "herding" or "pastoral" breed.

Morganna

Oh Biko you are very silly .i have owned ,bred .worked and shown German shepherds all my life.they are a super breed ,so loyal affectinate and brainy.I learnt to walk holding onto a german shepherd as did my son.Its the bad peole who have no understanding of dogs that should be banned .
Also practically everyday in Dublin some one is murdered should we then ban people !

Crazyivan 1979

Biko: I have never heard such a stupid comment. Judging by the bio on your profile, your interests include "drinking and fighting", skangers like you should be banned from Ireland!!:mad:

The Artist

Crazyivan 1979 wrote: »

Biko: I have never heard such a stupid comment. Judging by the bio on your profile, your interests include "drinking and fighting", skangers like you should be banned from Ireland!!:mad:

and from this forum imo.

lightening

He's a troll, has been warned about it before, I reckon we should just ignore him.

stevoman

i have experience from both side sof the fence and its not the breeds that are the danger its either the owner OR the individual temperment of the dog (and the owners responsibility to identfiy that!)

We have a rottie in out haouse and he is the softest dog i have ever come across. he would never hurt a fly and is literally afraid of everything (espeically and sharp noise). But at the same time we would never leave him with a child!

About 21 years ago my grandparents had a golden retreiver and from what i have been told was always a good dog. well my granny went down to hang up some washing and left me alone with the dog. i was about 6 years old and i bit the dog on the tail, and yes you guessed it i got 26 in my head for my troubles. How many of the doogooders are out there trying to get golden labs made illegal?

Of course the dog was put down immediatly and a lesson was learnd in my house that no matter what type of breed a dog is it should never be left with a child. It just goes to show you that no dog can be trusted. Its just a pity that the bigger breeds are sometimes seen as fashion accesories by young idiots and this in turn leaves these dogs left unsupervised and thats how a lot of attacks happen.

The Artist

im a lover for all dog and other pets.
i say this now matter what happens IMO any animals bite its their nature and a territorial thing.
having said that i have tropical fish and when i feed them they bite my finger too,even if i put me finger in they are like piranas!

Morganna

My god they will be banning fish next lol

cotton

Oh dear, it seems like I've been going about this all wrong. I better get to the shops & buy some dye, hoops & tracksuits immediately, then come home teach my dobies & shep to kill.:rolleyes:
I'll start with the biggest one who is at this moment rolling around on the bed with one of the cats, tyring to get his mr men teddy off him & loosing big time.:p

biko

Morganna wrote: »

Oh Biko you are very silly .i have owned ,bred .worked and shown German shepherds all my life.they are a super breed ,so loyal affectinate and brainy.I learnt to walk holding onto a german shepherd as did my son.Its the bad peole who have no understanding of dogs that should be banned .
Also practically everyday in Dublin some one is murdered should we then ban people !

Sorry I haven't been back and for causing such a stir. It's been a year since this topic started and looking back my wording was less than nice.
I didn't mention German Shepherds at all. In fact they are great reliable dogs used by both police/military and also make good tempered pets. I know several families that have them and would perhaps even get one myself. I like big well-mannered/trained dogs.

Perhaps I should clarify my point of view: I agree with The Dangerous Dogs Act UK that bans pitbulls and I think it should be expanded to Rottweiler and Dobermans too. The reason for this is that in the US, the Rottweiler is the number two breed of dog named in fatal human attacks from 1979 to 1998 in a report by the CDC. Rottweilers are a powerful breed with well developed genetic guarding and herding instincts, and prey drive. (I'm aware German Shepherds are on that list too, as michelleans said).
The Doberman is apparently a great dog but I have some less than nice experience from them.
Looking at the stats you see how much higher the first two breeds are that rest.

In Ireland the biting dogs seem to be of other races:

“The majority of the dogs involved in the attacks were male dogs between 2-6 years old, over 10kg in body weight and were among the popular breeds of Collies, Cocker/Springer Spaniels, Terrier breeds, Jack Russell Terriers, German Shepherds, and Golden Retrievers,” said O’Sullivan. “And the biting incidents were equally likely to occur in rural and urban/suburban areas.”more stats

@ lightening, not trolling but I can understand if a different view on this topic, in this forum, can be construed as such. There was an old thread somewhere (After Hours?) about this where I voiced this opinion before and butted heads with Nala or Mairt.

Perhaps a Gardai Dog Licence would be the best option for Ireland, rather than banning dangerous dogs outright?

lightening

biko wrote: »

In Ireland the biting dogs seem to be of other races..... Perhaps a Gardai Dog Licence would be the best option for Ireland, rather than banning dangerous dogs outright?

If its other breeds that are doing all the biting why have Gardai dog licenses for the breeds you mentioned? According to the stats you have just posted there isn't a problem.

biko

Good question.
I posted just one study. In Ireland there is no official reporting mechanism for dog bite incidents and specific data on the incidents is not readily available from hospital accident and emergency records.

However, if these dogs cause much concern in US and UK the problem is most likely present here too, or may soon be.

Smaller dogs may be more inclined to bite but will cause smaller injuries, bigger dogs can maim/kill.

A licence test at your local Gardai station will pretty much let any responsible person through but filter out undesirables, unless they buy a dog that does not require licence. Think of it as a fire arms licence. A scary dog can be just as intimidating as a gun pointing at you.